Interesting and (hopefully) non-political article

[OH Pete]

Thoughts on this?

I'm not sure what I'd advise my kids to do as a parent. On one had, those are some righteous bucks. But a HS Jr being offered that kind of $ makes me wonder if it wouldn't make more sense to advise my kid to at least go to college part time and learn computer and entrepreneurial skills. If $70K is the going rate, then just think about how much someone who can do the work AND understands the computer and business ends is worth.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/careers/skilled-trades-high-school-recruitment-fd9f8257

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

yeah, welders are killing it recently. 35- 40 bucks an hour all over the place. shortage of trades workers. a buddy of mine does electrical work, works for himself, turns down work every day..


now they are price gouging but that's because of the recent storms and shortage of people who can properly re-hook up your elecricity (Duquesne light only re-attaches), not responsible for anything inside..

 

[PittMan2003]

It is interesting stuff for sure and I was just telling my wife that we will have to keep up with these things when advising our kids-4 and 9. I read an article the other day that newly graduated undergrads are having a tougher time finding jobs and experts are trying to understand it. One of the factors considered was AI in certain fields as 5 new hires with Chat GPT can do the work of 20 without it. Said you will still make more money with a college degree but the gap isn't as big as before.

Welding jobs have taken off near me too in central pa and the more skilled welders can definitely make $30-$40 per hour right out of high school. The vo-tech schools are actually pretty tough to get into as there is a ton of demand to get in.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

It is interesting stuff for sure and I was just telling my wife that we will have to keep up with these things when advising our kids-4 and 9. I read an article the other day that newly graduated undergrads are having a tougher time finding jobs and experts are trying to understand it. One of the factors considered was AI in certain fields as 5 new hires with Chat GPT can do the work of 20 without it. Said you will still make more money with a college degree but the gap isn't as big as before.

Welding jobs have taken off near me too in central pa and the more skilled welders can definitely make $30-$40 per hour right out of high school. The vo-tech schools are actually pretty tough to get into as there is a ton of demand to get in.

i want to go back in time and be an under water welder. those dudes kill it.

either that or start golfing at 4.

 

[PittMan2003]

i want to go back in time and be an under water welder. those dudes kill it.

either that or start golfing at 4.

Yeah for sure. If you underwater weld and just save your money so you don't have to do it for too long (kills your body) you would be set.

But if I didn't go to Pitt and was a welder I wouldn't have so many great Pitt memories as a fan...Actually underwater welding would be better for my health than being a Pitt fan. F it I screwed up big time!

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Yeah for sure. If you underwater weld and just save your money so you don't have to do it for too long (kills your body) you would be set.

But if I didn't go to Pitt and was a welder I wouldn't have so many great Pitt memories as a fan...Actually underwater welding would be better for my health than being a Pitt fan. F it I screwed up big time!

you know what, im remembering Jaws 3 with the welder. never mind..

in all seriousness, it's like one of the most dangerous jobs there is so always a reason why it pays so much..

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

This statement is completely apolitical because it is the honest's truth. But.....if we are going to "make stuff" here in the US that is vital to our economy and security, then you are going to need skilled welders, electricians, machinists, pipefitters, etc....skilled trades. We have a generational gap because both High Schools and parents steered kids aways from this to college with worthless, yet expensive humanities degrees, etc...vs trades.

 

[OH Pete]

This statement is completely apolitical because it is the honest's truth. But.....if we are going to "make stuff" here in the US that is vital to our economy and security, then you are going to need skilled welders, electricians, machinists, pipefitters, etc....skilled trades. We have a generational gap because both High Schools and parents steered kids aways from this to college with worthless, yet expensive humanities degrees, etc...vs trades.

I don’t disagree. But we are in a transition now where technology meets blue collar work. You can have a job welding. But the way things are going, programming and design are becoming parts of the job for many blue collar workers. That is where the real money is. I mentioned a few months ago that I expect some of the local D3 schools to dip their toes into the water of a hybrid college/trade school model.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

I don’t disagree. But we are in a transition now where technology meets blue collar work. You can have a job welding. But the way things are going, programming and design are becoming parts of the job for many blue collar workers. That is where the real money is. I mentioned a few months ago that I expect some of the local D3 schools to dip their toes into the water of a hybrid college/trade school model.

Where robotics/AI is going to start replacing, highly skilled specialists is surgery. You are going to have diagnosticians and treatment analytical doctors, but true surgeons are going to go by the way of robotics adn A/I.

 

[HailToPitt1985]

Yeah for sure. If you underwater weld and just save your money so you don't have to do it for too long (kills your body) you would be set.

But if I didn't go to Pitt and was a welder I wouldn't have so many great Pitt memories as a fan...Actually underwater welding would be better for my health than being a Pitt fan. F it I screwed up big time!

You have it right. Underwater welding is much better for your health than being a Pitt fan now. No doubt about that.

 

[USN_Panther]

Where robotics/AI is going to start replacing, highly skilled specialists is surgery. You are going to have diagnosticians and treatment analytical doctors, but true surgeons are going to go by the way of robotics adn A/I.

I'm not sure this will happen anytime soon. I think AI will be better at diagnostics. It will do a good job of pattern recognition with large datasets of lab, testing and physiological parameters.
There is a lot of variation in clinical anatomy. Robotics and computers are good with repetitive tasks. No complex surgical procedure is the same as another. Surgical problem solving is a frequently utilized skill.
There will be computer aided surgery. There already is. "Robotic" surgery in the current form is computer aided surgery. Every action is initiated by the surgeon.
Disclosure: I am a surgeon.

 

[jtownknowitall]

This statement is completely apolitical because it is the honest's truth. But.....if we are going to "make stuff" here in the US that is vital to our economy and security, then you are going to need skilled welders, electricians, machinists, pipefitters, etc....skilled trades. We have a generational gap because both High Schools and parents steered kids aways from this to college with worthless, yet expensive humanities degrees, etc...vs trades.

60% of college students are women. Should we encourage them to become welders instead? How many of the men are just on campus to play football, baseball, basketball, etc. because they were raised to become a pro athlete?

My great grandparents raised their kids with the idea they didn’t want them following them into the mines and the mills. Steering kids away from that didn’t happen overnight.

 

[WeaverIsComing]

Thoughts on this?

I'm not sure what I'd advise my kids to do as a parent. On one had, those are some righteous bucks. But a HS Jr being offered that kind of $ makes me wonder if it wouldn't make more sense to advise my kid to at least go to college part time and learn computer and entrepreneurial skills. If $70K is the going rate, then just think about how much someone who can do the work AND understands the computer and business ends is worth.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/careers/skilled-trades-high-school-recruitment-fd9f8257

You can just spend a summer building with ai and learn everything you'd learn at college. You don't need to build any complex system for starting out in trade, just a fancy landing page and then you can already upcharge

 

[OH Pete]

60% of college students are women. Should we encourage them to become welders instead? How many of the men are just on campus to play football, baseball, basketball, etc. because they were raised to become a pro athlete?

My great grandparents raised their kids with the idea they didn’t want them following them into the mines and the mills. Steering kids away from that didn’t happen overnight.

Why not? Most welding projects don't require a ton of strength. Sure, certain jobs may be a little more difficult. But there are a ton of applications for welding that women could do just as well as men. Maybe better.

I've been going into many mills and machine and fab shops over the past 20 years. I've seen an evolution occurring over that time. A few of the things I've observed are that I rarely see a pin up girl calendar in the shops these days. And I'm seeing more and more women there every year. Especially the fab shops. (Don't Jimmy the Greek me here, only repeating what I was told) - One of the owners of one of the shops told me that for some jobs, the women out perform the men because they have smaller hands and are more conscientious about quality than the men. Just anecdotal, but still kind of interesting.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

60% of college students are women. Should we encourage them to become welders instead? How many of the men are just on campus to play football, baseball, basketball, etc. because they were raised to become a pro athlete?

My great grandparents raised their kids with the idea they didn’t want them following them into the mines and the mills. Steering kids away from that didn’t happen overnight.

it worked for this pittsburgh girl.

• https://www.bing.com/images/search?...WBEXrbrG0GwywjB8b3t8I6LkzmJjhvK4=&FORM=IDINTS

 

[OH Pete]

it worked for this pittsburgh girl.

• https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Flashdance+Actress&mmreqh=pqTTuk8/DuZWBEXrbrG0GwywjB8b3t8I6LkzmJjhvK4=&FORM=IDINTS

She's a maniac.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

I'm not sure this will happen anytime soon. I think AI will be better at diagnostics. It will do a good job of pattern recognition with large datasets of lab, testing and physiological parameters.
There is a lot of variation in clinical anatomy. Robotics and computers are good with repetitive tasks. No complex surgical procedure is the same as another. Surgical problem solving is a frequently utilized skill.
There will be computer aided surgery. There already is. "Robotic" surgery in the current form is computer aided surgery. Every action is initiated by the surgeon.
Disclosure: I am a surgeon.

How’s your eye hand coordination? lol.

I once had an offer back in the early days of Davinci. I didn’t take it. Not sure I regret it or not.

Fast forward 20 years and I just had robotic hernia surgery this year. Easy peazy. The surgery was pain free. But 4 months later I still can’t do ab workouts. It sucks.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

She's a maniac.

On the floor.

 

[PittMan2003]

Why not? Most welding projects don't require a ton of strength. Sure, certain jobs may be a little more difficult. But there are a ton of applications for welding that women could do just as well as men. Maybe better.

I've been going into many mills and machine and fab shops over the past 20 years. I've seen an evolution occurring over that time. A few of the things I've observed are that I rarely see a pin up girl calendar in the shops these days. And I'm seeing more and more women there every year. Especially the fab shops. (Don't Jimmy the Greek me here, only repeating what I was told) - One of the owners of one of the shops told me that for some jobs, the women out perform the men because they have smaller hands and are more conscientious about quality than the men. Just anecdotal, but still kind of interesting.

My friend is a vo tech welding instructor and said lately his best students have often been females.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

My friend is a vo tech welding instructor and said lately his best students have often been females.

yeah, this was a weird take for sure. you dont need to have balls to weld.

 

[USN_Panther]

How’s your eye hand coordination? lol.

I once had an offer back in the early days of Davinci. I didn’t take it. Not sure I regret it or not.

Fast forward 20 years and I just had robotic hernia surgery this year. Easy peazy. The surgery was pain free. But 4 months later I still can’t do ab workouts. It sucks.

The surgical "robots" do take tremor and unintentional movement away. They do not add decision support so they will still do things like unintentionally cut bowel or ureter if that is what the operator instructs them to do.
I used davinci before moving here 15 years ago. It is helpful for precise dissection and suturing. Not necessary for most things it is used for but can make a floundering surgeon ok with laparoscopic suturing. It can't make a dodgy surgeon great. A great surgeon is already great regardless of the tools.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

The surgical "robots" do take tremor and unintentional movement away. They do not add decision support so they will still do things like unintentionally cut bowel or ureter if that is what the operator instructs them to do.
I used davinci before moving here 15 years ago. It is helpful for precise dissection and suturing. Not necessary for most things it is used for but can make a floundering surgeon ok with laparoscopic suturing. It can't make a dodgy surgeon great. A great surgeon is already great regardless of the tools.

After my Gyn days, I was a product manager for the company who launched barbed sutures. I took our focus from plastics to orthos (knees/hips) and anything robotic. Grew the business massively. Not having to tie knots laparoscopically was a game changer. But then covidien came in, developed a knock off product that also worked pretty well, and I bolted.

 

[USN_Panther]

After my Gyn days, I was a product manager for the company who launched barbed sutures. I took our focus from plastics to orthos (knees/hips) and anything robotic. Grew the business massively. Not having to tie knots laparoscopically was a game changer. But then covidien came in, developed a knock off product that also worked pretty well, and I bolted.

Covidien is the VLoc right? Which one was your company's product?
I still tie knots laparoscopically. I don't like leaving barbs exposed in the abdomen to bowel.
I use barbed on fascia and skin.

 

[jtownknowitall]

My friend is a vo tech welding instructor and said lately his best students have often been females.

How many?

 

[OH Pete]

The surgical "robots" do take tremor and unintentional movement away. They do not add decision support so they will still do things like unintentionally cut bowel or ureter if that is what the operator instructs them to do.
I used davinci before moving here 15 years ago. It is helpful for precise dissection and suturing. Not necessary for most things it is used for but can make a floundering surgeon ok with laparoscopic suturing. It can't make a dodgy surgeon great. A great surgeon is already great regardless of the tools.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

I'm not sure this will happen anytime soon. I think AI will be better at diagnostics. It will do a good job of pattern recognition with large datasets of lab, testing and physiological parameters.
There is a lot of variation in clinical anatomy. Robotics and computers are good with repetitive tasks. No complex surgical procedure is the same as another. Surgical problem solving is a frequently utilized skill.
There will be computer aided surgery. There already is. "Robotic" surgery in the current form is computer aided surgery. Every action is initiated by the surgeon.
Disclosure: I am a surgeon.

And we are happy and proud to have you on this board!

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Covidien is the VLoc right? Which one was your company's product?
I still tie knots laparoscopically. I don't like leaving barbs exposed in the abdomen to bowel.
I use barbed on fascia and skin.

Yeah Vloc. I actually have vloc sutures in me right now. A literal gut punch. lol. Actually they are dissolved by now.

My product back in the day was Quill…we created the market. I used to work with the 2 largest body contouring guys in the world, who happened to be Univ of Pitt based…which is why I was hired. Then one day I walked into the OR and one of them was helping Covidien develop vloc. While it was a real gut punch, I fully understood that it was business. Afterall, UPMC was Covidiens largest suture account worldwide, and they were also funding his fellowship program. That said, his fellow at the time is still a friend of mine and one of upmc’s best plastic surgeons.

 

[USN_Panther]

Yeah Vloc. I actually have vloc sutures in me right now. A literal gut punch. lol. Actually they are dissolved by now.

My product back in the day was Quill…we created the market. I used to work with the 2 largest body contouring guys in the world, who happened to be Univ of Pitt based…which is why I was hired. Then one day I walked into the OR and one of them was helping Covidien develop vloc. While it was a real gut punch, I fully understood that it was business. Afterall, UPMC was Covidiens largest suture account worldwide, and they were also funding his fellowship program. That said, his fellow at the time is still a friend of mine and one of upmc’s best plastic surgeons.

Our hospital has an exclusive contract with J&J so we have their knockoff which is stratafix.

 

[USN_Panther]

And we are happy and proud to have you on this board!

Thanks! I appreciate that.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Our hospital has an exclusive contract with J&J so we have their knockoff which is stratafix.

Stratafix came along after I left that space. But from what I’m told now, and not having skin in the game anymore, Quill is more versatile across multiple specialties and procedure types, and has better needles. Stratafix has anti microbial properties while Quill doesn’t. And of course, being a J&J product, Stratfix is going to have strong contractual positioning. As far as VLoc, surgeons always hated Covidien sutures compared to j&J. But they seem to like VLoc.

 

[Tvax1]

so robotics is going to replace surgeons but won't be able to do tasks that welders and pipefitters and other tradesmen do?


ok

 

[OH Pete]

Speaking of robots doing jobs that people used to do - I was in a bar/restaurant in Beloit Wisconsin. Basically a middle of nowhere town. Its a really good place and I go there every time I travel there for business (a supplier of ours is located near there). Awesome wings, Spotted Cow on tap and great prices. Fantastic prices. But trust me - it is a hole in the wall place in a nowhere town. So I was shocked on my last visit in November. I noticed that while they still had waitstaff that took our orders, they didn't deliver the food from the kitchen. Robots did. The waitstaff was limited and stayed on the floor the entire time. They had iPad things to take orders. And then the robot would come out and go to the correct table with the food and the waitstaff would then transfer the food from the robot to the table. Pretty slick. I'm not sure how many, if any, jobs are being filled by the robots. But I do believe it is a major service improvement. The waitstaff is always visible and you know the food isn't just sitting around in the kitchen waiting to be picked up. Pretty slick. Not sure why I haven't seen them elsewhere yet.

 

[Tvax1]

Speaking of robots doing jobs that people used to do - I was in a bar/restaurant in Beloit Wisconsin. Basically a middle of nowhere town. Its a really good place and I go there every time I travel there for business (a supplier of ours is located near there). Awesome wings, Spotted Cow on tap and great prices. Fantastic prices. But trust me - it is a hole in the wall place in a nowhere town. So I was shocked on my last visit in November. I noticed that while they still had waitstaff that took our orders, they didn't deliver the food from the kitchen. Robots did. The waitstaff was limited and stayed on the floor the entire time. They had iPad things to take orders. And then the robot would come out and go to the correct table with the food and the waitstaff would then transfer the food from the robot to the table. Pretty slick. I'm not sure how many, if any, jobs are being filled by the robots. But I do believe it is a major service improvement. The waitstaff is always visible and you know the food isn't just sitting around in the kitchen waiting to be picked up. Pretty slick. Not sure why I haven't seen them elsewhere yet.

make sure to tip

 

[pittbb80]

Can you imagine this robot during surgery