Big XII preparing to invite up to six PAC-12 schools

JS School

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I've lived in North Carolina for 28 years, and I agree about the Duke comment. However, UNC is very popular throughout the state, just as NCSU is. Maybe even as close as 50 / 50 between the two.
My friend grew up in a small town NE of Raleigh, so I assume NC State is the overwhelming favorite there. With the growth of the Triangle, 50/50 sounds about right.
 

pittdan77

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Playing Devil’s advocate: there are zero programs in the Big XII that are currently desired by the Big Ten and SEC. Perhaps they’re actually the most stable conference in college football outside of those two?

The problem the Big12 and Pac12 have had with TV is that the majority of their schools either lacked a big fan base or were centered well outside of media markets that mattered. Now, the biggest media draws in each of those conferences is gone. Truthfully, the Pac12 still has some decent markets but they have a schedule problem because casual viewership is still rooted east of the Mississippi and their conference network never really took off. The Big12 had the Longhorn Network and mythical "Tier 3" rights that always seemed inflated. Now they're basically in the same situation as the ACC but the ACC has an established conference network that has schools in the some of the most saturated media markets in the east and has a national cable/satellite footprint. The Big12 at least has some reach east so it stands a chance but I'm not sure the media deal will be worth a ton without a national footprint. And there isn't anything holding any of those schools in place for a couple years.
 

HailToPitt725

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The problem the Big12 and Pac12 have had with TV is that the majority of their schools either lacked a big fan base or were centered well outside of media markets that mattered. Now, the biggest media draws in each of those conferences is gone. Truthfully, the Pac12 still has some decent markets but they have a schedule problem because casual viewership is still rooted east of the Mississippi and their conference network never really took off. The Big12 had the Longhorn Network and mythical "Tier 3" rights that always seemed inflated. Now they're basically in the same situation as the ACC but the ACC has an established conference network that has schools in the some of the most saturated media markets in the east and has a national cable/satellite footprint. The Big12 at least has some reach east so it stands a chance but I'm not sure the media deal will be worth a ton without a national footprint. And there isn't anything holding any of those schools in place for a couple years.

Agreed. Like I said in the other thread, I think what’s helping us even more than the GOR is the fact that ESPN has a vested interested in our success through the ACC Network. And even if we lose the schools I’ve been mentioning, our average payout per school will likely trump whatever the Big XII and what remains of the PAC-12 receive.
 
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Don’t count Heather out!

Thanks for posting that. The B10 certainly is Pitt’s unholy grail (it grates more than ever now that Pitt screwed up being part of the B10 so many decades ago, and then screwed up again in the early 80s… the idea that garbage like Rutgers and Northwestern are sitting comfortably is galling).

However, I can’t imagine Lyke’s mere acquaintance with individuals in B10 schools helps anything. Lots of people know lots of people. And the straw grasp at the Addison and Pickett accolades last season as reasons to include Pitt was a nice try, but of course, both of them are now long gone. The article may as well have included AD, TD, and Fitz as well, for as relevant as former stars are to the issue.

But at least it is nice that Pitt’s ‘flagship’ station put something positive and encouraging out there. I’m sure it belies the attitudes of most of its talk show hosts. Especially the one who still won’t acknowledge Sandusky’s guilt.
 

pittdan77

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Agreed. Like I said in the other thread, I think what’s helping us even more than the GOR is the fact that ESPN has a vested interested in our success through the ACC Network. And even if we lose the schools I’ve been mentioning, our average payout per school will likely trump whatever the Big XII and what remains of the PAC-12 receive.
Personally, if the powers that be decide to move some schools out of the ACC for greener pastures, there will be other schools moved in. There are too many decent media markets in the ACC footprint to just leave it die.
 

37tosspowertrap

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Contrary to what you may think, WVU would bend over backwards to get Pitt chosen to join the Big 12 over other ACC teams. Not sure we would have the clout but we would try. It is a great rivalry game that has TV appeal.
From another Mountaineer, I think there would be great support to have Pitt in the Big 12. When this shook out the last go around, we would have rather ended up somewhere else in possibly the ACC or SEC, but we had to take the Big 12 invite to survive. It would be great to play again every year. IMO, it's one of the best rivalries in college football.
 
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HailToPitt725

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Personally, if the powers that be decide to move some schools out of the ACC for greener pastures, there will be other schools moved in. There are too many decent media markets in the ACC footprint to just leave it die.
No doubt. If ESPN is committed to keeping the ACC around, I think we’d be able to attract any non-Big Ten or SEC school. Perhaps that’s some of the PAC-12 leftovers or maybe the eastern Big XII schools. Either way, I think we can position ourselves as the next best power conference after those two.
 
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Dointhatrag

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this discussion is not about conference but TV networks when it comes to which chess pieces will be played. As long as ACC teams dont jump to the Big 10/Pac12 there isnt a need to move them to the SEC. ESPN/ABC has the ACC/SEC locked in through 2034. They will want to keep both leagues viable.

Next 12 months. Big 10 contract: Fox has to keep this right? should be a big payout. Maybe they attempt a game of the week on CBS as well to replace the SEC

2025 is the next big time when ND and B12 open up. ESPN/ABC have enough content. They dont need the B12. They will put the push to get ND into the ACC by 2025.

B12 will help fill out the fox content likely or if NBC/CBS want to stay in the game maybe go there.

  • ACC - Committed to ABC/ESPN through 2036 at $17 million per school
  • Big Ten - 50/50 split of top tier rights between Fox and ESPN/ABC through 2022-23 at $31.4 million per school
  • Big XII - 50/50 split of rights between Fox and ESPN/ABC through 2025 at $20 million per school. (The rights to Oklahoma and Texas are locked in through 2025 as well.)
  • Pac-12 - 50/50 split of top tier rights between Fox and ESPN/ABC through 2024 at $21 million per school.
  • SEC - Starting with the 2024 football season, committed to ABC/ESPN through 2034 at $44 million per school. This number will likely change once Oklahoma and Texas join.
So who has room in their schedule for games?

  • ABC/ESPN - Fully committed across ABC, ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNews and ESPNU. Existing Big Ten rights expire in summer 2023, and adding additional SEC games (from CBS) starting in the fall of 2024.
  • CBS - Losing SEC after the 2024 season. Only other rights are mostly cable rights on CBSSN to the Mountain West and Big East basketball.
  • Fox - Fully committed across Fox and FS1. FS2 has limited distribution, resulting in overflow games being pushed to Fox Business and even Fox News.
  • NBC - Notre Dame home games through 2025 at $15 million per year. With the shutdown of NBCSN, many sports now air on CNBC and USA.
  • Turner - No college sports on TBS, TNT or TruTV other than the men’s NCAA basketball tournament.
 

joeydavid

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Exactly what i stated yesterday and all of a sudden im a troll.

We should do anything in our power to get out of the new ACC and in an expanded Big 12. Given our geography, brand, logistics for multiple team events, we would be given serious consideration.

The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's leave a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences for a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
 

pittmeister

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The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's leave a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences for a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
BINGO!
 

Las Panteras

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The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's stay in a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences leaving us in a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
fixed.

Cheers........
 

Las Panteras

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The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's leave a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences for a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
in the following scenario, where the Big 12 adds PAc schools....and the ACC likely loses its biggest brand names,

please tell me you are joking when you say we should stay here. And maybe add...I dont know, USF?

A re-stocked big 12 will renegotiate their TV deal, pay out more to members than a gutted ACC

but you want to stay here for .....

well, for what exactly?
 

HailToPitt725

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in the following scenario, where the Big 12 adds PAc schools....and the ACC likely loses its biggest brand names,

please tell me you are joking when you say we should stay here. And maybe add...I dont know, USF?

A re-stocked big 12 will renegotiate their TV deal, pay out more to members than a gutted ACC

but you want to stay here for .....

well, for what exactly?
Question: would the existing tv deal with ESPN remain intact if four schools leave the ACC? If so, I think we’d absolutely pay out more than the Big XII. The per-school distribution would go up with less schools in the conference and we’d distribute the GOR exit fees as well. We’d be in trouble after 2036, but it’d at least be a short-term solution.
 
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RaleighPittFan

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The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's leave a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences for a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
That fact is intentionally overlooked.
 
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Zeldas Open Roof

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The only reason the B12 is "stable" is because the only desirable programs already bounced. The remaining schools are stuck because no one wants any of them. Yeah, let's leave a conference because others in the conference are desirable to other conferences for a conference with teams no one wants. Brilliant.
it would be like breaking up with your hot girlfriend because she is probably gonna cheat on you and replace her with a homely looking chubby but kind of cute girl who you know will do whatever you want, whenever you want because she just wants to tell her friends she has a boyfriend..

i mean, when you put it like that, it kinda makes sense.
 

pittmeister

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QUESTION: What’s going to happen when schools like Texas and Oklahoma become perennial 6-5 teams year after year? What kind of support will they get? Fans, boosters and alumni want CHAMPIONSHIPS, they don’t care about branding, or how much a school will get by moving to a better conference. They want to win . Somebody has to finish in the bottom half. Texas & Oklahoma in my opinion made a serious mistake.
 

Dan1911

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Thanks for posting that. The B10 certainly is Pitt’s unholy grail (it grates more than ever now that Pitt screwed up being part of the B10 so many decades ago, and then screwed up again in the early 80s… the idea that garbage like Rutgers and Northwestern are sitting comfortably is galling).

However, I can’t imagine Lyke’s mere acquaintance with individuals in B10 schools helps anything. Lots of people know lots of people. And the straw grasp at the Addison and Pickett accolades last season as reasons to include Pitt was a nice try, but of course, both of them are now long gone. The article may as well have included AD, TD, and Fitz as well, for as relevant as former stars are to the issue.

But at least it is nice that Pitt’s ‘flagship’ station put something positive and encouraging out there. I’m sure it belies the attitudes of most of its talk show hosts. Especially the one who still won’t acknowledge Sandusky’s guilt.
Pitt was offered to the Big 10? When?
 

Zeldas Open Roof

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QUESTION: What’s going to happen when schools like Texas and Oklahoma become perennial 6-5 teams year after year? What kind of support will they get? Fans, boosters and alumni want CHAMPIONSHIPS, they don’t care about branding, or how much a school will get by moving to a better conference. They want to win . Somebody has to finish in the bottom half. Texas & Oklahoma in my opinion made a serious mistake.
well that is pretty much Texas' records now and they still have a cult like following and make more money from boosters than any other school in the country. So i dont think it matters.

Last 8 years below:

5-7
7-3
8-5
10-4
7-6
5-7
5-7
6-7
 

pittdan77

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it would be like breaking up with your hot girlfriend because she is probably gonna cheat on you and replace her with a homely looking chubby but kind of cute girl who you know will do whatever you want, whenever you want because she just wants to tell her friends she has a boyfriend..

i mean, when you put it like that, it kinda makes sense.
I kinda feel attacked.
 
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happjack

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Pitt was offered to the Big 10? When?
Pitt was never really offered, they were a leading candidate to replace the U of Chicago but the Big 10 went with Michigan State instead. If I remember the story Beano Cook used to tell, Michigan wanted Pitt purely to keep MSU out, the other Big 9 schools sided with MSU to spite The Wolverines.
 

HailToPitt725

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Pitt was never really offered, they were a leading candidate to replace the U of Chicago but the Big 10 went with Michigan State instead. If I remember the story Beano Cook used to tell, Michigan wanted Pitt purely to keep MSU out, the other Big 9 schools sided with MSU to spite The Wolverines.
Did the Big Ten hate Michigan that much back then? I guess they were the most successful program in the conference at the time.
 

pittmeister

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well that is pretty much Texas' records now and they still have a cult like following and make more money from boosters than any other school in the country. So i dont think it matters.

Last 8 years below:

5-7
7-3
8-5
10-4
7-6
5-7
5-7
6-7
Very true. However being in the Big 12 gave them legitimate hope of turning it around. Now they’ll be competing with schools that have the same financial resources they have.

If they can’t win now against teams that are financial inferior, how are they going to win year after year against teams that are on the same level?

Attendance and interest will dry up eventually across the board. Pro football is so popular because every team is equal. Every team has a legit chance to turn it around quickly and become a contender. College football will become the MLB…
 

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