ADVERTISEMENT

Pitt Attendance/Atmosphere continues to hurt recruiting 4/5 star recruits

I have to disagree with you here. Big time. This has been noted time and time again. While it may not be the biggest factor, it is definitely a factor for what I would guess the majority of the kids. People always say "winning", but teams that win also have mostly full stadiums.
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain
 
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain

It’s on the list, but it’s low. And it has nothing to do with a # of fans, it’s more atmosphere.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ambst95
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain

But, if a few schools are in the running and close, then a factor — such as the lack of game-day atmosphere at one of the schools — can be what helps a kid to make his difficult decision of eliminating one of the schools.

All schools have coaches who are good recruiters, who know how to make the kid feel like a priority. All schools preach that we’re a family... All schools can point to players in the NFL...

And all schools recruiting against Pitt can show photos of the yellow seats... And social media has made it simple to get this negative message to a recruit — over and over...

Go Pitt.
 
Honestly don't think simple attendance is a primary factor. Or no great players would ever go to Miami or USC. Frankly just about all programs have empty seats in today's era of FCS opponents, huge TVs and man caves, and discouraged tailgating.

Pitt's facilities are fine, our crowds aren't anything more awful than the other average programs, and we've shown we can have as rocking an atmosphere as anyone in big games.

As i mentioned in another thread I think kids and their parents have changed. You had front runners and slob-nobbers before but it seems more substantial now. Seems almost all would rather sit on the bench with a program almost certain to excel (and get to tag a long to a playoff or major bowl) than commit to be a building block for a second tier P5.

And I'm not saying it out of sour grapes or special yearning for Pitt to get these guys. Recruits would be fair to question our overall commitment. But so many like us seem to struggle similarly.

As i said in another post it's inexplicable to me if I'm a 4 star guy (or his parents) that I'd commit to Alabama or PSU or Michigan, knowing they had 4 or more similar or higher ranked prospects at my position with multiple years left. And would not consider Illinois or Virginia or Syracuse (or yes, Pitt) instead. One or two competing players, ok. That's understandable (and desired... you want confident players).

But it seems there's no limit to how many current players & prospects might be in front of these guys to nudge them to take a flyer on a school not already basically guaranteed to win 11 or more.

Unless these blue Bloods outright cheat, but i think *everyone* does a little. Anyway, I don't think they have to cheat! They seem to be able to just snap their fingers like the Fonz.
 
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain

We have kids now from this area with ZERO interest in Pitt. Of course it doesn't come up, Pitt isn't even in the conversation. That is mostly because of the atmosphere at Heinz.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Las Panteras
Everyone is here talking about quick fixes. There may be a few, but I think the AD should work on the longer term fix. Yes, on campus stadium should be part of the strategy, but I'm thinking somewhat novel.

How about catering to the students. Ask them what it would take to get them to every game and make that happen. Tram cars like Disney...no problem. Carry "ALL" their tailgating supplies...no problem. Need ice? We got you covered! Have the trams swing by the typical student tailgating areas instead of just straight to the stadium. Gradually secure additional space for student tailgating activities. If a little drinking were to take place on the tram or in the lots, ...so what. You get the picture. Make it FUN!

The above list could go on and on. Make it a seriously fun time for the students and THEN, upon graduation, offer them reduced season tickets for a number of years.

Having the students remember a great time is the way to build a fan base that attends games. I suspect that it would take about 2 years of "catering" before ANY benefit could be seen and really about 5 years before it could be noticed by others. After 10 years or the results would be seen by everyone watching a game!

Students attending and having a "great" time will also be an opportunity to invite the parents out to games. Figure out how to make their game experience better and things would really begin to click.

This is NOT a quick fix.
 
You’re right. I didn’t mean to imply that Pitt football is boring, but the results have been boring. The combination of Heinz Field being too big, and the results being poor, the atmosphere is bad. When the atmosphere wasn’t bad was in 2009 against Cincinnati when we were a top 10 team.

Exactly. Winning cures all. Pitt has sold out games against Cincinnati and Virginia Tech when they've had good teams. Pitt's Administration created the problem and now they have to buy their way out of it.
 
Tarps, shiny new stadiums, different stadium locations, on campus off campus, different color seats...none of that crap will change a thing unless we START WINNING!! And not 8-5...

9 / 10 win seasons!! ACC coastal championships!!
ACC Championships!!
 
Lets start by trying to keep a Head Coach for more than 5 seasons. How about winning the Home games that we are supposed to win. Maybe if we get a lead in a game we don’t go into “conservative lets not lose this game” mode and let teams come back and beat us in the second half. How about we wins games that are national TV games that have strong followings and ratings instead of playing like we really don’t deserve to be on the field with those teams . Lets try to recruit and develop a quality QB nand running back that could be named in the running for Heisman every couple years or possibly great players that draws National attention. How about we field a defense that doesn’t give up tons of passing yards or points and gets blown away by teams that it should beat.
I guess what I am trying to say is when Pitt offers a program that will consistently WIN games, play exciting football, rank nationally in offense and defenses that dominate and compete for ACC and National Championships, we can expect to see Pittsburgh Fans showing up to want to be part of that excitement. It’s not really that difficult to see the solution.........play entertaining football..........recruit great players and.........just win baby. It’s not really that difficult.
 
YeP....bring back the illustrious FAN EXPERIENCE COMMITTEE...PROBLEMS SOLVED.
The people on the fan experience committee must be the same people on the Mueller investigation team. All the time in the world to come up with something and what do we have after all that? Crickets.
 
"Right size" Heinz Field to the capacity of Old Pitt Stadium 56,000 seats.

Use Tarps or any other means to achieve this Right Size.

Heather get it done starting in 2019.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
The people on the fan experience committee must be the same people on the Mueller investigation team. All the time in the world to come up with something and what do we have after all that? Crickets.


No the Mueller investigation team achieved a lot more in so short a time.

22 people and companies charged
75 criminal charges brought
5 guilty pleas
1 person sentenced so far.

Need a better analogy.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Echo the posts above about not just winning, but winning significantly. Blame the Steelers and Penguins (plus the fact that we have Ohio State, Notre Dame, Michigan, PSU post- Sandusky, and even WVU around us performing at a higher level.

Like it or not it sets the bar high for success. This is the professional sports business (as in, charging for tickets, paying coaches and even the players, even if only scholarships). It's not idealistic rah rah stuff some romanticize it to be. It's a ruthless business.

Blame the consumer if you want. But if they're getting near constant success from those and mediocrity from us, it's going to show at the box office.

8-5 and regular C- level bowl losses isn't enough. Maybe in Wyoming it would put people over the moon. Not WPA.

Atmosphere is created by expectations. I see it every week. Take your average mid season Duke game. The crowd walking to the game is a LOT different, not only in size but buzz (aka atmosphere) if we are 6-1 and in contention for a division title, vs 3-4 and basically with hope for a Little Caesar's Bowl at best. And that would be largely true at every stadium.
 
Lol
No the Mueller investigation team achieved a lot more in so short a time.

22 people and companies charged
75 criminal charges brought
5 guilty pleas
1 person sentenced so far.

Need a better analogy.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

A bunch of Russians who will never have squat diddly brought against them and other things with nothing to do with Trump

The Russian Hoax

The only known connection by a campaign and the Rusk is the Crooked Hillary/ DNC / ObamaWho DOJ

Mueller is a Clownshow scam
 
  • Like
Reactions: twak
No offense meant to either paulb99 or to panthergrowl13, either

But, Mods, please do something about this thread!

Since there is no longer a locker room, can you delete it? Or, better yet, please just delete all political posts from the thread.

It is becoming obvious that any expected constraint by posters to keep political opinions off the board is simply not working!
 
Last edited:
A bunch of Russians who will never have squat diddly brought against them and other things with nothing to do with Trump

The Russian Hoax

The only known connection by a campaign and the Rusk is the Crooked Hillary/ DNC / ObamaWho DOJ



Mueller is a Clownshow scam[/QUOTE]
tsktsk.jpg
 
No offense meant to either paulb99 or to panthergrowl13, either

But, Mods, please do something about this thread!

Since there is no longer a locker room, can you delete it? Or, better yet, please just delete all political posts from the thread.

It is becoming obvious that any expected constraint by posters to keep political opinions off the board is simply not working!
Better yet, how about create a board for political of off topic discussions. That way, whoever wants to engage in political talk can go straight to that board. And anyone who posts in a political nature on the main boards will get a warning and or banned if a chronic abuser of the policy?
 
  • Like
Reactions: paulbl99
Lets start by trying to keep a Head Coach for more than 5 seasons. How about winning the Home games that we are supposed to win. Maybe if we get a lead in a game we don’t go into “conservative lets not lose this game” mode and let teams come back and beat us in the second half. How about we wins games that are national TV games that have strong followings and ratings instead of playing like we really don’t deserve to be on the field with those teams . Lets try to recruit and develop a quality QB nand running back that could be named in the running for Heisman every couple years or possibly great players that draws National attention. How about we field a defense that doesn’t give up tons of passing yards or points and gets blown away by teams that it should beat.
I guess what I am trying to say is when Pitt offers a program that will consistently WIN games, play exciting football, rank nationally in offense and defenses that dominate and compete for ACC and National Championships, we can expect to see Pittsburgh Fans showing up to want to be part of that excitement. It’s not really that difficult to see the solution.........play entertaining football..........recruit great players and.........just win baby. It’s not really that difficult.


POST OF THE DAY!
 
Echo the posts above about not just winning, but winning significantly. Blame the Steelers and Penguins (plus the fact that we have Ohio State, Notre Dame, Michigan, PSU post- Sandusky, and even WVU around us performing at a higher level.

Like it or not it sets the bar high for success. This is the professional sports business (as in, charging for tickets, paying coaches and even the players, even if only scholarships). It's not idealistic rah rah stuff some romanticize it to be. It's a ruthless business.

Blame the consumer if you want. But if they're getting near constant success from those and mediocrity from us, it's going to show at the box office.

8-5 and regular C- level bowl losses isn't enough. Maybe in Wyoming it would put people over the moon. Not WPA.

Atmosphere is created by expectations. I see it every week. Take your average mid season Duke game. The crowd walking to the game is a LOT different, not only in size but buzz (aka atmosphere) if we are 6-1 and in contention for a division title, vs 3-4 and basically with hope for a Little Caesar's Bowl at best. And that would be largely true at every stadium.

Exactly. EXACTLY. We do well in recruiting outside the region, now even further outside the region. But think about it....yes, I know the WPIAL is down....but the constant mediocrity, the constant half filled stadiums and the success of everyone else surrounding us only makes our mediocrity even more unpalatable.

2016......we got 2 out of 4 of the top WPIAL kids
2017.....we got 1 out of the top 6 WPIAL kids (best class in a few years)
2018......Weaker class, we got 1 out of the top 4 WPIAL kids
2019 (so far).....Really poor WPIAL class, but it looks like we will be shutout of the top WPIAL kids
2020.....even weaker, but the top WPIAL kid seems like he is looking anywhere but here??

I know the WPIAL is really, really, really down....and I really do like this staff's quick understanding and going wherever they can to get good players, but it can't be denied or excused that the top local kids for whatever reason, aren't considering Pitt. And this didn't happen, even when the Big East was crumbling or we were horrid with horrible facilities in the mid 90's. But it is happening now, and I guess that is a more cumulative effect of all of this mediocrity.
 
Cheaper tickets are definitely not an option. If you're only paying $1 a ticket, fans have zero issue not using the tickets. The more expensive, the less like they are to skip a game.

Pitt games aren't always fun because the fans that go don't create an atmosphere and then the ones that don't go complain about everything. It gets pretty old. The solution is pretty easy and that's to reduce capacity. It's an easy solution and one that would create a better look and feel for the games. Clearly the athletic department doesn't want to do that so it is what it is.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DiehardPanther
We beat #2 Clemson. And there is more talk about Pitt nationwide than in Western Pa.

We come home to play Duke in front of a frenzied crowd of 33,000.

Tarping the seats wont change anything if the above data / local culture stays the same which it likely will for a long time.

We continue to pay for decades of ineptitude.
 
We beat #2 Clemson. And there is more talk about Pitt nationwide than in Western Pa.

We come home to play Duke in front of a frenzied crowd of 33,000.

Tarping the seats wont change anything if the above data / local culture stays the same which it likely will for a long time.

We continue to pay for decades of ineptitude.
I can't speak authoritatively whatsoever on collegiate football, but does anyone think the local media has any hand in the influencing the perception of Pitt athletics?
 
Exactly. EXACTLY. We do well in recruiting outside the region, now even further outside the region. But think about it....yes, I know the WPIAL is down....but the constant mediocrity, the constant half filled stadiums and the success of everyone else surrounding us only makes our mediocrity even more unpalatable.

2016......we got 2 out of 4 of the top WPIAL kids
2017.....we got 1 out of the top 6 WPIAL kids (best class in a few years)
2018......Weaker class, we got 1 out of the top 4 WPIAL kids
2019 (so far).....Really poor WPIAL class, but it looks like we will be shutout of the top WPIAL kids
2020.....even weaker, but the top WPIAL kid seems like he is looking anywhere but here??

I know the WPIAL is really, really, really down....and I really do like this staff's quick understanding and going wherever they can to get good players, but it can't be denied or excused that the top local kids for whatever reason, aren't considering Pitt. And this didn't happen, even when the Big East was crumbling or we were horrid with horrible facilities in the mid 90's. But it is happening now, and I guess that is a more cumulative effect of all of this mediocrity.

Yup.... I would also add the constant negativity towards Pitt in the media has contributed as well. The nitters in the media will never forgive Pitt and its fans for the way they celebrated the demise of JoePa and how they tried to use it against them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DiehardPanther
Remember two of the last three Homecoming games? How about the free beverage debacle that was a national joke? Until disasters like that go away with regularity you’re not going to draw much outside of the denizens of this board and a few thousand other diehards.
 
First thing, there are 80,000 Clemson fans. There aren't 80,000 Pitt fans. There aren't 65,000 Pitt fans. Lower tickets, even to free, is not going to solve anything. Everyone knows it is hard to even give away tickets other than games like PSU and ND.

I think the Penn State home game actually hurts us. A lot of PSU fans buy Pitt season tickets then take delight in just throwing the rest of the tickets in the garbage, so those tickets/seats will never be used the rest of the season no matter what happens. That's a problem. Pitt can be 10-0 and there will be empty seats because PSU fans are giggling, hoarding them throwing them away. Don't think those nutcakes aren't doing this.

So what has to happen, as mentioned winning solves a lot, but you have to have people interested and invested in coming to see Pitt and not the opponent. That is what happens in the big time programs. Oh sure, tOSU draws and excites PSU fans more than Akron, Oklahoma or Texas draws and excites Hoopie fans more than Kansas, but those fans mostly come to see the home team.

In Pittsburgh, as someone said because of 35 years of mediocrity AND sharing the city with the winningest franchise over the last almost 50 years, people just aren't in the habit of going to college football games. They just aren't. People here, casual fans just aren't college football fans. It is not even they are PSU fans or WVU fans or ND fans, they are just NOT college football fans for the most part. So that is our challenge, as it is for most Northern cities with NFL teams.

Then you add that oversized stadium with those blasted yellow seats, not gold, but yellow, like bright yellow, like a highlighter circling every empty seat. That's not going to change overnight. Even with a good season. It is going to take some big winning seasons and a sustained run before you start entrenching this area into paying attention to college football.
The stadium is fine, the [product is what needs to change. If you win, those seats will be packed. When Wanny was here and we played Cincy for the BCS bid, Heinz was absolutely rockin --- I'd put that atmosphere THAT day up against any other college stadium. It was wild, fun, fans were excited about THAT team. WIN... and it WILL be like that again sooner rather than later.
 
I can't speak authoritatively whatsoever on collegiate football, but does anyone think the local media has any hand in the influencing the perception of Pitt athletics?

I think it has an extraordinary influence.

Local media are never going to go after the Steelers or penguins. The fan bases of those franchises butter their bread.

Instead....Pitt....and its decades long ineptitude....is low hanging fruit and local writers / media seem to take pleasure in their criticism.

Someone like Ron Cook can take shots at Pitt with no fallout whatsoever.
 
The stadium is fine, the [product is what needs to change. If you win, those seats will be packed. When Wanny was here and we played Cincy for the BCS bid, Heinz was absolutely rockin --- I'd put that atmosphere THAT day up against any other college stadium. It was wild, fun, fans were excited about THAT team. WIN... and it WILL be like that again sooner rather than later.

Amazing how a winning team playing a meaningful game can do for atmosphere...
 
  • Like
Reactions: passedout
We beat #2 Clemson. And there is more talk about Pitt nationwide than in Western Pa.

We come home to play Duke in front of a frenzied crowd of 33,000.

Tarping the seats wont change anything if the above data / local culture stays the same which it likely will for a long time.

We continue to pay for decades of ineptitude.

I've post a zillion times on this one.....That Duke game meant nothing. There was no Coastal division title on the line, we were already eliminated from contention. Pittsburgh is a pro town and used to a title chase. With no title chase there is no casual fan interest. And couple that with mediocre season ticket sales, you just aren't going to get a big walk up crowd to "welcome home" the team after a big road win at Clemson. It just doesn't work that way in Pittsburgh.

The best way to guarantee people use the tickets they bought and hope for a decent walk up crowd is to be in the title hunt at week 9 or 10. Otherwise it is a sea of yellow. And if the Steelers were out of it by week 13 they would also have a number of yellow seats. Just not as much since they sell out on season tickets. Thing is it is very rare that the Steelers are out at week 13.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Ski11585
I've post a zillion times on this one.....That Duke game meant nothing. There was no Coastal division title on the line, we were already eliminated from contention. Pittsburgh is a pro town and used to a title chase. With no title chase there is no casual fan interest. And couple that with mediocre season ticket sales, you just aren't going to get a big walk up crowd to "welcome home" the team after a big road win at Clemson. It just doesn't work that way in Pittsburgh.


The other thing is that winning one game one weekend almost never results in a huge bump in essentially walk up ticket sales for a game the following week anywhere, not just in Pittsburgh. It takes more than just one win to motivate fence sitting fans to get off their behinds and buy tickets. Especially when the game you are hoping they buy tickets for isn't one of any great importance or against an opponent that people have more than a passing interest in seeing.

Nobody in our situation that year would have seen a huge spike in attendance at that Duke game. Nobody. That just isn't the way that it works, not here and not anywhere else either.
 
The other thing is that winning one game one weekend almost never results in a huge bump in essentially walk up ticket sales for a game the following week anywhere, not just in Pittsburgh. It takes more than just one win to motivate fence sitting fans to get off their behinds and buy tickets. Especially when the game you are hoping they buy tickets for isn't one of any great importance or against an opponent that people have more than a passing interest in seeing.

Nobody in our situation that year would have seen a huge spike in attendance at that Duke game. Nobody. That just isn't the way that it works, not here and not anywhere else either.

exactly....and it is on TV as well.
 
I think it has an extraordinary influence.

Local media are never going to go after the Steelers or penguins. The fan bases of those franchises butter their bread.

Instead....Pitt....and its decades long ineptitude....is low hanging fruit and local writers / media seem to take pleasure in their criticism.

Someone like Ron Cook can take shots at Pitt with no fallout whatsoever.

Bullseye!
 
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain

Yep. All things being equal, I’m sure attendance has some impact.
But in the end, it’s about recruiters.
 
Lol


A bunch of Russians who will never have squat diddly brought against them and other things with nothing to do with Trump

The Russian Hoax

The only known connection by a campaign and the Rusk is the Crooked Hillary/ DNC / ObamaWho DOJ

Mueller is a Clownshow scam


I'm expecting PM may be found guilty of some of the 18 charges Mueller charged him with by Monday or Tuesday of this week. I'll come back on the board once the verdict is announced. Not a witch hunt.

Will you also be here, so we can discuss.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Last edited:
No offense meant to either paulb99 or to panthergrowl13, either

But, Mods, please do something about this thread!

Since there is no longer a locker room, can you delete it? Or, better yet, please just delete all political posts from the thread.

It is becoming obvious that any expected constraint by posters to keep political opinions off the board is simply not working!


Just a reply to comments made by a a previous Pitt poster on this subject.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
Last edited:
The stadium is fine, the [product is what needs to change. If you win, those seats will be packed. When Wanny was here and we played Cincy for the BCS bid, Heinz was absolutely rockin --- I'd put that atmosphere THAT day up against any other college stadium. It was wild, fun, fans were excited about THAT team. WIN... and it WILL be like that again sooner rather than later.

Disagree.
 
Recruits......... I was around a ton of kids from 2010 to 2013 who were getting recruited by D1 programs. Whether they were at combines, Camps, 7 on 7 and many other settings.

Never did I hear a kid say I am going to pick this school because they get 100000 people at their stadium......never!

What I did hear was how they loved certain guys who were recruiting them and how much they felt comfortable and how cool the head coach was and his track record of getting players into the pro’s playing his certain spot.

If a kid picks a school because of how many fans they have who show up at games he needs new advice from whoever is pumping that in his brain


You do know why you hear this a lot the last few years ?
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT