LSU coach saying was a mistake hiring Canada but yet I would loved to have him last year. I think the offense wouldn't have been as bad or sloppy and if Browne couldn't hack it I felt he could have helped with Dinucci mobility better than Watson called it. It just makes me sick seeing we had something here offensively going great just for him to leave and get dumped on like that and what we went through last season. Watson may have tried to replicate Canada's offense but when somethings not yours, your not going to have it work as well. Just the thought of the things he could do with Picketts mobility and the wideouts like Shockey. Sigh
Matt Canada ordeal has me sick
- Thread starter Jsr862
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While I agree that it would have been nice to have had Matt last year, I'm not so sure that the offense would have produced anything near what it produced the year before.
I honestly think that Nathan had a lot to do with the effectiveness of the plays that were called.
I honestly think that Nathan had a lot to do with the effectiveness of the plays that were called.
There has to be a reason Canada has had something like 11 jobs in 14 years. Maybe he’s a good coach but a bad employee?
NP was the straw that stirred the drink.
It wasn’t just Peterman
That offense had fringe nfl players at every single position
QB Peterman - 5th round
RB Conner - 3rd Round
FB Aston - Stud
WR Weah - UDFA
WR Henderson -UDFA
TE Orndoff - UDFA
LT O’Neil - 2nd Round
LG Johnsin - 4th Round
C Officer - UDFA
RG Bookser
RT Biznowaty - 6th Round
Canada called a good game but he had a lot of talent to work with
That offense had fringe nfl players at every single position
QB Peterman - 5th round
RB Conner - 3rd Round
FB Aston - Stud
WR Weah - UDFA
WR Henderson -UDFA
TE Orndoff - UDFA
LT O’Neil - 2nd Round
LG Johnsin - 4th Round
C Officer - UDFA
RG Bookser
RT Biznowaty - 6th Round
Canada called a good game but he had a lot of talent to work with
Thought he finally found the freedom and fit he wanted at Pitt, They out coached a few quality staffs. Him leaving was a blow to Narduzzi imo.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
To be fair, we didn't get rid of him. So he couldn't have been that bad of an employee here, because we still wanted him. And most acknowledge the LSU situation was entirely on Coach O.
Nate deserves due credit, he was outstanding his senior year. But take a look at his performance under Chaney. Pedestrian might be too generous. Same with the offense as a whole.
One year later with a totally different system, totally new playbook and only a few months to learn it, and Nate looks like a 4 year starter running one of the more dynamic, productive and creative offenses in the country. You do the math.
Canada was the best thing to happen to Pitt football in a long time. Losing him was easily the biggest hit we took last year. Unfortunately, he's a rolling stone.
Yeah, it was the (maybe) 5th or 6th best FB, not the NFL QB vs a 5th year backup and D1AA QB or the highest paid OC in NCAAF.
LSU will never do $hit under Orgeron. One of the worst high profile program hires in recent memory.
I posted he was making a mistake, especially if he was angling for a HC job. Wasn't worth the extra money to leave a place where he had a HC who liked him and was going to let him do his thing without looking over his should to go to a program with the kind of expectations they had there.
His best play was to stay at Pittsburgh where he had the keys to the car, and lower expectations.
Yes, as some noted in this thread, he would not have had the crazy good offense from the prior year, but he likely would have had a solid year, and been set up to get back on track this year, and showed some much needed stability on his resume ...
I'm assuming your first post was tongue in cheek. In the event it wasn't....
Aston would still be a walk on depth player if Canada hadn't recognized his skillset and created some plays to exploit it. Look no further than Q Henderson to see another example. Watching that offense, it seemed very simple-Canada ran plays to take maximum advantage of the individual skillsets of the players in it, as opposed to shoving square pegs into round holes and hoping for a good fit. What a novel idea.
Watson wasn't playing with exactly the same hand of cards that Canada had, particularly at QB, but nobody would have thought Canada had much of a hand going into 2016 either. Narduzzi let him have full creative control and the results speak for themselves. As for Watson, he can't be judged on last year alone, but the indications to this point are that it's a big dropoff at OC from Canada.
And the offense started to do a bit better once Ollison was moved to Aston's spot.
If you're angling for a HC job, you make the jump to LSU. Successful SEC coordinators frequently jump to major jobs.
Dan Mullen to Miss. State
Charlie Strong to Lville
Jimbo to FSU
Pruitt to Tenn
Smart to Bama
He also made a crap load of money and still got another P5 OC job right away. Plus, his LSU contract was structured with the intent of him being there 2 years before trying to take a HC job. He wasn't looking for one for 2018. Canada essentially got paid $3.2M to coach LSU last year and will make $700k this year at Maryland. He made a fabulous decision that essentially nets him $4M for 2 years as a P5 OC. He has the stability of another $1.4M+ over the next 2 years at Maryland or definite chances at being a HC, if he wants. It is unlikely things would have gone real well for him at Pitt last year with the QBs we had on roster, unless he would have pushed for Pickett to play right away.
Coordinators for championship head coaches frequently jump to major jobs. Two of those guys were under Meyer, two were under Saban and Jimbo was OC under Bowden before becoming HC. That is why Meyer assistants like Luke Fickell, Tom Herman and Chris Ash have continued to be picked for HC jobs even though he is in a different conference.
Not saying that Canada made a bad move going to LSU, but working for Ed Orgeron isn't exactly a fast track to a HC gig.
Look at the recruiting class ranking of his offense this year. It probably averages out to a Top 5 overall talent level.
If you're an OC, and somebody tells you, "Hey, you want to get a head coaching job? I'll pay you one million dollars a year and give you the best talent in the country every year to work with, in the most prestigious conference in the country."
You take that deal and don't even think twice about it.
Right now he's a very rich bad employee if that's the case. The LSU salary and buyout was like hitting the lottery.
I don't deny that talent level and salary were reasons for him to take the OC job at LSU. But who are the coordinators that have worked under Orgeron before landing head jobs?
Aranda could have a number of jobs, but he is getting paid $2.5M per year to be a DC.
I'm guessing the same number that have worked under Narduzzi that landed head coaching jobs.
That's an odd standard to use because it doesn't really justify staying at Pitt under Narduzzi either.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
I think having guys leave to move up the coaching ladder is a very good thing for a HC. Shows he is finding the right people. I think lateral moves are a bad look but if it's a pile of cash and a big contract, like Canada, it doesn't reflect poorly on Narduzzi.
The truth is, and I know there's a few guys that don't want to hear this, Pitt needs assistants that can recruit first and foremost. Pitt can have the absolute best developers of talent but if every recruit is a project, you're never going to win enough to stick around.
The problem with that is that even 5 stars need developed. I hate always using these as examples but Paul Jones and Sterling Jenkins were 5 star players out of HS. Neither of them had any talent but they had the measurable to get the stars slapped next to their name. They still needed developed. I get that Pitt needs better recruiters but it needs just as good if not better developers too.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
Well, you can't have 5 stars to develop if they're not coming to your school so I think recruiting takes a front seat over guys that can coach players up. At least right now, that's certainly the case.
I don't disagree, but it was the argument that you made for him going to LSU: "If you're angling for a HC job, you make the jump to LSU. Successful SEC coordinators frequently jump to major jobs".
Agreed. He is still the DC there for the same reason Canada took the OC job. Money.
I understand the SEC cords getting HC jobs. But I don't buy it. He could have got a HC job staying at Pitt if he continued to succeed. Might not have been a huge coaching job. And frankly even coming out of LSU he wouldn't have got a good P5 job right away . I mean look at Conklin, some the worst defenses we seen but still gets a coaching job. Even though what he is from Woford or coached there before or whatever. But still you do good things regardless where your at you can land a HC gig from Pitt.
I don't feel as bad about it, because we offered a raise as well. We tried our best to keep him. It's not like we just let him walk away. We're just not in the financial position to match LSU's offer. Most schools aren't. It is what it is.
I didn't make that argument, somebody else argued if he was angling for a HC job, he should have stayed at Pitt and not gone to LSU.
I simply responded that based on the "future HC" argument, LSU was the best place to be. You're in the best conference, showcased every week for the country to see, you will have 4* and 5* athletes everywhere to work with, and the SEC provides a springboard straight to upper tier P5 jobs.
I think having guys leave to move up the coaching ladder is a very good thing for a HC.
Maybe if you're a Nick Saban. Not if you have a rebuild job like this one, where continuity is critical.
That sad, it's virtually unpreventable if you have a guy who's dong a great job.
I do wonder this upcoming year how much of the old Canada fly sweep series offense we're going to keep at all. (I didn't watch the Spring game.)
One of the biggest reasons Canada's offense worked so well is it was so multiple and balanced that it kept the opposing D on its heels guessing all game. Numerous different players carried the ball on sweep action plays as opposed to always the wideouts or slot guys. We had FBs and TEs doing it as well. There was a lot of ballhandling, deception and misdirection, the same plays were blocked differently to avoid giving up tells, there was a ton of play action, etc. There was a ton of creativity to the play and playcalling, while at the same time keeping it relatively simple for the players. It's almost like we never ran the same play twice, even if it appeared to the casual viewer on TV to be the same. Honestly it was brilliant.
I didn't follow LSU carefully enough to know why Canada didn't work out there last year, but I suspect it was because Orgeron was meddling with the offense and his vision of what it should look like. He said numerous times throughout the year that it wasn't "smashmouth" enough for his taste and that he was gong to change that.
Looked a lot different than the vanilla Watson or Chaney straight jet sweeps. Worked a lot differently too.
The Canada offense was good series football at its best. Like the Wing T. It wasn't just plays and constraint plays, it was entire series with little variations.
Again though, what's the point of having our current OC coach it, if it's not what he does best?
Again though, what's the point of having our current OC coach it, if it's not what he does best?
Based on his career, I'm not sure there is something we could point to as "what he does best" soooo...
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