Important win for Capel

[TD_6082]

Unless Capel does something very wrong and can be dismissed for cause, he'll still be here next year unfortunately. He can't recruit and retain players at all, which is his biggest black mark. Get used to 9 - 12 wins every year with a 20 loss season being the norm until he's gone. I remember when a 20 win season was our low water mark.

Pitt can't break the bank just to get a few additional wins and maybe a few more fans in the stands. The crowds aren't coming back until we get a good coach and we're winning big games against top teams and achieving 20+ wins for a couple of years. If next year Capel can do that, he'll possibly get another year.

If his buyout is reasonable by today's standards or anywhere under $20 million, there is absolutely no reason to bring him back.

If money is the only deciding factor in buying Capel out, then the AD needs to go too, because that person is clearly a failure raising funds and managing finances.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

While Pitt bb will never force Pitt into bankruptcy they’re not going to continually throw good money into coaching buyouts for a bottom dwelling program . Pitt isn’t about to cannibalize their other sports programs to continually fund bad coaching decisions in their bb program .Cheaper to stay with JC and hope he finds the players he needs to win a few more games .

Financially speaking unless a coaching change can guarantee you positive returns including the buyout costs why would you do it ? To win 2 or 3 more bb games every yr , no way !

This is exactly correct. It is absolutely senseless for Pitt to pay Capel 8 figures to hire some mid-major coach who may be worse, or perhaps only marginally better. Its reckless waste of money. If they are going to give Capel a Brinks truck to go away, they absolutely have to hire a guarantee. You dont pay a coach a king's ransom to sit on the beach and then hire a lottery ticket. For the Pittjas's out there hoping for a lottery ticket hire, its not happening unless Capel has mass transfers.

 

[TD_6082]

This is exactly correct. It is absolutely senseless for Pitt to pay Capel 8 figures to hire some mid-major coach who may be worse, or perhaps only marginally better. Its reckless waste of money. If they are going to give Capel a Brinks truck to go away, they absolutely have to hire a guarantee. You dont pay a coach a king's ransom to sit on the beach and then hire a lottery ticket. For the Pittjas's out there hoping for a lottery ticket hire, its not happening unless Capel has mass transfers.

They aren't going to give him a king's ransom. They are going to give him some piddly amount between $8 & $ 12 million and send him on his way. Pretty simple and NOT expensive.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

They aren't going to give him a king's ransom. They are going to give him some piddly amount between $8 & $ 12 million and send him on his way. Pretty simple and NOT expensive.

Write that puddly little check then .

 

[TD_6082]

Write that puddly little check then .

For an ACC school, the amount of his buyout doesn't amount to much. The specifics should be in his contract, but those things are rarely paid in one lump sum. Usually they are paid out over several years.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Out of curiosity I went back and looked at the string of close losses in games without Horton. I suspect had Horton not acted stupidly we would most likely have had 4 more wins at this point (2 OOC + 2 ACC).

If so the current record would be 14-12 (7-8 ACC).

How much change, if any, would that make in the fan urgency to get rid of Capel immediately?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

They aren't going to give him a king's ransom. They are going to give him some piddly amount between $8 & $ 12 million and send him on his way. Pretty simple and NOT expensive.

They aren't paying 8 figures to make hik go away to hire another coach, who they may have to pay another expensive buyout to in a few years. Pitt cannot pay this high of a buyout to take a chance on a MM coach. If they can get Pitino, go for it.

 

[rockypanther]

Out of curiosity I went back and looked at the string of close losses in games without Horton. I suspect had Horton not acted stupidly we would most likely have had 4 more wins at this point (2 OOC + 2 ACC).

If so the current record would be 14-12 (7-8 ACC).

How much change, if any, would that make in the fan urgency to get rid of Capel immediately?

That’s still not worth bringing him back. Still 4 years in and not close to a NCAA bid.

 

[HailToPitt1985]

That’s still not worth bringing him back. Still 4 years in and not close to a NCAA bid.

I don't know about bringing him back. None of us knows. I doubt Lyke knows. But if Capel doesn't get us to the NIT MINIMUM and 18 total wins MINIMUM next year, I believe Lyke will be making a move to get him out the door. Empty seats and no revenue talk.

 

[TD_6082]

That’s still not worth bringing him back. Still 4 years in and not close to a NCAA bid.

Exactly. They are a bad team/program with Horton, and a bad team/program without him.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Spending money intelligently is one thing , spending money you don’t have foolishly leads to bankruptcy . Guess no one you know goes bankrupt or out of business !

While Pitt bb will never force Pitt into bankruptcy

So on the one hand, you can't spend money that you don't have because you might go bankrupt, and on the other hand there is absolutely no chance that Pitt spending the money will cause Pitt to go bankrupt.

Why don't you just admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

 

[Fsgolfdr]

For an ACC school, the amount of his buyout doesn't amount to much. The specifics should be in his contract, but those things are rarely paid in one lump sum. Usually they are paid out over several years.

I don’t care how it’s paid out ,if it’s over the life of his contract at 2.5 mil /yr that’s 2.5 less they have to spend for the next great coach .

If you feel 10 million is an insignificant amount of money then why didn’t they overwhelm their #1 choice in Hurley ? Money matters .

 

[Fsgolfdr]

So on the one hand, you can't spend money that you don't have because you might go bankrupt, and on the other hand there is absolutely no chance that Pitt spending the money will cause Pitt to go bankrupt.

Why don't you just admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

Guess Pitts athletic budget has no limits . Foolish me .

Funny how several yrs ago I put out there that Pitt should grossly overpay Nick Sabin and his staff and within a few yrs HF would be full and donations would be through the roof easily paying for the hire .One Joe The PF went on how Pitt just doesn’t have the resources to do this and fund the athletic department …. guess something changed !

If money is no object why did they let Hurley go to UConn and Canada to LSU ….MONEY MATTERS .

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

If money is no object why did they let Hurley go to UConn and Canada to LSU ….MONEY MATTERS .

Who ever said that money didn't matter?

Why don't you just admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Who ever said that money didn't matter?

Why don't you just admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

Well you go ahead and spend all the money you don’t have and we’ll see whose foolish in the end !

Max out every line of credit you have , enjoy yourself , you’ll have fun until you have to pay for it .

Pitt athletics also lives within a budget as does every other department in the university and most businesses and individuals do , but I guess you know better …..as always !

You didn’t answer the question , why did Pitt let Hurley go to UConn and Canada to LSU ? It can’t be money Pitt can just print all the money they need . I heard there’s a secret sub basement in the Cathedral where the printing presses are .

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Well you go ahead and spend all the money you don’t have and we’ll see whose foolish in the end !

The fool is the person who doesn't think that both companies and people regularly spend money that they do not have.

It's like you think if you take what I say out to some completely absurd statement that it somehow proves your statement that people can't spend money that they don't have to be true.

Why don't you just grow a pair and admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

 

[Fsgolfdr]

The fool is the person who doesn't think that both companies and people regularly spend money that they do not have.

It's like you think if you take what I say out to some completely absurd statement that it somehow proves your statement that people can't spend money that they don't have to be true.

Why don't you just grow a pair and admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

Sure companies expand and borrow money all the time , they take a sound financial plan to a bank or other financial institution and apply for loans or issue bonds . Individuals buy homes and cars on credit if they qualify for the loans . But guess what the money needs to be repaid and if you fail to repay you go bankrupt and lose your property . While Pitt won’t go bankrupt the athletic department has a budget and if you take x amount of dollars from one area it has to come from another . ( unless a booster ponies up the cash ) There’s not an endless pile of cash . Other programs will suffer at the expense of the bb program by firing JC , not sure that’s Pitts plans .


You still haven’t answered the question , why did Pitt let Canada go to LSU or not get the man they wanted in Hurley ?
Because they didn’t have the money to match LSU and they felt they offered Hurley the most they could . They don’t really print money in the basement of the Cathedral , they try to live within their budget and firing Capel and paying the next guy isn’t accounted for in their budget . Maybe you could float them the loan !

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

The fool is the person who doesn't think that both companies and people regularly spend money that they do not have.

It's like you think if you take what I say out to some completely absurd statement that it somehow proves your statement that people can't spend money that they don't have to be true.

Why don't you just grow a pair and admit that the notion that you can't spend money that you don't have is both foolish and has no application to the Pitt head coaching situation and leave it at that?

Pitt is spending money they don't have on a volleyball arena. Literally doing bond issues....with a huge negative ROI.

 

[Mr. Monaca]

Got win #10. They won’t wind up with a single digit win total like Stallings 8-24 season.

Also could get 1 or 2 more wins—Georgia Tech at the Pete and 1st round ACC Tourney game (if they gets favorable opponent matchup) are possibles.

Lost to The Citadel and UMBC at home in the same year. The embarrassment of this season took root a couple of months ago and cannot be covered over.

 

[gary2]

Lost to The Citadel and UMBC at home in the same year. The embarrassment of this season took root a couple of months ago and cannot be covered over.

For some, it seems 10 wins outweighs 20 losses.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

You still haven’t answered the question , why did Pitt let Canada go to LSU or not get the man they wanted in Hurley ?

The funny thing is that you keep demanding an answer to this, as if it proves your point, when in fact it does nothing of the sort.

Pitt let Canada go to LSU because Pitt determined what Canada was worth and wasn't willing to pay him more than that. Hurley didn't come to Pitt because he wanted a different job and he was using Pitt to get the best deal that he could where he wanted to go. Neither of which has anything to do with how much Pitt could have theoretically spent.

If you are out looking for a house and you find something you like and it's appraised at $200,000, do you pay $300,000 for it simply because you could? Of course not, you'd have to be an idiot to do that. If Pitt thinks that Matt Canada is worth $1,000,000 and they offer him that but he wants more they'd be foolish to offer more than what they think that he's worth. If they are looking to hire a basketball coach and they determine that some coach is worth $3,000,000 they'd be stupid to pay him $6,000,000 just to get him.

Smart people and smart companies determine what people are worth and they don't pay a penny more. You think that Pitt should spend whatever amount of money it takes even if they think that they aren't getting their money's worth. That's the kind of thinking that drives people and companies to bankruptcy.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

The funny thing is that you keep demanding an answer to this, as if it proves your point, when in fact it does nothing of the sort.

Pitt let Canada go to LSU because Pitt determined what Canada was worth and wasn't willing to pay him more than that. Hurley didn't come to Pitt because he wanted a different job and he was using Pitt to get the best deal that he could where he wanted to go. Neither of which has anything to do with how much Pitt could have theoretically spent.

If you are out looking for a house and you find something you like and it's appraised at $200,000, do you pay $300,000 for it simply because you could? Of course not, you'd have to be an idiot to do that. If Pitt thinks that Matt Canada is worth $1,000,000 and they offer him that but he wants more they'd be foolish to offer more than what they think that he's worth. If they are looking to hire a basketball coach and they determine that some coach is worth $3,000,000 they'd be stupid to pay him $6,000,000 just to get him.

Smart people and smart companies determine what people are worth and they don't pay a penny more. You think that Pitt should spend whatever amount of money it takes even if they think that they aren't getting their money's worth. That's the kind of thinking that drives people and companies to bankruptcy.

So let me get this straight , what you’re saying is that no matter how much money you have or have access to you don’t overpay to hire the guy / gal you want . To me that sounds like to Pitt money matters in making major decisions in the Athletic department ! Pitt isn’t a win at all cost school . Money matters !

Now I’m sure that if you donated the money to pay off JC and partially fund the next coach they’d put a plaque up in your honor . If your a little short of funds just go out and borrow out .
.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

So let me get this straight , what you’re saying is that no matter how much money you have or have access to you don’t overpay to hire the guy / gal you want .

Absolutely not. You pay people what you think that they are worth. If you think that someone is worth $3 million you don't pay them $6 million just because. THAT is what gets athletic departments (and businesses, and individuals) in trouble.

If you actually think that coach is worth $6 million, or $8 million, or $10 million, then by all means, offer them $6 million if that gets the deal done. But I can't believe that anyone who worries about Pitt's money as much as you do would seriously suggest that the solution to Pitt's problems is to start overpaying.