The U reducing capacity at Sun Life to 55,000 with........you guessed it

[Sean Miller Fan]

Well, actually, Miami has always tarped off the corners of the endzone at Sun Life but now they are expanding that to "banner" off the entire upper deck endzone sections to reduce capacity down to 55K.

Also, the stadium is being renovated after the 2015 season and the bright orange seats will be swapped out for aqua seats to make the place look less empty (for Dolphins games) you know because orange STICKS OUT. When the Sun Life renovations are complete, it will have a European soccer-esque roof that shades the fans from the sun. The good news about that for the Canes, though, is that the roof will allow the stadium to have the same kind of downsizing technology that the new Atlanta stadium will have when it houses its new MLS franchise. As you can see from the picture in the link below, starting next year, Miami won't be using a "tarp," its more like an enormous banner that extends from the roof to the first row of the upper deck, completing covering those sections as if its not there.

If we can never build a stadium in Oakland, I hope we can influence the Steelers to include this new technology in the new stadium they build in about 20 years. I just hope its not in Washington County. I've always said the biggest problem with Heinz Field isn't that its not on campus, its that its 20,000 seats too big. Pitt should not be playing in a 67,000 seat stadium.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...anners-over-upper-deck-end-zone-seats-in-2016

 

[HailtoPitt]

Our two programs are so similar in this regard that it's not even funny.

Actually, it is pretty amusing.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I agree with 'reducing capacity' but there just isn't any easy way to do it at Heinz. I'm guessing the lower bowl is about 40k now with the upper sides each about 10k and the bleachers about 8k.

 

[jaemoe76]

i agree we need to reduce capacity and work something out with the steelers to get rid of those yellow seats...maybe foot half the bill...also would like to see field turf

 

[HailtoPitt]

i agree we need to reduce capacity and work something out with the steelers to get rid of those yellow seats...maybe foot half the bill...also would like to see field turf

None of those 3 things are likely to happen. The Steelers like the seats being their colors. There aren't allowing tarps. The don't want fieldturf. Whatever the Steelers want, they get.

 

[Consultant Panther]

None of those 3 things are likely to happen. The Steelers like the seats being their colors. There aren't allowing tarps. The don't want fieldturf. Whatever the Steelers want, they get.

I get the other two, but why would the Steelers care if Pitt used tarps to cover some sections?

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Shouldn't the conversation be about filling the seats with bodies?

We could start with you. In or under, doesn't matter.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I get the other two, but why would the Steelers care if Pitt used tarps to cover some sections?

They wouldn't.

 

[Pghfan]

will never understand the obsession from pitt fans to tarp seats..

 

[HailtoPitt]

Now that was funny!

Tonight at 11, Richie Walsh on KDKA has exclusive artist designs for a new Pitt stadium.

Fortunately for yinz, I found it....

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Shouldn't the conversation be about filling the seats with bodies?

No, its not realistic for a small (in terms of major D1) school like Pitt to come close to filling a 67,000 seat stadium. Even if we won the NC every year, its just unrealistic. The conversation needs to be about reducing capacity to create a better atmosphere and increasing the value of a Pitt ticket (due to reduced supply).

 

[NTOP]

They wouldn't.

Possible labor conflict. Pitt employees would not be welcome into HF??

 

[geeman2001]

Pitt, being in an NFL town (and probably the most iconic NFL team at that) simply has too much spotlight to share to be able to merely throw any old team out onto the field and automatically fill the place, like (say) a South Carolina can. Fair or not, a team here has to have consistent, frequent success, and against perceived 'legitimate' opponents at that. Rail against 'bad Pitt fans' all you like, but this particular market requires success first. So either Pitt would have to hope the Steelers move to LA, or invest up front for the success needed to draw the fan support desired after. The good news is that this kind of support is basically guaranteed (and a guaranteed bonanza of riches) once it IS accomplished (as the Pens and Steelers, and lately the Pirates, have shown). It just isn't going to come before the success.

Posters who come here regularly, whining that Pitt fans should donate heavily, show up early, and stay to the end, regardless of the crap they are presented on the field, simply cuz it's "dear old Pittsburgh," are truly the ones living on Fantasy Island, rather than those who come here dreaming big with their posts. At least the latter know it's a dream.

That all said, using tarps is crazy, ain't fooling anybody, and more apt to draw even more mockery than the empty seats. Because hostile asshole media is ANOTHER irrefutable trait of the Pittsburgh market. Other places with obedient cheerleader media will politely ignore tarp seats. Satanic child rapist worshippers here will not.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

If they could somehow generate some revenue from the tarps (or whatever), maybe. The empty seats generate zero. But I think the only opportunity to 'contract' the capacity for Pitt games would have been when they first moved there.
And I don't think they have to 'fill the stadium' (another local media attendance fixation brainwasher actually started by joe) but it needs about 80% to get the atmosphere. That's 54k.

 

[geeman2001]

If they could somehow generate some revenue from the tarps (or whatever), maybe. The empty seats generate zero. But I think the only opportunity to 'contract' the capacity for Pitt games would have been when they first moved there.
And I don't think they have to 'fill the stadium' (another local media attendance fixation brainwasher actually started by joe) but it needs about 80% to get the atmosphere. That's 54k.

Agreed. Given what it turns out that the previous regime really had no high aspirations for Pitt football to have great success, a tarp strategy from the very outset might have been workable. Then, it could have been pitched as a designed feature, that market studies showed that more 'intimate' crowds are more conducive for college football, as a 'value' proposition to fans, and a differentiator from the Steelers (every seat is "close to the action!"

Honestly, that would all be as much BS as it would be today ... a deflection of the REAL problem (a program with no commitment to win). But it would have been more easy to establish as part of the stadium design (such as built in retractable awning-style covers, or foldaway hiding seats, incorporating logos, ads, maybe even use able as a massive display screen with creativity). PLus, making it part of initial plans would have established expectations on all sides (media, fans, Steelers). Might even have spurred higher demand for initial season tix (and a higher baseline price) and even more revenue, contrary to assumptions.

But as you suggest, doing it now clearly be an acknowledgement of failure.

My suggestion is that Pitt simply own the situation and 'virtually tarp' via its ticket sales. For most games, upper decks are automatically not sold in advance, and capacity is 40,000 (or whatever). Then, yes those yellow seats are still empty up there, but Pitt at least OWNS it ... it's 'on purpose'.

For "big" games, they are presold as part of season tix (priced accordingly too). Yeah, some folks may have inconvenience of having split parties for those games. ... small casualty of war.

And if the season turns into a winner, and the original 'tarped' games would have unexpected higher demand, it would be very easy for Pitt to put them on sale online on the week of, given new tech to print tickets at home and scan at the gate. That would spur impulse buying, higher prices, and more guaranteed to USE their tickets.

 

[NTOP]

Agreed. Given what it turns out that the previous regime really had no high aspirations for Pitt football to have great success, a tarp strategy from the very outset might have been workable. Then, it could have been pitched as a designed feature, that market studies showed that more 'intimate' crowds are more conducive for college football, as a 'value' proposition to fans, and a differentiator from the Steelers (every seat is "close to the action!"

Honestly, that would all be as much BS as it would be today ... a deflection of the REAL problem (a program with no commitment to win). But it would have been more easy to establish as part of the stadium design (such as built in retractable awning-style covers, or foldaway hiding seats, incorporating logos, ads, maybe even use able as a massive display screen with creativity). PLus, making it part of initial plans would have established expectations on all sides (media, fans, Steelers). Might even have spurred higher demand for initial season tix (and a higher baseline price) and even more revenue, contrary to assumptions.

But as you suggest, doing it now clearly be an acknowledgement of failure.

My suggestion is that Pitt simply own the situation and 'virtually tarp' via its ticket sales. For most games, upper decks are automatically not sold in advance, and capacity is 40,000 (or whatever). Then, yes those yellow seats are still empty up there, but Pitt at least OWNS it ... it's 'on purpose'.

For "big" games, they are presold as part of season tix (priced accordingly too). Yeah, some folks may have inconvenience of having split parties for those games. ... small casualty of war.

And if the season turns into a winner, and the original 'tarped' games would have unexpected higher demand, it would be very easy for Pitt to put them on sale online on the week of, given new tech to print tickets at home and scan at the gate. That would spur impulse buying, higher prices, and more guaranteed to USE their tickets.

So folks could get lower bowl seats w/o donating?? And let's be realistic...Pitt had no real say in stadium design when the move to HF was signed. Putting the beloved Dinocat on the end seats was better than I suspected. Of course, lots of people thought that Pitt Stadium was the problem, instead of the results on the field. I'd prefer to see what happens under the new leadership before tarping.

 

[geeman2001]

So folks could get lower bowl seats w/o donating?? And let's be realistic...Pitt had no real say in stadium design when the move to HF was signed. Putting the beloved Dinocat on the end seats was better than I suspected. Of course, lots of people thought that Pitt Stadium was the problem, instead of the results on the field. I'd prefer to see what happens under the new leadership before tarping.

Ummm ... no. They'd still be donating. Like today. In fact, by design, donating more, since the more would be competing for fewer seats.

The cheap bastids who now buy the crap seats that are so plentiful and unappealing that they don't require donations ... and since they cost next to nothing, are easy to blow off if its too cold, too hot, too wet, opponent too crappy, quaker steak & lube too far a walk ... they'd be the ones SOL.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I would tarp off the entire upper deck, raise the lower bowl ticket prices, and consider removing the tarps once Pitt has one full season of complete sell outs. If they can't accomplish that goal, then we don't need those seats, period. Use the tarps to show Pitt's retired jersey numbers, and use the upper endzone tarps to show the names of former great players and coaches.

 

[geeman2001]

I would tarp off the entire upper deck raise the lower bowl ticket prices, and consider removing the tarps once Pitt has one full season of complete sell outs. If they can't accomplish that goal, then we don't need those seats, period. Use the tarps to show Pitt's retired jerseys numbers, and use the upper endzone tarps to show the names of former great players and coaches.

Fair enough, i'd agree with that policy to see how it worked, but again, why would the physical tarps actually be needed? Pitt could impose that policy easily at any season. Just sell no seats from those sections (and make sure to prevent physical access there).

Again, tarping isn't fooling anyone. At this point, it would cause more mocking locally, not less. Attendance wisecracking would merely be exaggerated, if anything. "Pitt announced a tarp-enhanced 'sellout' of 43000..."

 

[NTOP]

Ummm ... no. They'd still be donating. Like today. In fact, by design, donating more, since the more would be competing for fewer seats.

The cheap bastids who now buy the crap seats that are so plentiful and unappealing that they don't require donations ... and since they cost next to nothing, are easy to blow off if its too cold, too hot, too wet, opponent too crappy, quaker steak & lube too far a walk ... they'd be the ones SOL.

If we only get 35-40K, there won't BE competition. So now your chasing away folks who don't contribute by making it mandatory!! That meager ticket revenue disappears, as many "cheapos" will opt for TV. Resulting in lower revenues & fewer attending. We need to make things happen on the field....then the problem takes care of itself. I would close down the North end bleachers, though. The 200 folks up there won't mind.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Fair enough, i'd agree with that policy to see how it worked, but again, why would the physical tarps actually be needed? Pitt could impose that policy easily at any season. Just sell no seats from those sections (and make sure to prevent physical access there).

Again, tarping isn't fooling anyone. At this point, it would cause more mocking locally, not less. Attendance wisecracking would merely be exaggerated, if anything. "Pitt announced a tarp-enhanced 'sellout' of 43000..."

Because the Pitt themed tarps would look 1000x better than empty yellow seats.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Ummm ... no. They'd still be donating. Like today. In fact, by design, donating more, since the more would be competing for fewer seats.

The cheap bastids who now buy the crap seats that are so plentiful and unappealing that they don't require donations ... and since they cost next to nothing, are easy to blow off if its too cold, too hot, too wet, opponent too crappy, quaker steak & lube too far a walk ... they'd be the ones SOL.

In other words, we'd lose their ticket revenue. Just to clarify.

 

[Coultr77]

Look I am a PSU fan, but if Pitt were good I would go to their games. I have tons of friends and family who would go with me. I would buy season tickets and take clients. This Tarp the seats idea is moronic at best. Get a good coach (check), get better recruits, win games, SEATS WILL BE FILLED! Corporations/ Business will buy seats leading to sold out stadium!

 

[HailtoPitt]

Look I am a PSU fan, but if Pitt were good I would go to their games. I have tons of friends and family who would go with me. I would buy season tickets and take clients. This Tarp the seats idea is moronic at best. Get a good coach (check), get better recruits, win games, SEATS WILL BE FILLED! Corporations/ Business will buy seats leading to sold out stadium!

No, they won't. Pitt isn't a school that fills the stadium no matter what. Heinz Field is just too big for Pitt's fanbase.

 

[Coultr77]

No, they won't. Pitt isn't a school that fills the stadium no matter what. Heinz Field is just too big for Pitt's fanbase.

Maybe the first step is changing the mentality

 

[HailtoPitt]

Maybe the first step is changing the mentality

I wish it were as simple as that, but changing mentality for a collective group isn't a quick process. Pitt football is just not a high priority for many alums and fans.

 

[Coultr77]

I wish it were as simple as that, but changing mentality for a collective group isn't a quick process. Pitt football is just not a high priority for many alums and fans.

That is why they need to look outside those two groups in the short run to sell tickets. It is still a business!

 

[geeman2001]

If we only get 35-40K, there won't BE competition. So now your chasing away folks who don't contribute by making it mandatory!! That meager ticket revenue disappears, as many "cheapos" will opt for TV. Resulting in lower revenues & fewer attending. We need to make things happen on the field....then the problem takes care of itself. I would close down the North end bleachers, though. The 200 folks up there won't mind.

Agreed. But assuming half assed commitment to winning continues to be the norm (and despite tough talk,

Because the Pitt themed tarps would look 1000x better than empty yellow seats.

It will look just like it did when the Pirates did it at Three Rivers. Which is to say, a giant embarrassing reminder that the seats under the tarps are empty. And a dirty, dull, grimy reminder at that, after the first couple rainy games, then sun fades it, then the winds stretch it out of shape and tear holes in it ... etc.

On second thought, perhaps it is a good metaphor for the program after all.

There is a better alternative to each idea, of course. Spend the REAL money needed to compete. Acknowledge that kids will smoke the occasional joint now and then. Great coaches and players will result. The tickets will be sold, the stadium will fill, at higher prices, donations will soar, and profits will leap. Repeat. It's a pretty easy formula. Much less brand-eroding than filthy torn tarps flapping in the breeze.

 

[HailtoPitt]

And a dirty, dull, grimy reminder at that, after the first couple rainy games, then sun fades it, then the winds stretch it out of shape and tear holes in it ... etc.

The tarps will only be used for Pitt games, so they won't get faded from the sun and damaged by the wind.

 

[eastcoasthoops]

I've actually warmed to the idea of a giant blue and gold script Pitt covering the upper deck end zone bleachers. Think about driving across the Ft. Pitt Bridge, looking to your left and seeing that? I could dig it.

Ultimately the empty stadium solution is winning. Whether or not the long term success we all crave is attainable is the question. Of course, Pitt could also double the enrollment and spit out parchments in Crab Grass Studies and Basket Weaving Technologies and build a fan base that way as well...

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Ultimately the empty stadium solution is winning.

This is incorrect. The empty yellows aren't going to away, even if we become a perennial Top 10 team (which is very unlikely to happen). Look at basketball. We pretty much had a decade in the Top 10 with countless big-time victories and even then, we had half empty arenas in Nov/Dec.

There's too much competition in the area for the live sports dollar and Heinz Field is at least 20,000 seats too large. So, even if we became a great program, you're probably not likely to see more than 50K actual people in the seats for games where the other team doesn't travel many fans. That's still 17K empty seats. I'm sorry but but no more than 50K people are going to come to see #11 6-0 Pitt vs 3-3 UVa at Heinz Field. That's the best we can hope for.........and one of the main reasons I say a downsizing plan is an answer.

 

[NTOP]

I've actually warmed to the idea of a giant blue and gold script Pitt covering the upper deck end zone bleachers. Think about driving across the Ft. Pitt Bridge, looking to your left and seeing that? I could dig it.

Ultimately the empty stadium solution is winning. Whether or not the long term success we all crave is attainable is the question. Of course, Pitt could also double the enrollment and spit out parchments in Crab Grass Studies and Basket Weaving Technologies and build a fan base that way as well...

You do realize that the tarp would be up 6-7 days per year?? HF is the Steelers' stadium....we are occasional tenants. Can't polish a turd.

 

[eastcoasthoops]

You do realize that the tarp would be up 6-7 days per year?? HF is the Steelers' stadium....we are occasional tenants. Can't polish a turd.

Yeah I realize it would only be up 6-7 days a year. However, it would look interesting - ESPECIALLY on game day and it wouldn't be the same drab empty yellow mustard bowl.

But let's not do ANYTHING. Let's just bitch and complain. Do you know why the Pitt fan base doesn't grow? It's as much the freaking depressing attitude of the fans as it is the depressing results on the field. We should adopt Debbie Downer as the mascot.

The administration shouldn't research the feasibility of selling alcohol on game day, they should work a deal with Walgreens and dispense antidepressants. Whaaaaaaa we want Script, we want an on campus stadium, we want different shades of blue...Holy hell it's a friggin chore to be a fan sometimes with all of this constant complaining and woe-is-me attitude.

And SMF, you are wrong…winning is the answer. Will Pitt games sell out each and every game? No. But is averaging a legitimate 50,000 - 55,000 a game possible? Yeah, I think that is reasonable. Play the right kind of schedule and win…I think Pitt fans and local football fans would buy into that.

 

[HailtoPitt]

There's too much competition in the area for the live sports dollar and Heinz Field is at least 20,000 seats too large. So, even if we became a great program, you're probably not likely to see more than 50K actual people in the seats for games where the other team doesn't travel many fans. That's still 17K empty seats. I'm sorry but but no more than 50K people are going to come to see #11 6-0 Pitt vs 3-3 UVa at Heinz Field. That's the best we can hope for.........and one of the main reasons I say a downsizing plan is an answer.

Correct. The stadium is too big for Pitt. All college teams with large stadiums grew to that point after decades of building a fanbase, combined with supportive administrations and competent leadership. Pitt has unfortunately not experienced this combination for a suitable length of time.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

And SMF, you are wrong…winning is the answer. Will Pitt games sell out each and every game? No. But is averaging a legitimate 50,000 - 55,000 a game possible? Yeah, I think that is reasonable. Play the right kind of schedule and win…I think Pitt fans and local football fans would buy into that.

Yes, if Pitt was a 9/10 win, every year, program, they probably could AVERAGE 50K-55K actual butts in seats. However, that's an average which would include 1-2 sellouts or near sellouts, and 2-3 games with 35-40K there looking like crap on TV.

My point is that Pitt is never, not in a million years going to be able to prevent massive yellow for at least 4-5 games per season. The stadium is just too large, we have too few alums, and there's too much competition.

If you want to fill Heinz Field, the best you could hope for is the Steelers moving to LA.

 

[eastcoasthoops]

Well…I hope you guys can stroke a check for $250M to get the ball rolling on a 55,000 seat stadium in South Oakland with ALL the bells and whistles to satisfy everybody's fantasy. Otherwise, grow a thicker skin and figure out a way to make Heinz work.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I think its worth a shot, just don't see how they can do it to have an impact with the way the stadium is configured.
I'm sure Barnes has seen the data and images. Not as sure they see it on the front burner.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Well…I hope you guys can stroke a check for $250M to get the ball rolling on a 55,000 seat stadium in South Oakland with ALL the bells and whistles to satisfy everybody's fantasy. Otherwise, grow a thicker skin and figure out a way to make Heinz work.

Isn't that what the discussion in this thread is about?

 

[eastcoasthoops]

Isn't that what the discussion in this thread is about?

Yeah, sorry…I'm still hungover from Wednesday…I guess my synapses aren't are firing the way they should be. I just get so freaking sick and tired of the "hate Heinz Field" finger-pointing circular argument.

It always ends up in the same place. The reality is what it is. The stadium is on the North Side, it's shared with a pro team in a pro town, it's adorned with idiotic yellow seats, and the turf always sucks. You want better attendance? Win more games (to please the Pitt faithful) against better competition (to interest the local football fan). Tarp the upper deck, light the freakin end zone on fire with dancing girls in bikinis, get Thomas Tull and Google to work in cooperation to build the first of it's kind field logo hologram system and plaster Pitt script all over the place. I don't give a damn.

I just want to watch the team win. I've never noticed the lack of "ambiance" when we win.

 

[Ray-Ray]

will never understand the obsession from pitt fans to tarp seats..

When there are 20,000 PSU fans with tickets to the game next year, maybe you will understand.