Pitt's fall to middle of the pack

[cranberrypanther]

How did Pitt hoops fall so far so fast? It really isn't that complicated, it's recruiting. I am not even going to get into the assistant coaches that have left, which is HUGE!

Off the top of my head these are a few names that I feel led to the current slump. I'm sure I am missing several!

• Losing Birch, Adams, Gilbert, Johnson and Johnson left big holes in the roster, obviously
• Not closing the deal on Heron, Rowan, Diallo or Swanigan left the coaches scrambling and picking up scraps (Uchebo)
• The Mostella saga? What was that all about??
• Jaylen Bond? What was that all about???
• JRob having his best season as a frosh then becoming very average
• Landing the worst of the Gibbs brothers didn't help either, could have used all 3!!

So there are 10-11 players over the last 5 years that have put Pitt in its current situation. Jamie is still a good coach, not a great coach, but good enough to be in the top tier of the ACC with the right talent.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I still think he's still figuring out where to recruit, what players to recruit, and who will recruit them since joining ACC.

 

[PittPoker]

Well as long as we are gonna be ranked 74th expect similar results. 74th?? That is depressing on so many levels.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Mostella was committed to Oklahoma State then committed to Pitt out of nowhere. I think he had qualifying issues. He's not doing that much at Tennessee. Shooting percentage not great and turns it over a lot. I think someone said on here defensively he'd fit right in here.

On Bond - He decided to back out (sounds like he may have been forced out) and go to prep school after Birch reclassified and got here earlier than expected. Hope Harve jumps in here - he knows the story well and I'm going by memory. He said that really hurt Pitt in the Philly area and we still haven't recovered. I don't think Carr or the other kid (both went to PSU right??) much consideration.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

And Birch was an overrated player who was either a head case or had crooked handlers--or maybe both.

 

[LeftCoastPanther]

The Birch departure was the biggest loss IMO. Pairing him and Adams in 2012-13 would have been Rejection City and the following year Patterson, Zanna and Birch may have been the best frontcourts in basketball. I think we would have seen better runs in the NCAAs as a better seed. Better tourney runs may have helped in recruiting.

Next for me staying in 2013-14 was losing Durand to a knee injury. He was coming on and added instant offense off the bench. That knee injury wrecked his career at Pitt as it went off the rails.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

And Birch was an overrated player who was either a head case or had crooked handlers--or maybe both.

Birch was a big pu$$y in the short time he was here. He ended up being a 2 time conference defensive player of the year when he was at UNLV but I still don't think he was overly physical. Good rebounder and very good shot blocker. He didn't live up to his 5 stars but still would have been a useful player had he stayed.

 

[DT_PITT]

How did Pitt hoops fall so far so fast? It really isn't that complicated, it's recruiting. I am not even going to get into the assistant coaches that have left, which is HUGE!

Off the top of my head these are a few names that I feel led to the current slump. I'm sure I am missing several!

• Losing Birch, Adams, Gilbert, Johnson and Johnson left big holes in the roster, obviously
• Not closing the deal on Heron, Rowan, Diallo or Swanigan left the coaches scrambling and picking up scraps (Uchebo)
• The Mostella saga? What was that all about??
• Jaylen Bond? What was that all about???
• JRob having his best season as a frosh then becoming very average
• Landing the worst of the Gibbs brothers didn't help either, could have used all 3!!

So there are 10-11 players over the last 5 years that have put Pitt in its current situation. Jamie is still a good coach, not a great coach, but good enough to be in the top tier of the ACC with the right talent.

What makes you say James had his best season as a freshman? It's hard to say that's accurate.

Also, are you saying that Ashton was the worst of the Gibbs brothers?

Regardless, there's no doubt we need to recruit more solid players who progress over their careers.

 

[KiwiJeff]

What makes you say James had his best season as a freshman? It's hard to say that's accurate.

Also, are you saying that Ashton was the worst of the Gibbs brothers?

Regardless, there's no doubt we need to recruit more solid players who progress over their careers.

Almost every bullet had an issue. But too much to even bother.

 

[InfoManiac]

Part of the problem is the perception that Pitt would continue on that pace forever. What was happening at Pitt was unsustainable. You guys probably remember the public relations information being put out.

I can't recall the specifics but if I was home I could look it up. Something like... In the last X years Pitt was 1 of 7 teams who made the tourney every year. In the last X years Pitt had the 6th best winning percentage in D1.

Many of the blue bloods weren't showing up in those numbers so it was inevitable that Pitt would hit a rough stretch just like they did.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

And "losing" Johnson and Gilbert - were hardly losses. Misses, sure. But they lost nothing when they left.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

And "losing" Johnson and Gilbert - were hardly losses. Misses, sure. But they lost nothing when they left.

I agree , losing them wasn't the issue because neither really could perform on the level needed when the got here. Gilbert was a 7 footer rated around top 100 (75 ? ) and Johnson looked great when he came here , a quick athletic guard just what the Dr ordered. Playing the what if game if they'd have been the players they were projected to be, Adams stays two years and Birch stays you can even add in DuradJ and JJ plus the transfer guard ( always forget his name )Pitt would have been a pretty good team during these lean years. Hopefully better talent evaluation and stability will return to the program with this incoming class the turnover has left the cupboard a little bare.

 

[Fredact]

How did Pitt hoops fall so far so fast? .

I read that and stopped reading. Pitt fell from about the 10th best program in the country (top 3% of all the teams) to about the 30th best (top 9%). It's not like they are CCNY, or Loyola, or San Francisco. If you don't know anything about those schools, that explains a lot about your lack of knowledge of the big picture of college basketball.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

And "losing" Johnson and Gilbert - were hardly losses. Misses, sure. But they lost nothing when they left.

The Gilbert situation hurt the most, IMO. He wasn't good, but that miss by Pitt (and the evaluators who gave him a consensus ranking of around 80th) really set them back. Pitt had a good run of developing big men, and between him transferring and Adams leaving after telling everyone he was coming back it really threw the C position off kilter. Instead of getting a guy and grooming him for 2-3 years behind another C, they've just been trying to get stopgaps and have seemed unwilling to commit to many HS C prospects. Even at this point the guy who truly seems to be their top priority at C is Moustapha Diagne.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Next for me staying in 2013-14 was losing Durand to a knee injury. He was coming on and added instant offense off the bench. That knee injury wrecked his career at Pitt as it went off the rails.

That 2013-14 season has always stuck in my craw somewhat. I think if Adams wound up following through and staying that would have been their best team.

It's funny looking back at old recruiting rankings. The 2 C ranked right around Adams were Tarczewski and Ridley. Overall Adams has been by far the best player, but he was probably also the worst college player by an even greater margin.

 

[BFo8]

Birch was a big pu$$y in the short time he was here. He ended up being a 2 time conference defensive player of the year when he was at UNLV but I still don't think he was overly physical. Good rebounder and very good shot blocker. He didn't live up to his 5 stars but still would have been a useful player had he stayed.

Saw Birch play many, many times and you are correct he wasn't a big physical presence. Numerous NBA scouts have said it's not his primitive offensive skills that keeps him on the fringes of the league, it's his weak lower body that allows opposing bigs to easily back him down in the lane that keeps him in Europe.

Have mentioned before I wanted to hate him at UNLV, but he grew up and actually became a team leader. He would've been a huge asset had he stayed, was one of the best natural shot blockers I've ever seen.