How Pitt is going to try and fix its defense

[steel_curtain]

Current defense

LB starters

Matt Galambos- 4.9 40
Seun Idowu- 4.92 40
Mike Caprara 4.94 40

Secondary

Terrish Webb 4.6 40
Reggie Mitchell 4.62 40
Ryan Lewis 4.56 40
Avonte Maddux 4.55 40


-Anyone else see a problem here with this? This is high school level size, speed, and athletic ability, not even mac level. That and all 7 of these players are undersized. Smurf U defense with turtle speed.




-How this can change with the last couple recruiting classes

LB

Cam Bright- 6'1 4.5 40
Chase Pine 6'4 4.64 40
Kyle Nunn 6'3 4.72 40
Saleem Brightwell 6'1 4.6 40
Anthony Mckee 6'1 4.55 40
Elijah Zeise 6'2 unknown 40

Secondary

Damar Hamlin- 6'1 4.5 40
Jordan Whitehead 6'0 4.52 40
Paris Ford 6'1 4.45 40
Therran Coleman 6'1 4.56 40
Bricen Garner 6'2 4.6 40
Damarri Mathis 6'0 4.68 40 (has a 41 inch vertical however)
Phil Campbell 6'1 4.6 40
Henry Miller 6'3 4.45 40


-Need to keep recruiting athletes in the next 2 classes and still need much more at lb. But at least the 2 recent classes have size, athletes, and speed. Now just need to coach them up. But at least the defense has decent "potential" here to get better now that I look at this more closely.

 

[Cap pitt]

Other then the northwestern game Pitts run defense was pretty darn good, the pass D needs a lot of help, hopefully the newer, bigger, more athletic secondary guys that you listed above will fix that problem. People say that Pitts D was horrible, only the pass D was horrible

 

[BuffetParrothead]

Current defense

LB starters

Matt Galambos- 4.9 40
Seun Idowu- 4.92 40
Mike Caprara 4.94 40

Secondary

Terrish Webb 4.6 40
Reggie Mitchell 4.62 40
Ryan Lewis 4.56 40
Avonte Maddux 4.55 40


-Anyone else see a problem here with this? This is high school level size, speed, and athletic ability, not even mac level. That and all 7 of these players are undersized. Smurf U defense with turtle speed.




-How this can change with the last couple recruiting classes

LB

Cam Bright- 6'1 4.5 40
Chase Pine 6'4 4.64 40
Kyle Nunn 6'3 4.72 40
Saleem Brightwell 6'1 4.6 40
Anthony Mckee 6'1 4.55 40
Elijah Zeise 6'2 unknown 40

Secondary

Damar Hamlin- 6'1 4.5 40
Jordan Whitehead 6'0 4.52 40
Paris Ford 6'1 4.45 40
Therran Coleman 6'1 4.56 40
Bricen Garner 6'2 4.6 40
Damarri Mathis 6'0 4.68 40 (has a 41 inch vertical however)
Phil Campbell 6'1 4.6 40
Henry Miller 6'3 4.45 40


-Need to keep recruiting athletes in the next 2 classes and still need much more at lb. But at least the 2 recent classes have size, athletes, and speed. Now just need to coach them up. But at least the defense has decent "potential" here to get better now that I look at this more closely.

"they be slow"

Dont worry they're small but they're slow?

 

[sappycrease]

But are the new replacements good at football?

 

[88Pitt88]

Starting this season, the level of athlete that we put out there is going to be better at every defensive position except for Price. Since we are young, mistakes will be made, but as they gain experience, we should see real improvement. We need a healthy Hendrix this year and the young linebackers to step up.

The secondary will be like night and day as compared with last year. We will have two of the best safeties in the entire country playing together. Therefore, don't expect running backs and receivers to be running wild in our secondary anymore. These guys are erasers and I can't wait to watch them play!

 

[Farnox]

Listen to the Rob Harley interview. With the game changing to more of a passing game and they are
recruiting accordingly. The kids they are targeting for linebackers have to be able to run.

 

[Jpripper88]

Other then the northwestern game Pitts run defense was pretty darn good, the pass D needs a lot of help, hopefully the newer, bigger, more athletic secondary guys that you listed above will fix that problem. People say that Pitts D was horrible, only the pass D was horrible

The run defense actually wasn't all that good either. The stats are skewed because of 2 things: 1. People chose to throw A LOT; 2. We blitz all the time and got sacks and college football still moronically counts that in with our "rush defense" even though they aren't rushing plays. For instance, we gave up 106 yards on 24 carries for a 4.4ypc to Villanova, but the stat sheet will show 43 yards on 31 carries because of our sacks. It was similar for PSU. They really ran for 108 on 24 carries, but with counting sacks it would come in at 69 yards and 31 carries. Vastly different stories. Even the Marshall game is 26 for 128 vs. 30 for 104. That takes it from about 5ypc to 3.4ypc. That is a really big difference.

We still have a lot of improving to do against the run.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

I would throw in that the offense was a contributing problem for the defense. Its not a good thing when any defense, even a good one, has to spend too much time on the field. With an offense that practically scored at will in a number of games we had a gassed weak defense--not solely a weak one.

Question--are Steel's stats old high school soph or junior year stats that the recruiting sites published or are they real ones measured by the Pitt staff during recruiting or even more recently. It is pretty hard for me to believe those numbers are really that bad--at least based on the one data point I have--wife's nephew (a HS Pro-Style QB) attended a Pitt camp 2 summers ago and I watched him get timed at 4.7 in the 40--and he looked lumbering to me. Given that it is hard for me to believe Pitt would recruit LBs who timed in the 4.9 range--those are DT numbers.

 

[Swervin27]

I am anxious to see any technique changes with our CBs.. They went in depth here with this "in phase" or whatever they call it, which sounds like basically playing inside, jam at the line and run next to, playing inside and facing the WR. Please correct me if im wrong. The problem as I saw it was our CBs were not physical, whiffing at the line which left them trailing by a yard and having their back to the QB (Making it impossible to turn around to make play on the ball).

I was very confused by this technique so I youtubed some of the highlights from that MSU CB who got drafted a year or two ago. Robinson maybe? Forget his name now. Anyways, that guy who played under duzzer always seemed to be either next to or even ahead of the CB, allowing him time to turn around, turn in, and make the plays. Now this was a highlight film so it was all good plays and they didn't show him jamming the WR either..

So in short, If Duzzer is gonna stick by this technique for the CBs, think the easiest and most important fix is to get guys that can actually jam the WR a bit because this 5'9" CB trailing the WR by a yard and having his back to the QB is going to literally drive us all insane..

 

[mike 301]

I really gotta question the OP 40 times from current players . Especially the Lbs .
Link ? Youre telling me we have/had 3 starting Lbs. that ran damn near a 5 second 40 ? No way .

 

[9nationalchampionships]

Recruiting bigger CBs and teaching them to be more physical will change our D dramatically. The article that came out within the last few days saying that we were going to recruit CBs that look like the Steelers. Coach said looking at the Steelers' CBs at practice told them what they needed to know. Let's see how it works. No more 5'8" CBs!

I am anxious to see any technique changes with our CBs.. They went in depth here with this "in phase" or whatever they call it, which sounds like basically playing inside, jam at the line and run next to, playing inside and facing the WR. Please correct me if im wrong. The problem as I saw it was our CBs were not physical, whiffing at the line which left them trailing by a yard and having their back to the QB (Making it impossible to turn around to make play on the ball).

I was very confused by this technique so I youtubed some of the highlights from that MSU CB who got drafted a year or two ago. Robinson maybe? Forget his name now. Anyways, that guy who played under duzzer always seemed to be either next to or even ahead of the CB, allowing him time to turn around, turn in, and make the plays. Now this was a highlight film so it was all good plays and they didn't show him jamming the WR either..

So in short, If Duzzer is gonna stick by this technique for the CBs, think the easiest and most important fix is to get guys that can actually jam the WR a bit because this 5'9" CB trailing the WR by a yard and having his back to the QB is going to literally drive us all insane..

 

[Swervin27]

the smaller/quicker CBs are fine but just play to their strengths. square peg round hole.

 

[9nationalchampionships]

I think the way Coach wants the CBs to play it is too hard for a shorter CB to be his WR from catching the ball. In the interim I agree with playing techniques that fit the current CB.

How tall is Hamlin really? I see a few different heights listed.

the smaller/quicker CBs are fine but just play to their strengths. square peg round hole.

 

[TheNoise88]

It's a good start. Can these guys actually play (aka get coached up) of course is the question, and how fast. Took Jester Weah 3 years until he could literally hold on to a single pass in a game. Past physical marvels produced little, whether through their own inadequacies or incompetent or staid coaches. Do we think Chryst would have gotten anything much out of Henderson for example? He might have run a clumsy reverse two or three a year with Henderson. Not as apples to oranges with defense but a concern as well given our poor house assistants. Duz can't be everywhere teaching all the time.

I really gotta question the OP 40 times from current players . Especially the Lbs .
Link ? Youre telling me we have/had 3 starting Lbs. that ran damn near a 5 second 40 ? No way .

I have more doubts that our previous LB were in the 4s at all. What is the symbol for "infinity" again?

 

[Jpripper88]

I really gotta question the OP 40 times from current players . Especially the Lbs .
Link ? Youre telling me we have/had 3 starting Lbs. that ran damn near a 5 second 40 ? No way .

Same question the other way with the recruits. Hell, steel extrapolates 40s from 100m times. Look at the NFL combine results and then look at some of the numbers steel posts from recruiting profiles.

 

[Swervin27]

I think the way Coach wants the CBs to play it is too hard for a shorter CB to be his WR from catching the ball. In the interim I agree with playing techniques that fit the current CB.

How tall is Hamlin really? I see a few different heights listed.

what boggles my mind is that our CBs were ALWAYS in this same position, 1yard trailing and facing towards the WR (Back to the QB). I Mean every single pass play. I know sometimes you get beat at the line but sometimes you don't. That leads me to believe that this is a technique thing. everyone screams "turn your head" but you cant turn your head 180 degrees while running full speed, you cant do it. Now you can slow down, turn your body and then look around but the WR would be 8 yards ahead of you if you did that.

This is what made me look up the youtube highlights of that MSU guy. I mean duzzi is a smart guy, what technique are they trying to do? Where is the CB supposed to be when the QB throws a lob-up for grabs pass along the sidelines. I've seen a ton of football and I've never seen a CB be tought to always have their back to the QB. So why is our CBs always like this? You cant tell me they screw up on their own on every damn pass play..

 

[MajorMajors]

For what it's worth, I happened to notice in the warmups before the Pinstripe game that Pitt's DBs were doing a drill where they contacted the "WR", then ran with them, then turned their head to catch a ball thrown by the coach. Maybe they did this drill all year, I don't know, but it seemed to specifically target the DB problem of not turning their heads to find the ball...

Go Pitt

 

[Swervin27]

For what it's worth, I happened to notice in the warmups before the Pinstripe game that Pitt's DBs were doing a drill where they contacted the "WR", then ran with them, then turned their head to catch a ball thrown by the coach. Maybe they did this drill all year, I don't know, but it seemed to specifically target the DB problem of not turning their heads to find the ball...

Go Pitt

stupid question I know but where they turning their head in or out? Meaning, if they were on the left sideline, where they turning their head left or back to the qb of over their right shoulder? If it's the latter, that tells me that the CBs were consistently being beaten at the line. If they are taught to look over their left shoulder on in, well I have no clue what the hell that means..

 

[SVPanther]

What difference does this make if we're going to load 9 guys in the box and let the corners out to dry? Is PN going to drop the safeties back this year? Possible, but hasn't been his MO in past.

 

[9nationalchampionships]

Lol. Be honest .... How many times did you yell "turn your head" as the ball was in the air?

what boggles my mind is that our CBs were ALWAYS in this same position, 1yard trailing and facing towards the WR (Back to the QB). I Mean every single pass play. I know sometimes you get beat at the line but sometimes you don't. That leads me to believe that this is a technique thing. everyone screams "turn your head" but you cant turn your head 180 degrees while running full speed, you cant do it. Now you can slow down, turn your body and then look around but the WR would be 8 yards ahead of you if you did that.

This is what made me look up the youtube highlights of that MSU guy. I mean duzzi is a smart guy, what technique are they trying to do? Where is the CB supposed to be when the QB throws a lob-up for grabs pass along the sidelines. I've seen a ton of football and I've never seen a CB be tought to always have their back to the QB. So why is our CBs always like this? You cant tell me they screw up on their own on every damn pass play..

 

[Swervin27]

Lol. Be honest .... How many times did you yell "turn your head" as the ball was in the air?

well I was a bad ass safety, (the bad ass could be debated). I agree, extremely hard and that's why most CBs will play inside, ride the WR on his back hip, with his body facing in (basically running parallel with the WR). So with this unorthodox "phase in" technique, you are setting your CB up for failure, unless they are in perfect position. That's why I'd love to understand this technique more because I am missing something. To me, a dumb fan, I see the risks but not the rewards..

I know duzzi is a million times smarter than me in the world of football, that's why I know I am missing something here with this.

 

[h2p_5150]

what boggles my mind is that our CBs were ALWAYS in this same position, 1yard trailing and facing towards the WR (Back to the QB). I Mean every single pass play. I know sometimes you get beat at the line but sometimes you don't. That leads me to believe that this is a technique thing. everyone screams "turn your head" but you cant turn your head 180 degrees while running full speed, you cant do it. Now you can slow down, turn your body and then look around but the WR would be 8 yards ahead of you if you did that.

This is what made me look up the youtube highlights of that MSU guy. I mean duzzi is a smart guy, what technique are they trying to do? Where is the CB supposed to be when the QB throws a lob-up for grabs pass along the sidelines. I've seen a ton of football and I've never seen a CB be tought to always have their back to the QB. So why is our CBs always like this? You cant tell me they screw up on their own on every damn pass play..

They didn't turn their heads because they were "out of phase." They got beat by their WRs at the line of scrimmage. At that point they tried (and failed miserably) to catch up which doesn't give them time to turn their head to make a play on the ball. If they were "in phase" and even with the WR they should turn their head to try to catch it. It's pretty hard for the small guys we have to jam those big WRs so they were out of phase all the damn time. As you said, square pegs in round holes.

 

[Swervin27]

Honestly, the more highlights I watch from this Dennard dude from MSU, aka how this is supposed to be played, and comparing it to our CBs last year, I know this sounds harsh but I truly believe our CBs were consistently out of position. I am talking like, 99% of the time, out of position. No technique in the world teaches the CB to be a yard or two behind, back to the qb. Sorry to say this but I believe our CBs truly sucked bad last year..

 

[h2p_5150]

Honestly, the more highlights I watch from this Dennard dude from MSU, aka how this is supposed to be played, and comparing it to our CBs last year, I know this sounds harsh but I truly believe our CBs were consistently out of position. I am talking like, 99% of the time, out of position. No technique in the world teaches the CB to be a yard or two behind, back to the qb. Sorry to say this but I believe our CBs truly sucked bad last year..

I agree 100%. They aren't teaching the DBs to never turn their heads; they're taught to turn their heads when they're in good position and to faceguard when they're not. We saw them faceguarding 50 times a game b/c they just couldn't get the job done. They were also midgets so it was more of a chestguard than a faceguard....

 

[Cap pitt]

The run defense actually wasn't all that good either. The stats are skewed because of 2 things: 1. People chose to throw A LOT; 2. We blitz all the time and got sacks and college football still moronically counts that in with our "rush defense" even though they aren't rushing plays. For instance, we gave up 106 yards on 24 carries for a 4.4ypc to Villanova, but the stat sheet will show 43 yards on 31 carries because of our sacks. It was similar for PSU. They really ran for 108 on 24 carries, but with counting sacks it would come in at 69 yards and 31 carries. Vastly different stories. Even the Marshall game is 26 for 128 vs. 30 for 104. That takes it from about 5ypc to 3.4ypc. That is a really big difference.

We still have a lot of improving to do against the run.

What were you watching? Pitts run D was ranked 4th nationally, but I expect this kind of crap from you, you are just like crook and phony. So anti Pitt!!!!! Your man Barkley had a total of 60 rushing yds against Pitt

 

[Swervin27]

What were you watching? Pitts run D was ranked 4th nationally, but I expect this kind of crap from you, you are just like crook and phony. So anti Pitt!!!!! Your man Barkley had a total of 60 rushing yds against Pitt

Duzzi is going to stop the run, he will sell out to stop the run, he has said as much. We obviously saw that this year. I believe Duzzi wants to stop the run and make em pass to beat us. obviously we've seen the downside to this.

 

[sherepower]

Other then the northwestern game Pitts run defense was pretty darn good, the pass D needs a lot of help, hopefully the newer, bigger, more athletic secondary guys that you listed above will fix that problem. People say that Pitts D was horrible, only the pass D was horrible

Teams who were committed to running the football did so with success. It was simply a case where teams completely abandoned the run because of how bad our pass defense was. For example. Miami, GT, NW, Marshall, Virginia all ran the ball well against us. Due to their commitment towards it.

Our defense had problems at all three levels.

 

[steel_curtain]

I really gotta question the OP 40 times from current players . Especially the Lbs .
Link ? Youre telling me we have/had 3 starting Lbs. that ran damn near a 5 second 40 ? No way .

-These players are 2 star recruits with no offers including a walkon, what did you expect?

-The speed on this defense is a disgrace. Dont even recruit PA players in 2018 for defense outside of Raines.



Seun Idowu- 4.92

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/combine/_/id/175130/oluwaseun-idowu


Matt Galambos

Draft Express- 4.85

http://www.draftcountdown.com/player/matt-galambos/

Draft Scout- 4.93

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=127119&draftyear=2017&genpos=ILB

CBS- 4.83

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/...-looking-to-step-it-up-against-virginia-tech/

------------------------


Mike Caprara- 4.86, 4.96

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profilexnews.php?pyid=122351&draftyear=2017&genpos=ILB

 

[steel_curtain]

Same question the other way with the recruits. Hell, steel extrapolates 40s from 100m times. Look at the NFL combine results and then look at some of the numbers steel posts from recruiting profiles.

-Actually, I use the 100M to prove recruits have inflated bullshit 40 times. Because you dont have anywhere near a 4.3 40 with a sub 11 100M. Not even remotely close.

 

[sappycrease]

@steel_curtain I need to see every one of these players shuttle times.

Also, please factor in the Florida.

 

[steel_curtain]

@steel_curtain I need to see every one of these players shuttle times.

Also, please factor in the Florida.

-You are asking for a lot of work. Ill just tell you straight up that the 3-some of Hamlin, Whitehead, and Ford are Elite in the shuttle and change of direction, and I dont say the word Elite often. They have NFL numbers. Hamlin and Whitehead need to get healthy asap

 

[sappycrease]

-You are asking for a lot of work. Ill just tell you straight up that the 3-some of Hamlin, Whitehead, and Ford are Elite in the shuttle and change of direction, and I dont say the word Elite often. They have NFL numbers. Hamlin and Whitehead need to get healthy asap

Just joking around with you, man.

 

[Jpripper88]

What were you watching? Pitts run D was ranked 4th nationally, but I expect this kind of crap from you, you are just like crook and phony. So anti Pitt!!!!!

Haha. I am not anti-Pitt. Look at the real stats. The sacks (which were #8 in the country) skewed those NCAAF run stats.

-Actually, I use the 100M to prove recruits have inflated bullshit 40 times. Because you dont have anywhere near a 4.3 40 with a sub 11 100M. Not even remotely close.

Essentially 0 (I say essentially because there may, may, be 1 per year) recruits run a 4.3. Hell almost 0 run a 4.4.

 

[Jeffburgh]

Honestly, the more highlights I watch from this Dennard dude from MSU, aka how this is supposed to be played, and comparing it to our CBs last year, I know this sounds harsh but I truly believe our CBs were consistently out of position. I am talking like, 99% of the time, out of position. No technique in the world teaches the CB to be a yard or two behind, back to the qb. Sorry to say this but I believe our CBs truly sucked bad last year..

Dennard was great at getting into the WRs routes, too.

That is a big part of defending the fly patterns.

If you get into the route ahead of a WR you can either run to the ball yourself or slow down and just take him out of the route.

 

[steel_curtain]

Haha. I am not anti-Pitt. Look at the real stats. The sacks (which were #8 in the country

Essentially 0 (I say essentially because there may, may, be 1 per year) recruits run a 4.3. Hell almost 0 run a 4.4.

-Henderson, Ffrench, and Weah all ran the 100M in the 10.6ish range or better. Weah recorded a 10.59 in the 100M. These players certainly exist and were a big part of the reason why our offense was so explosive last year. These are track star athletes with legit times to back up the 40's. All 3 of these players in their college football careers have proven to be able to blow by defenders. Henderson torched a ton of teams with pure speed.

-This is the exact reason I am so high on Michael Smith. Because he didnt just beat Florida defenders with speed, he was annihilating Florida db's for TD's with Elite speed and athleticism.

 

[Skip74]

You can have world class CB's, but they will still fail without pressure on the QB. Pitt still desperately needs DE's who show a proven ability to get to the passer. And I mean more than one guy who can be triple teamed - like Price. Without that component the DB's are still going to get beat, though they won't rank last in the NCAA. Under these circumstances, when your D-line coach misses on 4 high priority DE's, you gotta get a better recruiter!

 

[steel_curtain]

You can have world class CB's, but they will still fail without pressure on the QB. Pitt still desperately needs DE's who show a proven ability to get to the passer. And I mean more than one guy who can be triple teamed - like Price. Without that component the DB's are still going to get beat, though they won't rank last in the NCAA.

-What you say is 100% correct. The dline as Ive said in the past is the most important position in football to get pressure. However, having pure speed at lb and the secondary eliminates a lot of big plays. And our defense gave up tons of big plays this year because we were probably the slowest and smallest defense at lb and the secondary in all of P5. That's a result of dogshit recruiting.

 

[MajorMajors]

stupid question I know but where they turning their head in or out? Meaning, if they were on the left sideline, where they turning their head left or back to the qb of over their right shoulder? If it's the latter, that tells me that the CBs were consistently being beaten at the line. If they are taught to look over their left shoulder on in, well I have no clue what the hell that means..

They were simulating running down the sideline with the WR and turning their heads the same way the WR would turn his head to try to make the catch - toward the middle of the field.

 

[PITT MAN]

I liked Nate a lot for his toughness and grit but he does not throw an accurate deep ball. Maybe the only thing keeping him out of the 1st 3 rounds in the draft.

I also have watched enough tape on Browne and he does throw an accurate deep ball. I would think guarding WRs in practice with a QB that can throw the deep ball will be great practice for our CBs and Ss.

Just a thought

 

[p45]

I liked Nate a lot for his toughness and grit but he does not throw an accurate deep ball. Maybe the only thing keeping him out of the 1st 3 rounds in the draft.

I also have watched enough tape on Browne and he does throw an accurate deep ball. I would think guarding WRs in practice with a QB that can throw the deep ball will be great practice for our CBs and Ss.

Just a thought

Its a myth that Peterman was a poor deep ball thrower. I screenshotted the stat because it was contrary to what everyone kept saying. As of November 21st of this past season, so about 8 or 9 games into the season, Peterman was 33-60 (55% best in the power 5) on passes of 15+ air yards. Totalling 1,094 yards, 12 tds to 0 ints. This was tweeted out by David Hale of ESPN. Im not sure about the stats at the end of the year, but considering this stat was before the Duke, Clemson, and Syracuse games & Peterman was phenomenal in all of those, Id say that held.

So, no, Peterman was not a good deep pass thrower, he was an excellent one.