Carr is leaving per Evan Daniels
- Thread starter pitt2010
- Start date
After the past few years getting in with the top 25-30 schools is pretty damn good for a start.
It's a national sports writer making the comment, which is good for Capel and good for Pitt. But, you're welcome to dismiss it.
Capel is the first one there, while Stallings was busy sleeping.
Luther wouldn’t start on any good Pitt team during the Dixon yrs . Miller lost a lot of his recruits is the only reason I can think of for Ryan even being offered . Being the best player on Pitts current team and being impactful at Az are two entirely different things . He will not duplicate his numbers at Az .
In Carr’s case I’m not sure what he’s thinking . My guess is that when he meet JC the conversation didn’t go to MC liking . He’s not a pg , but maybe that’s the position he wants to play .
Stewart can be a weapon on the right team . Great shooters are born not made .
My guess is that the guys leaving Pitt want to put a bad experience behind them and are also concerned for their future PT .
Bottom line none of the guys staying or leaving ( including your boy wonder Golden ) are the type of players Pitt needs to become competitive . Give JC time and these guys will come to Pitt .
I understand your point but the first things that came to mind were:
1. Stallings was 0-19 in his second year
2. Stallings was hired through an alleged shady deal
3. True or not it appeared Stallings was saved from being fired by the alleged shady deal
4. Capel is a couple decades younger than Stallings and may have more appeal to the prospective recruits
5. I have not heard Capel blame academic standards for his past failures...I am not saying he didn't make excuses, but I am unaware of them.
6. Stallings had the benefit of coming into a situation with players on the roster looking forward to a change in offense and approach, and he destroyed that momentum with boorish behavior as early as the Duquense game in his first season.
Could not agree more with point #1.
If Capel goes 0-19 this year it’s a bad sign, but somewhat understandable. If he goes 0-19 in year 2 like Stallings did only then would I qualify him as an absolute bust.
I was responding to Gary2 who said we are in with the top 25-30 schools but haven’t landed any. In with means recruiting the same level of players. Which is true. So it is really your comprehension of facts that should be questioned.
Oh. I didn’t realize he already committed to Pitt over the other 38 schools that have offered him.
Good basketball teams usually have battle tested upperclassmen mixed in with talented underclassmen. Great teams have talented, battle tested upperclassmen mixed with talented, but inexperience underclassmen. You have to be good before you can be great, and we could have used Carr and Stewart for the next three years no matter who Capel brings in.
I think Capel will be the best recruiter Pitt has had in decades, but I really doubt we’ll see much evidence of that in this narrow window he has to fill the 2018 class.
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And you are assuming everything goes sideways for HCJC. Not one player that left was anything close to a difference maker. They might be a decent player on a good team? Not that hard to replace. They will lose with or without them who comes in will determine if they win more than the last year now the guys still here or who left.
Idk on that.
5-13 is only (possibly) a couple wins from being a bubble NCAA team.
1-17 is one of the worst power five teams in the country again.
5-13 also shows a solid amount of improvement.
Geez you’d think Pitts breaking up the 1970’s Steelers ! I constantly tried to remind everyone that these freshman were put into an unfair situation last season , but these guys even as upperclassmen weren’t going to compete for an ACC title . Everyone needs to take a step back from the ledge , JC needs to reestablish Pitt as a place good bb players want to go , let him do his thing . The man knows how to recruit and he knows how to evaluate talent . I doubt that he’ll be as successful in landing Duke type talent to Pitt , but there’s nothing wrong with the next step down . Next season hopefully will be a stepping stone to better days it was never going to be a tourament yr .
It’s always sad Pitt has fans that hopes the new coach fails just so they can say “I was right”
Nothing you wrote here contradicts my point. Carr could’ve stayed here and played meaningful minutes for three more years. Capel would also recruit over him sooner or later. I don’t know why you’re getting bent out of shape about it.
There is no need to show improvement. The players were and are mostly bad. “Improvement” will be recruiting better players to join and/or replace them.
What difference does it make if Capel gets every ounce of effort out of these kids and their ceiling is 5-13? That’s still a really bad record. We need a team with players who can do better than 5-13.
Much of this is true, although it does preclude the possibility that Carr would continue to improve as a player as his career went on. Maybe he does and maybe he doesn’t, but I think he was one of the guys I would’ve liked to see stay.
Stewart was gone the second KS was fired and there was nothing JC could’ve have done .
We don’t know either Carr’s or JC thoughts , but Carr was sujected to the worst bb experience of his life last season . He was placed in a position that was really unfair , was constantly being criticized by the fan base and was a member of a winless conference team . I doubt that he enjoyed his time here at Pitt .
I know it’s hard to believe , but these kids liked and respected KS and his staff , I guess if you wanted Parker , Carr and Luther to stay and Golden and Kingsby to come to Pitt then you needed KS to be retained .
I’ll take JC and his staff over KS , his staff and all those players and I don’t care what 2018 brings as far as W&L’s are concerned . You need to take a longer view approach to Pitt bb .
I’m sure Pitt will field a better team than last season and then a better team the season after that ......
When they sign, I'll say, "Okay, great trade-off". I'm a PITT fan, call me skeptical until they are pulling up their socks during an opening tip in early
November.
Judging by the offers that Stewart, Carr and Golden are apparently getting...you're off. Again.
Totally different. Stallings had no one to retain in terms of young talent w/ any experience once Luther got hurt. Unless you don't believe Cam's dad. Capel had the opportunity to keep a couple guys that had significant minutes in the ACC and couldn't get it done.
I believe JC can get it done, but it still doesn't mean KS shouldn't have been kept another year. JC was still there next year to pluck.
When JC signs some YOUNG players for the 2018 class, I'll happily admit that I was wrong.
Just my opinions--
Stallings sealed his fate when he decided to IMO unnecessarily blow up an entire roster and was unable to replace it with a better one.
I doubt Capel tried very hard to keep Carr, Luther and Golden. Probably told them no more than a "you can stay if you want." IMHO, he is just as happy to have their ships to use on more talented recruits for this year or next.
I believe there is no doubt Capel will add good replacements by September.
Stallings sealed his fate when he decided to IMO unnecessarily blow up an entire roster and was unable to replace it with a better one.
I doubt Capel tried very hard to keep Carr, Luther and Golden. Probably told them no more than a "you can stay if you want." IMHO, he is just as happy to have their ships to use on more talented recruits for this year or next.
I believe there is no doubt Capel will add good replacements by September.
My bad. He would have to redshirt one year at Pitt and graduate after three years here to get 2 post grad years. That’s what Cam did right?!
I believe that is accurate. In any event, ny understanding is a player has 5 years available to get in 4 playing seasons overall--occasionally 6 years to do it-- if granted an injury hardship waiver.
Not at all bent out of shape. My only point is the program would be better off with him by any measure, and every program needs some capable upperclassmen. I think he will get his share of minutes anywhere he goes regardless of roster makeup, as he would have at Pitt the next 3 years no matter who Capel brings in.. He's a legit D1 player who is just getting his feet wet.
I've had a long view approach to Pitt athletics for 35 years. I'e had to reset it to zero about 20 times. Forget about winning--you have to put a team on the floor in 2018-19. This isn't Hoosiers, 4 marginal guys and the team manager aren't going to cut it. Right now we can't do that--and Capel may be an ace recruiter, but there aren't many pretty girls left without dance partners right now, and Pitt isn't a very attractive option for good players and good transfers that have lots of 2018 options. It would take a minor miracle to fill this roster with capable P5 players for 2018. 2019 is the chance for Capel to begin to show what he's got as a recruiter.
It's not remotely fair to blame Capel for failing to keep the guys that are leaving, just as it wasn't fair to blame Stalling for failing to retain Cam.. Luther in particular has been through 3 staffs and a lot of misery at Pitt. Why wouldn't he take his last shot at having some fun playing college basketball? Cam was a less than nothing recruit who played his way to becoming a hot commodity--so he did what was best for his future.
That’s why I’m not really concerned with next yrs record . I’d like to see personal improvement in the holdover players and I’m sure there will be a few positive additions .
I never held KS accountable for the first recruiting class either .
It doesn't sound like he has a UM offer at this point. He seems to be a backup option, which is extremely common. I would bet he ends up at Minnesota or Marquette and his coach is fired before he plays a 2nd year for them.
You gave Stallings blind faith after an 0-19 2nd season, a complete screw up in 2016-17, and a bad end to tenure at Vandy. The situations are vastly different. If Capel goes 0-19 in year 2, no one should give him any support.
Except Cam left after a year under Stallings where the team went from NCAAT to 4-14 in the ACC. The situations are vastly different.
What are those offers? For Carr it seems like he will likely get offers from Minnesota and Marquette. Those are two schools who are very, very likely to be hiring new HCs in the next 2 years. Michigan has him as a backup plan.
What are Stewarts offers?
Yeah, I don't know where some guys are seeing these great offers for Carr and Stewart. As you said, Carr will probably land in a very tenuous situation if he lands at Marquette. And I doubt Michigan will ever happen. Most P6 schools like to have guys who can play defense. Carr is suspect in that department. He would have been better off staying at Pitt, even if he were a backup. But he's a kid and kids make a lot of mistakes.
And Stewart? I haven't heard of any real offers for him. If there was anything or anyone serious, an offer would have been out there already.
With the interest that a couple of high quality PG's are showing Pitt and Capel recently that are in the 2018 class, one a top 50 player, I think there is at least some optimism that Pitt will be just fine without a Carr. Here's hoping at least one of them commits.
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