What are your thoughts on Coach Capel’s coaching decisions. Against WVU, Pitt was down 9-8 when Hugley picked up his second foul. He stayed on the bench until halftime and Pitt was down by 12. John played 18 minutes in the 2nd half and Pitt outscored WVU by 3. The 2 minutes he sat Pitt was outscored by 6. He was the only Pitt player with a plus/minus ratio of plus 2. I believe the decision to keep him on the bench for the last 14 minutes of the half cost Pitt any chance of winning. Also against Citadel Hugley was substituted after 3:30 in the first half when Pitt was down 14-4. He came back in at the 12:02 mark when Pitt now trailed 27-9. He touched the ball in the paint only 1 time in the first 8 minutes against a team that had no answer for him. What was Jeff thinking?
Jeff’s coaching decisions
- Thread starter Mercer50
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@Jeffburgh posted something similar to this on the other board, but I agree with the sentiment. With Hugley, you're talking about a kid who hasn't played in almost a year, and really struggled with D1 speed and quickness on the defensive end when he was playing last year. They've seen him in practice, but his ability in a game setting as a sophomore with all the time off (and the extra weight that it looks like he's still working off) is still TBD.
So you have that, and then you have a road game that's already getting more than a little chippy with your only other good player, Femi, already appearing to be headed on the fast track to Technical Foul Town. It wasn't inconceivable to see a situation where they sit him but put him back with a few minutes before the half, WVU goes right after Hugley again and he picks up #3 with 2:45 left to go in the half. Instead, you could make the argument that they were able to get him to settle down and it ended up helping him play pretty well in the second half. I don't like the "two fouls and sit for the rest of the half" unwritten rule generally speaking, but I get why they probably were a little more careful in this circumstance. Maybe by the time we get into conference play, he's shown enough to be given a little more leash to be put out there with two fouls and a couple minutes left in the first half.
Hugley's play in the first two games has been a real bright spot this season (one of the few bright spots so far), and his two games this year has probably been the best two games that we've seen a center play since Michael Young has been here. So I get the argument for additional usage, and I think we'll see that more as the games add up. But even against the Citadel, you're talking about a guy who played 34 minutes as it was.
So you have that, and then you have a road game that's already getting more than a little chippy with your only other good player, Femi, already appearing to be headed on the fast track to Technical Foul Town. It wasn't inconceivable to see a situation where they sit him but put him back with a few minutes before the half, WVU goes right after Hugley again and he picks up #3 with 2:45 left to go in the half. Instead, you could make the argument that they were able to get him to settle down and it ended up helping him play pretty well in the second half. I don't like the "two fouls and sit for the rest of the half" unwritten rule generally speaking, but I get why they probably were a little more careful in this circumstance. Maybe by the time we get into conference play, he's shown enough to be given a little more leash to be put out there with two fouls and a couple minutes left in the first half.
Hugley's play in the first two games has been a real bright spot this season (one of the few bright spots so far), and his two games this year has probably been the best two games that we've seen a center play since Michael Young has been here. So I get the argument for additional usage, and I think we'll see that more as the games add up. But even against the Citadel, you're talking about a guy who played 34 minutes as it was.
6 of one, half dozen of another situation. If he keeps him in and he picks up his third quickly then he would be ripped for that. Biggest problem I have with his coaching is not having any strategy to attack full court pressure and half court traps. He better find something soon cause any coach that watches that game film would be crazy not to do the same.
Pretty much agree with you but I'll add (1) Lack of constant movement and screening in half court sets.
(2) I don't believe he's good at in-game adjustments.
I remember Jeff Van Gundy saying something he picked up from Pat Riley is playing good players when they have 3 fouls. He said "OK, what's the worst that can happen -- they foul out then I can't play them. Well if I am sitting them, I'm already not playing them."
IDK if any analytics nerds have done a study on this but it makes sense to me to play your best players the most minutes you can (with exception for NBA load management for injury purposes.)
IDK if any analytics nerds have done a study on this but it makes sense to me to play your best players the most minutes you can (with exception for NBA load management for injury purposes.)
I agree with the inclination to let them play with fouls. Get the most that you can out of them. One angle I can see in opposition to that idea is if the player gets too passive, avoiding contact or something, but playing through foul trouble seems like a skill worth cultivating.
Maybe an experienced player might understand the nuances of playing with 3 fouls on you .
If you can stay in the game ( score wise ) then you have a fresh rested player going down the stretch .
If they foul out your an idiot and if they don’t people will say I don’t know why they take a player out until the next time they foul out . Dam if you do dam if you don’t.
Yes, they have studied it and it says you should never sit a player for foul trouble because all parts of the game are equally important. Now, I wouldn't go crazy and play a guy with 4 fouls in the 1st Half but I would play a guy with 2 fouls in the 2nd part of the 1st Half and a guy with 4 fouls at probably 12 or 13 minutes of the 2nd Half.
Yeah, I can see removing someone briefly after a foul and I can see wanting to avoid picking up a third foul, say, in the last minute of the 1st half. But this notion that you automatically sit a player for the remainder of the 1st half when they pick up a second personal foul just seems like a vestige of pre-Enlightenment thinking. Someone defy this ancient taboo!
Hugley in or out of the game based on Capel's decision on early foul trouble isn't Pitt's real problem so it isn't worth fretting about. The problem is too much dribbling/free lancing and, above all, no 3-ball shooting. Hugley's inside game will all but disappear in ACC play as every opponent packs it in on D if Pitt continues to lack an outside shooting threat(s).
I'm not fretting much about the outcome of games this year. At least I haven't yet. Trust me!
I'm kind of speaking more as a generality, the benching of a player with two fouls in the 1st half seems like one of those established sports assumptions (like holding your best relief pitcher for a "save" opportunity that may not arrive) where you're just withholding a player because conventional wisdom says you should, when you might actually give yourself a better chance to win by ignoring the conventions.
if you pickup two quick fouls I'm not fully on board sitting that player for the reminder of the half. It has to be case by case. You have to see how the game is being called. You have to, at the very least, sit the kid down for some time. Let the emotion wear off. Maximizing minutes doesn't always mean letting them play with 2 fouls in the first half.
Apathy has set in with this basketball program.
I mean , what is Capel's vison for this team , the future ?
Recruiting is non existent.
Come on man.
I mean , what is Capel's vison for this team , the future ?
Recruiting is non existent.
Come on man.
I agree. After a guy gets his second, especially if they are two in quick succession, then take the guy out for a couple minutes so he doesn't get a third, frustration-type foul. But then as game situations dictate, put them back into the game.
BTW, since the women have gone to quarters it seems like coaches are more willing to play someone with two fouls in the 2nd quarter if they pick up two early in the first. I wonder if it's just kind of a mental block for some coaches? "It's the first half, we need to be really careful" versus "it's the second quarter, we can open things up a bit more" even though it's the exact same time in the game.
Towson should have never had the ball at the end of the half there to score anything.
Forget who the Pitt player was that had the ball on a momentary break with about 20-some seconds left. The break disappeared quickly but that didn’t deter our Pitt player. Continued out of control to the basket resulting in a predictable turnover. Smart move would have been to pull back and set up for a last shot.
Well, that's exactly my issue with Capel. I don't hang everything on wins vs. losses, and even stats can be misleading. I see players standing around on offense. I see players making bad decisions like the one you cited. I just don't see evidence of player improvement under this coaching regime.
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