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Sigh……50 years ago today…

pittmeister

Heisman Winner
May 26, 2010
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The Reds beat the Pirates in Game 5 of the the best of five NLCS.

For those who weren’t around, the Pirates were the defending World Series champs and considered the best team in baseball.

They were three outs away from going to their consecutive World Series. Up comes Johnny Bench who hits a lead off home run against the best reliever in the National League (Dave Guisti) to tie the game. Guisti then loses it. He gives up two singles. Virdon pulls him in favor of Bob Moose. He gets the next two batters out and then uncorks a wild pitch to give the Reds the NL Championship and a trip to the Series.

It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan. Unknown to all at the time, it was Clemente’s last game.

In my opinion, it symbolically started the shift from Pittsburgh being a baseball town to a football town. In the next couple of months, the Immaculate Reception happened and the death of Clemente sealed it…

 
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Baseball in the 70's was great. So many big stars, and the games weren't snooze fests like they are today. I remember as a kid watching that wild pitch, but Sid scoring in 1992 was the true death of baseball in this city. Pirates in the 70's recovered from that wild pitch and won the world series in 79. The 2013-2015 run was an accident that Nutting simply enjoyed the increased profits from.
 
That loss really affected me too, I was 7 years old and just becoming familiar with sports. My dad and I would watch together. He was crushed by that game, and taking his cue, so was I.

We were always suspect about Giusti (who I believe continued as their closer into at least 77, when they brought in Goose Gossage for merely a year, then it passed to Kent Tekulve).

Giusti was solid, but as a result of that game, whenever they brought him in we always made the exaggerated “Ohhhh boy” exclamation, and if he closed it out, it seemed a miracle. We treated Roy Gerela field goals the same way. 😄

Along with the Clemente death, Bob Moose, (that Reds mishap aside) who was a solid pitcher for the Bucs, was killed in a major car accident a few years later while still pretty young.

Anyway, that was a crushing loss but the Pirates remained competitive through the decade, frequent division winners and playoff participants and won it all in 79, of course. So it wasn’t such a devastating loss as in 92, when the world knew that it was the absolute very end for the Pittsburgh Pirates as a relevant franchise, which unfortunately was not an exaggeration in the least.
 
Baseball in the 70's was great. So many big stars, and the games weren't snooze fests like they are today. I remember as a kid watching that wild pitch, but Sid scoring in 1992 was the true death of baseball in this city. Pirates in the 70's recovered from that wild pitch and won the world series in 79. The 2013-2015 run was an accident that Nutting simply enjoyed the increased profits from.
70s baseball was actually OK, so much better, Pittsburgh was a top team, Yankees weren't always dominant. The style they played was so much better, Lumber & Lightening, not analytics, heavy emphasis on stealing baes, hit and run, hit to the opposite field etc.
 
Baseball in the 70's was great. So many big stars, and the games weren't snooze fests like they are today. I remember as a kid watching that wild pitch, but Sid scoring in 1992 was the true death of baseball in this city. Pirates in the 70's recovered from that wild pitch and won the world series in 79. The 2013-2015 run was an accident that Nutting simply enjoyed the increased profits from.
Yes, they got lucky with two retread pitchers and a few castoffs from other teams that did somewhat better than anyone expected (including the Pirates themselves, no doubt). Their solitary star player shone brightly as well. Credit where it’s due, they won a significant number of games, so it wasn’t totally luck…but.. it mostly was luck.

Then poof, it was all over.
 
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Yes, they got lucky with two retread pitchers and a few castoffs from other teams that did somewhat better than anyone expected (including the Pirates themselves, no doubt). Their solitary star player shone brightly as well. Credit where it’s due, they won a significant number of games, so it wasn’t totally luck…but.. it mostly was luck.

Then poof, it was all over.
Who where the retreads and castoffs?
 
That loss really affected me too, I was 7 years old and just becoming familiar with sports. My dad and I would watch together. He was crushed by that game, and taking his cue, so was I.

We were always suspect about Giusti (who I believe continued as their closer into at least 77, when they brought in Goose Gossage for merely a year, then it passed to Kent Tekulve).

Giusti was solid, but as a result of that game, whenever they brought him in we always made the exaggerated “Ohhhh boy” exclamation, and if he closed it out, it seemed a miracle. We treated Roy Gerela field goals the same way. 😄

Along with the Clemente death, Bob Moose, (that Reds mishap aside) who was a solid pitcher for the Bucs, was killed in a major car accident a few years later while still pretty young.

Anyway, that was a crushing loss but the Pirates remained competitive through the decade, frequent division winners and playoff participants and won it all in 79, of course. So it wasn’t such a devastating loss as in 92, when the world knew that it was the absolute very end for the Pittsburgh Pirates as a relevant franchise, which unfortunately was not an exaggeration in the least.
What made the 72 loss harder than the 92 loss was the fact that the Pirates in 1972 was a better team than the Reds (not by much, but still better).

Before the start of the 1972 World Series, Sparky Anderson was very confident in their chances against the A’s. Curt Gowdy asked him what makes him so confident and he said “because we already beat the best team in baseball (Pirates)” It didn’t turn out that way…. I felt that the Pirates could have beaten the A’s. They were without Reggie Jackson.

The 1992 Braves we’re clearly better than the Pirates. Which made the loss not as hard to take. Just my opinion. Of course, by the mid 70’s, the Reds were on another level.
 
That loss really affected me too, I was 7 years old and just becoming familiar with sports. My dad and I would watch together. He was crushed by that game, and taking his cue, so was I.

We were always suspect about Giusti (who I believe continued as their closer into at least 77, when they brought in Goose Gossage for merely a year, then it passed to Kent Tekulve).

Giusti was solid, but as a result of that game, whenever they brought him in we always made the exaggerated “Ohhhh boy” exclamation, and if he closed it out, it seemed a miracle. We treated Roy Gerela field goals the same way. 😄

Along with the Clemente death, Bob Moose, (that Reds mishap aside) who was a solid pitcher for the Bucs, was killed in a major car accident a few years later while still pretty young.

Anyway, that was a crushing loss but the Pirates remained competitive through the decade, frequent division winners and playoff participants and won it all in 79, of course. So it wasn’t such a devastating loss as in 92, when the world knew that it was the absolute very end for the Pittsburgh Pirates as a relevant franchise, which unfortunately was not an exaggeration in the least.
I was just a bit too young to really be affected. And anyone between the ages of say 40 and 60 I can't see how anything was more devastating than the Sid Bream slide.
 
What made the 72 loss harder than the 92 loss was the fact that the Pirates in 1972 was a better team than the Reds (not by much, but still better).

Before the start of the 1972 World Series, Sparky Anderson was very confident in their chances against the A’s. Curt Gowdy asked him what makes him so confident and he said “because we already beat the best team in baseball (Pirates)” It didn’t turn out that way…. I felt that the Pirates could have beaten the A’s. They were without Reggie Jackson.

The 1992 Braves we’re clearly better than the Pirates. Which made the loss not as hard to take. Just my opinion. Of course, by the mid 70’s, the Reds were on another level.
That’s a totally pertinent perspective. Both the teams in 72 were really loaded. Yeah If I only see the names listed I think I’d actually give the edge to the Reds (Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, Concepcion, Foster, Griffey, and I’m not sure the latter two were even starting yet that year … yikes). Of course the Pirates didn’t have Parker or Stennet (he might have been a Sept call up), then the Garner, Madlock trades yet to come, either. Neither team exactly had aces on the mound like the O’s or Mets but competent guys. Great rivals. Then throw in the Phillies later in the decade as well. Fun time to be into baseball.
 
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What made the 72 loss harder than the 92 loss was the fact that the Pirates in 1972 was a better team than the Reds (not by much, but still better).

Before the start of the 1972 World Series, Sparky Anderson was very confident in their chances against the A’s. Curt Gowdy asked him what makes him so confident and he said “because we already beat the best team in baseball (Pirates)” It didn’t turn out that way…. I felt that the Pirates could have beaten the A’s. They were without Reggie Jackson.

The 1992 Braves we’re clearly better than the Pirates. Which made the loss not as hard to take. Just my opinion. Of course, by the mid 70’s, the Reds were on another level.
The 72 Bucs were the best Pirates team ever. And the 92 Braves were not better than the 92 Pirates!
 
The Reds beat the Pirates in Game 5 of the the best of five NLCS.

For those who weren’t around, the Pirates were the defending World Series champs and considered the best team in baseball.

They were three outs away from going to their consecutive World Series. Up comes Johnny Bench who hits a lead off home run against the best reliever in the National League (Dave Guisti) to tie the game. Guisti then loses it. He gives up two singles. Virdon pulls him in favor of Bob Moose. He gets the next two batters out and then uncorks a wild pitch to give the Reds the NL Championship and a trip to the Series.

It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan. Unknown to all at the time, it was Clemente’s last game.

In my opinion, it symbolically started the shift from Pittsburgh being a baseball town to a football town. In the next couple of months, the Immaculate Reception happened and the death of Clemente sealed it…

Unfortunately I remember watching ... Tough one for a 9 year old ...
 
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That’s a totally pertinent perspective. Both the teams in 72 were really loaded. Yeah If I only see the names listed I think I’d actually give the edge to the Reds (Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, Concepcion, Foster, Griffey, and I’m not sure the latter two were even starting yet that year … yikes). Of course the Pirates didn’t have Parker or Stennet (he might have been a Sept call up), then the Garner, Madlock trades yet to come, either. Neither team exactly had aces on the mound like the O’s or Mets but competent guys. Great rivals. Then throw in the Phillies later in the decade as well. Fun time to be into baseball.
Stennett was on that team (he was a mid-season callup the season before) and I don't believe they had traded Dave Cash away yet. So you had the outfield of Stargell (knees hadn't quite given out), Oliver, and Clemente, with Hebner and Bob Robertson at the corner infield spots, and I'm pretty sure Jackie Hernandez at short (Gene Alley had given way to his injuries). Plus you had guys like Gene Clines and Vic Davalillo coming off the bench (I'm not sure if Richie Zisk had been called up yet, but if so, he was filling in also).
 
Stennett was on that team (he was a mid-season callup the season before) and I don't believe they had traded Dave Cash away yet. So you had the outfield of Stargell (knees hadn't quite given out), Oliver, and Clemente, with Hebner and Bob Robertson at the corner infield spots, and I'm pretty sure Jackie Hernandez at short (Gene Alley had given way to his injuries). Plus you had guys like Gene Clines and Vic Davalillo coming off the bench (I'm not sure if Richie Zisk had been called up yet, but if so, he was filling in also).
Zisk was called up the next year when they were dueling the Mets for the pennant.
 
Stennett was on that team (he was a mid-season callup the season before) and I don't believe they had traded Dave Cash away yet. So you had the outfield of Stargell (knees hadn't quite given out), Oliver, and Clemente, with Hebner and Bob Robertson at the corner infield spots, and I'm pretty sure Jackie Hernandez at short (Gene Alley had given way to his injuries). Plus you had guys like Gene Clines and Vic Davalillo coming off the bench (I'm not sure if Richie Zisk had been called up yet, but if so, he was filling in also).
Yes, back in the day when "the baseball people" in an organization made the organization what it was, it brought a lot of pride to a team and city to be able to maintain a contender for an extended period of time, now money plays a large factor, so to me it is not the same.
 
Stennett was on that team (he was a mid-season callup the season before) and I don't believe they had traded Dave Cash away yet. So you had the outfield of Stargell (knees hadn't quite given out), Oliver, and Clemente, with Hebner and Bob Robertson at the corner infield spots, and I'm pretty sure Jackie Hernandez at short (Gene Alley had given way to his injuries). Plus you had guys like Gene Clines and Vic Davalillo coming off the bench (I'm not sure if Richie Zisk had been called up yet, but if so, he was filling in also).
Ah . . . how could I forget Sanguillen behind the plate? Now that I recall (sort of), were the injuries for Gene Alley (repetitive, I think) his throwing shoulder?
 
Remember this game all too well.

A devasting defeat to our best team that just didn't get catch a break.

Ceasar Geronimo the owner of 51 career home runs, who also went 2 for 20 in the series hit one out to make it 3-2 in the fifth.

Johnny Bench then leads off the 9th with a home run that just cleared the fence.

Bob Moose come in gets two out then throws the heartbreaking wild pitch to end the game and prevent our chance to repeat.

This game and the Syd Bream slide are probably the two most heartbreaking defeats in Pirate history.
 
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The biggest sports heartache in my life
Biggest sports heartache. That would probably make a good separate OT thread. Likely been done a hundred times before I joined the board though.

I was only 7 for this particular Pirates loss so I think the 92 loss was bigger for me. As I mentioned above it was particularly bad because the Pirates were forever dead and gone after that.

But there have been a couple losses in other sports more painful to me than that. The Steelers SB loss to the Cowboys. The Pitt hoops loss to Villanova. The Pen’s loss to the Islanders in 93(?). The Pitt football loss to Cincinnati in the de facto Big East championship game.
 
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Biggest sports heartache. That would probably make a good separate OT thread. Likely been done a hundred times before I joined the board though.

I was only 7 for this particular Pirates loss so I think the 92 loss was bigger for me. As I mentioned above it was particularly bad because the Pirates were forever dead and gone after that.

But there have been a couple losses in other sports more painful to me than that. The Steelers SB loss to the Cowboys. The Pitt hoops loss to Villanova. The Pen’s loss to the Islanders in 93(?). The Pitt football loss to Cincinnati in the de facto Big East championship game.
The hardest losses is when you are the better team and lose…
 
The Reds beat the Pirates in Game 5 of the the best of five NLCS.

For those who weren’t around, the Pirates were the defending World Series champs and considered the best team in baseball.

They were three outs away from going to their consecutive World Series. Up comes Johnny Bench who hits a lead off home run against the best reliever in the National League (Dave Guisti) to tie the game. Guisti then loses it. He gives up two singles. Virdon pulls him in favor of Bob Moose. He gets the next two batters out and then uncorks a wild pitch to give the Reds the NL Championship and a trip to the Series.

It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan. Unknown to all at the time, it was Clemente’s last game.

In my opinion, it symbolically started the shift from Pittsburgh being a baseball town to a football town. In the next couple of months, the Immaculate Reception happened and the death of Clemente sealed it…

Starting lineups for Game 5 of the 1972 NLCS between Pirates and Reds :

REDS :

Pete Rose LF
Joe Morgan 2B
Bobby Tolan CF
Johnny Bench C
Tony Perez 1B
Denis Menke 3B
Cesar Geronimo RF
Darrel Chaney SS
Don Gullett P


PIRATES :

Rennie Stennett LF
Al Oliver CF
Roberto Clemente RF
Willie Stargell 1B
Manny Sanguillen C
Richie Hebner 3B
Dave Cash 2b
Gene Alley SS
Steve Blass P
 
That loss really affected me too, I was 7 years old and just becoming familiar with sports. My dad and I would watch together. He was crushed by that game, and taking his cue, so was I.

We were always suspect about Giusti (who I believe continued as their closer into at least 77, when they brought in Goose Gossage for merely a year, then it passed to Kent Tekulve).

Giusti was solid, but as a result of that game, whenever they brought him in we always made the exaggerated “Ohhhh boy” exclamation, and if he closed it out, it seemed a miracle. We treated Roy Gerela field goals the same way. 😄

Along with the Clemente death, Bob Moose, (that Reds mishap aside) who was a solid pitcher for the Bucs, was killed in a major car accident a few years later while still pretty young.

Anyway, that was a crushing loss but the Pirates remained competitive through the decade, frequent division winners and playoff participants and won it all in 79, of course. So it wasn’t such a devastating loss as in 92, when the world knew that it was the absolute very end for the Pittsburgh Pirates as a relevant franchise, which unfortunately was not an exaggeration in the least.
Moose died on his way back from his birthday bash on Route 7 in Ohio.
At the the time, Route 7 was a bad road at night.
I think Moose was over the limit
 
Biggest sports heartache. That would probably make a good separate OT thread. Likely been done a hundred times before I joined the board though.

I was only 7 for this particular Pirates loss so I think the 92 loss was bigger for me. As I mentioned above it was particularly bad because the Pirates were forever dead and gone after that.

But there have been a couple losses in other sports more painful to me than that. The Steelers SB loss to the Cowboys. The Pitt hoops loss to Villanova. The Pen’s loss to the Islanders in 93(?). The Pitt football loss to Cincinnati in the de facto Big East championship game.
I was 7 also, but really wasn't that cognizant of everything. I barely remember the 71 world series, I know my parents let me watch. I remember the Christmas Day NFL game between the Chiefs and Dolphins that year watching at my grandparents with all of the other folks. That is really my first sports memory.
 
As big of a Pittsburgh sports fan as I am, I’m not sure if ever seen that that was how they lost in 72.

Being sandwiched in between two WS championships (and preceding 4 SB and a PITT national title), it’s kind of lost to history. What made 92 so devastating was that it was at the beginning of at a historic bad run. Had years and years to dwell on it
 
The Reds beat the Pirates in Game 5 of the the best of five NLCS.

For those who weren’t around, the Pirates were the defending World Series champs and considered the best team in baseball.

They were three outs away from going to their consecutive World Series. Up comes Johnny Bench who hits a lead off home run against the best reliever in the National League (Dave Guisti) to tie the game. Guisti then loses it. He gives up two singles. Virdon pulls him in favor of Bob Moose. He gets the next two batters out and then uncorks a wild pitch to give the Reds the NL Championship and a trip to the Series.

It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan. Unknown to all at the time, it was Clemente’s last game.

In my opinion, it symbolically started the shift from Pittsburgh being a baseball town to a football town. In the next couple of months, the Immaculate Reception happened and the death of Clemente sealed it…

It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan....... Worse than 48-14?
 
The loss in the 1991 NLCS was the worst one for me, they were the best team in baseball that year and would have beat the Twins in the World Series, I don't think they would have beaten Toronto in 92.
 
It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan....... Worse than 48-14?

no, that is #1, Sid's slide in 1992 was a close second. Loss to cinci in 2009 was #3. Pens losing to Islanders in 93 when they were best team in hockey is #4.

1991 NLCS should be up there as well. Had a 3-1 series lead and blew it. I guess you could say game 6 was the devastating loss when Van Slyke was called out on strikes with the tying run on 3rd. After that loss you knew game 7 was a mere formality and the Pirates would lose, which they did.
 
I was 7 also, but really wasn't that cognizant of everything. I barely remember the 71 world series, I know my parents let me watch. I remember the Christmas Day NFL game between the Chiefs and Dolphins that year watching at my grandparents with all of the other folks. That is really my first sports memory.
I recall watching the 72 loss as mentioned, probably due to how my dad reacted.

Don’t recall a thing about the 71 WS. Too young.

We apparently were among the many in WPA who couldn’t see the Immaculate Reception game because it was blacked out. I have no recollection of it. Started to know vaguely about the Steelers and football that fall though. I knew Franco’s Italian Army. I knew Gerela’s Gorillas.

I distinctly remember my dad coming in to our dining room when we were about to have breakfast and mentioning that Roberto Clemente had died the night before. He was very sad. I didn’t truly KNOW what Clemente was but I certainly got the gist from that that his passing was a serious matter. My dad never made any similar announcements like that before for sure.

I remember watching the divisional playoff with my dad the following season when the Raiders got revenge on the Steelers with a pretty thorough beating. Not much of the regular season.

74 was when I really got into it, watched every Steelers game and the playoffs and Super Bowl. I really understood more nuances. Recall watching the blowout over the Bills in the divisional playoff. Recall watching Oakland win the divisional game over Miami in the final seconds and feeling “sports dread” for the first time (as an eventual Pitt fan, Dread along with its cousin Disappointment would become commonplace through the years). Then the euphoria of the AFC Championship in Oakland and the Super Bowl. I wrote a short story in 3rd grade about the Super Bowl, recall it vividly.

At the same time the Pirates were rolling their way through competitive seasons, but never getting as close at they did in 72. Recall a pretty thorough beat down from the Dodgers in one of the divisional playoffs. Mostly recall there were dramatic races between the Bucs and Phillies mid and late decade.

I was thoroughly off and running as diehard sports fan by then. I’d watch and follow other teams and games besides “my” teams. I collected and traded baseball and football cards. I recall trading a Jim Otto card to my 4 th grade teacher (a Raiders fan, blasphemy!) for a Franco Harris rookie card, which was a big deal to me (and I sure wish I’d kept).
 
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As big of a Pittsburgh sports fan as I am, I’m not sure if ever seen that that was how they lost in 72.

Being sandwiched in between two WS championships (and preceding 4 SB and a PITT national title), it’s kind of lost to history. What made 92 so devastating was that it was at the beginning of at a historic bad run. Had years and years to dwell on it
I wasn't alive in the early 70s, but at least they won a title in that timeframe. The problem with 1992 is that it was the last hope of winning it all for the timeframe. Yeah, the 91 Bucs were probably better than 92 (and maybe even the 90 Bucs too), but 92 was the last chance of the era, and to lose in game 7--for the second straight year--was devastating.
 
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It was the most devastating loss I’ve experienced as a Pittsburgh fan....... Worse than 48-14?
It’s not even on my list of devastating losses. I know nitters want everyone to believe it is….
 
It’s not even on my list of devastating losses. I know nitters want everyone to believe it is….
Nah. I knew enough by then that Pitt had talent but something seemed amiss, a lack of consistency. An eventual loss seemed inevitable. DM threw a lot of interceptions, we were generally sloppy much of the time (I guess a stain on the Sherrill myth we forget today). Penn State was less talented, but not by much, and more disciplined (and always got favorable officiating, always).

It would have been a more painful loss if it had a been a more thrilling back and forth game. But it was weird in how lopsided it was for us at first, and then immediately flipped to being lopsided for PS, a complete 180. So it was an easy game to dismiss and move on from, which I did, somewhere around the third quarter. They can get all gooey in their innards about it, the equivalent to a naked 5 year old boy for them… but frankly I was more pissed about the next season, which continued the sloppy trend to an extreme.
 
I wasn't alive in the early 70s, but at least they won a title in that timeframe. The problem with 1992 is that it was the last hope of winning it all for the timeframe. Yeah, the 91 Bucs were probably better than 92 (and maybe even the 90 Bucs too), but 92 was the last chance of the era, and to lose in game 7--for the second straight year--was devastating.
The 90 Buccos loss stings due to how unlikeable that Reds team was, plus they would have thumped the A's.
 
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