Who are your top five football head coaches in the ACC? (list is below)

[cbpitt2]

Who are your top five football head coaches in the ACC? (list is below)

Boston College - Bill O'Brien
Cal - Justin Wilcox
Clemson - Dabo Swinney
Duke - Manny Diaz
Florida State - Mike Norvell
Georgia Tech - Brent Key
Louisville - Jeff Brohm
Miami - Mario Cristobal
UNC - Mack Brown
NC State - Dave Doeren
Pitt - Pat Narduzzi
SMU - Rhett Lashlee
Stanford - Troy Taylor
Syracuse - Fran Brown
Virginia - Tony Elliott
Virginia Tech - Brent Pry
Wake Forest - Dave Clawson

 

[bobfree]

Historically? Or right now?

For Pitt or for Clemson?

I'll tell you my criteria.

Historically based on actual accomplishments:

Dabo
Narduzzi
Cristobal
Lashlee
Brohm


If I was hiring for Pitts job, tomorrow.

Lashlee
Brohm
Brown
Diaz
Cristobal.

 

[TD_6082]

Historically? Or right now?

For Pitt or for Clemson?

I'll tell you my criteria.

Historically based on actual accomplishments:

Dabo
Narduzzi
Cristobal
Lashlee
Brohm


If I was hiring for Pitts job, tomorrow.

Lashlee
Brohm
Brown
Diaz
Cristobal.

Brown or Cristobal at Pitt? I think those guys would be a disaster.

And why not Mack Brown for accomplishments? There's only 3 coaches in today's game with a Natty, and he's one of them.

 

[cashisking884]

It’s somewhat program based.

Like would I want Mario if I was a Boston College or Wake fan? Absolutely not.

But if you’re capable of bringing in the type of recruiting class that can win a national championship, would I want Mario? Absolutely, because he’s going to live on the trail and get you that type of recruiting class.

I’d take Norvell over Mario for most ACC jobs. I take Mario over Norvell for FSU, Miami, and Clemson without a second’s thought.

Brohm is a great offensive mind that is capable of getting into his bag and scheming up several TDs against teams with a talent advantage over him. But he sucks at high school recruiting. They aren’t even trying to recruit high school anymore essentially. Because they have realized Brohm is so bad at it, their NIL money is going to go further directed at college players where building relationships and staying on them and talking that sweet talk, isn’t as important.

It’s really based on how you see yourself as a program.

I’d go:

1. Dabo
2. Mario
3. Brohm
4. Lashlee
5. Doeren

 

[mike412]

I would base my choices on who I think would succeed at Pitt. I think Dabo and Cristobal need recruiting resources they couldn’t get at Pitt.

I would pick Key. He seems to have GT heading in the right direction and has what some rank as the second best recruiting class in the ACC coming in. He is at a school which has a similar footprint to Pitt — an urban school in a state where it is number 2 behind a state school with a much larger student body and far more recent success. I have seen 3 of their games on video this year and they appear to be very well coached. Moreover, his offensive and defensive game plans were significantly adjusted to matchup better with the opponent.

 

[PittAU]

I would base my choices on who I think would succeed at Pitt. I think Dabo and Cristobal need recruiting resources they couldn’t get at Pitt.

I would pick Key. He seems to have GT heading in the right direction and has what some rank as the second best recruiting class in the ACC coming in. He is at a school which has a similar footprint to Pitt — an urban school in a state where it is number 2 behind a state school with a much larger student body and far more recent success. I have seen 3 of their games on video this year and they appear to be very well coached. Moreover, his offensive and defensive game plans were significantly adjusted to matchup better with the opponent.

If choosing one of the other ACC coaches for Pitt I would just add Lashlee to your choice of Key. I think they are both very good.

Key has the benefit of Valley grad Tyler Santucci as his DC .

 

[bobfree]

Brown or Cristobal at Pitt? I think those guys would be a disaster.

And why not Mack Brown for accomplishments? There's only 3 coaches in today's game with a Natty, and he's one of them.

You think Fran Brown can get players to Syracuse but not Pitt?

 

[bobfree]

I would base my choices on who I think would succeed at Pitt. I think Dabo and Cristobal need recruiting resources they couldn’t get at Pitt.

I would pick Key. He seems to have GT heading in the right direction and has what some rank as the second best recruiting class in the ACC coming in. He is at a school which has a similar footprint to Pitt — an urban school in a state where it is number 2 behind a state school with a much larger student body and far more recent success. I have seen 3 of their games on video this year and they appear to be very well coached. Moreover, his offensive and defensive game plans were significantly adjusted to matchup better with the opponent.

Mike I considered him but he's a Tech alum and southern guy. But I still do think a north East guy maybe with Pitt connections and his skill set would be our best bet.

Much like Narduzzi but a little more cogent on the offensive side of the ballZ

 

[Las Panteras]

If choosing one of the other ACC coaches for Pitt I would just add Lashlee to your choice of Key. I think they are both very good.

Key has the benefit of Valley grad Tyler Santucci as his DC .

Santucci rumored to be on his way to FSU

 

[TD_6082]

You think Fran Brown can get players to Syracuse but not Pitt?

I was talking about Mack Brown.

But no. I don't think Fran Brown can get players at either place.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I would rank everyone before Cristobal.

 

[MarshallGoldberg]

IDK how to rank them but I'd be happy if Brohm or Lashlee came here for some reason (no clue why they would though.)

 

[TD_6082]

I would base my choices on who I think would succeed at Pitt. I think Dabo and Cristobal need recruiting resources they couldn’t get at Pitt.

I would pick Key. He seems to have GT heading in the right direction and has what some rank as the second best recruiting class in the ACC coming in. He is at a school which has a similar footprint to Pitt — an urban school in a state where it is number 2 behind a state school with a much larger student body and far more recent success. I have seen 3 of their games on video this year and they appear to be very well coached. Moreover, his offensive and defensive game plans were significantly adjusted to matchup better with the opponent.

Ga Tech has a decent NIL game. Stoudamire just landed a Top 10 basketball recruit for the class of 26. Their NIL budget in football alone is over $5 million. Geoff Collins landed some nice talent there, tbh. Collins must have been star-chasing when it came to Jeff Sims though, because I have no clue what he saw there.

Honestly, other than being a Tech grad & having the job fall to him the way it did, I think he would be hard pressed to land HC gig elsewhere. It has nothing to do with his coaching ability. He's just all-time bad when it comes to public speaking and interviews. He gives really short answers, followed by awkward long pauses. He almost never elaborates on anything. It's really something the GaTech brass need to help him with.

 

[Upg bobcat]

Honestly, other than being a Tech grad & having the job fall to him the way it did, I think he would be hard pressed to land HC gig elsewhere. It has nothing to do with his coaching ability. He's just all-time bad when it comes to public speaking and interviews. He gives really short answers, followed by awkward long pauses. He almost never elaborates on anything. It's really something the GaTech brass need to help him with.

If you're a Pitt fan, I don't know how you could be any bit surprised that being smooth in front of the camera doesn't really translate to wins and losses. Narduzzi isn't great with the media yet he has won an ACC championship. Chryst was the all time worst and he was still able to win half his games. Based on his media adeptness, you'd think Chryst would never win a single game.

 

[TD_6082]

If you're a Pitt fan, I don't know how you could be any bit surprised that being smooth in front of the camera doesn't really translate to wins and losses. Narduzzi isn't great with the media yet he has won an ACC championship. Chryst was the all time worst and he was still able to win half his games. Based on his media adeptness, you'd think Chryst would never win a single game.

If you've heard Narduzzi on the ACC network, or on serious XM with Roddy Jones or Full Ride with Rick Neuhisel, he's actually very good.

Chryst was bad, but he is infinitely better than Brent Key.

 

[GT74]

Comparing apples to apples, we must give each coach the same NIL opportunities. Dabo is a good combo of recruiter and coach, He is winning without using the transfer portal and his results speak for themselves. Lashlee is winning but has cash from alumni to use. I like Brohm's and Lashlee's offense and Diaz's defense. I think Duzz has developed his players, so he is under consideration and has won the ACC. Cristobal, Brown, and Norvell are out of the running from past or present results. If I had to choose 1 for Pitt, all things considered, it would be Lashlee.

 

[cashisking884]

I would rank everyone before Cristobal.

This is such a odd argument.

Removing 2020 because it was the weird Covid year, and not enough games were played that literally would have even allowed it to be possible:

Of Cristobal’s 6 seasons as a P4 coach, he has won 10+ regular season games in 3 of them. So not even needing a bowl game exhibition win to get to 10.

What standard are we holding him to that makes him such a bad coach? Saban?

 

[Upg bobcat]

This is such a odd argument.

Removing 2020 because it was the weird Covid year, and not enough games were played that literally would have even allowed it to be possible:

Of Cristobal’s 6 seasons as a P4 coach, he has won 10+ regular season games in 3 of them. So not even needing a bowl game exhibition win to get to 10.

What standard are we holding him to that makes him such a bad coach? Saban?

Isn't he financed by LifeWallet, and has been ever since he arrived in Miami? He has the budget to get top recruits the past how many seasons, and had the budget to sign a top flight transfer class. Will he deliver an ACC championship? Will he make the playoffs? Will he be able to make any noise in the playoffs? With the resources he has, he has little excuses.

 

[PittAU]

This is such a odd argument.

Removing 2020 because it was the weird Covid year, and not enough games were played that literally would have even allowed it to be possible:

Of Cristobal’s 6 seasons as a P4 coach, he has won 10+ regular season games in 3 of them. So not even needing a bowl game exhibition win to get to 10.

What standard are we holding him to that makes him such a bad coach? Saban?

Just for a little context, we have had EIGHT 10-win seasons since, and including, 1905.

 

[HailtoPitt]

This is such a odd argument.

Removing 2020 because it was the weird Covid year, and not enough games were played that literally would have even allowed it to be possible:

Of Cristobal’s 6 seasons as a P4 coach, he has won 10+ regular season games in 3 of them. So not even needing a bowl game exhibition win to get to 10.

What standard are we holding him to that makes him such a bad coach? Saban?

I suspect that given the same talent or Oregon and Miami, all of the ACC coaches could achieve 10 wins. How did he get the job at Oregon after being fired from FIU? I guess because he was an assistant at Bama, where anybody can succeed under Saban. I guess he is a good recruiter, but really, he underperforms.

 

[HOF Coach]

Who are your top five football head coaches in the ACC? (list is below)

Boston College - Bill O'Brien
Cal - Justin Wilcox
Clemson - Dabo Swinney
Duke - Manny Diaz
Florida State - Mike Norvell
Georgia Tech - Brent Key
Louisville - Jeff Brohm
Miami - Mario Cristobal
UNC - Mack Brown
NC State - Dave Doeren
Pitt - Pat Narduzzi
SMU - Rhett Lashlee
Stanford - Troy Taylor
Syracuse - Fran Brown
Virginia - Tony Elliott
Virginia Tech - Brent Pry
Wake Forest - Dave Clawson

Scratch Mack Brown...

 

[cashisking884]

I suspect that given the same talent or Oregon and Miami, all of the ACC coaches could achieve 10 wins. How did he get the job at Oregon after being fired from FIU? I guess because he was an assistant at Bama, where anybody can succeed under Saban. I guess he is a good recruiter, but really, he underperforms.

Oregon wasn’t good when Cristobal took it over. It’s Cristobal that built up the talent, left it as a 10 win program, and then handed a stacked roster to a guy who had never been a HC, to where that guy could keep winning 10+ games.
You’re not giving him enough credit.

Miami has won 10+ regular season games once in how many years? 20-ish? And he’s only in year 3. Meaning his recruiting classes don’t even account for the upperclassmen yet.

You’re just not giving him nearly enough credit because you’re putting too much emphasis on the game day coaching side of it. As if talent acquisition isn’t arguably the most important part of the job.

 

[cashisking884]

Isn't he financed by LifeWallet, and has been ever since he arrived in Miami? He has the budget to get top recruits the past how many seasons, and had the budget to sign a top flight transfer class. Will he deliver an ACC championship? Will he make the playoffs? Will he be able to make any noise in the playoffs? With the resources he has, he has little excuses.

Cristobal has always been in insane recruiter. Everywhere he has been. He’s basically a recruiting boogeyman to opposing coaches. “say you’re prayers or Mario will steal your recruits.”

That predates NIL.

 

[Upg bobcat]

Cristobal has always been in insane recruiter. Everywhere he has been. He’s basically a recruiting boogeyman to opposing coaches. “say you’re prayers or Mario will steal your recruits.”

That predates NIL.

So he's James Franklin in other words. Where do you rank Franklin among the top coaches in the Big 10? Do you consider him in the top two or three Big 10 coaches?

 

[HailtoPitt]

Oregon wasn’t good when Cristobal took it over. It’s Cristobal that built up the talent, left it as a 10 win program, and then handed a stacked roster to a guy who had never been a HC, to where that guy could keep winning 10+ games.
You’re not giving him enough credit.

Miami has won 10+ regular season games once in how many years? 20-ish? And he’s only in year 3. Meaning his recruiting classes don’t even account for the upperclassmen yet.

You’re just not giving him nearly enough credit because you’re putting too much emphasis on the game day coaching side of it. As if talent acquisition isn’t arguably the most important part of the job.

Sounds like James Franklin. Recruits well. Sucks on gameday. And it really shouldn't be that difficult to recruit at Miami. Beats the teams they easily have more talent then. That only works for so long.

 

[cashisking884]

So he's James Franklin in other words. Where do you rank Franklin among the top coaches in the Big 10? Do you consider him in the top two or three Big 10 coaches?

I think Franklin is a good comparison. But Franklin has been at PSU long enough to build up a roster and have it be his. That is his team, and has been his team for many years.

Mario had that kind of success at Oregon and this year at Miami, without having the roster ever fully be his. Cristobal only ever had 3 full recruiting classes on the field at Oregon. Has only had two at Miami.

You can take that two ways as it relates to Franklin. He hasn’t been at a P4 job long enough to prove he can sustain the kind of 10 win success that Franklin has.

But also hasn’t been at any P4 job long enough to prove he can’t build a roster beyond Franklin’s, and so surpass what Franklin has done.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I think Franklin is a good comparison. But Franklin has been at PSU long enough to build up a roster and have it be his. That is his team, and has been his team for many years.

Mario had that kind of success at Oregon and this year at Miami, without having the roster ever fully be his. Cristobal only ever had 3 full recruiting classes on the field at Oregon. Has only had two at Miami.

You can take that two ways as it relates to Franklin. He hasn’t been at a P4 job long enough to prove he can sustain the kind of 10 win success that Franklin has.

But also hasn’t been at any P4 job long enough to prove he can’t build a roster beyond Franklin’s, and so surpass what Franklin has done.

It's not going to matter how well he recruits and for how many years if he isn't a good coach on gameday and makes those boneheaded decisions.

 

[cashisking884]

Sounds like James Franklin. Recruits well. Sucks on gameday. And it really shouldn't be that difficult to recruit at Miami.

People, or maybe just you, keep talking about how easy the Miami job *should* be.

Yet it took a HOF coach for them to have a single 10 win season in the last 20 years.

And no coach has recruited at the level Mario is recruiting at within his first 3 classes.

I don’t know. Maybe we should stop judging Cristobal by these hypothetical coaches you are growing in a lab.

 

[cashisking884]

It's not going to matter how well he recruits and for how many years if he isn't a good coach on gameday and makes those boneheaded decisions.

Les Miles, Coach O, Gene Chizik, and Larry Coker say, “hold my national championship ring for a second while I type out a response.”

 

[pittdan77]

It’s somewhat program based.

I think this is the best answer. Different programs have different needs and they all have very different resources.

 

[TD_6082]

Sounds like James Franklin. Recruits well. Sucks on gameday. And it really shouldn't be that difficult to recruit at Miami. Beats the teams they easily have more talent then. That only works for so long.

I think Franklin is much better than Cristobal. Franklin's teams are generally tougher, more physical, and more disciplined.

Franklin did spend 3 years at Vandy winning several games against teams that had better talent. He had the rep of being a great game day coach.