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Netscape - Daily discussion on scores and Net impact

Dointhatrag

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Sep 3, 2017
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Everyone's favorite topic!

ACC day 1:
After quite a few opening day struggles the ACC went 14-0!

Big 12 the supposed "premier conference" with 2 losses:
K state lost to a ranked USC team
Oklahoma St losses to Abilene Christian - bad loss

B10 with 2 losses
#4 MSU lost to James Madison! bad loss
Rutgers losses to Princeton

SEC
Georgia lost to oregon

P12 undefeated
Big East - undefeated
 
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I hate NET so bad but I guess it makes these Nov games more interesting. I'm "rooting" every possession so we extend the lead and run it up. Also, I dont think you can waste a possession anymore by dribbling out the clock like we did yesterday. The extra 2 points we may have gotten wouldn't have mattered but the NCAA is telling you that they want you to run it up. By the same token, if Duke is up 20 on us and dribbling out the clock, I am trapping and fouling their walk-ons and trying to cut into that lead. Maybe you go on a 6-0 lead late with your starters vs their walk-ons. I'd be so obnoxious and obvious and maybe enough people would notice thay they'd change it.
 
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Everyone's favorite topic!

ACC day 1:
After quite a few opening day struggles the ACC went 14-0!

Big 12 the supposed "premier conference" with 2 losses:
K state lost to a ranked USC team
Oklahoma St losses to Abilene Christian - bad loss

B10 with 2 losses
#4 MSU lost to James Madison! bad loss
Rutgers losses to Princeton

SEC
Georgia lost to oregon

P12 undefeated
Big East - undefeated
There's never a good loss at home, but JMU is an up-and-coming program across the board. They could be an NCAAT team this year. Princeton was in the Sweet 16 last year, so not a shocker there either.
 
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There's never a good loss at home, but JMU is an up-and-coming program across the board. They could be an NCAAT team this year. Princeton was in the Sweet 16 last year, so not a shocker there either.

I know nothing about JMU's team this year but its really bad to schedule a decent mid-major in Game 1. They play in good mid-major league (Sun Belt). Don't schedule teams like that early.
 
Everyone's favorite topic!

ACC day 1:
After quite a few opening day struggles the ACC went 14-0!

Big 12 the supposed "premier conference" with 2 losses:
K state lost to a ranked USC team
Oklahoma St losses to Abilene Christian - bad loss

B10 with 2 losses
#4 MSU lost to James Madison! bad loss
Rutgers losses to Princeton

SEC
Georgia lost to oregon

P12 undefeated
Big East - undefeated
Love the title...takes me back to early days of the world wide web....
 
One of Pitt's opponents this year Purdue - Fort Wayne won last night 130-34 WTF. That comes on the heel of a road win at DePaul.
 
One of Pitt's opponents this year Purdue - Fort Wayne won last night 130-34 WTF. That comes on the heel of a road win at DePaul.
Andrews University is in the USCAA and doesn't look like it would be competitive in a low level D3 conference. No idea why any D1 school is playing them.
 
Andrews University is in the USCAA and doesn't look like it would be competitive in a low level D3 conference. No idea why any D1 school is playing them.
Probably because it doesn't count in the NET rankings. They can get a tune up without hurting their number.
 
When do they come out and what is delay?


Last year the first NET ratings came out in December.

And it's not really a delay, it's the acknowledgement that putting them out now would be meaningless. Ratings like Pomeroy and Torvik and others have meaning because they assign everyone a starting ranking based on last season and who teams have coming back and the like, things that have shown in the past to have predictive value for how good a team will be this season. And then as time goes on those initial starting ratings are removed from the calculation. The NET doesn't do that. It only uses this season's data. And after a small number of games and only counting those small number of games, what the NET comes up with would be meaningless.
 
While buried behind NFL yesterday a few interesting outcomes that will affect the NET:

Not good for WCC last night
23 St Marys loses to Weber St.
Loyala Marymont loses to Yale

Others
Maryland loses to UAB and goes to 1-2
Clemson over Davidson
Indiana beat 0-3 army only by 8
Nevada beat Washington
 
ACC another 3-0 night. Keep piling up those wins

Purdue over Xavier likely a nice quad 1 win for B10
Penn over Villanova - hurts BE
Michigan over St Johns - hurts BE good win for B10


Tonight we have several interesting matchups
9 Duke vs 18 Mich St
4 Marquette vs 23 Illinois
1 Kansas vs 17 Kentucky
Wisconsin vs Providence
 
Bad night for big10 as MSU, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin go down. Northwestern also struggled and fell below Pitt in KenPom. Providence passed Pitt with their win over Wisky, so Pitt stays at 47.

USC and Stanford lost out west. But not to be outdone, for the ACC….
Cuse comes back 24 down to beat Colgate
UVA beat our friends NCAT by 29…..
GT lost to Umass….branch at Lowell
 
Bad night for big10 as MSU, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin go down. Northwestern also struggled and fell below Pitt in KenPom. Providence passed Pitt with their win over Wisky, so Pitt stays at 47.

USC and Stanford lost out west. But not to be outdone, for the ACC….
Cuse comes back 24 down to beat Colgate
UVA beat our friends NCAT by 29…..
GT lost to Umass….branch at Lowell

They came back from 24 with 16:00 left. Outscored Colgate 44-16. Colgate has a 99.4% chance to win at 54-30
 
So far the 3 WTF losses by the ACC are:

Ga Tech home to Umass Lowell 74-71
Louisville to Chattanooga 81-71
Notre Dame to W Carolina 71-61

I can live with losses to Georgia, S Carolina, and Arizona
 
So far the 3 WTF losses by the ACC are:

Ga Tech home to Umass Lowell 74-71
Louisville to Chattanooga 81-71
Notre Dame to W Carolina 71-61

I can live with losses to Georgia, S Carolina, and Arizona
As long as the ACC can keep the bad OOC losses confined to the 2-3 teams that everyone knew were going to be bad, they’ll be okay. Last year, the issue was teams like Florida State and Syracuse, who had some talent, losing weird games in the OOC, which dragged down their metrics for conference play, even if they weren’t all that bad.
 
So far the 3 WTF losses by the ACC are:

Ga Tech home to Umass Lowell 74-71
Louisville to Chattanooga 81-71
Notre Dame to W Carolina 71-61

I can live with losses to Georgia, S Carolina, and Arizona

GT barely beat Howard so you know they had no shot to beat Karim Coulibaly and UML. Bad hire for GT. Too inexperienced.

I think a lot of people would have picked Chat over Lou.

And ND may have the least talent in the league
 
As long as the ACC can keep the bad OOC losses confined to the 2-3 teams that everyone knew were going to be bad, they’ll be okay. Last year, the issue was teams like Florida State and Syracuse, who had some talent, losing weird games in the OOC, which dragged down their metrics for conference play, even if they weren’t all that bad.
I'm not a NET expert so I have to ask, is that really the case? Does it matter to Pitt if say both Louisville and Duke play the same crappy OOC team and Duke loses and Louisville wins, ,or if Duke wins and Louisville loses?
 
I'm not a NET expert so I have to ask, is that really the case? Does it matter to Pitt if say both Louisville and Duke play the same crappy OOC team and Duke loses and Louisville wins, ,or if Duke wins and Louisville loses?
Maybe I’m not explaining it right.

From a perception level, it definitely matters. NET and the team sheets matter, but human beings are on the selection committee. And if the perception is “ACC is bad,” then that has an effect. To this point, the teams that are supposed to be good actually being good, the teams that are supposed to be bad not being as bad as people thought, and teams that people thought would be mediocre actually being solid all matter. If Duke, and UNC, and Virginia, and Miami, and even to an extent Syracuse, NC State, Florida State and Pitt being good all matters on a human level.

From a NET perspective, you can’t have situations where a Florida State team that actually has some talent ends up getting their NET torpedoed by losing OOC games to Stetson. As we learned last year, that was a team that wasn’t dreadful - but the NET reflected the OOC results. You’ve gotta avoid that as a league. That’s where I’m a little concerned about Notre Dame - they don’t have a ton of talent and they’re going to lose OOC games, but Shrewsberry can scheme up a game plan that can win some ACC games, and those will be huge NET traps. You need the talented teams to win their games, because then their NET will be reflective of their talent level.

By way of example, Duke’s going to be more talented than Pitt this year whether they finish 27-4 or whether they finish 18-13. But if they’re 18-13, then we’re going to go into our home game with Duke where they’re a Q2 win at best, and a loss that won’t look great on the team sheet if we lose, even if they’re a better team. You need the good teams to win, so that their NET is reflective of that. And you need the bad teams to win, too, honestly.
 
With respect to perception, three teams predicted to be in the tourney, NW, Indiana, and Virginia have all underperformed Pitt versus common opponents thus far. It will work itself out. The biggest thing is for Pitt to avoid bad losses itself. The less quad 4 opportunities the better. We don’t want ND, Lville, GT to be such when we play them as anything can still happen any night.
 
Maybe I’m not explaining it right.

From a perception level, it definitely matters. NET and the team sheets matter, but human beings are on the selection committee. And if the perception is “ACC is bad,” then that has an effect. To this point, the teams that are supposed to be good actually being good, the teams that are supposed to be bad not being as bad as people thought, and teams that people thought would be mediocre actually being solid all matter. If Duke, and UNC, and Virginia, and Miami, and even to an extent Syracuse, NC State, Florida State and Pitt being good all matters on a human level.

From a NET perspective, you can’t have situations where a Florida State team that actually has some talent ends up getting their NET torpedoed by losing OOC games to Stetson. As we learned last year, that was a team that wasn’t dreadful - but the NET reflected the OOC results. You’ve gotta avoid that as a league. That’s where I’m a little concerned about Notre Dame - they don’t have a ton of talent and they’re going to lose OOC games, but Shrewsberry can scheme up a game plan that can win some ACC games, and those will be huge NET traps. You need the talented teams to win their games, because then their NET will be reflective of their talent level.

By way of example, Duke’s going to be more talented than Pitt this year whether they finish 27-4 or whether they finish 18-13. But if they’re 18-13, then we’re going to go into our home game with Duke where they’re a Q2 win at best, and a loss that won’t look great on the team sheet if we lose, even if they’re a better team. You need the good teams to win, so that their NET is reflective of that. And you need the bad teams to win, too, honestly.

Yea, you cant be having Louisville and others being Q4 games or even Q3. Louisville does have some talent, just a horrible coach. Clemson's Q4 loss to them kept them out of the tournament. Had Louisville had a NET of like 120, which is still bad, Clemson probably gets in.
 
The next 6 weeks basically lock in each conferences' overall NET scores. If you have 4 or 5 teams in quad 4 like last year you are screwed because the only way they improve their NET is to beat common opponents which then drop those teams down in NET ranking
 
Bad night for big10 as MSU, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin go down. Northwestern also struggled and fell below Pitt in KenPom. Providence passed Pitt with their win over Wisky, so Pitt stays at 47.

USC and Stanford lost out west. But not to be outdone, for the ACC….
Cuse comes back 24 down to beat Colgate
UVA beat our friends NCAT by 29…..
GT lost to Umass….branch at Lowell
UMass Lowell wasn’t even an upset. They are 3-0 and rated higher on Pomeroy than Georgia Tech
 
ACC another 3-0 last night taking care of business

Rutgers over georgetown

Games of interest tonight:
auburn vs ND - ND is going to get blasted
UMass Lowell at Arizone St
Utah vs wake forest
 
I’m curious to see how Notre Dame looks. They aren’t good and should lose, but I think it’ll be a good gauge for how Shrewsberry will be able to give superior teams problems from a scheme perspective.
 
I’m curious to see how Notre Dame looks. They aren’t good and should lose, but I think it’ll be a good gauge for how Shrewsberry will be able to give superior teams problems from a scheme perspective.

I have a feeling ND is going to be one of those teams who tanks Nov/Dec but gives some teams some Q3/4 losses in Jan/Feb
 
I hate NET so bad but I guess it makes these Nov games more interesting. I'm "rooting" every possession so we extend the lead and run it up. Also, I dont think you can waste a possession anymore by dribbling out the clock like we did yesterday. The extra 2 points we may have gotten wouldn't have mattered but the NCAA is telling you that they want you to run it up. By the same token, if Duke is up 20 on us and dribbling out the clock, I am trapping and fouling their walk-ons and trying to cut into that lead. Maybe you go on a 6-0 lead late with your starters vs their walk-ons. I'd be so obnoxious and obvious and maybe enough people would notice thay they'd change it.
You already are!
 
ACC another 3-0 last night taking care of business

Rutgers over georgetown

Games of interest tonight:
auburn vs ND - ND is going to get blasted
UMass Lowell at Arizone St
Utah vs wake forest
Well Wake and ND both lost, neither team is looking good and will hurt ACC/Pitt Net rankings

Other games of note:
Dayton over LSU
St Bonn. over Oklahoma St
Missouri over Minnesota
ASU beat UMass lowell by 2 after being down 9 at half
Montana St beat Cal
 
Well Wake and ND both lost, neither team is looking good and will hurt ACC/Pitt Net rankings

Other games of note:
Dayton over LSU
St Bonn. over Oklahoma St
Missouri over Minnesota
ASU beat UMass lowell by 2 after being down 9 at half
Montana St beat Cal
Losing close games to high major schools isn’t a huge deal (Wake). Losing big to high major schools is less ideal (Notre Dame) but again, that’s a team that was supposed to be bad and is meeting that early expectation.

The key for the league is continuing to avoid the bad and/or big losses to non high majors, and then not going 0-fer in the games against high majors. And if you’re going to lose to a non-high major, those losses need to be contained to Louisville and Notre Dame as much as possible.
 
Well Wake and ND both lost, neither team is looking good and will hurt ACC/Pitt Net rankings

Other games of note:
Dayton over LSU
St Bonn. over Oklahoma St
Missouri over Minnesota
ASU beat UMass lowell by 2 after being down 9 at half
Montana St beat Cal
Mizz finished on 31-9 run last night to barely win. Pitt -14.5 for tonight. I think they cover again.
 
Well Wake and ND both lost, neither team is looking good and will hurt ACC/Pitt Net rankings

Other games of note:
Dayton over LSU
St Bonn. over Oklahoma St
Missouri over Minnesota
ASU beat UMass lowell by 2 after being down 9 at half
Montana St beat Cal
Another really good game for Nate Santos at Dayton versus a quality program. Happy to see it.
 
In the battle of misfit toys, ND up by 8 over Ok State at the half. 209 vs 85 in Ken Pom and even more discrepancy in Torvik.
 
In the battle of misfit toys, ND up by 8 over Ok State at the half. 209 vs 85 in Ken Pom and even more discrepancy in Torvik.


That's a good win for the ACC and a bad loss for the Big 12. Notre Dame lost to Western Carolina last weekend. They are, once again, not good at all.

On the other hand, Florida giving Florida State a 21 point beat down wasn't a good one for the ACC.

But perhaps makes our game against Florida even more interesting.
 
We are now up to 39 in KenPom and 55 in Torvik. Both substantial 9 and 8 spot moves, respectively, after tonight’s win.
 
Yes it did shift last few minutes. Maybe other opponents they played as Miami won earlier in day than Pitt.
 
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