Ithiel Horton

[gary2]

Here’s something. Horton describes his Arkansas visit as “a wonderful and interesting experience” and plans to decide in the next week and a half. Can’t say I’ve heard that description too often.

https://forums.hogville.net/index.php?topic=686064.0

That does not sound as positive as I would have liked. The week and a half sounds like he wants to go to Arkasas and they are stringing him along while they explore other options. It will be interesting if they have others visiting in the next week.

It would be a shame if the difference between an unofficial and official visit plays any part in Horton's decision.

 

[Drew1208]

That does not sound as positive as I would have liked. The week and a half sounds like he wants to go to Arkasas and they are stringing him along while they explore other options. It will be interesting if they have others visiting in the next week.

It would be a shame if the difference between an unofficial and official visit plays any part in Horton's decision.

Yeah the timeline is tough.
I agree.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

That does not sound as positive as I would have liked. The week and a half sounds like he wants to go to Arkasas and they are stringing him along while they explore other options. It will be interesting if they have others visiting in the next week.

It would be a shame if the difference between an unofficial and official visit plays any part in Horton's decision.

Last team to get a visit always has a big advantage.

 

[Elsalvador]

I agree with you @DC_Area_Panther , but at least the visits were back-to-back and not a week or more apart, like in football. I'm sure the Pitt visit is still pretty fresh in his mind, since it was the day before. Trying to be as positive as I can here people haha.

 

[gary2]

Last team to get a visit always has a big advantage.

Usually - if the Cleve St player visits (or anyone else), it is likely Horton is not a priority for them.

 

[TWPitt]

Dead Period Starts Friday through the end of July. So any visits would have to be this week if they were going to visit. Kid from Cleveland State is from the area so I am sure he has been to Arkansas's campus. He can still talk to the coaches, etc. I think visits are overrated sometimes.

McGowens committed without a visit, Coulibaly only ever had an Unofficial Visit prior to committing to Pitt. I thought X was an unofficial prior to him signing.

All of this depends of what the kid wants, where they think they can progress toward a pro career best and for some of them where the education is better.

We never know what the recruit/team priorities truly are. We (the fans) just want every player who shows any interest in us and is talented to sign.

End of the day, the connections, geography, opportunity and conference all bode well for Pitt on this one. I still think Horton becomes a Panther sooner rather than later.

 

[gary2]

Dead Period Starts Friday through the end of July. So any visits would have to be this week if they were going to visit. Kid from Cleveland State is from the area so I am sure he has been to Arkansas's campus. He can still talk to the coaches, etc. I think visits are overrated sometimes.

McGowens committed without a visit, Coulibaly only ever had an Unofficial Visit prior to committing to Pitt. I thought X was an unofficial prior to him signing.

All of this depends of what the kid wants, where they think they can progress toward a pro career best and for some of them where the education is better.

We never know what the recruit/team priorities truly are. We (the fans) just want every player who shows any interest in us and is talented to sign.

End of the day, the connections, geography, opportunity and conference all bode well for Pitt on this one. I still think Horton becomes a Panther sooner rather than later.

Agree

 

[Fsgolfdr]

The real question is , is he better than any of the high school pgs that JC is offering since he won’t be available to play until 2020 ?

The value for Pitt is if X leaves they have a guy ready to step in , but what if X stays ? Good for Pitt , but what about him !

 

[below0w]

The real question is , is he better than any of the high school pgs that JC is offering since he won’t be available to play until 2020 ?

The value for Pitt is if X leaves they have a guy ready to step in , but what if X stays ? Good for Pitt , but what about him !

Horton isn't a point guard and shouldn't be compared against point guards. He's clearly a 2 and we could really use his deep shooting. I don't care what conference he comes from, 41% 3 point shooting at that volume is very impressive.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

If X departs early--McGowens likely moves over to point. Then, Horton, or whomever, plays the off guard.

 

[Harve74]

If X departs early--McGowens likely moves over to point. Then, Horton, or whomever, plays the off guard.

We're heavily recruiting THREE NYC points: RJ Davis, Curbelo and Posh Alexander and have shown some love/contact with Farrakhan. I think we'll sign one of them too.

 

[BPKY]

Here’s something. Horton describes his Arkansas visit as “a wonderful and interesting experience” and plans to decide in the next week and a half. Can’t say I’ve heard that description too often.

https://forums.hogville.net/index.php?topic=686064.0

He mentioned that Pitt is much closer to home. That stood out to me.
As a transfer, it's harder to figure what will matter most to him. I'm sure he is taking way more things into consideration than a typical HS recruit.

 

[Elsalvador]

Easily without, but even if Horton comes aboard, I think Pitt will still look to add a guard in 2020. Capel easily prioritizes guards/ball-handlers, than an old-fashioned big. He's fine with a 6'8" guy in the middle it appears. Aaron Gray was awesome at Pitt, but needing a 7 footer on the roster, isn't a necessity.

Heres hoping proximity to home matters to Horton and his family. Hail to Pitt and Happy 4th of July to my Lair brethren.

 

[CScott14]

Last team to get a visit always has a big advantage.

Of the 16ish players that took OV’s to Pitt this year, only Diallo, ORN, and Walker picked the school that got the last visit. Diallo only took 2 OV’s and ORN was just waiting for Tennessee to open up. The only player that not getting the last visit affected us was Walker. I’m not counting guys like Drumgoole and Murphy who only took 1 OV like a 5 month span.

 

[pittchagg]

Easily without, but even if Horton comes aboard, I think Pitt will still look to add a guard in 2020. Capel easily prioritizes guards/ball-handlers, than an old-fashioned big. He's fine with a 6'8" guy in the middle it appears. Aaron Gray was awesome at Pitt, but needing a 7 footer on the roster, isn't a necessity.

Heres hoping proximity to home matters to Horton and his family. Hail to Pitt and Happy 4th of July to my Lair brethren.

Yeah, I don’t think landing Horton would affect their recruitment of RJ Davis, Curbelo, or Posh. And he’s a true two guard like Murphy, unlike guys like Gordon or Puff who seem to be much more in the Drumgoole or Toney mold as wings who can also play the two. They’ll still absolutely take, for example, Davis, Gordon, Puff and Hugley for 2020 if they all want in.

I do think you’re right, though, on their overall mold for bigs. I think there’s a reason why the 6’10”, long-armed Qudus Wahab was at the top of their board for months at the position, even though they thought they had an in with Cockburn for a while.

 

[Drew1208]

We are getting one of the 3 pt guards and they're all going to be good m
One of them is ours.
He's building a team.

 

[PittCity]

..

 

[NTOP]

If X departs early--McGowens likely moves over to point. Then, Horton, or whomever, plays the off guard.

I don't see Trey as a PG. A slasher who needs to shoot better. I love his athleticism and energy....just needs to mature a bit and work on his jumper, maybe develop a pullup shot. If he distributes well, he'd be quite a package.

 

[bummer01]

Decision date is July 10

 

[Drew1208]

I don't see Trey as a PG. A slasher who needs to shoot better. I love his athleticism and energy....just needs to mature a bit and work on his jumper, maybe develop a pullup shot. If he distributes well, he'd be quite a package.

There's a nice video of him working on his pull up with Milan Brown

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

I don't see Trey as a PG. A slasher who needs to shoot better. I love his athleticism and energy....just needs to mature a bit and work on his jumper, maybe develop a pullup shot. If he distributes well, he'd be quite a package.

Don't disagree entirely. Just believe McGowens could be switched to being our primary point by necessity. But, that would depend on whether Johnson does/does not leave early and whether a point can be recruited who would provide more value at point than McGowens would by the time Johnson actually moves on.

Also, I suspect that given the current roster makeup, that we may see McGowens as Johnson's primary backup at point this coming season. I believe that highly possible because we have plenty of candidates to play the 2 and 3 (maybe even 1 or 2 too many) while (with N'Dir gone) there is no one other than McGowens with a handle good enough to bring the ball up against pressure and take it to the hoop in traffic when Johnson is on the bench---Caveat: Unless Murphy is a lot more ball skilled than we know and isn't only useful as a 3-ball specialist.

 

[panther4life32]

McGowens did not have a large sample size at the point, but our offense did run smoothly when he played backup point vs. some of our non conference games, NC State and Florida State when N’Dir was out.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

McGowens did not have a large sample size at the point, but our offense did run smoothly when he played backup point vs. some of our non conference games, NC State and Florida State when N’Dir was out.

Putting Trey at point weakens two positions . Not a good idea .

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Putting Trey at point weakens two positions . Not a good idea .

IMO, barring an unexpected late addition of a grad transfer point guard Trey will be getting some minutes at point this coming season (perhaps about 8 minutes). We have backups like Murphy and Drumgoole who can backfill at the 2 when McGowens is on the bench or subbing for Johnson (something like 15-16 minutes total). McGowens appears to be the only viable prime time backup at the point for next season which is not the case at the 2 guard where there is depth.

Presumably when Johnson leaves then either a 2020 recruit or McGowens will be the starter at the point.

 

[DT_PITT]

IMO, barring an unexpected late addition of a grad transfer point guard Trey will be getting some minutes at point this coming season (perhaps about 8 minutes). We have backups like Murphy and Drumgoole who can backfill at the 2 when McGowens is on the bench or subbing for Johnson (something like 15-16 minutes total). McGowens appears to be the only viable prime time backup at the point for next season which is not the case at the 2 guard where there is depth.

Presumably when Johnson leaves then either a 2020 recruit or McGowens will be the starter at the point.

Agree with all.

 

[Jeffburgh]

I dont think Trey is natural at the point and it looks like Murphy could be a spot backup pg, but decent chance Trey could get the call to help his nba resume.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

IMO, barring an unexpected late addition of a grad transfer point guard Trey will be getting some minutes at point this coming season (perhaps about 8 minutes). We have backups like Murphy and Drumgoole who can backfill at the 2 when McGowens is on the bench or subbing for Johnson (something like 15-16 minutes total). McGowens appears to be the only viable prime time backup at the point for next season which is not the case at the 2 guard where there is depth.

Presumably when Johnson leaves then either a 2020 recruit or McGowens will be the starter at the point.

It will be a major recruiting failure if Trey is forced to play primarily at pg next yr if X is gone . My personal thoughts are that unless X improves tremendously he’s at Pitt for his junior yr .

 

[levance2]

IMO, barring an unexpected late addition of a grad transfer point guard Trey will be getting some minutes at point this coming season (perhaps about 8 minutes).

Am I wrong to expect XJ plays >32 mpg? IMO, if he's really auditioning for the NBA, he's got to cut down on the dumb fouls and play more minutes.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Perhaps? Last year Johnson averaged 32 minutes. Doubt he would play less than that but even with fewer fouls also doubt he would be played the full 40 minutes by Capel. Capel's job is to win games and is going to balance things so that his best players are 100% effective when they are on the floor so he will be taking him out for some rest from time to time.

Capel also needs to effectively use and develop his newcomers to maximize the team's overall performance and that will also factor in to the equation. The more Capel uses full court pressure and an attacking style of offense the more rest the starters like Johnson will need as Capel is unlikely to play a walk the ball up and execute a deliberate half court offense much judging by last season.

We will have to wait and see but I doubt Johnson plays the full 40 minutes--probably the max would be 35-36, IMHO, and could remain as low as 32. We will have to wait and see.

 

[levance2]

Perhaps? Last year Johnson averaged 32 minutes. Doubt he would play less than that but even with fewer fouls also doubt he would be played the full 40 minutes by Capel. Capel's job is to win games and is going to balance things so that his best players are 100% effective when they are on the floor so he will be taking him out for some rest from time to time.

If you actually look at the conference games, he had only 11, 37, and 24 minutes in the first three. After that he played 34.1mpg for the next 17 games.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

If you actually look at the conference games, he had only 11, 37, and 24 minutes in the first three. After that he played 34.1mpg for the next 17 games.

The 32 minutes average was for the entire season. He could average a couple of more minutes per game this season. With all the incoming players who, IMHO, won't be relegated to the bench I think he will play about the same number of minutes as last season and that could very well be 34-35 in ACC play. Just don't see him going to the 37-40 minute range because I don't believe it is necessary and might not make the overall team better.

 

[thom67]

Putting Trey at point weakens two positions . Not a good idea .

Trey was recruited as a pg. He became a 2 guard after Johnson developed into a top pg.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Trey was recruited as a pg. He became a 2 guard after Johnson developed into a top pg.

Don’t care what he was recruited as he’s better off the ball especially if he can shoot better .

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Don’t care what he was recruited as he’s better off the ball especially if he can shoot better .

I don't see this as a particularly relevant argument given that Capel will be looking to find minutes for the newcomers at the crowded 3. Could be wrong, of course, but MCGowens seems the best option to spell Johnson at the point and that, in turn, frees up some additional minutes for guys like Drumgoole and Murphy at the 2, which in turn frees up minutes for Toney and Champagnie at the 3.

 

[TWPitt]

I really think Capel likes to recruit PG's and play them together. X and Trey were both PG's as was Murphy and Horton. Having 2 strong ball handlers who can score, pass and shoot makes more sense. I think Trey will be more of a PG as a junior regardless of who we recruit. He is a great ball handler, passer and has the ability to create for others. As he expands his game he will become more dangerous with the ball as well.

Options is the big thing and a diversified attack. When more guys can create for themselves or others we become more difficult to defend. Love the team he is building.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I don't see this as a particularly relevant argument given that Capel will be looking to find minutes for the newcomers at the crowded 3. Could be wrong, of course, but MCGowens seems the best option to spell Johnson at the point and that, in turn, frees up some additional minutes for guys like Drumgoole and Murphy at the 2, which in turn frees up minutes for Toney and Champagnie at the 3.

That’s a different scenario than having Trey as your full time pg . As Pitts roster is now constituted Trey is the best choice to run the point when X needs a breather , but if Trey’s your starting pg next season to me it says JC struck out recruiting . That’s assuming X is gone which I’m not too sure about .

 

[Chescat]

That’s a different scenario than having Trey as your full time pg . As Pitts roster is now constituted Trey is the best choice to run the point when X needs a breather , but if Trey’s your starting pg next season to me it says JC struck out recruiting . That’s assuming X is gone which I’m not too sure about .

I agree with your assessment. I also believe Capel will get another pg in here,
whether it's Horton or a 2020 recruit. Trey can certainly play the point, but IMO
he's a 2g, and a good one at that. If he develops his jump shot he'll be almost
impossible to guard as an off guard. Of course like all of us I'm hoping X
stays, and the two of them continue to develop. I think they're a guard combo
that will only get better in time.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

There was a rumor Horton was announcing his decision tomorrow. Any confirmation?

 

[CScott14]

There was a rumor Horton was announcing his decision tomorrow. Any confirmation?

That was PSN messing up the date and saying it was Tuesday the 10th. Decision is on Wednesday.

 

[joeydavid]