Saban on the state of college athletics
- Thread starter NCPitt
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He is not the Goat. Put him at Temple and see what happens. He is just angry that now all of the schools will cheat like Bama leveling the playing field. What a whining hypocrite!!!
I don't think the problem is so much paying players as it is allowing them to transfer after each season. That's got to be a coaching nightmare.
I don't think there is a GOAT of coaches. With that being said, who is a better HC in CFB then Saban over the last 25 years?
I heard on Finebaum that Saban was asked in his interview "If we hired you, would you say we are hiring the best football coach in the country?" Saban's reply was, "No. There are a several coaches out there that are probably better than I am. However, I promise you, you'll be hiring the best recruiter in the game."
I'd say that's pretty much spot on.
When I lived in Maryland I frequented Navy Football a bunch and got to know several coaches down there. One day, Niumatalolo was sharing his son's recruiting experience at Alabama along with his personal experiences with Saban. He said that Saban is the "total package" as a HFC -
Things that stood out to me in that conversation -
1. He runs the biggest fortune 500 company in CFB and his fingerprints are all over it. He is the best manager in the country.
2. He coaches an actual position. He said how many HFC in today's game, coach a position but one that is crucial like defensive backs at his age? He's a master position coach.
3. He's an innovator. His Match 3 defense was/is unique and kept offenses from exploding for a LONG time.
4. He's the common denominator. He's had a slew of coordinators/position coaches yet Bama kept running without skipping a beat.
Like I said, I think the GOAT statement amongst coaches is dumb. Just too many variables. But, this dude stretched every program he's ever been apart of beyond it's potential. If he were to coach Temple, he would probably have them as a consistent top 25 team. They've had other coaches there produce quality results.
That's some good stuff in this post, thanks for sharing.
There are a lot of ignorants out there who seem to think that the elite coaches like Saban were just born lucky and start at the top. "Anyone can do what he did at Alabama." As if they didn't earn their way to the top by building programs and winning everywhere they go. You;re right, out him at Temple, he builds them into a winning team and moves up and out within 1-3 years, as he did at Toledo, Michigan State, etc.
Those same people also don't grasp how driven, single-minded, ambitious, competitive and ruthless a guy has to be to get to where Saban is. One of my longtime buddies was recruited by Dan Simrell at Toledo. Simrell was beloved in Toledo and was doing a good job at a tough place to win. After my buddy had signed his LOI Saban puilled the first of many power plays in his career by working with his old boss Don James to convince Toledo AD AL Bohl to fire Simrell and replace him with Saban, a career assitant then, after a season where Simrell finished 2nd in the MAC. Saban then "re-recuirted" Simrell's class, including my buddy, but came on way too strong and most of that class bailed on him. My buddy ended up playhing a year of JUCO at DuPage in Illinois before transferring back to a MAC school for his last 3 years of eligibililty.
Simrell was a nice guy, a a decent coach, a Toledo guy born and raised, and everyone there loved him. They were outraged when he was fired. Printed tee shirts etc. Saban and Bohl were seen as villains. Saban, on the other hand, is a born killer who finds losing not only unacceptable, but repulsive and sickening. Find the rare guy like that, and you will win, and win big. In hindsight, all credit to Al Bohl for having the vision to see that a guy like Simrell can only take your program so far.
It’s not just that Saban had insane success at Alabama, it’s how you ran Alabama.
Saban brought the CEO-recruiter-resource hound figurehead to college football. And the rest of football just wasn’t ready for it, and it became the model for all major programs, and still is today.
With that being said, he’s saying all of this while sitting on a mountain of money.
And any changes in the game that breaks up Alabama type dynasties, can’t be that bad. College football wasn’t better when Alabama was playing for the national title essentially every year.
Saban brought the CEO-recruiter-resource hound figurehead to college football. And the rest of football just wasn’t ready for it, and it became the model for all major programs, and still is today.
With that being said, he’s saying all of this while sitting on a mountain of money.
And any changes in the game that breaks up Alabama type dynasties, can’t be that bad. College football wasn’t better when Alabama was playing for the national title essentially every year.
I don’t disagree with any of this. And Saban has never had any qualms about expressing viewpoints that are in line with his own best interests. But that’s another quality that has made him the best at what he does.
People can hate on Saban all they want. But the infrastructure, boosters and fans were all there at Alabama before his arrival, and they were floundering. They had 2 ten win seasons the decade before. After his 1st season, Saban never won less than 10 games, most 12 or more, 16 straight years finishing in the top 10, most of those top 5.
Coaching Matters.
Coaching Matters.
No other team won consistently under his time at Alabama. Ohio st, Clemson, Georgia, all good and achieved lots of success but not over the long duration Saban did it. Teams like Penn st, USC, Tennessee, Texas A&M etc have all the resources Alabama has and they haven’t come close to haven’t come close to winning one championship let alone 7 during his time .
It’s a double edged sword though isn’t it? Because with any or elevation of Toledo that coach is gonzo. They have zero chance of holding on to a great coach.
Kinda makes me think like Pitt’s situation. Many are fine with Narduzzi because he’s good enough since they see a ceiling at Pitt.
Paying players was a cool way to gain an advantage when it was against the rules.
Exactly. He ran the program. It wasn't just out X's and O's, but he had a tight ship. Wasn't afraid to hire the best and the brightest (my biggest criticism of Tomlin) and while demanding and holding them accountable, he let them do their job. People say "Alabama recruits itself". Not really. "A consistent top 5 Alabama recruits itself". I mean no program has more resources than Texas. A&M has supposedly outrecruited everyone. Those programs have been pretty close to Pitt like the past decade. Saban ran his football program better than anyone else.
Then why does a guy like Saban think paying players has suddenly changed the game?
He’s not going to openly admit to cheating. There’s also much more money involved now as there’s people that wouldn’t donate money to illegally pay players before. It’s also more than just NIL. The transfer portal has a major impact. You can lose any player at any time in their career to a big NIL deal.
You said everyone was cheating but now you're saying people wouldn't spend the money to cheat before?
I’ll clarify. For example, under the old rules Pitt has their set of bag men they use to pay players but a company like PGT trucking isn’t going to make to jeopardize their business by making illegal payments. Now they can pay whoever. Just more people willing to get in because it’s legal.
Even if that's true, the Bama's of the world were doing it on a much grander scale without much fear of reprisal.
He was genius at bringing in "analysts" on staff who were fired as HCs from other schools--but still getting paid by those schools.
"It's all about the money for these kids" And tell us again Nick what your salary was at Alabama?
Yeah for sure. My point is that it was more than just bama. Ohio st, Penn st, Florida, Clemson, Georgia, etc all played that same game. Saban was just better at the other parts of recruiting, player development and coaching than everyone else.
I don't think he objects to players getting paid. He stressed that the primary concern
of players and/or parents today is how much they will get paid. I don't think Saban is a
saint by any means and he's motivated to win. However he did stress that developing
a young man as a player AND a person is also important. Not everyone who plays D-1
football goes pro (even at Alabama). A free college education is a valuable asset. NIL
money is just icing on the cake.
It's both. And that's not to say that players shouldn't be paid. But NIL has become the wild west of payment to players. Some structure needs to be provided, but the successful lawsuit limiting the NCAA's authority over this could be bad news.
Along those lines,
Saban and Jack Lambert were part of the same Kent State defense.
It just seems strange that they were team mates.
Did you see Saban moving to a different school every 1-2 years for the money, like players do?
Just for comparison
.........................Nick Saban (28 years) .... Jock Sutherland (20 years)
National titles: .............. 7 ..........................5
Conf/Regional titles.......12..........................8
Winning Percentage.. 0.804................... 0.812
NFL Record..................0.469...................... 0.622
Ridiculous comparison. What school was going to pay Saban more than his $10.6M? Players move to maximize their payout. You may not like it, but it makes sense.
Agreed. Just not sure he is the person that should be saying it. Cheapens the message.
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