OT: USMNT Soccer....

[Sean Miller Fan]

Zelalem is 20 (not that that's old) and has a grand total of 1 career goal at the senior club level.

He's a 20 year old midfielder, not a 25 year old striker. You understand that, right?

Arsenal thinks enough of him that they signed him to a contract extension earlier this year. They obviously think more highly of him than you do.

He's an attacking midfielder. Maybe Arsenal thinks more of him than I do but I am sure you realize that these clubs have 30-50 players on their books. Most are "lottery tickets." Maybe they pan out but in the meantime, they pay his salary by loaning him out. Arsenal has very little invested in the kid.

I hope it works out for him but I don't see it.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

We're not talking about MLS. Its a 2nd rate league. If this country had the 8th best basketball league in the world instead of the NBA, how would those ratings be?

Nobody is saying world-class soccer is as popular as the Big 3 leagues. Its passed up the NHL and that's a very big deal considering the times of games and the crappy time slots.

Uh, MLS sort of is the point. OUR league is 2nd rate. That's because we don't have a good talent like other countries.

Here is my point. You have talked about where soccer has come from since the 90s, or how it has surpassed NHL. Well, yeah that's improvement, but it's improvement from almost non-existence. I'll give you this analogy. Let's say you have a college football team that goes 0-12. Then they go 4-8 next year. Ok, well, that's good improvement in relative terms. However, in absolute terms it's still bad. They still can't compete with Alabama, Clemson, Ohio St, Michigan, etc.

College Football is a bad example but it would be like the sport of Rugby or Cricket league passing the NHL in 20 years. That's nuts.

Soccer has a long way to go to catch the NBA or MLB (never the NFL) but there are signs that if the MLS had the best players, they could. And after the 2026 World Cup, they are going to try it.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Well that's just it, they really aren't in better times slots. The notion that 12:30 on a Saturday is a good time slot for television ratings is nuts. And that's probably the best time slot they are in. MLB doesn't put games on national tv at 12:30 on a Saturday afternoon. The NBA doesn't put games on national television at 12:30 on a Saturday afternoon. When the NFL plays playoff games on Saturday they start the earliest game at around 4:00. There's a reason for that.

I never said it was a good time slot. My point was, when the NFL, NBA, or MLB put games on at noon or 1 (and that DOES happen. NFL does it every week) they still outdraw soccer by a wide margin, at that time slot.

Hell, let's even look at college football. Georgia/Vanderbilt drew 1.9 million at noon last week. Oklahoma/Iowa St drew 2.4 million. Clemson/Wake Forest drew 864k. Even a lousy Texas Tech/Kansas game drew 351k.

College Football is the 2nd highest TV sport in this country.

Man U/Chelsea at noon vs Cubs/Cardinals at noon wouldn't have that large of a gap and that is WITHOUT having home team markets to inflate the numbers.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

OUR league is 2nd rate. That's because we don't have a good talent like other countries.

That isn't really the reason that MLS is 2nd rate. The Brazilian League isn't any better than MLS. Is that because Brazil doesn't have good enough talent? Or Argentina. The Argentine League isn't any better than MLS (actually it's almost certainly worse). Is that because Argentina doesn't have good enough talent?

MLS being second rate has far more to do with it being (relatively speaking) a very young league and not being even close to the highest moneyed league. The best players from around the world go to where they can make the most money and play on the most prestigious clubs. The whole MLS salary cap wouldn't even pay for one good starter on an EPL or Bundesliga team. And sure, that doesn't include the designated players who can make more money. But if you are a mid-level starter would you rather play on a team where a mid-level starter makes millions or on one where a mid-level starter makes $150K? Geoff Cameron is a mid-level starter for Stoke, a mid-level EPL team. He makes $2.4 million per season. Stoke has 14 guys making $1.5 million or more this season. That means non-starters making more than $1.5 million. How much does your average non-starter on an MLS team make? $100K? $80K?

Until those numbers get a lot closer together MLS will always trail behind the best leagues.

I disagree with you that MLS is better than the Argentinian and Brazilian leagues. Although ALL the top and MOST of the 2nd tier domestic players leave for Europe, you are vastly underestimating the depth of those talent pools. Its massive.

In fact, after England, Germany, Italy, France, player for player, I believe the Brazilian and Argentinian leagues are right there with Netherlands, Belgium, Turkey, Russia, etc

 

[Panther Parrothead]

College Football is the 2nd highest TV sport in this country.

If it wasn't for the proliferation of so many sports channels and their need to fill-up the time slots with sports programming, we wouldn't see 75% of the football games that are now available for viewing. If you have doubts, check-out the schedule of televised football games each and every Saturday. I'll save you some time; here's a link to this week's schedule and beyond. Note that these are just the FBS games; there are the lower division games that are televised, too:

http://www.fbschedules.com/college-football-schedule/

And if it's not a "live" game, it's a replay of a game from last week, or one of their so-called "classic" games from years past.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

College Football is the 2nd highest TV sport in this country.

If it wasn't for the proliferation of so many sports channels and their need to fill-up the time slots with sports programming, we wouldn't see 75% of the football games that are now available for viewing. If you have doubts, check-out the schedule of televised football games each and every Saturday. I'll save you some time; here's a link to this week's schedule and beyond. Note that these are just the FBS games; there are the lower division games that are televised, too:

http://www.fbschedules.com/college-football-schedule/

And if it's not a "live" game, it's a replay of a game from last week, or one of their so-called "classic" games from years past.

Yea but what's your point? College football is the #2 TV sport in terms of interest.

 

[Pitt79]

Also, some kids get into soccer because they just weren't good at other sports. Those aren't the type of kids who will go on to be world-class talents.

This is kind of a stupid comment, insinuating that soccer is easier, and if you suck at "real" sports, there's always soccer. It's just not true, lots of kids on high school football and basketball teams, couldn't compete in soccer, as much as vice versa.

 

[Pitt79]

That's the guy SMF. Freddie Adu. I was going to ask what became of him. When he was 16 he was labeled the future of US soccer. And I guess in a way they were right in a roundabout way.

He's playing in NASL, which is minor league to MLS. D-2. He's played all over the world, progressively washing out of worse and worse clubs, he played for DC United at age 14 and played for USMNT for awhile too. he's washed up and long forgotten and he's probably 26 years old.

 

[Pitt79]

We're not talking about MLS. Its a 2nd rate league. If this country had the 8th best basketball league in the world instead of the NBA, how would those ratings be?

Nobody is saying world-class soccer is as popular as the Big 3 leagues. Its passed up the NHL and that's a very big deal considering the times of games and the crappy time slots.

What do most fans get drawn too?

Would you rather watch two world class teams at the absolute highest skill level? Or would you rather root for and follow a favorite, possibly local team that is of lesser quality and be passionate about that, sort of like Pitt Football.

I guess that's two types of fans, 1) fans of the sport more than the team, wanting to see the highest quality play, or 2) fans who adopt a team, and follow it, even if it's 3rd rate, usually because it's local or you have some other form of connection.

So you're saying most people aren't drawn to MLS because it's not "the best", EPL is the very best, and I can't watch it because I can't build an attachment to teams in cities in England, no matter how great they play. I guess I'm like a Eurobasket fan who is satisfied with that and doesn't watch the NBA.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

He's playing in NASL, which is minor league to MLS. D-2. He's played all over the world, progressively washing out of worse and worse clubs, he played for DC United at age 14 and played for USMNT for awhile too. he's washed up and long forgotten and he's probably 26 years old.

Yes and that is my point. I believe he was once on the cover of Sports Illustrated as a 16 year old with the heading of "the Future of American Soccer" or something like that.

Oh wait...it was Time.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

SMF, I actually can remember being in HS in the 80's and watching the FA Cup games on ESPN or one of those sports channels. We always thought it was cool (the crowds, etc...) but had no real idea on how it all worked as it was before the internet and information sources like that.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

We're not talking about MLS. Its a 2nd rate league. If this country had the 8th best basketball league in the world instead of the NBA, how would those ratings be?

Nobody is saying world-class soccer is as popular as the Big 3 leagues. Its passed up the NHL and that's a very big deal considering the times of games and the crappy time slots.

What do most fans get drawn too?

Would you rather watch two world class teams at the absolute highest skill level? Or would you rather root for and follow a favorite, possibly local team that is of lesser quality and be passionate about that, sort of like Pitt Football.

I guess that's two types of fans, 1) fans of the sport more than the team, wanting to see the highest quality play, or 2) fans who adopt a team, and follow it, even if it's 3rd rate, usually because it's local or you have some other form of connection.

So you're saying most people aren't drawn to MLS because it's not "the best", EPL is the very best, and I can't watch it because I can't build an attachment to teams in cities in England, no matter how great they play. I guess I'm like a Eurobasket fan who is satisfied with that and doesn't watch the NBA.

Not everybody is you. There's a reason why the EPL pounds the MLS in ratings. MOST people want to watch the best teams and best players. I'd suspect thr NBA gets better ratings in Europe than their domestic leagues.

However, for me personally, if Pittsburgh had an MLS team, I'd buy season tickets and follow them like I follow Pitt sports but I would be in the extreme minority. I could care less about the Riverhounds because there is no point to them. If they're great, so what, they win the USL title, I dont care about that. They dont get promoted so who cares. Winning a USL title means absolutely nothing to me. If they were in MLS, that ultimate goal of winning MLS would mean something to me.

 

[Pitt79]

Yes and that is my point. I believe he was once on the cover of Sports Illustrated as a 16 year old with the heading of "the Future of American Soccer" or something like that.

Oh wait...it was Time.

Honestly, they can't tell how good someone will be at 14. That guy, I think his name is Sills, he's a WR at WVU, USC gave him a scholarship as a QB at age 13, and while he's a decent football player, he never panned out as a QB, but at 13, he was the next coming.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

SMF, I actually can remember being in HS in the 80's and watching the FA Cup games on ESPN or one of those sports channels. We always thought it was cool (the crowds, etc...) but had no real idea on how it all worked as it was before the internet and information sources like that.

The FA Cup is so awesome. Its like the NCAAT. Everyone gets in, even semi-pro teams and sometimes you get those massive upsets like the NCAAT produces.

The thing with it is that the home venue is drawn so you could have a Man U playing in front of 2000 people in some rinky dink stadium. Just awesome.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

That's the guy SMF. Freddie Adu. I was going to ask what became of him. When he was 16 he was labeled the future of US soccer. And I guess in a way they were right in a roundabout way.

He's playing in NASL, which is minor league to MLS. D-2. He's played all over the world, progressively washing out of worse and worse clubs, he played for DC United at age 14 and played for USMNT for awhile too. he's washed up and long forgotten and he's probably 26 years old.

He's not playing anywhere now. He tried out for a Polish team this year but didn't make it. He is a terrible player.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Honestly, they can't tell how good someone will be at 14. That guy, I think his name is Sills, he's a WR at WVU, USC gave him a scholarship as a QB at age 13, and while he's a decent football player, he never panned out as a QB, but at 13, he was the next coming.

He's a pretty good WR for WVU by the way. But sure, Chris Leak's brother is another example. He was given a scholly as a HS freshman, and well....he was so anonymous I don't even remember his first name.

Of course, you had Sidney Crosby and Connor McDavid who were labled "the next ones" at 12 years old, and well....they were right about that.

 

[Pitt79]

Not everybody is you. There's a reason why the EPL pounds the MLS in ratings. MOST people want to watch the best teams and best players. I'd suspect thr NBA gets better ratings in Europe than their domestic leagues.

However, for me personally, if Pittsburgh had an MLS team, I'd buy season tickets and follow them like I follow Pitt sports but I would be in the extreme minority. I could care less about the Riverhounds because there is no point to them. If they're great, so what, they win the USL title, I dont care about that. They dont get promoted so who cares. Winning a USL title means absolutely nothing to me. If they were in MLS, that ultimate goal of winning MLS would mean something to me.

That's what I'm wondering, do people care more about having their own team and following it, or just seeing THE BEST no matter if they care about the teams or not. So you're answer is that I'm in the minority. I am in fact a big fan of the Baltimore Blast, indoor soccer, and I'm actually really excited they won the last 2 MASL titles, I go to games and watch online, it's great, I'd watch them over EPL. I'm really excited that I just heard this year, that the plan is that Baltimore is going to get a USL team in '18 or '19. Planning to build an 8,000 seat stadium, I'm all excited to get tickets and have it be my primary team, and be pumped up to see them win the USL, which would mean a lot to me, basically, it's fun, FUN to be there, I was at the finals when the Blast played Monterrey, Mexico two years ago, that's way more appealing that seeing Man U have spectacular, fantastical, physical feats of athleticism vs. Stoke Fckin City. If I was in Pittsburgh, I'd go to Riverhounds games, it would be easy for me to buy in, it would be fun probably, great venue, tailgate, etc. I don't care about the quality of play, it's more about being part of it to some degree, again, I don't go to all these games, never a season ticket holder, but it's easy for me to adopt these teams and get excited about it, while I can never get excited about teams in foreign cities, no matter how great their skill level.

 

[Pitt79]

He's not playing anywhere now. He tried out for a Polish team this year but didn't make it. He is a terrible player.

He played a little for Tampa Bay in the NASL I think.

 

[Pitt79]

...I could care less about the Riverhounds because there is no point to them. If they're great, so what, they win the USL title, I dont care about that. They dont get promoted so who cares. Winning a USL title means absolutely nothing to me. If they were in MLS, that ultimate goal of winning MLS would mean something to me.

Why is there "no point to them"? The only point to any of this is FUN, it's just an entertainment vehicle. The point is the same as why you go to the movies, or a concert, ENTERTAINMENT. I've found rooting for a team and actually following a team win a minor league sports championship as great fun and very entertaining and having a point. This idea that if they aren't THE BEST it's worthless is odd to me? Why is winning the MLS so much better than winning the USL, higher level, sure, but not any less fun or entertaining, those Cinncinati FC fans have it right, they are really enjoying it.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Why is there "no point to them"? The only point to any of this is FUN, it's just an entertainment vehicle. The point is the same as why you go to the movies, or a concert, ENTERTAINMENT. I've found rooting for a team and actually following a team win a minor league sports championship as great fun and very entertaining and having a point. This idea that if they aren't THE BEST it's worthless is odd to me? Why is winning the MLS so much better than winning the USL, higher level, sure, but not any less fun or entertaining, those Cinncinati FC fans have it right, they are really enjoying it.

You do realize your world is very centric to your specific tastes and likes? I mean we all are to a point, but you especially seem to have trouble of grasping bigger picture and global views to sports. It is whatever is in my neighborhood and that is all I need. Which is okay. But that is not the way of most sports fans.

 

[Pitt79]

But that is not the way of most sports fans.

I'm just trying to understand "most sports fans" I guess my views are more suited to like 1935, when everyone was all gung ho about high school football, because they'd have to travel 300 miles on dirt roads to get to the nearest pro game. I honestly can't watch any game where I don't care about one of the teams.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

By the way, Bruce Arena is out. I'm not sure what took so long.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

But that is not the way of most sports fans.

I'm just trying to understand "most sports fans" I guess my views are more suited to like 1935, when everyone was all gung ho about high school football, because they'd have to travel 300 miles on dirt roads to get to the nearest pro game. I honestly can't watch any game where I don't care about one of the teams.

First off, Adu did play for TB but not anymore. He couldn't even hack it in NASL.

As for soccer interest, the market speaks for itself. Most people want to see the best. Its why EPL does better here than MLS and I suspect the NBA does better in Spain than their domestic league and the NHL probably does better in Russia than the KHL. I admire your support of your local teams but its absolute garbage soccer. Truth be told, on the world scale, ACC soccer is also garbage but I am a proud Pitt alum so now that they are getting good, I am watching them and actually caring a little if they win or lose. If they stayed good, I might even become more of a fan. But the difference is that I am a Pitt Panther. They are me, in a way. I have an emotional interest in that team. I don't have an emotional connection to the Riverhounds. I dont feel any pride if they win USL. If Pitt was in the National Championship, heck, I'd probably go and if they won, it would be one of my best sports moments. So, I guess I'd say that most people want to watch the best unless they have an emotional connection to the team. For you, you just seem to like watching any type of local soccer. That's cool but you are in the extreme minority.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

By the way, Bruce Arena is out. I'm not sure what took so long.

And there are no good options out there to replace him. Do we hire an American from MLS, Caleb Porter (who failed to qualify the U23s), Tab Ramos whose U20s always grt get bounced early, or do we go with a big name international coach who will tell us how bad MLS is for 4 years.

Honestly, if it were me, I'd hire, yes, a German coach and a bunch of German front office types and say, "here's US soccer, start over, go." I don't trust American soccer people. They should have no hand in running US soccer.

 

[Pitt79]

So, I guess I'd say that most people want to watch the best unless they have an emotional connection to the team.

I can only watch sports with an emotional connection, like I have a hard time watching the CFP Championship game, because I don't care about the teams playing.

 

[Pitt79]

Honestly, if it were me, I'd hire, yes, a German coach and a bunch of German front office types and say, "here's US soccer, start over, go." I don't trust American soccer people. They should have no hand in running US soccer.

Greece hired a German coach before 2004, Otto something? And that's when the won the European Championships.

 

[PeetWeet1]

And there are no good options out there to replace him. Do we hire an American from MLS, Caleb Porter (who failed to qualify the U23s), Tab Ramos whose U20s always grt get bounced early, or do we go with a big name international coach who will tell us how bad MLS is for 4 years.

Honestly, if it were me, I'd hire, yes, a German coach and a bunch of German front office types and say, "here's US soccer, start over, go." I don't trust American soccer people. They should have no hand in running US soccer.

Sam Allardyce

 

[topdecktiger]

This is kind of a stupid comment, insinuating that soccer is easier, and if you suck at "real" sports, there's always soccer. It's just not true, lots of kids on high school football and basketball teams, couldn't compete in soccer, as much as vice versa.

It's not a stupid comment. You inference is way off.

You have to understand that the issue is not the sport of soccer itself. The issue is American society. The good athletes in this country play other sports. So when you have an average kid who can't make it in football or basketball, he turns to another sport where he has a chance. In this country, soccer happens to be one of those sports, since again, the best athletes are in other sports.

In other countries, that's not the case. Places like England or Germany, the best athletes do play soccer. So our hypothetical average kid wouldn't make it at soccer in those countries. In England or Germany, he would wash out in soccer like he would wash out in football or basketball here. This is also why we aren't good in soccer internationally. Countries like England and Germany are sending their best athletes, and we aren't.

You're too sensitive about criticism of soccer, which is causing you to misread this issue. This isn't criticism of the sport. It's criticism of American attitudes towards the sport.

That isn't really the reason that MLS is 2nd rate. The Brazilian League isn't any better than MLS. Is that because Brazil doesn't have good enough talent? Or Argentina. The Argentine League isn't any better than MLS (actually it's almost certainly worse). Is that because Argentina doesn't have good enough talent?

MLS being second rate has far more to do with it being (relatively speaking) a very young league and not being even close to the highest moneyed league. The best players from around the world go to where they can make the most money and play on the most prestigious clubs. The whole MLS salary cap wouldn't even pay for one good starter on an EPL or Bundesliga team. And sure, that doesn't include the designated players who can make more money. But if you are a mid-level starter would you rather play on a team where a mid-level starter makes millions or on one where a mid-level starter makes $150K? Geoff Cameron is a mid-level starter for Stoke, a mid-level EPL team. He makes $2.4 million per season. Stoke has 14 guys making $1.5 million or more this season. That means non-starters making more than $1.5 million. How much does your average non-starter on an MLS team make? $100K? $80K?

Until those numbers get a lot closer together MLS will always trail behind the best leagues.

The reason Brazil and Argentina don't have good leagues is that their best players go overseas to EPL, La Liga, etc. MLS is bad because our players aren't that good.

I want to hit on something you said, which is that MLS is 2nd rate because it's a relatively new league. That's exactly the point. We have only had a serious pro soccer league for ~20 years. That's because soccer isn't very popular in the U.S. Well, that's the ENTIRE problem. Soccer has really only caught on here in the last 10-15 years. We are DECADES behind other countries. That's why we don't produce the kind of talent as other countries do. It would be just like if England or Germany suddenly decided to start playing football. We could probably send a high school team and slaughter whatever national team they put together. That's because we have been playing football for 100+ years, and they barely even know what a football is.

It's no more complicated than that. Some of you guys are overthinking this way too much.

College Football is a bad example but it would be like the sport of Rugby or Cricket league passing the NHL in 20 years. That's nuts.

Soccer has a long way to go to catch the NBA or MLB (never the NFL) but there are signs that if the MLS had the best players, they could. And after the 2026 World Cup, they are going to try it.

College Football is the 2nd highest TV sport in this country.

Man U/Chelsea at noon vs Cubs/Cardinals at noon wouldn't have that large of a gap and that is WITHOUT having home team markets to inflate the numbers.

Man U/Chelsea is the best that could be offered, and it still wouldn't outdraw an average game. It's for a very simple reason. SOCCER ISN'T THAT POPULAR HERE. I understand the improvements that have been made recently. However, those improvements pale in comparison to the popularity of soccer in established countries. Until soccer in this country approaches those levels (and not just slightly better than NHL), you are going to continue to see a talent gap between us and the rest of the world, bottom line.

 

[Pitt79]

It's not a stupid comment. You inference is way off.

You have to understand that the issue is not the sport of soccer itself. The issue is American society. The good athletes in this country play other sports. So when you have an average kid who can't make it in football or basketball, he turns to another sport where he has a chance. In this country, soccer happens to be one of those sports, since again, the best athletes are in other sports.

In other countries, that's not the case. Places like England or Germany, the best athletes do play soccer. So our hypothetical average kid wouldn't make it at soccer in those countries. In England or Germany, he would wash out in soccer like he would wash out in football or basketball here. This is also why we aren't good in soccer internationally. Countries like England and Germany are sending their best athletes, and we aren't.

You're too sensitive about criticism of soccer, which is causing you to misread this issue. This isn't criticism of the sport. It's criticism of American attitudes towards the sport.

I honestly just don't think that anyone who is playing American Football or basketball would automatically get a spot and displace kids that are in soccer now. You're inferring that the kids in football are all better athletes than the kids in soccer today. I just don't think that's true.

 

[Pitt79]

It's almost like you're saying if the football jocks practiced enough, they'd easily beat the nerds on the soccer team at soccer.

 

[topdecktiger]

I honestly just don't think that anyone who is playing American Football or basketball would automatically get a spot and displace kids that are in soccer now. You're inferring that the kids in football are all better athletes than the kids in soccer today. I just don't think that's true.

It's almost like you're saying if the football jocks practiced enough, they'd easily beat the nerds on the soccer team at soccer.

There are certain athletic attributes which make some people better at sports than others. Some of it is size and strength. Some of it is speed and stamina. Some of it is motor control and coordination. Different sports emphasize different attributes, but in general those with superior athletic ability will do better at sports.

So again, the issue is not with soccer itself. The issue is unique to American society. In other countries, the "jocks" (if you want to use that term) play soccer. In America, the "jocks" play football/basketball/baseball.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

It's almost like you're saying if the football jocks practiced enough, they'd easily beat the nerds on the soccer team at soccer.

QB's, RB's, WR's, DB's and some LB's and TE's. Yeah, that would be exactly what I would say.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

It's almost like you're saying if the football jocks practiced enough, they'd easily beat the nerds on the soccer team at soccer.

QB's, RB's, WR's, DB's and some LB's and TE's. Yeah, that would be exactly what I would say.

If they started playing by age 8 instead of football then I'd be in agreement.

However, Jester Weah is the opposite of this. Good, but not great (surprisingly considering Uncle George is one of the best ever and cousin Tim is on the books at PSG) soccer player who went out for football his senior year and has a shot at the NFL. This is a lifelong soccer player with some of the best soccer bloodlines you can have who had a better shot at the NFL than a crap league like MLS.........soooooooo

 

[Pittfan85]

QB's, RB's, WR's, DB's and some LB's and TE's. Yeah, that would be exactly what I would say.

That is an incredibly stupid stance to have.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

And there are no good options out there to replace him.

Honestly, I don't think they should be looking for a full time replacement right now. Because I agree, the options right now aren't that good. They will be much better at this time next year. I would be fine if they gave the job to someone like Ramos right now on a short term contract and used the next year or so as a tryout of sorts to see if he has what it takes. Then, at this time next year you see who is out there and who is interested and you make the long term decision then.

 

[Pitt79]

QB's, RB's, WR's, DB's and some LB's and TE's. Yeah, that would be exactly what I would say.

A few, but some would fail. Many would fail.

 

[Pitt79]

If they started playing by age 8 instead of football then I'd be in agreement.

However, Jester Weah is the opposite of this. Good, but not great (surprisingly considering Uncle George is one of the best ever and cousin Tim is on the books at PSG) soccer player who went out for football his senior year and has a shot at the NFL. This is a lifelong soccer player with some of the best soccer bloodlines you can have who had a better shot at the NFL than a crap league like MLS.........soooooooo

That's the thing, some would end up great at soccer, but just as likely many would fail, and also, some kids that are great athletic soccer players, could have been in the NFL if they had played football from age 8.