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Aliquippa and WPIAL Playoff forfeits

If a family prioritizes their kid playing on a certain football team enough to actually pick up and move, I say it should be allowed. But none of this "Oh, I live with my fake uncle now" stuff. I realize it's probably a sensitive subject to uphold sometimes. Especially if there is a certain education program one school offers, like someone mentioned in Aliquippa... I'm sure that clouds the water a bit (even if it's a common sense observation to most people).

If a family moves, they should absolutely be allowed to play without penalty but the WPIAL decides which families move homes for athletic purposes which is crazy to me.

Living with an uncle or grandma, I still think should be allowed but if they aren't the legal guardian, then ok, I can see that being penalized.
 
How can someone get hurt. They were beating their competition badly and bringing an a large number of transfers.
These public schools are the ones who pushed for this rule because they felt private schools had an advantage
As I pointed out at the time, the worst offenders were some of the public schools in the WPIAL

Fair enough. My thinking is that a 1A school could have a season where only 20 kids want to play and they end up with 175-pounders on the line, which will likely never be the case for any 4A team.

But maybe it will never happen with Aliquippa, either.
 
That's insane. Regarding Aliquippa having to play up, it was quite a story. Basically the WPIAL has some rule where if win the championship for two years (I think that's the specifics but i could be wrong) then you have to play up a level.


Well that's not quite the rule. First of all, it's a PIAA rule, not a WPIAL rule. And secondly, someone could win the state football championship literally every single season, and if they don't have more than the prohibited number of transfers that school would never be forced to move up a class. It is only schools that win at a very high level AND that have a lot of transfers that are forced to play up from their previous class.

If you don't want to be forced to move up a class don't have so many transfers on your team. As others have pointed out, it's unlikely that people are moving to the Aliquippa school district for the education, so that means that all these football players are transferring there because, well, we all know why they are transferring there.
 
Well that's not quite the rule. First of all, it's a PIAA rule, not a WPIAL rule. And secondly, someone could win the state football championship literally every single season, and if they don't have more than the prohibited number of transfers that school would never be forced to move up a class. It is only schools that win at a very high level AND that have a lot of transfers that are forced to play up from their previous class.

If you don't want to be forced to move up a class don't have so many transfers on your team. As others have pointed out, it's unlikely that people are moving to the Aliquippa school district for the education, so that means that all these football players are transferring there because, well, we all know why they are transferring there.
My opinion on quippa and this rule was because they volunteered to play up two levels. The fact (if it is a fact) that they get 12 football transfers a year into their program is a whole other conversation.

honestly, I’m having a very hard time believing this. Even if it was 2-3 transfers a year, that is still very hard to believe. The WPIAL is notorious for ruling against any and all transfers no matter what yet they let a dozen go thru with aliquippa without a word?? Again, even cut that in half, 6 transfers is still unbelievable.
 
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My opinion on quippa and this rule was because they volunteered to play up two levels. The fact (if it is a fact) that they get 12 football transfers a year into their program is a whole other conversation.

honestly, I’m having a very hard time believing this. Even if it was 2-3 transfers a year, that is still very hard to believe.


It's not two or three transfers per year. It can be (for football) up to five transfers. Aliquippa's problem, as was brought up when this all happened last summer, is that their number is not 2 or 3 or 5, it's somewhere around 20.

They appealed the ruling when it first came out, saying that they were counting some people that they shouldn't (for whatever reason) be counting. But even the administration there admitted that if they didn't count all the people that Aliquippa didn't think they should count they would still be way over the limit.
 
It's not two or three transfers per year. It can be (for football) up to five transfers. Aliquippa's problem, as was brought up when this all happened last summer, is that their number is not 2 or 3 or 5, it's somewhere around 20.

They appealed the ruling when it first came out, saying that they were counting some people that they shouldn't (for whatever reason) be counting. But even the administration there admitted that if they didn't count all the people that Aliquippa didn't think they should count they would still be way over the limit.
Over the limit for what? Playing in triple A?
 
Over the limit for what? Playing in triple A?


Yeah, over the limit for not having to move up a class. Even if the PIAA allowed them to not count all the transfers that they didn't think they should have to count they still would have been way over five, which is the number you are allowed to have and not have to move up a class.

Note that they weren't even disputing that all those kids transferred in. Their argument was that unlike everyone else in the state that if someone transferred in for what they thought was a good reason they shouldn't have to count them like everyone else has to.
 
Yeah, over the limit for not having to move up a class. Even if the PIAA allowed them to not count all the transfers that they didn't think they should have to count they still would have been way over five, which is the number you are allowed to have and not have to move up a class.

Note that they weren't even disputing that all those kids transferred in. Their argument was that unlike everyone else in the state that if someone transferred in for what they thought was a good reason they shouldn't have to count them like everyone else has to.
So they said they shouldn’t have to move up a class because they didn’t count kids that they should have. But they moved up two classes anyways, then had the wpial move them up a third class.


So what are we arguing. Quippa says they should be single A, you are saying they should be double A but they volunteered to play in triple A and the wpial has them playing in Quad A.


This is so confusing.
 
Transfers or not, they are still half the size of any school in the classification they are playing in.
 
So what are we arguing. Quippa says they should be single A, you are saying they should be double A but they volunteered to play in triple A and the wpial has them playing in Quad A.


Aliquippa isn't saying they should be single A, they are saying they should be 3A. The PIAA (not the WPIAL) is saying that they were 3A but because they met the criteria for teams to have to move up a class they are 4A.

I am saying that it doesn't really matter to me what the rules are, but that everyone should have to follow them equally. Aliquippa for some reason seems to think that the rules shouldn't apply to them, and that they shouldn't have to count a rather large number of transfers that literally every other school in the state would have to count.
 
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Aliquippa isn't saying they should be single A, they are saying they should be 3A. The PIAA (not the WPIAL) is saying that they were 3A but because they met the criteria for teams to have to move up a class they are 4A.

I am saying that it doesn't really matter to me what the rules are, but that everyone should have to follow them equally. Aliquippa for some reason seems to think that the rules shouldn't apply to them, and that they shouldn't have to count a rather large number of transfers that literally every other school in the state would have to count.
Thank you. I believe I now understand.
 
uhhh….let's say interesting description

Haha, touche. They lost to Belle Vernon 20-0, only beat Trinity 10-7, only beat West Mifflin 12-7, and beat Uniontown 35-20.

By contrast, TJ beat Belle Vernon 42-21, beat Trinity 51-14, beat West Mifflin 52-0, and beat Uniontown 58-0.. So you're looking at a difference of 165 points in those four games.

I wouldn't have expected McKeesport pulling this one off. Guess it's why they play the game.
 
It's a PIAA rule and Aliquippa wasn't the only school to have this happen. With all of the transfers, they aren't "poor little Aliquippa playing up and getting hosed." Supposedly they have something like two dozen kids who are transfers. That's an awful lot and it's certainly not because of academics or some sort of STEM program.
Two dozen? LMAO They barely have two dozen kids on the team. They have two transfers and one is a kicker. Do your homework!
 
How can someone get hurt. They were beating their competition badly and bringing an a large number of transfers.
These public schools are the ones who pushed for this rule because they felt private schools had an advantage
As I pointed out at the time, the worst offenders were some of the public schools in the WPIAL
The Middle school team beat North Allegheny 41-0 with NO transfers.
 
Haha, touche. They lost to Belle Vernon 20-0, only beat Trinity 10-7, only beat West Mifflin 12-7, and beat Uniontown 35-20.

By contrast, TJ beat Belle Vernon 42-21, beat Trinity 51-14, beat West Mifflin 52-0, and beat Uniontown 58-0.. So you're looking at a difference of 165 points in those four games.

I wouldn't have expected McKeesport pulling this one off. Guess it's why they play the game.
yeah, guess that explains why TJ never played up.
 
yeah, guess that explains why TJ never played up.

Does McKeesport have any prospects? I thought this was generally regarded as a pretty weak team for them. I know they're 6-1 or whatever, but that doesn't always mean much in some of these divisions.
 
My buddy is TJ alum under Cherp. Said this is the first home loss since 2004...if true that's amazing. He also could have said 2014, it was a quick convo.

First home loss since they lost to Belle Vernon in 2015.

yeah, guess that explains why TJ never played up.

I never understood why TJ never played up. I suppose they value WPIAL title and state playoffs more than anything else because winning every week by 40 points and only playing one or two competitive games a year (including PIAA playoffs probably gets a bit stale).

FWIW, TJ scored a TD to tie but it was called back due to a penalty. I actually think they had three penalties after huge plays on their final drive. McKeesport could lose 3 games and play any of the best teams close. TJ is also a team that could win by 40 in a rematch. That’s how these two teams roll.
 
They have two transfers and one is a kicker. Do your homework!


Well that's silly. The reason that they had to play up was because they had more than the five transfers allowed. The administration fought the notion that there were around 20, but even they admitted in their appeal that there were far more than the five allowed. Their argument was never that they didn't have more than five, it was that the rule shouldn't apply to them like it does to everyone else.

If they actually only had two transfers then that would have been their argument on the appeal, and if that was actually true they would have won their appeal. That they did no such thing tells you all you need to know about the idea that they only have two transfers.
 
Two dozen? LMAO They barely have two dozen kids on the team. They have two transfers and one is a kicker. Do your homework!

Wrong. The 20+ was over the 3 year measurement period
Aliquippa themselves admitted they were over the limit
 
Two dozen? LMAO They barely have two dozen kids on the team. They have two transfers and one is a kicker. Do your homework!

You may want to check the number of players they have listed on their school website and Max Preps. Way more than two dozen.
 
Does McKeesport have any prospects? I thought this was generally regarded as a pretty weak team for them. I know they're 6-1 or whatever, but that doesn't always mean much in some of these divisions.
I was going between games, but McKeesport looked like a good team from what I saw. It wasn’t a fluke that they won.
 
I think what it comes down to is that if you live in a neighboring town and are good at football, you are more inclined to rent an apartment in Aliquippa to play football there and unless it can be proven that the family isn't living there, I dont know how you can justify penalizing that.
That's exactly what happened. The kid that transferred from Africa never even saw a football before this season.
 
That's exactly what happened.


So after all this, now you agree with SMF that exactly what happened was that a bunch of kids who lived in neighboring towns moved to Alliquippa to play football. Which is exactly what the PIAA said happened, and exactly why they were required to move up a class.

I mean I guess what I can't figure out is why you think that when kids do that they aren't transfers? Isn't that exactly what a transfer is? In fact, if they actually did what you are agreeing with SMF that they did, shouldn't you also be saying that since they transferred to Alliquippa for athletic reasons that the individual players also should have have had to sit out one season, since that is, after all, the rule?

In short, why is it that you (and lots of other people from Alliquippa) don't think that the rules should apply to them?
 
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