Ok, I officially think this team is much better than Stallings last team..... and arrow is up...

[Vader_Storm]

Curious. How much do you think a philosophy to win with defense existed with Capel before this year?

It most certainly did. Last year is the perfect example. That team started 8-2 overall and 4-1 in the ACC. The first game against St. Francis was an anomaly on defense but after that, the entire team was dialed in on defense. And was winning with it out of conference and in the ACC. Starting with Wake Forest last year, the team stopped playing defense and the players slowly started quitting as the losses were piling up. Without the defense, the team was done for.

The same thing happened the year prior. The defense started off real well at 13-6 and 4-4 in the ACC. Then after the game at BC, the defense quit playing anywhere near the level they were at. Mcgowens was already having thoughts of quitting long before the season finished. And he left. As did other players, and the chemistry was lousy all season long.


So in the last 2 prior seasons we actually were playing defense really well to start the season off. But then, the team quit trying on defense, and lost, over and over again. This year, the script can be written differently if we play defense all year. Its up to the players to do it.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I appreciate the thought, but let's see how things go this year. The last six games have been agreeable enough, but the games prior offered some very discouraging performances.

I think the ACC is bad enough that they'll win 3-4 games, maybe 5. And if those 4 come back, I think I'd prefer to have those 4 on the team next year rather than having a MAAC coach take over a roster with 3 players on it including none of those 4.

 

[gary2]

It most certainly did. Last year is the perfect example. That team started 8-2 overall and 4-1 in the ACC. The first game against St. Francis was an anomaly on defense but after that, the entire team was dialed in on defense. And was winning with it out of conference and in the ACC. Starting with Wake Forest last year, the team stopped playing defense and the players slowly started quitting as the losses were piling up. Without the defense, the team was done for.

The same thing happened the year prior. The defense started off real well at 13-6 and 4-4 in the ACC. Then after the game at BC, the defense quit playing anywhere near the level they were at. Mcgowens was already having thoughts of quitting long before the season finished. And he left. As did other players, and the chemistry was lousy all season long.


So in the last 2 prior seasons we actually were playing defense really well to start the season off. But then, the team quit trying on defense, and lost, over and over again. This year, the script can be written differently if we play defense all year. Its up to the players to do it.

Capel’s commitment to defense has been constant.

It is the players that are the problem. Seem to hear that refrain quite a bit.

 

[gary2]

I think the ACC is bad enough that they'll win 3-4 games, maybe 5. And if those 4 come back, I think I'd prefer to have those 4 on the team next year rather than having a MAAC coach take over a roster with 3 players on it including none of those 4.

I think it is well past time to aspire to minimize the worst by retaining the creator of the present.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

I hate to say this but if Hugley, Femi, and Burton stay and we return Nike and Horton, I'd be ok with giving Capel one last chance.

1/3 is already 9 toes out the door and I bet another follows him. I’m done rehashing all of this I made all my points and he’s gotten 4 years. If you need to see more to know this staff can’t get it done thats on you. I’m 95 percent sure barring a miracle this experiment is over though.

 

[Vader_Storm]

Capel’s commitment to defense has been constant.

It is the players that are the problem. Seem to hear that refrain quite a bit.

Which is why we have to see how this year finishes. Because like I said above, everything points to this team still trying really hard and having good chemistry together. That is something that wasn't the case the prior 3 years with X running the team. And this current team has not quit on defense yet.

And like I said before. If Capel comes back and this team remains competitive (especially on defense) and wins some acc games meaning more than 4 or 5, I do NOT anticipate very many transfers at the end of the year regardless of the rule changes.

I also think that, depending on how many ACC wins we can get, recruiting can certainly be salvaged in the late period.

But that's getting ahead of ourselves. Because nothing matters right now except the Notre Dame game and showing up on the defensive end to beat them.

 

[TWPitt]

Capel’s commitment to defense has been constant.

It is the players that are the problem. Seem to hear that refrain quite a bit.

Both can be true.

The issue is what is the cause of the on-court play suffering. Is it coaching? is it player's family/external forces? Is it me first play?

These are the questions that none of us really know the answers to.

This is also the crux of what the decision to bring back or Fire Capel will be.

If this group of players stays dialed in and starts winning in ACC play and fans start to return (which normally happens when you win), then Capel will stay and recruiting efforts should improve too. I know recruiting looks bleak for 2022 but with the portal and our current roster and the fact that the type of HS player we are going to get that isn't really going to contribute much we would be ok with 2 developmental HS players with upside this year and 2 transfers to fill out the roster and continue to build on / around John/Horton/Femi/Burton for next year.

If they swoon like the past 3 years, then he is done.

 

[TWPitt]

1/3 is already 9 toes out the door and I bet another follows him. I’m done rehashing all of this I made all my points and he’s gotten 4 years. If you need to see more to know this staff can’t get it done thats on you. I’m 95 percent sure barring a miracle this experiment is over though.

Your information hasn't been all that reliable in the past and really feels like you have some personal axe to grind against Capel or the Pitt Program in general.

 

[Vader_Storm]

Your information hasn't been all that reliable in the past and really feels like you have some personal axe to grind against Capel or the Pitt Program in general.

The one thing I don't understand with him is the salt he has toward Femi. I mean, for a player that bballinsider said was 1 and 1/2 feet out the door already, in the last press conference Femi said he rewatched the St. Johns game 3 different times in full to help himself and the team improve and Femi certainly improved last game. That doesn't sound like a player that is remotely close to the type of teammate Mcgowens or X was leaving their teammates hung out to dry while quitting while the season was still in play. Ill excuse Toney because he got into a car accident before he quit in the season.

Femi is still doing everything he can to improve for himself and the team. He also cheers when he sits on the bench for his teammates, every single game.

 

[gary2]

The one thing I don't understand with him is the salt he has toward Femi. I mean, for a player that bballinsider said was 1 and 1/2 feet out the door already, in the last press conference Femi said he rewatched the St. Johns game 3 different times in full to help himself and the team improve and Femi certainly improved last game. That doesn't sound like a player that is remotely close to the type of teammate Mcgowens or X was leaving their teammates hung out to try while quitting while the season was still in play. Ill excuse Toney because he got into a car accident before he quit in the season.

Femi is still doing everything he can to improve for himself and the team. He also cheers when he sits on the bench for his teammates, every single game.

I had Femi as our best guard before anyone was announced as hurt or arrested.

He hasn’t always shown it this season, but I feel it is in there.

 

[DT_PITT]

Both can be true.

The issue is what is the cause of the on-court play suffering. Is it coaching? is it player's family/external forces? Is it me first play?

These are the questions that none of us really know the answers to.

This is also the crux of what the decision to bring back or Fire Capel will be.

If this group of players stays dialed in and starts winning in ACC play and fans start to return (which normally happens when you win), then Capel will stay and recruiting efforts should improve too. I know recruiting looks bleak for 2022 but with the portal and our current roster and the fact that the type of HS player we are going to get that isn't really going to contribute much we would be ok with 2 developmental HS players with upside this year and 2 transfers to fill out the roster and continue to build on / around John/Horton/Femi/Burton for next year.

If they swoon like the past 3 years, then he is done.

I haven’t even factored a possible swoon into my thoughts as of yet. But if we are able to start off something like 4-8, then lose our last 8, I do believe it would need to be factored in.

 

[DT_PITT]

Your information hasn't been all that reliable in the past and really feels like you have some personal axe to grind against Capel or the Pitt Program in general.

I don’t think he has any axe to grind with the program in general.

 

[DT_PITT]

I think the ACC is bad enough that they'll win 3-4 games, maybe 5. And if those 4 come back, I think I'd prefer to have those 4 on the team next year rather than having a MAAC coach take over a roster with 3 players on it including none of those 4.

Not sure I agree (or disagree) but I just wanted to note that this looks like a reasonable thought.

Bottom line for me is just letting the season play out. I suspect the “right move” will be much more clear by season’s end, one way or another.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Haha it’s not a joke. What Capel is doing is a joke. Plenty of coaches would love this job. Which you’ll see soon when we get some good candidates here in a couple months.

And no that doesn’t mean we are going to take away a successful P5 sitting coach or anything. But we can certainly get our own Mike Young/Stevr Forbes and give them a solid assistant budget. I am 100% confident in doing so the replacement could AT LEAST get us to the NIT once in 4 years.

Sure there’s plenty of coaches would like an HC ACC job , who wouldn’t like a multi million dollar position ? The problem is that the top candidates out there always seem to have other more attractive job offers .

When Howland left Pitts national search came up empty and Pitt got very lucky to give it to a little known assistant .

Lets not discuss when JD left .

When JC was hired it was looking like Pitt once again was getting snubbed when Hurley choose UConn . and there where no candidates until Heather got JC . Which at the time seemed like a coup .

I’m all in in having a new coach , I just don’t have any confidence that they can find anyone who can instantly come in here and bring in the level of players needed to be competitive. without some type of booster involvement.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I don’t think he has any axe to grind with the program in general.

I totally disagree with you here , when has he said anything positive?

Granted there’s not a lot of positivity around Pitt bb for a long time but there has been a few moments.

 

[DT_PITT]

I totally disagree with you here , when has he said anything positive?

Granted there’s not a lot of positivity around Pitt bb for a long time but there has been a few moments.

I understand your point but don’t think it’s appropriate for me to debate on behalf of bbinsiders intentions.

 

[HailToPitt1985]

Champ. That’s a good thing as kids want to go to the NBA. Other than that………..

Yeah, Champ was it. One good thing in almost 4 years.

 

[gary2]

Not sure I agree (or disagree) but I just wanted to note that this looks like a reasonable thought.

Bottom line for me is just letting the season play out. I suspect the “right move” will be much more clear by season’s end, one way or another.

Based on the last 5 games, I believe we can be in a good many games.

Conversely, I can’t say I “expect” us to beat anyone.

That is a pretty bad comment on the current situation.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I understand your point but don’t think it’s appropriate for me to debate on behalf of bbinsiders intentions.

I don’t mind anyone pointing out the negatives but his constant negativity wears me out !

I understand your position and I’m glad you don’t live in his head !

 

[pittjas]

I don’t mind anyone pointing out the negatives but his constant negativity wears me out !

I understand your position and I’m glad you don’t live in his head !

I too thought he was overly negative about Capel for the past couple years. But now I’m 100% with him. And he’s been about 95% right on all of it

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Yes, I have a personal axe to grind against our stable, very successful basketball program.

In this very thread, I admitted to TD I was wrong about Narduzzi who was ADAMANTLY against. I have zero problem admitting when I’m wrong about something. And I absolutely bleed blue and gold.

The problem is… this program and the staff are not good. There were uphill battles to climb when coach got here. And I was on board year 1, I thought he mismanaged everything year 2 with the scholarship situation and then used it as a cop out, and year 3 my eyes were completely opened and I think it’s nothing more than a Todd Graham fraud at this point. Maybe not as bad, because he’s not abusive to the kids or anything. But I think this entire staff is downright lazy. The roster management has been a joke, the recruiting has been so-so, and for a staff with 4 guys who have called timeouts on it we don’t seem to have any coherent plan offensively or defensively. I don’t blame the kids, it’s not their fault they don’t really develop here. Champagnie’s development coincided with Covid when the coaches’ were no longer allowed in the gym with them. Toney used to work out with private trainers around Pittsburgh all the time. I just don’t think they care enough, tbh.

agree with me or not, I have zero axe to grind with Pitt hoops. I’d love for them to be great again. I certainly wouldn’t spend my time on a message board talking to you knuckleheads if I didn’t like pitt hoops I’d go troll another fan base. I don’t care for people who don’t want to be held accountable and use excuses. There are no more. Everything has always been put off, oh 21 class is bad we’re really hitting 22 hard. Bad compared to what? Everyone is getting from the same pool of players. There’s always an indirect deflection of blame. Even the off the court problems. You can’t help someone is banging someone else’s girl or whatever else. Then they should’ve chosen Trey the year before over X and grabbed his little bro. The roster management and misuse of scholarships is the thing that bugs me the most. We have Femi, who is a decent lead guard, probably like 10-12 best in the ACC, and then 3 guys getting minutes who should be a 4th MAYBE 3rd guard for a good team. Jeffress should be at 5 mins or below a game. Hugley is playing too much but is a league average center.

Just the whole thing has been a cluster**** for 4 years. Not sure how many data points, including going back to Oklahoma, to see these problems follow coach. 1/3 of this roster or at least 2 players youre counting on for next year will not be here. We aren’t replacing them with the touted 22 class. We’re gonna replace them with darts at the board again. And that will give you more of the up and down performance we’ve seen.

There’s no culture, there’s no identity, there’s no foundation.

 

[gary2]

Yes, I have a personal axe to grind against our stable, very successful basketball program.

In this very thread, I admitted to TD I was wrong about Narduzzi who was ADAMANTLY against. I have zero problem admitting when I’m wrong about something. And I absolutely bleed blue and gold.

The problem is… this program and the staff are not good. There were uphill battles to climb when coach got here. And I was on board year 1, I thought he mismanaged everything year 2 with the scholarship situation and then used it as a cop out, and year 3 my eyes were completely opened and I think it’s nothing more than a Todd Graham fraud at this point. Maybe not as bad, because he’s not abusive to the kids or anything. But I think this entire staff is downright lazy. The roster management has been a joke, the recruiting has been so-so, and for a staff with 4 guys who have called timeouts on it we don’t seem to have any coherent plan offensively or defensively. I don’t blame the kids, it’s not their fault they don’t really develop here. Champagnie’s development coincided with Covid when the coaches’ were no longer allowed in the gym with them. Toney used to work out with private trainers around Pittsburgh all the time. I just don’t think they care enough, tbh.

agree with me or not, I have zero axe to grind with Pitt hoops. I’d love for them to be great again. I certainly wouldn’t spend my time on a message board talking to you knuckleheads if I didn’t like pitt hoops I’d go troll another fan base. I don’t care for people who don’t want to be held accountable and use excuses. There are no more. Everything has always been put off, oh 21 class is bad we’re really hitting 22 hard. Bad compared to what? Everyone is getting from the same pool of players. There’s always an indirect deflection of blame. Even the off the court problems. You can’t help someone is banging someone else’s girl or whatever else. Then they should’ve chosen Trey the year before over X and grabbed his little bro. The roster management and misuse of scholarships is the thing that bugs me the most. We have Femi, who is a decent lead guard, probably like 10-12 best in the ACC, and then 3 guys getting minutes who should be a 4th MAYBE 3rd guard for a good team. Jeffress should be at 5 mins or below a game. Hugley is playing too much but is a league average center.

Just the whole thing has been a cluster**** for 4 years. Not sure how many data points, including going back to Oklahoma, to see these problems follow coach. 1/3 of this roster or at least 2 players youre counting on for next year will not be here. We aren’t replacing them with the touted 22 class. We’re gonna replace them with darts at the board again. And that will give you more of the up and down performance we’ve seen.

There’s no culture, there’s no identity, there’s no foundation.

With no previous history of success at a school, few schools would give a coach a chance to start from basically scratch, after 4 years of failure.

 

[pittjas]

Yes, I have a personal axe to grind against our stable, very successful basketball program.

In this very thread, I admitted to TD I was wrong about Narduzzi who was ADAMANTLY against. I have zero problem admitting when I’m wrong about something. And I absolutely bleed blue and gold.

The problem is… this program and the staff are not good. There were uphill battles to climb when coach got here. And I was on board year 1, I thought he mismanaged everything year 2 with the scholarship situation and then used it as a cop out, and year 3 my eyes were completely opened and I think it’s nothing more than a Todd Graham fraud at this point. Maybe not as bad, because he’s not abusive to the kids or anything. But I think this entire staff is downright lazy. The roster management has been a joke, the recruiting has been so-so, and for a staff with 4 guys who have called timeouts on it we don’t seem to have any coherent plan offensively or defensively. I don’t blame the kids, it’s not their fault they don’t really develop here. Champagnie’s development coincided with Covid when the coaches’ were no longer allowed in the gym with them. Toney used to work out with private trainers around Pittsburgh all the time. I just don’t think they care enough, tbh.

agree with me or not, I have zero axe to grind with Pitt hoops. I’d love for them to be great again. I certainly wouldn’t spend my time on a message board talking to you knuckleheads if I didn’t like pitt hoops I’d go troll another fan base. I don’t care for people who don’t want to be held accountable and use excuses. There are no more. Everything has always been put off, oh 21 class is bad we’re really hitting 22 hard. Bad compared to what? Everyone is getting from the same pool of players. There’s always an indirect deflection of blame. Even the off the court problems. You can’t help someone is banging someone else’s girl or whatever else. Then they should’ve chosen Trey the year before over X and grabbed his little bro. The roster management and misuse of scholarships is the thing that bugs me the most. We have Femi, who is a decent lead guard, probably like 10-12 best in the ACC, and then 3 guys getting minutes who should be a 4th MAYBE 3rd guard for a good team. Jeffress should be at 5 mins or below a game. Hugley is playing too much but is a league average center.

Just the whole thing has been a cluster**** for 4 years. Not sure how many data points, including going back to Oklahoma, to see these problems follow coach. 1/3 of this roster or at least 2 players youre counting on for next year will not be here. We aren’t replacing them with the touted 22 class. We’re gonna replace them with darts at the board again. And that will give you more of the up and down performance we’ve seen.

There’s no culture, there’s no identity, there’s no foundation.

I don’t know how anybody can argue with anything in this post.

 

[Vader_Storm]

There’s no culture, there’s no identity, there’s no foundation.

Regarding this statement... I agree there was a lack of identity and culture the 1st 3 years. I dont agree with this statement this year if our defense and toughness remains on course like it has the last 6 games. And I already said 6 games isn't enough to prove anything. The defense needs to be cemented into place and playing like it has the last 6 games for the rest of the season with only a few bad defensive games sprinkled in. We have a group of players that is still wanting to be coached. If the players quit, and it wont be hard to tell when that happens because we will get blown out repeatedly like in the past, that's when the towel can be thrown in on Capel. That has not happened yet this year with regard to any of the players, including Femi.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Regarding this statement... I agree there was a lack of identity and culture the 1st 3 years. I dont agree with this statement this year if our defense and toughness remains on course like it has the last 6 games. And I already said 6 games isn't enough to prove anything. The defense needs to be cemented into place and playing like it has the last 6 games for the rest of the season with only a few bad defensive games sprinkled in. We have a group of players that is still wanting to be coached. If the players quit, and it wont be hard to tell when that happens because we will get blown out repeatedly like in the past, that's when the towel can be thrown in on Capel. That has not happened yet this year with regard to any of the players, including Femi.

Well what a rare treat that we agree

 

[caleco's]

I know thats not saying much, but, barring injury to key players, this team is much better. they will win some ACC games. Mo , Burton, Hughley, Femi all solid ACC players. we get Horton back soon, who knows, if he plays as well or better than last year.

huh???
we beat 2 garbage teams and suddenly we have acc talent? . this is a 3 to 4 conf win team. wow we almost beat minnesota the big 10s second worse team.... this team shoots less than 30% from the floor regularly. this team is good awful

 

[PittPharm2002]

1/3 is already 9 toes out the door and I bet another follows him. I’m done rehashing all of this I made all my points and he’s gotten 4 years. If you need to see more to know this staff can’t get it done thats on you. I’m 95 percent sure barring a miracle this experiment is over though.

But you’ll repeat it again 20 times a day , because for some reason you and smf think anyone cares what you think —
So ya beat everything to death.

let those of us who actually root for pitt and enjoy basketball find reasons to continue to cheer on the team.
The coaching decisions will be after the season.
We all know your opinions.

 

[Pittisit4me]

But you’ll repeat it again 20 times a day , because for some reason you and smf think anyone cares what you think —
So ya beat everything to death.

let those of us who actually root for pitt and enjoy basketball find reasons to continue to cheer on the team.
The coaching decisions will be after the season.
We all know your opinions.

I agree with this. No point dwelling on the negatives, and there are many. Reality is that nothing will be done about Capel anyway until after the season. I like the way the team has played over the last half dozen. I will continue to back them. If the bottom falls out as it has the last 3 seasons, the decision will be an easy one. If not, and Capel can sign a few players who are not just fillers, Heather will have to do some serious thinking about whether or not she wants to start over again.

 

[4Mark_Marty]

But you’ll repeat it again 20 times a day , because for some reason you and smf think anyone cares what you think —
So ya beat everything to death.

let those of us who actually root for pitt and enjoy basketball find reasons to continue to cheer on the team.
The coaching decisions will be after the season.
We all know your opinions.

I agree wholeheartedly with bballinsider and I will cheer the team on the rest of this season and forever.

 

[PittPharm2002]

I agree wholeheartedly with bballinsider and I will cheer the team on the rest of this season and forever.

There is not a single person who thinks Capel has done a good job and his career at pitt is safe , nor anyone suggesting he’s the answer to improving the program.
So it does absolutely nothing to rehash the point dozens of times .
It’s a matter of when and not if Capel is fired .

so let’s focus on the kids who are under gunned most games but are competing lately .

 

[mo cheeks]

huh???
we beat 2 garbage teams and suddenly we have acc talent? . this is a 3 to 4 conf win team. wow we almost beat minnesota the big 10s second worse team.... this team shoots less than 30% from the floor regularly. this team is good awful

If this is a 3 or 4 win team in conference it is light years better than the 0 18 team. That is all I said. This team is better than we thought a few weeks ago. I am not predicting a ncaa championship !

 

[PittPharm2002]

If this is a 3 or 4 win team in conference it is light years better than the 0 18 team. That is all I said. This team is better than we thought a few weeks ago. I am not predicting a ncaa championship !

That stalling team was not even remotely competitive most games
this isn’t even close - and yes this team is a bad team

 

[gary2]

If this is a 3 or 4 win team in conference it is light years better than the 0 18 team. That is all I said. This team is better than we thought a few weeks ago. I am not predicting a ncaa championship !

Be telling me the same things a month from now and I will listen.

 

[PittPharm2002]

Be telling me the same things a month from now and I will listen.

I could have told you the same thing after the uva game -
This team will lose plenty but will compete.
That team quit half the games and were down 20-30 often.

i really don’t understand your allegiance to what is literally a historically bad team and the only winless team in acc history

 

[DT_PITT]

I could have told you the same thing after the uva game -
This team will lose plenty but will compete.
That team quit half the games and were down 20-30 often.

i really don’t understand your allegiance to what is literally a historically bad team and the only winless team in acc history

That’s not accurate. There have been other winless teams in ACC history—most recently Boston College in 15-16.

 

[sonofabit]

I don’t know how anybody can argue with anything in this post.

Well there’s a bone to pick in regard to the notion that Champ’s development and the coach’s absence during protocols wasn’t just coincidental. Unless I misinterpreted that notion….

 

[PittPharm2002]

That’s not accurate. There have been other winless teams in ACC history—most recently Boston College in 15-16.

Fair
But also true that team wasn’t remotely competitive

 

[caleco's]

back up here
stallinga went 8-5 in ooc that 0-18. capel is not close to that and has far WORSE ooc losses than stallings did
capel will not go 0-18 only because of how bad the acc is this year. but say capel is no where close to stallings at this point is non sense.
he has been worse at the same point in the season

 

[pittchagg]

back up here
stallinga went 8-5 in ooc that 0-18. capel is not close to that and has far WORSE ooc losses than stallings did
capel will not go 0-18 only because of how bad the acc is this year. but say capel is no where close to stallings at this point is non sense.
he has been worse at the same point in the season

That team’s OOC schedule was padded with a collection of horrible teams…and played two more OOC games and two fewer ACC games.

 

[caleco's]

That team’s OOC schedule was padded with a collection of horrible teams…and played two more OOC games and two fewer ACC games.

lolololololololol.

i cant laugh hard enough at this comment