WPIAL Championships this week at The Pete

Sean Miller Fan

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Thursday
5 - 1A Boys - 1 Bishop Canevin vs 3 Union
7 - 3A Girls - 1 North Catholic vs 3 Freedom
9 - 4A Boys - 1 Quaker Valley vs 4 Montour

Friday
3 - 2A Girls - 1 OLSH vs 2 Neshannock
5 - 3A Boys - 3 SSA vs 8 Avonworth
7 - 6A Girls - 1 Mt Lebanon vs 3 Upper St. Clair
9 - 5A Boys - Laurel Highlands vs 2 New Castle

Saturday
11 - 1A Girls - 4 Aquinas Academy vs 7 Bishop Canevin
1 - 2A Boys - OLSH/GCC winner vs Fort Cherry/Carlynton winner
3 - 4A Girls - Blackhawk/EF winner vs Southmoreland/Knoch winner
5 - 5A Girls - CV/Moon winner vs South Fayette/McKeesport winner
7 - 6A Boys - North Hills/Lebo winner vs Fox Chapel/Central Catholic winner

- the private school thing is evident in the lower classes and its just not fair. 7 if the 12 finalists in 1A-3A will be private schools. If the PIAA isnt going to make a separate class for them, they should be required to play up 2 classes......or maybe play the regular season in their regular class but have a separate playoff. These small community teams going up against all-star teams is the definition of unfairness.

- The Friday night girls Lebo/USC rivalry game followed by the LH/NC boys game will outdraw every Pitt game this year besides the Duke game. I would not be surprised if the combined attendance of those 2 games was about 7000. New Castle fans are the best. LH fans have the best team in school history and I remember Uniontown fans traveling very well to Pgh in the early 2000s, which doesn't exactly prove LH will but people down there are passionate about generational teams. I remember a NC/Uniontown final at Palumbo truly selling out. They had to close the ticket office and turn people away.

- I haven't followed Rodney Gallagher much since his giving up on college basketball but would he even be a Top 200 basketball recruit? He hasn't grown enough and he's the 2nd leading scorer on his own team. I get that defenses are designed to stop him but he's only averaging 21 in WPIAL 5A basketball. How good is the DeShields kid who is their leading scorer?

- I don't think these games are on TV. I was thinking maybe 22 The Point would do them since they had Friday Night WPIAL basketball package and were doing RMU games but I guess not. I may have watched a couple. Maybe I'll cast the end of LH/NC to my TV if I remember.

- not sure what sense it makes to play a 9PM game on a school night but no 9PM game on a Saturday night. Those kids will be getting home after midnight.

If it were me I'd group the girls games together and boys games together because boys basketball and girls basketball have separate followings.

Thursday
6 - 3A Girls
8 - 4A Girls

Friday
3 - 1A Girls
5 - 2A Girls
7 - 5A Girls
9 - 6A Girls

Saturday
11 - 1A Boys
1 - 2A Boys
3 - 3A Boys
5 - 4A Boys
7 - 5A Boys
9 - 6A Boys
 

PittPharm2002

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New castle is really good , deep, and balanced .
They were mercy ruling teams early in the playoffs by getting up by 30 to end the games
 

Sean Miller Fan

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New castle is really good , deep, and balanced .
They were mercy ruling teams early in the playoffs by getting up by 30 to end the games

Didn't know they had that. I hate the mercy rules. I was on good teams and bad teams before the Mercy rules were put in. I would have hated for games to end early whether we were up or down. Players like to play. If kids' self-esteem would be hurt that bad, perhaps once a certain score is reached, the team is declared winner, scores reset to 0 and stay there but the teams finish out playing.
 
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Interesting to see if North Hills can run the table and finish as undefeated 6A champs. I'd like to go if they make the finals and see if Parham looks like the real deal
 

4Mark_Marty

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Didn't know they had that. I hate the mercy rules. I was on good teams and bad teams before the Mercy rules were put in. I would have hated for games to end early whether we were up or down. Players like to play. If kids' self-esteem would be hurt that bad, perhaps once a certain score is reached, the team is declared winner, scores reset to 0 and stay there but the teams finish out playing.
It's not like a 10 run rule where they stop the game. They just use a running clock.
 

wbrpanther

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Thursday
5 - 1A Boys - 1 Bishop Canevin vs 3 Union
7 - 3A Girls - 1 North Catholic vs 3 Freedom
9 - 4A Boys - 1 Quaker Valley vs 4 Montour

Friday
3 - 2A Girls - 1 OLSH vs 2 Neshannock
5 - 3A Boys - 3 SSA vs 8 Avonworth
7 - 6A Girls - 1 Mt Lebanon vs 3 Upper St. Clair
9 - 5A Boys - Laurel Highlands vs 2 New Castle

Saturday
11 - 1A Girls - 4 Aquinas Academy vs 7 Bishop Canevin
1 - 2A Boys - OLSH/GCC winner vs Fort Cherry/Carlynton winner
3 - 4A Girls - Blackhawk/EF winner vs Southmoreland/Knoch winner
5 - 5A Girls - CV/Moon winner vs South Fayette/McKeesport winner
7 - 6A Boys - North Hills/Lebo winner vs Fox Chapel/Central Catholic winner

- the private school thing is evident in the lower classes and its just not fair. 7 if the 12 finalists in 1A-3A will be private schools. If the PIAA isnt going to make a separate class for them, they should be required to play up 2 classes......or maybe play the regular season in their regular class but have a separate playoff. These small community teams going up against all-star teams is the definition of unfairness.

- The Friday night girls Lebo/USC rivalry game followed by the LH/NC boys game will outdraw every Pitt game this year besides the Duke game. I would not be surprised if the combined attendance of those 2 games was about 7000. New Castle fans are the best. LH fans have the best team in school history and I remember Uniontown fans traveling very well to Pgh in the early 2000s, which doesn't exactly prove LH will but people down there are passionate about generational teams. I remember a NC/Uniontown final at Palumbo truly selling out. They had to close the ticket office and turn people away.

- I haven't followed Rodney Gallagher much since his giving up on college basketball but would he even be a Top 200 basketball recruit? He hasn't grown enough and he's the 2nd leading scorer on his own team. I get that defenses are designed to stop him but he's only averaging 21 in WPIAL 5A basketball. How good is the DeShields kid who is their leading scorer?

- I don't think these games are on TV. I was thinking maybe 22 The Point would do them since they had Friday Night WPIAL basketball package and were doing RMU games but I guess not. I may have watched a couple. Maybe I'll cast the end of LH/NC to my TV if I remember.

- not sure what sense it makes to play a 9PM game on a school night but no 9PM game on a Saturday night. Those kids will be getting home after midnight.

If it were me I'd group the girls games together and boys games together because boys basketball and girls basketball have separate followings.

Thursday
6 - 3A Girls
8 - 4A Girls

Friday
3 - 1A Girls
5 - 2A Girls
7 - 5A Girls
9 - 6A Girls

Saturday
11 - 1A Boys
1 - 2A Boys
3 - 3A Boys
5 - 4A Boys
7 - 5A Boys
9 - 6A Boys
The Point is carrying two semi-final games but said it wasn't cost effective to carry any final games. I miss the old days in the 60s and early 70s when The local PBS station carried the 3 final games from the Civic arena. Chilly Billy and a very young Bill Hillgrove.
 
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recruitsreadtheseboards

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Alas, my adapted mother will not be in the finals as they were beaten by Laurel Highlands last night. But they really don't have any Seniors so Highlands (not the Laurel) kind should be one of the top 5A teams next year again. One thing I give them credit for, they play anyone anywhere.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Alas, my adapted mother will not be in the finals as they were beaten by Laurel Highlands last night. But they really don't have any Seniors so Highlands (not the Laurel) kind should be one of the top 5A teams next year again. One thing I give them credit for, they play anyone anywhere.
Aren't you from that area? How the heck is Highlands HS growing? I should ask the same question about LH. Cant believe they're still 5A in basketball.

I remember Uniontown in the 2000s was 4A in a 4A system. Now their football is 3A in a 6A system and dropped out of WPIAL football.
 

Pitt79

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Didn't know they had that. I hate the mercy rules. I was on good teams and bad teams before the Mercy rules were put in. I would have hated for games to end early whether we were up or down. Players like to play. If kids' self-esteem would be hurt that bad, perhaps once a certain score is reached, the team is declared winner, scores reset to 0 and stay there but the teams finish out playing.
Exactly, I had times in my childhood sports days when I was a good player and a deep bench warmer, I would of been pissed if they ended it early just as I was about to get rare playing time. I remember losing an elementary school basketball game 72-8, I was actually proud of being high scorer with 4 :) I would of hated ending it sooner
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Exactly, I had times in my childhood sports days when I was a good player and a deep bench warmer, I would of been pissed if they ended it early just as I was about to get rare playing time. I remember losing an elementary school basketball game 72-8, I was actually proud of being high scorer with 4 :) I would of hated ending it sooner
When I was 10, my baseball team didn't win a game in a 9-12 league. We were all young and got crushed every time. I had an absolute blast being one of the best players on my team as opposed to sitting in RF all season on a good team. By the time we were 12, we won the championship. I would have been so pissed to have games ended early when we were getting blown out.
 
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accindc

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When I was 10, my baseball team didn't win a game in a 9-12 league. We were all young and got crushed every time. I had an absolute blast being one of the best players on my team as opposed to sitting in RF all season on a good team. By the time we were 12, we won the championship. I would have been so pissed to have games ended early when we were getting blown out.
mercy rules in youth rec leagues - unnecessary but fine
mercy rules in HS playoff games - beyond stupid
 

Sean Miller Fan

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mercy rules in youth rec leagues - unnecessary but fine
mercy rules in HS playoff games - beyond stupid

The youth baseball team I coach got "Mercy ruled" once. I actually didn't know we had that rule. The coach asked if we wanted to keep playing? I was like, "huh, oh there's a Mercy rule." Of course we kept playing. Didn't even ask the kids. They signed up to play baseball. This team was the best in the league, who cares if you get crushed.
 
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Sean Miller Fan

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I think what tonight showed, in case anyone doubted it, was the huge gulf between Duke and every other team in this conference. They are not only a lot better than us, they are a lot better than anyone else we've played this season.

Well yea. Duke is a legit NC contendor. The 2nd best team in the league is not much better than First Four level.
 

Pitt79

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mercy rules in youth rec leagues - unnecessary but fine
mercy rules in HS playoff games - beyond stupid
I don't think it's ever a good idea, they should poll the players on losing teams about games that got shortened and ask them if they where happy they stopped it? Getting your ass kicked in a sport is not that big a deal, I never felt devastated by it. My daughter's junior year in high school, her soccer team went 0-13, her coach praised her for playing hard until the end, I was proud of her response, she said she didn't care about the score just kept trying to beat the person in front of her, senior year they won a few and earned a home playoff game too. IMO all sports are more about just playing than the result below the pro level.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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I don't think it's ever a good idea, they should poll the players on losing teams about games that got shortened and ask them if they where happy they stopped it? Getting your ass kicked in a sport is not that big a deal, I never felt devastated by it. My daughter's junior year in high school, her soccer team went 0-13, her coach praised her for playing hard until the end, I was proud of her response, she said she didn't care about the score just kept trying to beat the person in front of her, senior year they won a few and earned a home playoff game too. IMO all sports are more about just playing than the result below the pro level.
I think the only sport where it makes a small bit of sense is football and that is due to the injury factor. However, I still disagree with it in football because injuries can happen when its 0-0 or 21-0 too. If it were me, I'd try to avoid having these teams even play each other. I have been on all sides of these situations. Recently, we blew out a soccer team and I asked the league if we could switch with someone so we didn't have to blow them out again. There's just no good in a game like that. The league obliged. What is the point of having old-school Clairton playing some Fayette County team? Use some common sense and creativity.
 

recruitsreadtheseboards

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Aren't you from that area? How the heck is Highlands HS growing? I should ask the same question about LH. Cant believe they're still 5A in basketball.

I remember Uniontown in the 2000s was 4A in a 4A system. Now their football is 3A in a 6A system and dropped out of WPIAL football.
Yeah I don't know. We have a couple of new housing developments, I don't think we are growing as much as so many districts are shrinking so fast.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Yeah I don't know. We have a couple of new housing developments, I don't think we are growing as much as so many districts are shrinking so fast.
I mean I wouldn't think its growing by leaps and bounds but I was surprised to see Highlands in 5A after winning 4A a few years ago. I just remember you painting a grim picture of that area but it seems its actually gaining population which is extremely, extremely rare. Very few of those types of areas are gaining.
 

meadvillecoach

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take the total number of teams participating in a respective sport and divide by 6. Get the classes as equal as possible to the number and there you have it. It does not really matter as to the size because the Piaa strives to keep numbers equal.example 100 teams 4 classes= 25 teams per class. They set the numbers according to the number of teams in each class
 
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accindc

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I don't think it's ever a good idea, they should poll the players on losing teams about games that got shortened and ask them if they where happy they stopped it? Getting your ass kicked in a sport is not that big a deal, I never felt devastated by it. My daughter's junior year in high school, her soccer team went 0-13, her coach praised her for playing hard until the end, I was proud of her response, she said she didn't care about the score just kept trying to beat the person in front of her, senior year they won a few and earned a home playoff game too. IMO all sports are more about just playing than the result below the pro level.
The kids just want to play. My son's first travel hockey tournament they lost to Honeybaked 12-0. Yet they were so excited to find out they would play Honeybaked again in first round of playoffs, talking about how it will be different the next game, yada yada yada. They lost 13-0. But had a great time and they all still talk about it with a good laugh.
 

DT_PITT

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The kids just want to play. My son's first travel hockey tournament they lost to Honeybaked 12-0. Yet they were so excited to find out they would play Honeybaked again in first round of playoffs, talking about how it will be different the next game, yada yada yada. They lost 13-0. But had a great time and they all still talk about it with a good laugh.
Indeed!
 

Pitt79

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The kids just want to play. My son's first travel hockey tournament they lost to Honeybaked 12-0. Yet they were so excited to find out they would play Honeybaked again in first round of playoffs, talking about how it will be different the next game, yada yada yada. They lost 13-0. But had a great time and they all still talk about it with a good laugh.
And the modern woke/PC attitude is to not keep score with younger kids and give everyone trophies, I remember my daughter's 1st soccer team, they where all 6 year olds, and it was rec and they gave everyone a trophy and thought that the kids don't care anyways, her team finished 5-0-1 and one kid on her team says, "But we won every game, we should get a bigger trophy", another replied, "No, we tied one" :) No, they don't notice :)
 

Pitt79

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The kids just want to play. My son's first travel hockey tournament they lost to Honeybaked 12-0. Yet they were so excited to find out they would play Honeybaked again in first round of playoffs, talking about how it will be different the next game, yada yada yada. They lost 13-0. But had a great time and they all still talk about it with a good laugh.
When you think about the mercy rules, they must of been conceived by the stud athletes who always won, I think most kids who are average or mediocre who stay with sports for years and years, just want to play, they aren't devastated by losing.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Here's a great example:

2A Final:

OLSH vs Fort Cherry

Fort Cherry is not known as a good sports school, certainly not basketball in rural Washington County. I don't remember them ever being good at anything other than a few years in football in the 90s when they had the all-time WPIAL rusher. So, I guess they have a generational basketball team this year. My guess is its a bunch of kids from the same small town who grew up dreaming for this moment. Now they're there. And who is their opponent? Well, its an all-star team from Allegheny County who can pull kids from anywhere they please. How in the world is this fair?

Schools which arent bound by geography should play 3A, at a minimum. The neighborhood schools like Fort Cherry deserve an equal shot.
 
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Pitt79

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Schools which arent bound by geography should play 3A, at a minimum. The neighborhood schools like Fort Cherry deserve an equal shot.
Every team used to be a "neighborhood school", it's crazy how today you commonly hear about a PARENT that starts a high school because their kid is a stud at some sport, and used to be top recruits went to normal neighborhood schools, now they all go to My Dad's GED Class Basketball High :)
 

PittPharm2002

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And the modern woke/PC attitude is to not keep score with younger kids and give everyone trophies, I remember my daughter's 1st soccer team, they where all 6 year olds, and it was rec and they gave everyone a trophy and thought that the kids don't care anyways, her team finished 5-0-1 and one kid on her team says, "But we won every game, we should get a bigger trophy", another replied, "No, we tied one" :) No, they don't notice :)
That’s not a modern thing
It’s been going on for at least 35 years for instructional league baseball and into soccer
 

JRPITT

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Here's a great example:

2A Final:

OLSH vs Fort Cherry

Fort Cherry is not known as a good sports school, certainly not basketball in rural Washington County. I don't remember them ever being good at anything other than a few years in football in the 90s when they had the all-time WPIAL rusher. So, I guess they have a generational basketball team this year. My guess is its a bunch of kids from the same small town who grew up dreaming for this moment. Now they're there. And who is their opponent? Well, its an all-star team from Allegheny County who can pull kids from anywhere they please. How in the world is this fair?

Schools which arent bound by geography should play 3A, at a minimum. The neighborhood schools like Fort Cherry deserve an equal shot.
Private schools (especially Catholic) are out of control. Bishop Canevin, Olsh, Greensburg Central, Central of Pittsburgh, Seton Lasalle, & Geibel are bringing in multitudes of athletes from public schools. They should be placed in a separate section or league but the WPIAL is very WEAK and are intimidated by these schools. One thing that public school AD's could do (which I doubt they would) would be to refuse to play any private school in any nonsection, tip-off, or Christmas tournament game. Also, if private schools are in your section, don't play them in JV games. Afterall, those JV kids probably won't be playing varsity later on.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Private schools (especially Catholic) are out of control. Bishop Canevin, Olsh, Greensburg Central, Central of Pittsburgh, Seton Lasalle, & Geibel are bringing in multitudes of athletes from public schools. They should be placed in a separate section or league but the WPIAL is very WEAK and are intimidated by these schools. One thing that public school AD's could do (which I doubt they would) would be to refuse to play any private school in any nonsection, tip-off, or Christmas tournament game. Also, if private schools are in your section, don't play them in JV games. Afterall, those JV kids probably won't be playing varsity later on.

I couldn't believe Geibel had a good year when I saw the brackets.

If they aren't going to have their own classification, they need to play up 2 classes. They make Aliquippa play up 3 classes in football, which requires a lot of players. These schools can easily play up 2 classes. That seems fair. I hate to see 1A and 2A be a private school invitational tournament with a few lucky private schools getting bids. Its stupid
 

Pitt79

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That’s not a modern thing
It’s been going on for at least 35 years for instructional league baseball and into soccer
Sorry to hear that, I graduated from high school 44 years ago, when I was a kid they taught us to win
 

PittPharm2002

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Sorry to hear that, I graduated from high school 44 years ago, when I was a kid they taught us to win
And yet -
You’re a cog in a machine working for the government and shit pointing anonymously on the internet
 

Sean Miller Fan

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Sorry to hear that, I graduated from high school 44 years ago, when I was a kid they taught us to win
I am actually a fan of not keeping score until maybe middle elementary school. Its not to help kids from getting their feelings hurt if they lose. Its to incent coaches for playing kids evenly and in different positions so that all kids can have a chance to develop. The second you start keeping score for kindergarteners, most coaches main priority is winning the game so if that means Billy plays RF and bats 9th every game, so be it. And parents also start losing their minds when scores are kept.
 

Joe the Panther Fan

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And parents also start losing their minds when scores are kept.


THAT is the reason not to keep score in the younger ages. When my kids were playing soccer when they were little and they "didn't keep score" at the end of the game every kid knew whether they had won or lost. But saying that they aren't keeping score helps save the parents who just can't help themselves from themselves.
 

Sean Miller Fan

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THAT is the reason not to keep score in the younger ages. When my kids were playing soccer when they were little and they "didn't keep score" at the end of the game every kid knew whether they had won or lost. But saying that they aren't keeping score helps save the parents who just can't help themselves from themselves.
Well soccer is low scoring so yea the kids do keep score and know who won or lost but for most sports, you can easily do this.

Our league kept score for 7-8 year old baseball when the coach pitches to their own players. And you have to bug a parent to do the book. I thought how pointless, what a waste of time. I am pitching to my players. Its not real baseball. If the kids want to keep score on their own, great but does it need to be official. The one year we went undefeated and I was so mad we'd never get to bat in the bottom of the 6th. We "won." So what. The kids getting an extra at-bat or the defense making a nice play is more important than winning or losing.