#1 Priorty of this Coaching Staff for next Season

[SoufOaklin4Life]

They REALLY need to find some defensive identity. I don't care if its man to man, zone, trapping, pressure, over-playing passing lanes, whatever....we need something we can rely on.

It's pretty apparent Dixon has tried the kitchen sink approach, just trying to get some kind of stops this season..

but, we have no bread an butter identity right now.

I was thinking about this, and when is the last time that Pitt made it hard on teams defensively consistently? By that I mean, when was the last time Pitt would just disrupt the flow of the opponent's gameplan with their defense?

For years, we seemingly mastered that..or as Bilas put it, we were really not a fun team to play. We had schemes and plans where it seemed out defensive players knew where the ball was going and beat their man to the spot to disrupt the play.

I don't think I'm waxing nostalgic about this..but, maybe I am...but, it used to take a tremendous individual effort to beat Pitt.

Now, we seem to make everyone look like stars every game.


This post was edited on 3/12 7:52 AM by SoufOaklin4Life

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I'll take playing SOME defense of decent intensity.

In reality...........not sure what the makeup of the team is going to look like but it will likely be a combination of the following.

PG JRob 6'3"
SG Durand Johnson 6'6"
SF Jamel Artis 6'7 or Sheldon Jeter 6'8"
PF Jamel or Mike Young 6'9"
C Young or Rozelle Nix 7'0

I look at this group and do not see particularly good quickness, footwork. I do see tremendous length. That is a pretty decent sized team, and we see Syracuse in many cases with a lineup like that using their 2-3 zone. I look to work that zone, maybe a more aggressive version that we have been playing as the base defense.

I no people have a fit when WVU is mentioned on this board as a comparison, but we have seen Huggins implement straight up man defenses, then a 1-3-1 defense then this year their version of Nolan Richardson's 40 minutes of hell pressing.

The only reason why I bring this up, a much more senior coach who should be more entrenched in his ways can completely reinvent their defensive identity and style in different years, so why not Pitt?

 

[UP#1]

Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two


That is waht is needed.

Not a better scheme better players

Pretty easy to see that

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Originally posted by UP#1:

That is waht is needed.

Not a better scheme better players

Pretty easy to see that

We were MUCH better with Lamar and Zanna, and all the sophs as frosh defensively, than this team.

So..I"m not buying that, alone.

I mean, Gibbs and Ramon were limited athletically..but, they always were fundamentally able to stay in front of their main.

Nasir was maybe 6'4" and played tougher defense than anyone on this roster in the post.
Tyrell Biggs was better than what we have no defensively.
These aren't gifted talents were are talking about.

 

[Cap pitt]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Still do not see this team getting much better next year

 

[thebadby2]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Agree with those statements. I don't think Jamie has forgotten how to coach defense, but this group of players is SOFT. Mike Young gets way too much credit on this board IMO. He is soft in the post--not just undersized and out of position, he just isn't tough. He doesn't bang and grind. He also is a poor screener which is unacceptable at Pitt, where the bigs have to be able to set ball screens in their sleep. He needs to get mean out there. Jeter, Artis, Jones--SOFT.

You;re right about Ramon and Gibbs--Ramon in particular was able to hold his own defensively despite being far more limited athletically than Robinson, Newk or Cam Wright--they did have much better team defense around them though. And what wouldn't we give to have Julius Page in the backcourt again? I used to be frustrated that he was a streaky shooter, but he was really tough at the 2--a lockdown defender who was athletic enough to do some damage in transition at the offensive end.

We need some guys who are willing to do the dirty work. This group must be very frustrating to JD--but he;s the one who put it together, mostly from last minute recruiting leftovers and transfers. That's no way to do it.

I think we were better when we were getting our kids from hard ass urban high school programs than from these east coast prep school basketball factories like Our Saviour, where the players are coddled prima donnas. Unless you;re getting the can;t miss superstar from one of those places (which we are never realistically in contention for), I think you;re getting a soft player who hasn't had to work very hard. Give me a kid who has played in the NYC, NJ or Philly public or Catholic leagues, and who knows what it's like to play a whole game with a bloody nose and bruised ribs.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Yeah...which is why I want to point out players like Gibbs and Ramon, Nas and Biggs...
limited athletes who played much more solid and good team defense, and were fundamentally solid.

I mean..I'd kill for a Page or Jaron, or even Antonio Graves...even would settle for Jermaine Dixon (at least defensively) or Gil Brown.


That's why I'm putting this on the coaches, primarily. They aren't reaching these kids and they sure aren't holding them accountable for this piss-poor defense.

 

[thebadby2]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

With Jamie being the kind of defensive coach he is, you'd think he would be kicking the shit out of this crew in practice, toughening them up making it hell on them until they come around.

I keep thinking what a Bobby Knight or Tom Izzo practice would be like after just one of these horrific defensive performances we've strung together.

Maybe he is doing that and it just isn't working with them, but if he is, I would have expected to see some evidence of it in our games.

 

[NTOP]

Uhhh...the city kids with talent now go to the prep schools.

It boggles the mind to think that uppity places like Episcopal Academy or Penn Charter (NOT a charter school.) are fielding better squads than Overbrook, Gratz & West Catholic in Philly. I'm sure they're getting tuition aid or full scholies....those places rival Shadyside or Sewickley for costs. $20K?? ???

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

if anyone doesn't clearly see that our perimeter is awful on both ends this season..which is why its a bad year...

you don't know what you're watching.

Barber and Lacey went for what, 52 combined yesterday.
Robinson, Wright, Newkirk, and Jones combined for 40 and Cam contributed 19 of those.

We lost by 11.

This isn't rocket surgery

All our problems start with a GOD AWFUL perimeter defense.

 

[pittman71]

do you guys really think one on one man to man defense is really as emphasized now as it was maybe 10 years ago? I ask because I see nearly EVERY team using ball screens; which means it doesn't matter how good of a one on one defender you are, if you don't know how to hedge/defend the on-ball screen you will be in trouble. Even last night for all the talk regarding how quick the NC State guards were nearly every time down the court they were able to penetrate ONLY because of the on-ball screen and Pitt's inability to defend it properly.

Guys like Newkirk are horrible on defense so opposing teams don't need to use an on ball screen for the man he is covering, but for Robinson and Wright I really don't see a huge issue with their initial man to man defense, it is when the opponents use the ball screen when everything breaks down.

 

[Atch]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Originally posted by SoufOaklin4Life:
Yeah...which is why I want to point out players like Gibbs and Ramon, Nas and Biggs...
limited athletes who played much more solid and good team defense, and were fundamentally solid.

I mean..I'd kill for a Page or Jaron, or even Antonio Graves...even would settle for Jermaine Dixon (at least defensively) or Gil Brown.


That's why I'm putting this on the coaches, primarily. They aren't reaching these kids and they sure aren't holding them accountable for this piss-poor defense.

Scotty Reynolds would kill for Jermaine and Gil again too.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Originally posted by Atch:

Originally posted by SoufOaklin4Life:
Yeah...which is why I want to point out players like Gibbs and Ramon, Nas and Biggs...
limited athletes who played much more solid and good team defense, and were fundamentally solid.

I mean..I'd kill for a Page or Jaron, or even Antonio Graves...even would settle for Jermaine Dixon (at least defensively) or Gil Brown.


That's why I'm putting this on the coaches, primarily. They aren't reaching these kids and they sure aren't holding them accountable for this piss-poor defense.

Scotty Reynolds would kill for Jermaine and Gil again too.

Well, that's why they are the lower tier of "settle for".

That's how bad we are right now.

 

[thebadby2]

Re: Uhhh...the city kids with talent now go to the prep schools.

Of course-maybe it softens some of 'em up. Those are run and gun, showcase your game and get a D1 ride, prep versions of Calipari's UK program. They don't work very hard on anything but their offense and their academic eligibility at those prep hoops factories. it's not like playing four years for Bob Hurley or the like. Kids that come out of those programs know how to set a screen, fight through a ball screen, and box out for a rebound. Tray Woodall wasn;t very skilled, but he had more toughness in his pinky finger than any guard on our roster--of course, we really only have two "guards". I don;t count Jones or the Johnsons--to me, they are 3s.

Of course, I'm not saying I'm right about this--but it's just something that occurred to me when I look at the makeup of our team now versus the makeup of our tougher teams back in the day.

Those private cakeater schools you mention aren't what I'm talking about--I'm talking about the prep hoops factories, the Our Saviors, Brewster Academies, etc. I'm exempting Oak Hill because they take the cream of the crop, most of them are can't miss top 50 kids.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Back to your Subject title.


"Priorty (sp) of this Coaching Staff for next Season".

I think you hit on something that has to change. And that is "coaching staff". Really would like to see 2 new guys come in, one obviously a better recruiter, but one who also has head coaching experience.

I still think that is lacking here. Would love to have had Ben here for a year or two as an assistant, I know that is a huge pipedream, but even the most experienced of coaches have coaches on their staff that have been head coaches.

And also....on those lines, it was almost annual thing where Pitt was losing an assistant each year to a head coaching job, and that was a good thing, We haven't had anyone leave for a head coaching job now in awhile.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Originally posted by recruitsreadtheseboards:

Back to your Subject title.


"Priorty (sp) of this Coaching Staff for next Season".

I think you hit on something that has to change. And that is "coaching staff". Really would like to see 2 new guys come in, one obviously a better recruiter, but one who also has head coaching experience.

I still think that is lacking here. Would love to have had Ben here for a year or two as an assistant, I know that is a huge pipedream, but even the most experienced of coaches have coaches on their staff that have been head coaches.

And also....on those lines, it was almost annual thing where Pitt was losing an assistant each year to a head coaching job, and that was a good thing, We haven't had anyone leave for a head coaching job now in awhile.

Now you're getting my intent.

I AM blaming the coaches primarily.

 

[NTOP]

I realize that they "factories" are different, but lots of players do

end up at legit "prep" schools. $$$$?? The junk schools are essentially AAU teams with dorms., and will eventually have their credentials questioned. At least I hope so.

 

[thebadby2]

Re: Recruit some tough minded SOB's to lock it down and a shooter or two

Reynolds wouldn't have needed any last second heroics against our current backcourt--of course, that game would never have been played in mid-late March, either.

 

[thebadby2]

Re: I realize that they "factories" are different, but lots of players do

We have a couple of the legit prep schools with big time hoops here in metro Detroit--they do give athletic scholarships to cover the $30,000/year tuition, but they are a very different story than the hoops factories. They are better coached and play a more structured game against a traditional schedule of the best H.S. teams in Michigan, as opposed to a "national" schedule of other prep hoop factories, which as you said, is just an extension of AAU ball. The best of them here for many years was Detroit Country Day, which yielded Chris Webber and Shane Battier, among dozens of other high D1 players. The legendary coach responsible for all that success retired after the 2012 season, and even though they still get top players, the hoops program has completely deflated. My niece is a senior at that school now, and is an excellent soccer player and top student headed to Northwestern next year.

 

[9nationalchampionships]

Starting JR art the point would be the definition of insanity.