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Pitt job is attractive

I went to that Pittsburgh / ND game - pitting Wannstedt against Charlie Weiss. Speaking of Pitting. My goodness. I went with my buddy who was a huge ND fan and I was feeling pretty good that it was going to be a good game. Boy, was I wrong. What a completely humiliating loss. We got dismantled and I think I never really became a believer in Dave from that point on. That performance, especially since it was a home game, was unforgivable.

You brought up Walt not being a great speaker. You know who else had more trouble putting sentences together in front of the media? Wannstedt. You know who else? Paul Chryst. In fact, I would say Walt was actually- as hard as it is to believe- a bit better than both of those two and for all the criticism he is now getting - Pat Narduzzi comes across far more articulate and eloquent now than either Wannstedt or Chryst.


Wannstedt had trouble just getting words and thoughts out of his mouth. He was always like a dear in headlights - he never seemed to know what to say.

Chryst knew what to say, but could never seem to be able to finish a sentence.

Narduzzi is far from being a great oratorios - and we may feel he does not give us the answers we want to hear, but at least he can deliver complete; intelligible thoughts.
That game was a beatdown. No doubt. The rest of your post I disagree with. Wanny did do college football commentary for years on fox. Speaking ability was not his problem. It was his best asset.
 
He let UCONN & Cinci pass us in the pecking order of the Big East. Please stop with the Wanny shouldn't have been fired stuff.
I don't know if I would call this passing us in the pecking order of the Big East. Wanny was 5-2 in his last season, same as UCONN. Cincy was 2-5 and PItt beat the brakes off UC in Wanny's last game. I thought PItt was a better program that both.

Records from 2008-10

Pitt 27- 12 overall, 15-6 Big East
UC 27-12 overall, 15-6 Big East
UConn 24-15 overall, 11-10 Big East

Wanny just delivered the best 3 year stretch in Pitt football over the last 40 years. That fact, plus it was obvious the replacement would be a clear downgrade, I don't see how you can possibly conclude that a coaching change was a good idea.
 
I don't know if I would call this passing us in the pecking order of the Big East. Wanny was 5-2 in his last season, same as UCONN. Cincy was 2-5 and PItt beat the brakes off UC in Wanny's last game. I thought PItt was a better program that both.

Records from 2008-10

Pitt 27- 12 overall, 15-6 Big East
UC 27-12 overall, 15-6 Big East
UConn 24-15 overall, 11-10 Big East

Wanny just delivered the best 3 year stretch in Pitt football over the last 40 years. That fact, plus it was obvious the replacement would be a clear downgrade, I don't see how you can possibly conclude that a coaching change was a good idea.

When it mattered.....Pitt lost to Cinci. When it mattered.....Pitt lost to UCONN. And to rub more salt in the wound, WVU blew Pitt out of the water in the season finale by a coach who would be fired at the end of the season. If you are happy with that I don't know what to say.
 
When it mattered.....Pitt lost to Cinci. When it mattered.....Pitt lost to UCONN. And to rub more salt in the wound, WVU blew Pitt out of the water in the season finale by a coach who would be fired at the end of the season. If you are happy with that I don't know what to say.
Pitt went 27-12 from 2008-10. Sure, it would have been nice to accomplish a bit more, but that is a helluva lot better than Pitt ended up with after they canned him. If you are happy with what you got after Wanny was fired, then I don't know what to say.
 
Pitt went 27-12 from 2008-10. Sure, it would have been nice to accomplish a bit more, but that is a helluva lot better than Pitt ended up with after they canned him. If you are happy with what you got after Wanny was fired, then I don't know what to say.

at least they tried to improve from Wanny, it didn't go so well for a number of reasons. But how you can be happy with Cinci & UCONN, teams with zero tradition, winning the Big East and Wanny winning it exactly ZERO times, is beyond me.
 
at least they tried to improve from Wanny, it didn't go so well for a number of reasons. But how you can be happy with Cinci & UCONN, teams with zero tradition, winning the Big East and Wanny winning it exactly ZERO times, is beyond me.
Yes. They tried to improve from Wanny and they failed miserably. They once again suffered losing records and walked 3 head coaches up to the podium in a span of 12 months and made the program a laughing stock once again.

FWIW, Pitt was Big East Co-Champs in 2010, they just didn't win the tie-breaker for the BCS Bowl game. (That isn't really a bad thing, imo)

When you think about it, they didn't really try to improve from Wanny. They hired Mike Haywood.

When Pitt fires a football coach, they have a whole roster of players that are hit with the realization that they are going to be playing for a staff that didn't recruit them, (new system, personalities, etc.) so naturally not all of them are going to stick around. The entire staff is dusting off their resume. Pitt is thrust into a a leadership void with a tight time frame to hire a new head coach, and the coaching search itself is a game where the deck is stacked against Pitt. It's usually a step back before a step forward at a school like Pitt that isn't a major player in recruiting.

It's ridiculous to fire a coach that is winning, competing for conference championships, and recruiting at a somewhat higher level than Pitt has in the past 20 years. The risk/reward just doesn't justify it.
 
it's not a given that you lose good coaches. briles stayed at baylor, patterson at tcu, petersen stayed at BSU a long time. hell, we held on to jamie for years. i'm not saying it's likely or easy; but it can be done.

but a coach is so good that he's gone after 3 years, then that's a great selling point to new coaches. "do what that guy did and you're in the big time in 3 years."

Narduzzi is doing just as well as Patterson since TCU made the move to P5.

Pitt needs to view itself as big time and build its program to recruit like it.
 
The Wanny debate will never end because both sides are at least partially right...
  • Many of us were extremely frustrated by the big game losses against WVU, Cincy, Uconn
  • Many of us loved him and almost everyone thinks the Haywood hire was uniquely bad
 
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gary has 3 top 10 finishes. i'd give my leg for just one.

Gary is a helluva coach and I'm not trying to take anything away from him. He's done a great job there.

Since joining the Big 12, he's also had 3 losing seasons and a few more with only 6 or 7 wins. Higher highs & lower lows.

I don't really put any stock in rankings and rarely look at them, tbh. What purpose do they serve?
 
Gary is a helluva coach and I'm not trying to take anything away from him. He's done a great job there.

Since joining the Big 12, he's also had 3 losing seasons and a few more with only 6 or 7 wins. Higher highs & lower lows.

I don't really put any stock in rankings and rarely look at them, tbh. What purpose do they serve?

well, it's how we measure success. and he's had a small school finish as high as #3 in the country- that sounds like some fun seasons. I'd trade some higher highs and some lower lows (not really much lower) over straight mediocrity in perpetuity. they've played in big games that meant something, real bowl games, on field sustained success during a full season. I'd trade our situation for their's any day.
 
well, it's how we measure success. and he's had a small school finish as high as #3 in the country- that sounds like some fun seasons. I'd trade some higher highs and some lower lows (not really much lower) over straight mediocrity in perpetuity. they've played in big games that meant something, real bowl games, on field sustained success during a full season. I'd trade our situation for their's any day.

I don't think the rankings tell an accurate picture. Actually, I think they are a crock. If TCU were truly a top 3 team in 2014, they would have been in the playoffs. Instead we had tOSU, Oregon, Bama, and FSU. They got a nice invite to a meaningless bowl where they beat the hell out of an Ole Miss team that lost 4 of 6 to close the season. Still a great season, but I don't think they were one of the top 3 teams in 2014. Obviously the CFP committee didn't either.
 
Yes. They tried to improve from Wanny and they failed miserably. They once again suffered losing records and walked 3 head coaches up to the podium in a span of 12 months and made the program a laughing stock once again.

FWIW, Pitt was Big East Co-Champs in 2010, they just didn't win the tie-breaker for the BCS Bowl game. (That isn't really a bad thing, imo)

When you think about it, they didn't really try to improve from Wanny. They hired Mike Haywood.

When Pitt fires a football coach, they have a whole roster of players that are hit with the realization that they are going to be playing for a staff that didn't recruit them, (new system, personalities, etc.) so naturally not all of them are going to stick around. The entire staff is dusting off their resume. Pitt is thrust into a a leadership void with a tight time frame to hire a new head coach, and the coaching search itself is a game where the deck is stacked against Pitt. It's usually a step back before a step forward at a school like Pitt that isn't a major player in recruiting.

It's ridiculous to fire a coach that is winning, competing for conference championships, and recruiting at a somewhat higher level than Pitt has in the past 20 years. The risk/reward just doesn't justify it.
Spot on post. Especially the last sentence. I would have loved to see what Wanny would do with a bigger
budget and rid of Pederson.
 
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I don't think the rankings tell an accurate picture. Actually, I think they are a crock. If TCU were truly a top 3 team in 2014, they would have been in the playoffs. Instead we had tOSU, Oregon, Bama, and FSU. They got a nice invite to a meaningless bowl where they beat the hell out of an Ole Miss team that lost 4 of 6 to close the season. Still a great season, but I don't think they were one of the top 3 teams in 2014. Obviously the CFP committee didn't either.

they finished 3. that's it. they did. you're opinion is not a fact. they finished 3 - that is a fact. we haven't finished in the top 10 in almost 40 years. do you hate fun? that seems to be your only argument - you want to die on the hill of the Pitt being better off NOT having multiple top 10 finishes? what in the world is your argument here?
 
That game was a beatdown. No doubt. The rest of your post I disagree with. Wanny did do college football commentary for years on fox. Speaking ability was not his problem. It was his best asset.
Are you being serious? Best asset? Lol.

His "nice guy" demeanor and his ability to recruit some really good players at Pitt were by far his two best assets. Did you ever hear him speak to a reporter on the sidelines before going into the locker room at halftime while he was the coach of Pitt or listen to any of his his press conferences at Piit? It was often painful to watch.

He did eventually get a little better over time at Fox, but even then, he was hardly elaquent.

Nice guy Yinzer: yes.

A gifted orator: not so much.
 
they finished 3. that's it. they did. you're opinion is not a fact. they finished 3 - that is a fact. we haven't finished in the top 10 in almostyears. do you hate fun? that seems to be your only argument - you want to die on the hill of the Pitt being better off NOT having multiple top 10 finishes? what in the world is your argument here?

No argument. I think he's done a great job at TCU. I've stated as much. All I'm saying is that I don't care what they were ranked. It doesn't influence my opinion of how I perceive TCU's program. After all, the rankings are nothing more than a compilation of opinions.

You could put stock in a compilation of a bunch of opinions and conclude Jason White is better than Larry Fitzgerald if you want. Rankings are one of the most absurd things about college football, imo.

TCU plays in a horrible conference. They play in the only P5 conference that has yet to notch a victory in the playoffs. Nice program, and yes, certainly more successful than Pitt. However, they are only 44-37 in the Big 12 compared to their lofty record of 48-3 in the Mountain West. They were Big 12 Co-Champs in 2014, sharing the conference title with Baylor, but they also lost to the Bears that year. There is a difference, but not really that much when you break it down. ...unless you put all your stock in rankings.
 
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Are you being serious? Best asset? Lol.

His "nice guy" demeanor and his ability to recruit some really good players at Pitt were by far his two best assets. Did you ever hear him speak to a reporter on the sidelines before going into the locker room at halftime while he was the coach of Pitt or listen to any of his his press conferences at Piit? It was often painful to watch.

He did eventually get a little better over time at Fox, but even then, he was hardly elaquent.

Nice guy Yinzer: yes.

A gifted orator: not so much.

I have never heard a football coach speak that I would consider a gifted orator. Some have more personality than others, and a few are really good storytellers, but very few are gifted orators.
 
Are you being serious? Best asset? Lol.

His "nice guy" demeanor and his ability to recruit some really good players at Pitt were by far his two best assets. Did you ever hear him speak to a reporter on the sidelines before going into the locker room at halftime while he was the coach of Pitt or listen to any of his his press conferences at Piit? It was often painful to watch.

He did eventually get a little better over time at Fox, but even then, he was hardly elaquent.

Nice guy Yinzer: yes.

A gifted orator: not so much.
Narduzzi’s press conferences are the worst of all time! Ya know lol
 
No argument. I think he's done a great job at TCU. I've stated as much. All I'm saying is that I don't care what they were ranked. It doesn't influence my opinion of how I perceive TCU's program. After all, the rankings are nothing more than a compilation of opinions.

You could put stock in a compilation of a bunch of opinions and conclude Jason White is better than Larry Fitzgerald if you want. Rankings are one of the most absurd things about college football, imo.

TCU plays in a horrible conference. They play in the only P5 conference that has yet to notch a victory in the playoffs. Nice program, and yes, certainly more successful than Pitt. However, they are only 44-37 in the Big 12 compared to their lofty record of 48-3 in the Mountain West. They were Big 12 Co-Champs in 2014, sharing the conference title with Baylor, but they also lost to the Bears that year. There is a difference, but not really that much when you break it down. ...unless you put all your stock in rankings.

rankings is how we measure success. i would love to know your judgement that is completely different from how the sport has done so for the last 100+ years and is 100% accepted.

and how is the big 12 any worse than the ACC, especially the coastal?
 
This "I'm not anti Gary Patterson, but actually..." stuff is silly. He won 11 games twice and 12 games once since joining the Big 12. In 2014, they were 3 points away from a perfect record and had ten wins over Power Five teams alone. He's won a Rose and a Peach bowl on New Year's Day. They've stalled out a bit lately but it's a hall of fame coaching career by someone with multiple national coach of the year honors.

Pitt hasn't won 11 games in almost 40 years. What was Pitt's last big name bowl win? Narduzzi hasn't gotten to 9 wins once yet (though I have some hope for this year and think he's done a decent and sometimes underrated job.)
 
Narduzzi’s press conferences are the worst of all time! Ya know lol
Narduzzi’s press conferences can be tough to listen to - especially when Pitt loses - because they are often filled with the same lame excuses or non answers or vague responses that don’t really answer the question.

Wannstedt’s press conferences where tough to listen to because he had trouble even articulating his thoughts. He didn’t even know what he wanted to say.

Chryst’s press conferences were tough to listen to because he stared on another sentence before he ever finished the sentence before it.
He couldn’t finish a thought.

You can tell all three are genuinely good guys who really want the best for their players. It’s probably fair to say that Pat can come across a little bit arrogant and dismissive. Dave was the only one of the three to have have Pitt in the top 25 at the end of the season (15th) and the only one of the three to crack the top 10 during the season. I want to remain as as fair as possible. That is why I can can’t act like Dave’s speaking ability was his best asset. Honestly, (please look at his Pitt press conferences or halftime interviews) it just wasn’t a strength of his.
 
Narduzzi’s press conferences can be tough to listen to - especially when Pitt loses - because they are often filled with the same lame excuses or non answers or vague responses that don’t really answer the question.

Wannstedt’s press conferences where tough to listen to because he had trouble even articulating his thoughts. He didn’t even know what he wanted to say.

Chryst’s press conferences were tough to listen to because he stared on another sentence before he ever finished the sentence before it.
He couldn’t finish a thought.

You can tell all three are genuinely good guys who really want the best for their players. It’s probably fair to say that Pat can come across a little bit arrogant and dismissive. Dave was the only one of the three to have have Pitt in the top 25 at the end of the season (15th) and the only one of the three to crack the top 10 during the season. I want to remain as as fair as possible. That is why I can can’t act like Dave’s speaking ability was his best asset. Honestly, (please look at his Pitt press conferences or halftime interviews) it just wasn’t a strength of his.

at least Wanny sounded like a head coach in interviews/press conferences. I never thought he was that bad on the mic. Chryst and Narduzzi, on the other hand, are unlistenable.
 
I have never heard a football coach speak that I would consider a gifted orator. Some have more personality than others, and a few are really good storytellers, but very few are gifted orators.
Lou Holtz and Knute Rockne were pretty darn good at giving speeches. I wasn’t making a point that there are a lot coaches who speak well, though. I was simply pointing out that Wannstedt’s best asset at Pitt was certainly not his speaking ability.
 
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at least Wanny sounded like a head coach in interviews/press conferences. I never thought he was that bad on the mic. Chryst and Narduzzi, on the other hand, are unlistenable.
Not defending Christ or Narduzzi, but I implore you to find some footage of Dave at Pitt responding to questions during post game press conferences or at halftime during any game. I remember saying, “For the love of God, can someone in the Pitt administration please get this guy a speaking coach. He’s like a dear in headlights when anyone asks him a question.”

I will admit he has gotten a little better since his Pitt days.
 
rankings is how we measure success. i would love to know your judgement that is completely different from how the sport has done so for the last 100+ years and is 100% accepted.

and how is the big 12 any worse than the ACC, especially the coastal?
The NFL does just fine without rankings.

The Big 12 is the only P5 conference that has yet to win a single playoff game. Clemson has been one of the two best programs in college football during the playoff era, so obviously it's harder to win the ACC than the Big 12. The Big 12 is working their ass off just to remain a conference.

Lots of things are accepted in college football that are stupid, tbh.
 
The NFL does just fine without rankings.

The Big 12 is the only P5 conference that has yet to win a single playoff game. Clemson has been one of the two best programs in college football during the playoff era, so obviously it's harder to win the ACC than the Big 12. The Big 12 is working their ass off just to remain a conference.

Lots of things are accepted in college football that are stupid, tbh.
Ha!
 
That game was a beatdown. No doubt. The rest of your post I disagree with. Wanny did do college football commentary for years on fox. Speaking ability was not his problem. It was his best asset.

Yea, Wannstedt might have had a lot of negative qualities but public speaking might have been the thing he was best at. He was entertaining and always seemed to have meaningful things to say. Chryst, I cringed when he spoke. I'm not sure I've ever seen a public figure worse at public speaking than he was. It almost seemed like English was his 2nd language. When he spoke, I got that feeling like I was embarrassed for him.
 
I know people say the coach's job is to win games, not make nice with the media and do good press conferences. But I really think part of why fans (and players?) liked Wanny is he really seemed sincere about his love for Pitt and his players. So there is something to that, and I wish Narduzzi would show a little more grace when answering questions.

Graham's lack of sincerity was apparent on day one. Chryst seemed sincere yet lost in his own world. Haywood gave the strangest press conference of all time.
 
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what is ASU thinking???
You have to wonder but likely he had answers to their questions and probably started by telling them Pitt's negatives in terms of his being a poor fit here, he didn't even like sharing the Steeler's facility....
 
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