What is most disgusting about this whole thing is...

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

 

[PittPoker]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

Vitale knew, Bilas knew, they all knew, Rafferty knew. It makes this whole thing even worse. Announcers probably talking on air about all these team's recruiting wins every game knowing how shady all these coaches were.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Bilas has long carried the argument that athletes should be able to profit from their likeness , and the claim of "there's no money" is hollow.

So- he's being consistent that it's crazy that when everyone is getting paid off the backs of the talent , except the talent, that the FBI is coming in because the kids are getting paid.

It's a valid point-while coaches, schools, and shoe companies are a multi-billion industry in college sports.

 

[levance2]

ESPN is just as complicit as anyone. The apparel companies are great advertisers. Promoting college stars who will turn pro and then pitch their own Adidas line is all in ESPN’s best interest.

 

[UPitt '89]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

What really sucks is how close Pitt got to a Final Four in 2009..... and we did it without cheating.

If Dixon would've just ridden it out with Pitt a couple more years, he could begin to reap the benefits of the new paradigm we're about to have in college basketball.

Threat of prison focuses the mind like nothing else. You aren't going to see any assistant offering money to any players for the forseeable future. Threat of sanctions wasn't a deterrent.... but jail definitely is.

 

[PittPoker]

What really sucks is how close Pitt got to a Final Four in 2009..... and we did it without cheating.

If Dixon would've just ridden it out with Pitt a couple more years, he could begin to reap the benefits of the new paradigm we're about to have in college basketball.

Threat of prison focuses the mind like nothing else. You aren't going to see any assistant offering money to any players for the forseeable future. Threat of sanctions wasn't a deterrent.... but jail definitely is.

I'm sure Artis point shaved. He was at Rivers all the time.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Everyone needs to stop being hypocritical , everyone knew . I mean everyone from the university presidents to the casual fan . Money talks and when a kid has enough talent to make everyone involved with him a lot of cash bad things are bound to happen . Not everyone was dirty , but I can't imagine many high profile recruits and programs are Lilly clean .
Pitt was involved for a period of time and they won a national championship in Fb and had a team full of truly talented Bb players . Pitt got caught and disbanded the Golden Panthers and have been irrelevant since except for JDs golden yrs. There's unanswered questions with the successful recruitment of Kim Birch . Everyone knew !

 

[PittMan 72]

The fundamental issue behind this scandal isn't about paying players. It's about ACQUIRING players. Buying them through the use of influence peddling and bribery.

The guys like Vitale and Bilas defending what has taken place know exactly what's going on. For their own personal reasons (friendships, allegiances) they want to promote keeping the status quo with regards to what programs are currently at the top of the mountain.

If those programs are able to continue to buy the best talent due to their "connections", there is a much better chance they will remain at the top. It's a seamy, seedy way for certain programs to be able to maintain a very distinct competitive advantage. Any illegal player acquisition networks need to be destroyed.

 

[wbrpanther]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

Maybe Jay is worried they might be sniffing around the Durham area.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

The fundamental issue behind this scandal isn't about paying players. It's about ACQUIRING players. Buying them through the use of influence peddling and bribery.

The guys like Vitale and Bilas defending what has taken place know exactly what's going on. For their own personal reasons (friendships, allegiances) they want to promote keeping the status quo with regards to what programs are currently at the top of the mountain.

If those programs are able to continue to buy the best talent due to their "connections", there is a much better chance they will remain at the top. It's a seamy, seedy way for certain programs to be able to maintain a very distinct competitive advantage. Any illegal player acquisition networks need to be destroyed.

Bilas wants the players to share in the money , that's not the status quo .

 

[sibleyfan91]

I thought you were gonna say it's most disgusting that even with this huge cloud, the various prospects for Pitinos replacement were "bigly" better than what Pitt had at the time of Dixon's departure.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Bilas has long carried the argument that athletes should be able to profit from their likeness , and the claim of "there's no money" is hollow.

So- he's being consistent that it's crazy that when everyone is getting paid off the backs of the talent , except the talent, that the FBI is coming in because the kids are getting paid.

It's a valid point-while coaches, schools, and shoe companies are a multi-billion industry in college sports.

With the revenue and money generated now, I do agree. The questions are how and how much? And what about the non revenue sports?

My problem with Bilas's contention that this all comes about from players not being paid is that is wrong. Different argument. If say we set up a pay scale structure or cap, there still will be these shoe companies and/or boosters willing to gain an extra advantage to direct and incent a top player to go to a team that is of their preference.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

The fundamental issue behind this scandal isn't about paying players. It's about ACQUIRING players. Buying them through the use of influence peddling and bribery.

The guys like Vitale and Bilas defending what has taken place know exactly what's going on. For their own personal reasons (friendships, allegiances) they want to promote keeping the status quo with regards to what programs are currently at the top of the mountain.

If those programs are able to continue to buy the best talent due to their "connections", there is a much better chance they will remain at the top. It's a seamy, seedy way for certain programs to be able to maintain a very distinct competitive advantage. Any illegal player acquisition networks need to be destroyed.

I mean let's look at Vitale and his defense of his fellow paisan.
1) Pitino had the very public affair where he cheated on his wife.
2) His team was guilty of hosting a recruiting party with prostitutes.
3) Now the buying of the Bowen kid through a shoe company.

I am sure there are other things I am missing in his long history.

But Vitale is going to defend him?

Bilas has one major talking point and that is college player's rights and the ability to share in some of the revenue/success (which on its own is somewhat noble) but just like those who side with gun control, he is making every issue about the players not being paid instead of the real issue that has surfaced.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

What really sucks is how close Pitt got to a Final Four in 2009..... and we did it without cheating.

If Dixon would've just ridden it out with Pitt a couple more years, he could begin to reap the benefits of the new paradigm we're about to have in college basketball.

Threat of prison focuses the mind like nothing else. You aren't going to see any assistant offering money to any players for the forseeable future. Threat of sanctions wasn't a deterrent.... but jail definitely is.

I don't know, did we? Maybe not on a wide scale, but I am just wondering if we were willing to go the Khem Birch route, who else? Slice was involved with alot of kids, had alot of connections, I am not saying he was getting money from Pitt or Pitt boosters, but I wonder if he could move some of this shoe money around to some kids.

 

[Pitt79]

If I was a Louisville fan, I'd be grateful for the championship Pitino bought for me, even if they vacated it, I'd still watch it on DVD, wear the championship gear and celebrate it forever.

 

[bayardstreet]

They work for ESPN or CBS sports. They don't want future ratings to drop because it's their livelihood

Vitals mad millions pimping diaper dandys. If his heart is broken then he needs to retire and get therapy

 

[President Stache]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

You would think these guys actually believe this???

It is tough for me to believe they do believe this, but they are making some strong statements. I completely agree that everyone knows it happens, and these guys who have to meet big time benefactors often have to know this.

Some places dont have to do this, but I am sure some boosters still give players cash under the table (I would think coach K is clean for example)

 

[pitt-girl]

Not all talking heads are supporting these coaches. We listened to Dan Dakich's show last night. (I know he can be an a*s, but at least he's being honest.) Here is an article about his tirade.

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...nd-more-dirt-bag-than-chuck-person/715371001/

Digressing a bit but you have to imagine that the NCAA is mulling over the death penalty for Louisville. I mean their (NCAA) backs are against the wall here. Louisville was on active probation when they knowingly participated in paying players.

 

[sibleyfan91]

Not all talking heads are supporting these coaches. We listened to Dan Dakich's show last night. (I know he can be an a*s, but at least he's being honest.) Here is an article about his tirade.

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...nd-more-dirt-bag-than-chuck-person/715371001/

Digressing a bit but you have to imagine that the NCAA is mulling over the death penalty for Louisville. I mean their (NCAA) backs are against the wall here. Louisville was on active probation when they knowingly participated in paying players.

This is quite a litmus test for the NCAA. They've regularly failed (or succeeded depending on your view!) several others of late ... PSU (in bold), Miami, Baylor, UNC ... and Louisville previously! Where is the confidence they'll do the right thing here? Apparently little, since multiple very legit coaches are being mentioned as interested to take over for Pitino... coaches far better than what we were mentioned for after Jamie. That's also a litmus test IMO ... of the joke level of the NCAA. But let's remember the NCAA is the schools, of which Pitt is included... so what is its toothlessness say about the member schools?

 

[PittPoker]

Not all talking heads are supporting these coaches. We listened to Dan Dakich's show last night. (I know he can be an a*s, but at least he's being honest.) Here is an article about his tirade.

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...nd-more-dirt-bag-than-chuck-person/715371001/

Digressing a bit but you have to imagine that the NCAA is mulling over the death penalty for Louisville. I mean their (NCAA) backs are against the wall here. Louisville was on active probation when they knowingly participated in paying players.

No way they will get the death penalty. If Penn State didn't get it for allowing a known pedophile to roam around campus for decades and harm children, Louisville will be spared. Sucks and sad but true.

 

[Jpripper88]

Bilas wants the players to share in the money , that's not the status quo .

But Bilas' set up would equate to the exact same problems, just more of it above board and less of it below board. Money would still steer kids to schools based on influence and power and the divide between haves and have nots would be even further widened. Of course that helps his alma mater, so he doesn't mind much.

 

[4Mark_Marty]

If I was a Louisville fan, I'd be grateful for the championship Pitino bought for me, even if they vacated it, I'd still watch it on DVD, wear the championship gear and celebrate it forever.

Yep. Nobody can take nobody's experience away from them.

 

[sibleyfan91]

Yep. Nobody can take nobody's experience away from them.

Indeed. Whatever anyone thinks of what Louisville, or PSU or anyone else deserve, "negating" victories is laughable "punishment".

Say they would negate Louisville 55 point victory over Pitt last year. Anyone feeling like it was a win?

 

[pitt-girl]

Indeed. Whatever anyone thinks of what Louisville, or PSU or anyone else deserve, "negating" victories is laughable "punishment".

Say they would negate Louisville 55 point victory over Pitt last year. Anyone feeling like it was a win?

Great - you had to remind me. I'm not sure I have ever been more angry at a sporting event as I was that night.

 

[sibleyfan91]

No way they will get the death penalty. If Penn State didn't get it for allowing a known pedophile to roam around campus for decades and harm children, Louisville will be spared. Sucks and sad but true.

Totally and that is the extra spice on the
poo sandwich that the NCAA's awful negligence in the PSU case. It not only let them off the hook for unspeakable offenses. It also signaled it was pretty much never going to discipline anyone else for anything. After all what could be worse than what they did? Other than murdering the children maybe?

Paying a guy, or running a fake school for athletes, is bad but certainly isn't as bad as that, and PSU got nothing, so how can Louisville or UNC get anything? And if the NCAA would dare, all these schools have to do is lawyer up like PSU and all will be dropped.

And always remember the member schools were fine with it, including Pitt. The NCAA is the schools. All hands are dirty.

 

[Large Panther]

Not all talking heads are supporting these coaches. We listened to Dan Dakich's show last night. (I know he can be an a*s, but at least he's being honest.) Here is an article about his tirade.

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com...nd-more-dirt-bag-than-chuck-person/715371001/

Digressing a bit but you have to imagine that the NCAA is mulling over the death penalty for Louisville. I mean their (NCAA) backs are against the wall here. Louisville was on active probation when they knowingly participated in paying players.

I too would like to think that the death penalty is being given serious consideration, but the precedent the NCAA set by taking away a few scholarships from a cash cow football program that enabled a child molester for decades tempers my faith in that august body. Unfortunately it took the Feds to do the heavy lifting that the NCAA has been unwilling to do, namely enforce their own rules.

 

[PittMan 72]

Bilas wants the players to share in the money , that's not the status quo .

Status quo in terms of how certain cheating programs are able to acquire players through bribes and influence peddling: shoe companies; handlers; AAU contacts; street agents; etc.

 

[Swervin27]

Great - you had to remind me. I'm not sure I have ever been more angry at a sporting event as I was that night.

thanks pitt-girl, I literally forgot that happened so thank you for bringing this up.

 

[drp1tt]

not that it happened. Anyone with a functioning IQ knew this kind of stuff was happening. But if you follow twitter, you have guys like Dick Vitale who was "deeply saddened" and spoke with Rick Pitino a few hours ago and he told him "he would never be involved with something like this" and same with Jay Bilas (who I am growing to dislike more and more) who feels this is overblown and a direct result of paying players.

Jay's a smart guy, it is not about "paying players", it is about gaining "an advantage" to acquire talent. Even if these guys are paid, what is to stop this from happening?

Anyways, the college BB intelligentsia is whining and justifying this, they also probably realize their sport is becoming less relevant with the one and done and continued rise of NBA popularity. But it is disgusting to see them justify this or run shields for these rogue coaches (Vitale always has) because they are buddy buddies.

Jay is such a Duke and UNC homer it is unreal. I am still waiting after what...seems like 30 years...for the final findings on UNC's program. Should be coming in the next 10 years.

 

[pitt-girl]

thanks pitt-girl, I literally forgot that happened so thank you for bringing this up.

Hey - don't blame me! It was someone else.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Go ahead and pay the players, and while you're at it, make it a minor league system. No need to keep this part of college athletics.

Remove the Universities from the equation and see what happens to the interest in the product. There won't be any interest, and there won't be any money.

Cry me a river because a kid has to play in college for a year before he enters the NBA (go petition the NBA). A travesty that a kid can get a free education while playing basketball for a school.

 

[Swervin27]

Go ahead and pay the players, and while you're at it, make it a minor league system. No need to keep this part of college athletics.

Remove the Universities from the equation and see what happens to the interest in the product. There won't be any interest, and there won't be any money.

Cry me a river because a kid has to play in college for a year before he enters the NBA (go petition the NBA). A travesty that a kid can get a free education while playing basketball for a school.

yeah, I think the people pushing for this really should be careful what you wish for. paying players opens up a ton of issues and honestly, there are about 25 programs that actually make a profit, 90%+ operate in the red. You start this up, college athletics is pretty much gone.

some people are ok with that, they'd rather have some sort of amateur league but amateur league not backed by colleges wont work, it would be worse than that D-league or whatever you call it.

 

[sibleyfan91]

Hey - don't blame me! It was someone else.

It's me. It's me.

 

[sibleyfan91]

yeah, I think the people pushing for this really should be careful what you wish for. paying players opens up a ton of issues and honestly, there are about 25 programs that actually make a profit, 90%+ operate in the red. You start this up, college athletics is pretty much gone.

some people are ok with that, they'd rather have some sort of amateur league but amateur league not backed by colleges wont work, it would be worse than that D-league or whatever you call it.

Openly paying players a stipend is fine (not for Pitt though, if too much... probably mean the end of our programs if the 5 or more figures some throw out there).

But there would still be payola under the table. And academic fraud and lax discipline and prostitutes and all the other stuff. It just raises the bar.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

But Bilas' set up would equate to the exact same problems, just more of it above board and less of it below board. Money would still steer kids to schools based on influence and power and the divide between haves and have nots would be even further widened. Of course that helps his alma mater, so he doesn't mind much.

I would think that Duke is one of those programs that really doesn't have to get dirty ,
but ya never know do ya ?
Where else in the world could a young adult come into a situation and turn the fortunes of that business around and really not get compensated adequately and have no other viable options ? A college education is a wonderful thing for someone who wants one , but an elite player whose destined for a professional career barring injury it's meaningless .
First thing they need to end is the one and done rule , but I'm not sure how your ever going to get the bad actors out of game with so much money in it that rewards results so handsomely .

 

[PantherO]

Openly paying players a stipend is fine (not for Pitt though, if too much... probably mean the end of our programs if the 5 or more figures some throw out there).

But there would still be payola under the table. And academic fraud and lax discipline and prostitutes and all the other stuff. It just raises the bar.

This is where the NCAA could step in. Enforce a salary cap if you will. If Pitt is on an even playing field, no reason that can't pony up the same $$ as everyone else.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Vitale just doubled down. You would not believe what he just tweeted. "Rick Pitino has put 29 assistant coaches into head coach jobs, it is a shame his last few assistants have let him down".

 

[Jpripper88]

Vitale just doubled down. You would not believe what he just tweeted. "Rick Pitino has put 29 assistant coaches into head coach jobs, it is a shame his last few assistants have let him down".

I believe it. Dick Vitale is a moron.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

I believe it. Dick Vitale is a moron.

Dick Vitale was a run-of-the-mill high school coach in Nowheresville, New Jersey until one season, his star player, Les Cason, was recruited by every college in America. (By the way, Cason went on to be one of the biggest flops in the history of the NCAA.) Much like nobody would ever have heard of the Kardashians if not for O. J. Simpson, nobody would have ever heard of Vitale if not for Cason.

 

[sibleyfan91]

This is where the NCAA could step in. Enforce a salary cap if you will. If Pitt is on an even playing field, no reason that can't pony up the same $$ as everyone else.

If they could enforce both the above and under table payola, perhaps. But by definition under the table is unseen and unregulated. Like the $100000 and $150000 being bandied around here! That's where the issue is already and Pitt already is not keeping up. Even if we had boosters willing to do that, Pitt's leadership would never go for it. That stuff won't end. This scandal won't stop it. The FBI uncovered this incident; the NCAA didn't, and won't in the future either. Adding an obligation above the table for Pitt, particularly a high amount, only exasperates our plight. But that's just my take...