Next years Offense

[Pitt20-20]

Alot of people are saying that it can't get worse.
Ok that's fine.
Tell me how it gets better then .
Use the TE more or just hope Pickett continues to progress ?
Honestly I'm a little worried about the WR's .
One of the 3 new guys should help but will that replace Ffrench and Mack seems to get dinged up a lot.
Just thinking out loud here.

 

[Macchiato]

The offensive line was young and inexperienced last year. They have another year to get bigger, stronger and experience playing together. They will define the success of this offense

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

TEs who can catch would be a big help. You would like to think Pickett will improve in year 2 of Whipple's system. You had Shocky and Wayne show flashes last year. I think Wayne is going to be good. Barden is going to play. Beatty called him the best route runner on the east coast. Addison is going to be used as well. It would be nice for someone else to step up like Smith, Butler-Jenkins, or Gipson.

 

[Pitt20-20]

The offensive line was young and inexperienced last year. They have another year to get bigger, stronger and experience playing together. They will define the success of this offense

I would be more optimistic with knowing we were getting new and better OL than the previous years crop just getting better with more experience.
The RB's are not to the level Pitt has seen in the past either.

 

[anon_d97v9o3a8b6xr]

What would our offense have been with even half of the drops and half of the poor passes. Think about how those two things just killed our offense. Lack of sustaining drives were a huge issue in the second half, as well as adjustments by the other team. If we can get the second half better to the point of scoring a TD every game, big difference.

 

[gourdt]

I think our best WR actually hurt us last year. Ffrench tried so hard to show his skills, and make up for his lack of receptions 2 years ago. Fumbles and poor special teams play hurt us a lot. I also think familiarity with the offense will help. That said, if the O line only practices stepping backwards to pass protect, it will never be able to run block. We need more balance and less trick plays.

 

[PittFanDan17]

I think next year Whipple relies on the run to set up the pass. We need to get back to at least being able to run the ball for 4 yards to set up 2nd and 3rd and short. Pickett was good last year, our OLine was not. They will 100% be better next year (still a weakness) but Whipple did as much as he could to with those guys. I am optimistic.

 

[cashisking884]

It will get better to *some* degree because as others said, it can’t get worse.

But in terms of projecting a massive jump? There’s no real reason to do so.

I just don’t see a team of high upside personnel on offense. Which would be okay if I had a ton of confidence in Whipple. But I don’t. He just doesn’t do enough to put stress on the defense. Which is going to require a more talented offensive personnel than what we have.

 

[cashisking884]

I think next year Whipple relies on the run to set up the pass. We need to get back to at least being able to run the ball for 4 yards to set up 2nd and 3rd and short. Pickett was good last year, our OLine was not. They will 100% be better next year (still a weakness) but Whipple did as much as he could to with those guys. I am optimistic.

But you wouldn’t put any of the OL issues on Whipple himself and what he is asking them to do within his system?

 

[9nationalchampionships]

We go as our OL goes. 4/5 return and the one that does not was a turnstile. Our OL will be stronger and heavier with another year in the weight room and at the training table!

KP will be back and although he is not able to take over a game, he is serviceable and now more experienced. Our O will be better...the question is how much better?

 

[JohnnyGossamer]

RBs, OL, WRs, TEs and QB will all be a little or a lot better. Whipple too because he's in his second year with just about everyone back.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

If they improve their scoring offense to average (from 21ppg to 30ppg), they're likely a favorite to win the coastal.

 

[9nationalchampionships]

Punching in TDs inside the 20 instead of settling for FGs can make a big difference. The coastal should be better across the board. Whoever wins it this year is going to have really good year imo

If they improve their scoring offense to average (from 21ppg to 30ppg), they're likely a favorite to win the coastal.

 

[jrnPitt]

The offensive line was young and inexperienced last year. They have another year to get bigger, stronger and experience playing together. They will define the success of this offense

I don't think the OL problem was having to get bigger and stronger. I think they lack lateral quickness and can be beat quite easily by our opponents DL's. And remember we are also replacing a not great OT that no one on the roster was able to beat out last season.---Until proven otherwise I see the same ineffective offense returning next year.

 

[jrnPitt]

I think next year Whipple relies on the run to set up the pass. We need to get back to at least being able to run the ball for 4 yards to set up 2nd and 3rd and short. Pickett was good last year, our OLine was not. They will 100% be better next year (still a weakness) but Whipple did as much as he could to with those guys. I am optimistic.

You can't run much if the OL doesn't block well. The OL is the problem that I'm afraid will have Pitt looking a lot like the previous season.

 

[MarySki]

At the LOI event yesterday Whipple compared Kenny to that guy Burrows. I hope he is right because he will have a lot to do with it. And he was serious....

 

[jtbuba]

Alot of people are saying that it can't get worse.
Ok that's fine.
Tell me how it gets better then .
Use the TE more or just hope Pickett continues to progress ?
Honestly I'm a little worried about the WR's .
One of the 3 new guys should help but will that replace Ffrench and Mack seems to get dinged up a lot.
Just thinking out loud here.

After watching all the games since the season many times; here are my thoughts.
1. The defense seemed to get sloppy every 4th quarter.
2. Each offensive lineman made blocking scheme mistakes every game all year.
3. Tight ends dropped more passes than they caught.
4. We missed on a lot of deep passes by slight under throws.
5. The team needs better focus the whole game. To many penalties

 

[superstein61a]

1. Year 2 of Whipple's offense. Everyone who was here should make some strides forward

2. The young OL will have had a year of experience and another year in the weight room and should be better

3. Wayne and Shocky gained valuable experience in the second half of the season and will make strong contributions next year. And I suspect one of the incoming freshman will contribute as well.

4. Even if you don't like Pickett, another year of experience surely won't hurt him

5. Hopefully the new TEs catch the ball and eliminate drops. Can't say this will happen for sure but if the team overall eliminated 2/3 of the drops from last year it would be a nice step forward

 

[Joe Magarac]

I don't think the OL problem was having to get bigger and stronger. I think they lack lateral quickness and can be beat quite easily by our opponents DL's. And remember we are also replacing a not great OT that no one on the roster was able to beat out last season.---Until proven otherwise I see the same ineffective offense returning next year.

I hope you are wrong but I fear you are right. One more year of experience does not guarantee improvement. Pitt fans will know where the offense stands after the first two games. Either a pleasant surprise or another average won loss record is in store for us long suffering Pitt fans.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

At the LOI event yesterday Whipple compared Kenny to that guy Burrows. I hope he is right because he will have a lot to do with it. And he was serious....

Well they’re comparable in that they’re both QBs. So there’s that.

When I saw Burrow play he had more than adequate time which Pickett rarely had. But he made all the throws and made them accurately.

And yes, the drops of course. But even KP’s completions aren’t always as accurate as they should be.

Pickett’s got enough that they can win with enough help around him. But he’s no Joe Burrow. My goodness.

 

[cashisking884]

If they improve their scoring offense to average (from 21ppg to 30ppg), they're likely a favorite to win the coastal.

That’s probably true of every team in the Coastal 1 thru 4.
UNC just needs their defense to get a little better because their offense looks like it’s putting 35 to 40 on everybody next year.
Miami just needs their offense to get to average because their defense is still upper tier.

VT is probably the school that doesn’t need a massive leap on any side of the ball to become average, as both sides were already at least average. They just need each side to get a little better to elevate them a lot more.

 

[Pitt5593]

Alot of people are saying that it can't get worse.
Ok that's fine.
Tell me how it gets better then .
Use the TE more or just hope Pickett continues to progress ?
Honestly I'm a little worried about the WR's .
One of the 3 new guys should help but will that replace Ffrench and Mack seems to get dinged up a lot.
Just thinking out loud here.

It’s all about the offensive line. Period.

 

[RoguePanther]

After watching all the games since the season many times; here are my thoughts.
1. The defense seemed to get sloppy every 4th quarter.
2. Each offensive lineman made blocking scheme mistakes every game all year.
3. Tight ends dropped more passes than they caught.
4. We missed on a lot of deep passes by slight under throws.
5. The team needs better focus the whole game. To many penalties

4. Kenny was hurt. His shoulder was garbage most of the year. I separated my shoulder skydiving at iFlY 6 months ago, and I'm just now able to throw a light ball relatively pain free.

 

[HopeandChangeforAntoons]

I agree that turning FGs into TDs would be a big upgrade. Their RZ scoring (TD or FG) was 90th in FBS at 78.9%. But looking only at TDs, they were 118th in FBS, only punching it in 47.4% of times they had the ball in the RZ.

But they also only had 38 RZ attempts, which was 105th in the country, because too many drives stalled out.

Last year Pitt had a Points-to-3&Out rate (drives that ended in FG or TD / drives that didn't get a 1st down) of 0.88:1. So Pitt had more drives where they didn't get a single 1st, than drives where they got points. For reference, Oklahoma was tops at 3.56:1.

Part of that is the anemic run game. You also have to wonder how many more times they'd have moved the chains but for a drop. But play calling was also awful at times. The terrible pass to Ffrench for -3 on 3rd & 1 in the bowl wasn't an isolated thing. Ffrench caught a school record 96 balls but couldn't break 1,000 yards! Neither he, nor Mack were in the top 200 in YPC. They combined for 31% of Pitt's catches and together averaged less than 10 YPC.

 

[MajorMajors]

According to a coach at the LOI event, the offense had a lot of injuries that held them back. Mack didn’t practice much late in the season and running backs had injuries that limited them.

Also said that TE Lucas Krull can really run. We’ll have to see how well he catches, but despite his size, an upgrade in speed.

Daniel Carter and the incoming freshman should help at RB.

As others, my biggest reservation is the OT position. Warren has experience now, but is he quick enough? I actually have higher hopes for Houy and Van Lynn...

And we have two giant OTs in this incoming class. Stratum is 6-7 but weighs 370 pounds! I’d rather see us bring in the 280 pound guys who can move some and add weight to them.

Go Pitt.

 

[Salempanther2015]

It will get better to *some* degree because as others said, it can’t get worse.

But in terms of projecting a massive jump? There’s no real reason to do so.

I just don’t see a team of high upside personnel on offense. Which would be okay if I had a ton of confidence in Whipple. But I don’t. He just doesn’t do enough to put stress on the defense. Which is going to require a more talented offensive personnel than what we have.

I disagree with the no talent comment or upside. Last years line was very young. We had a tackle and two guards with very little experience. Our best running back was a freshman and as far as receivers go Shocky and Wayne are both very young. Our receiving Corp will get a huge influx of talent with the incoming class. Not to mention we have a good power back that was a true freshman in Carter, not to mention Abanikanda who is very good. I think we have just the right amount of youth and experience to make this offense much better than last year. Just my opinion.

 

[jrnPitt]

I disagree with the no talent comment or upside. Last years line was very young. We had a tackle and two guards with very little experience. Our best running back was a freshman and as far as receivers go Shocky and Wayne are both very young. Our receiving Corp will get a huge influx of talent with the incoming class. Not to mention we have a good power back that was a true freshman in Carter, not to mention Abanikanda who is very good. I think we have just the right amount of youth and experience to make this offense much better than last year. Just my opinion.

You will have to convince me that our OL will be better than last absent the so so OT transfer thats finished playing and that no one else on the roster was able to beat out. The scoring O was dismal at best and a 2nd half disaster in most games.

 

[PantherO]

Alot of people are saying that it can't get worse.
Ok that's fine.
Tell me how it gets better then .
Use the TE more or just hope Pickett continues to progress ?
Honestly I'm a little worried about the WR's .
One of the 3 new guys should help but will that replace Ffrench and Mack seems to get dinged up a lot.
Just thinking out loud here.

I think there are a lot of "ifs" ... However, a few things to be at least optimistic on.

2nd Year with the same OC.
OLine is more mature. (bigger/stronger)
Pickett has another year under his belt and the same OC.
TE transfers.
RB are more mature (bigger/stronger)
Incoming WR's

 

[Pitt20-20]

I pretty much haven't heard a peep about Daniel Carter since he stepped foot on campus.
I'm surprised he didn't play at all last season.

 

[PittInMissouri]

[QUOTE="RJPittPanther, post: 2986368, member: 3456" If we can get the second half better to the point of scoring a TD every game, big difference.[/QUOTE]

Pitt lost 3 games during the regular season by a TD or less. So yeah, just 1 more TD every second half (and maybe 1 fewer turnover too - would have to look that up for those games), and last season is 10-2 with a win against PSU, a second place finish in the Coastal (due to tie breaker with Virginia), a likely top 25 ranking, and a better bowl game.

They really aren't as far away as we think sometimes...defense will be elite again, and if the offense can just clean up the mistakes (drops and turnovers) and score 7-10 more a game, next year could finally be the year.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

well on the flip side, we also won like 6 games by a TD or less too. some of those games we could have easily lost, some we SHOULD have lost. so we aren't as far as way from being a 3-9 team either.

sorry to be "that guy" but it's true. ucf, duke, even Delaware, we were down late and needed a rally to win.. but we did and so we got the W. that's why i hate playing the "what if" game with wins and losses.. to quote some coach, we are what our record is..

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

I pretty much haven't heard a peep about Daniel Carter since he stepped foot on campus.
I'm surprised he didn't play at all last season.

there was a thread about him specific to how thick his thighs were. it wasn't a great moment for Pantherlair, it got awkward..

 

[9nationalchampionships]

I think we can al agree that the team seemed worn down by the last part of the season! I just looked at the film for the 3 LBs coming in (DeSheilds, Roberts and Kamara) and they all look the part size wise and can run well.

I think they help out on STs immediately and by the end of the season should be able to help the LB corps. We need depth to finish games and the season well....are we getting close?

 

[jrnPitt]

I think we can al agree that the team seemed worn down by the last part of the season! I just looked at the film for the 3 LBs coming in (DeSheilds, Roberts and Kamara) and they all look the part size wise and can run well.

I think they help out on STs immediately and by the end of the season should be able to help the LB corps. We need depth to finish games and the season well....are we getting close?

People seem to be forgetting that our defense was nothing to write home about the last 4 games of the season. On paper the potential for a very good D exists but the late season performance make well question that forecast.

 

[9nationalchampionships]

That is what I said! Do you believe we have enough depth this year to play entire games and the season?

People seem to be forgetting that our defense was nothing to write home about the last 4 games of the season. On paper the potential for a very good D exists but the late season performance make well question that forecast.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

People seem to be forgetting that our defense was nothing to write home about the last 4 games of the season. On paper the potential for a very good D exists but the late season performance make well question that forecast.

front seven got manhandled by emu and boston college's rb is still running over us. but don't tell this board stuff like this, they are sticking with the "dominant" narrative..

 

[PittAU]

TEs who can catch would be a big help. You would like to think Pickett will improve in year 2 of Whipple's system. You had Shocky and Wayne show flashes last year. I think Wayne is going to be good. Barden is going to play. Beatty called him the best route runner on the east coast. Addison is going to be used as well. It would be nice for someone else to step up like Smith, Butler-Jenkins, or Gipson.

Yes. We led the nation in drops, right? About 48 of them. Cut that in half and the season is drastically different. Heck, run the ball at all and the offense is much different.

 

[pittdan77]

Yes. We led the nation in drops, right? About 48 of them. Cut that in half and the season is drastically different. Heck, run the ball at all and the offense is much different.

Yeah, this is a pretty big deal. You can point to a lot of defects in the offense but this is the one that probably hurt the most. With this defense, even if the offense isn't great, a twenty yard completion flips the field.

It's not like Pitt wasn't in most of the games they lost. Even a minor improvement in the offense yields at least one more win.

 

[cashisking884]

I disagree with the no talent comment or upside. Last years line was very young. We had a tackle and two guards with very little experience. Our best running back was a freshman and as far as receivers go Shocky and Wayne are both very young. Our receiving Corp will get a huge influx of talent with the incoming class. Not to mention we have a good power back that was a true freshman in Carter, not to mention Abanikanda who is very good. I think we have just the right amount of youth and experience to make this offense much better than last year. Just my opinion.

I never said there is “no talent.”
But this was one of *the worst* offenses in all of college football last year.

You can say, “they were young at spots,” and that’s fine. But high upside talent should be able to overcome youth at spots to some degree. Talent alone should keep you out of the basement of college football. And yet, we were in the basement.
Which means it’s either or a combination of the talent not being great and/or the OC sucking.
So projecting this upcoming season:

1. Talent is the same. It’s not like there is some hot shot Jalen Hurts grad transfer coming in.

2. OC is the same.

I’m not arguing the offense won’t improve. But you aren’t as insanely bad as we were last year simply because the OL was young at certain positions. That’s not an adequate explanation as to why we were 117th IN THE COUNTRY in offense last year. At some point somebody has to suck beyond real redemption to get that number.

 

[PittInMissouri]

well on the flip side, we also won like 6 games by a TD or less too. some of those games we could have easily lost, some we SHOULD have lost. so we aren't as far as way from being a 3-9 team either.

sorry to be "that guy" but it's true. ucf, duke, even Delaware, we were down late and needed a rally to win.. but we did and so we got the W. that's why i hate playing the "what if" game with wins and losses.. to quote some coach, we are what our record is..

sure...but if the offense were to be 7-10 points better and eliminate a turnover a game, then those close wins aren't close wins anymore either. I know you can't play the what if game and come up with a definitive answer, but with how good the defense could be, just a consistently average college offense in PPG should be enough for 10 wins.