2018 US News Undergrad rankings (Pitt holds steady)

[CrazyPaco]

The new US News undergrad rankings are out. Regardless of what you think of them, or how stupid some parts of the methodology is, there is no avoiding the fact that they are influential.

Pitt held steady this year at #68 among national universities and #24 among public universities. However, this is the 6th straight year without any improvement in Pitt's standing. Although the methodology has changed over the years, for the worse IMO, making it hard to compare current results to historical results, the current ranking is down from Pitt's all-time high water mark of #56 in the 2010 (released fall 2009) rankings. Keep in mind that the current rankings use last academic year's data, so the current rankings are evaluating 2016-17.

Pitt's undergraduate business school ranking is up 7 spots this year to #31 (which is up from #41 six years ago). This also places Pitt's undergraduate business in the top 20 of all public schools. A jump of 10 overall spots is an excellent improvement over the last six years.

Pitt engineering is also up one spot from last year to #49 (but down one spot #48 six years ago). So Swanson undergrad is essentially holding steady over the last six years.

And the ACC easily retains the crown as the conference with both the best mean and median ranking of all member schools among FBS conferences. I'll post additional numbers below.

 

[CrazyPaco]

The new US News undergrad rankings are out. Regardless of what you think of them, or how stupid some parts of the methodology is, there is no avoiding the fact that they are influential.

Pitt held steady this year at #68 among national universities and #24 among public universities. However, this is the 6th straight year without any improvement in Pitt's standing. Although the methodology has changed over the years, for the worse IMO, making it hard to compare current results to historical results, the current ranking is down from Pitt's all-time high water mark of #56 in the 2010 (released fall 2009) rankings. Keep in mind that the current rankings use last academic year's data, so the current rankings are evaluating 2016-17.

Pitt's undergraduate business school ranking is up 7 spots this year to #31 (which is up from #41 six years ago). This also places Pitt's undergraduate business in the top 20 of all public schools. A jump of 10 overall spots is an excellent improvement over the last six years.

Pitt engineering is also up one spot from last year to #49 (but down one spot #48 six years ago). So Swanson undergrad is essentially holding steady over the last six years.

And the ACC easily retains the crown as the conference with both the best mean and median ranking of all member schools among FBS conferences. I'll post additional numbers below.

Here's the ACC's US News rankings for their overall undergraduate programs. Included are one year and 5 year ranking movements so you can see the wobble or trends.

Rank, School, 1 year move*, 5 year move*
9. Duke, -1, =
18. Notre Dame, -3, -1
25. Virginia, -1, -1
27. Wake Forest, =, =
30. North Carolina, =, =
32. Boston College, -1, -1
34. Georgia Tech, =, +2
46. Miami, -2, -2
61. Syracuse, -1, -3
67. Clemson -1, +1
68. Pitt, =, -10
69. Virginia Tech, +5, +3
81. Florida State, +11, +16
81. NC State, +11, +25
165. Louisville, +6, -5

*+ is a better ranking, - is a worse ranking, = no movement


Here's the mean and median average ranking for the P5 conferences (again with 1 & 5 year trends, current membership used for all years):
ACC mean 54.2, +1.5, +1.5
ACC median 46.0, -2, -2
Big10 mean 62.2, -1.3, -3.9
Big10 median 58.5, +1.5, +3.0
Pac12 mean 79.3, +1.6, +2.5
Pac12 median 96.5, +1, +9.5
SEC mean 102.4, -0.1, -3.7
SEC median 106.5, -1.5, -7.5
B12 mean 120, -0.5, -6.9
B12 median 115, -0.5, -11.5


Here's the rankings of all P5 member schools:

5. Stanford
9. Duke
11. Northwestern
14. Vanderbilt
18. Notre Dame
21. USC
21. Cal-Berkeley
21. UCLA
25. Virginia
27. Wake Forest
28. Michigan
30. North Carolina
32. Boston College
34. Georgia Tech
42. Florida
46. Miami
46. Wisconsin
52. Illinois
52. Penn State
54. Ohio State
54. Georgia
56. Purdue
56. Washington
56. Texas
61. Syracuse
61. Maryland
67. Clemson
68. Pitt
69. Virginia Tech
69. Minnesota
69. Rutgers
69. Texas A&M
75. Baylor
78. Iowa
78. TCU
81. Florida State
81. NC State
81. Michigan St
90. Indiana
90. Colorado
97. Oklahoma
103. Oregon
103. Auburn
103. South Carolina
103. Tennessee
110. Utah
110. Alabama
115. Arizona St
115. Iowa St
115. Kansas
120. Missouri
124. Nebraska
124. Arizona
133. LSU
133. Arkansas
133. Kentucky
140. Washington St
145. Oregon St
145. Mississippi
145. Kansas St
156. Oklahoma St
165. Louisville
171. Mississippi St
176. Texas Tech
187. West Virginia

 

[LivinWell]

Hard to believe that Penn State is ranked so high given there lower admission standards at University Park and the invasion of branch campus students there junior year. There test scores are much lower diluting the entire student body. Endowment ranking? About equal. What gives?

 

[CrazyPaco]

Hard to believe that Penn State is ranked so high given there lower admission standards at University Park and the invasion of branch campus students there junior year. There test scores are much lower diluting the entire student body. Endowment ranking? About equal. What gives?

Mostly, straight up arbitrary reputation scores and the even worse guidance counselor ranking component. The impact of the admission criteria component has been reduced over the years as well. PSU alumni donate at a higher clip. PSU does better getting their students graduated in 6 years. All those branch campus transfers...which are like half the students at University Park...don't factor into the rankings at all.

 

[rschwartz_armdise]

The new US News undergrad rankings are out. Regardless of what you think of them, or how stupid some parts of the methodology is, there is no avoiding the fact that they are influential.

Pitt held steady this year at #68 among national universities and #24 among public universities. However, this is the 6th straight year without any improvement in Pitt's standing. Although the methodology has changed over the years, for the worse IMO, making it hard to compare current results to historical results, the current ranking is down from Pitt's all-time high water mark of #56 in the 2010 (released fall 2009) rankings. Keep in mind that the current rankings use last academic year's data, so the current rankings are evaluating 2016-17.

Pitt's undergraduate business school ranking is up 7 spots this year to #31 (which is up from #41 six years ago). This also places Pitt's undergraduate business in the top 20 of all public schools. A jump of 10 overall spots is an excellent improvement over the last six years.

Pitt engineering is also up one spot from last year to #49 (but down one spot #48 six years ago). So Swanson undergrad is essentially holding steady over the last six years.

And the ACC easily retains the crown as the conference with both the best mean and median ranking of all member schools among FBS conferences. I'll post additional numbers below.

Pitt

 

[bwh05]

So Clemson is a better school than us apparently. That just seems off.

 

[CrazyPaco]

So Clemson is a better school than us apparently. That just seems off.

Remember, this is undergrad only...and one spot is really minuscule difference in scores. You also have to consider the methodology (for instance consider Clemson is #56 in guidance counselor rankings and Pitt is #90 and think about why Pitt is so low).

I've attended and taught at some of the schools ahead of Pitt. They aren't better, but they are better at marketing themselves and unapologetically game the methodology.

 

[LivinWell]

It seems like employer feedback would be better that HS guidance counsellors. What do they know about the quality of a school other than the scores needed to get in?

 

[Pitt_Boss]

Yeah, I refuse to believe Miami, Syracuse and Clemson are better school than Pitt and Virginia Tech. And the last people's opinion that should matter are HS guidance counselors who were likely low-achieiving students themselves.

 

[CrazyPaco]

It seems like employer feedback would be better that HS guidance counsellors. What do they know about the quality of a school other than the scores needed to get in?

Most don't even know the entry scores and they aren't looking them up when filling out a survey. They know only what they are familiar with...where they went to school, and they've likely have only ever attended one school, studied one field while there, and taught at zero.

Why do you think US News added guidance counselor survey results as a component to the overall rankings? Think that they want guidance counselors to feel like a stakeholder in these rankings? They're a conduit to the target market they are looking to sell to and keep this publication relevant for. This ranking is US News' biggest money maker.

Now think about how these people are surveyed....it is pretty much regional high schools counselors ranking their regional schools. You can start to imagine how Pitt is disadvantaged here in Pennsylvania. Part of it is simple demographics and alumni status of these counselors, some is the crowded higher ed market in PA, and part of it is definitely on Pitt and its decades of terrible marketing.

If you looked at the actual components of the ranking that relied on quantitative (not qualitative) data, you'd think Pitt would place in the top 50. Same is true for schools with similarly ranked graduate programs, you'd think Pitt would be in the top 40.

All of that said, it is really hard to compare universities with such disparate characteristics and missions for something as broad as undergraduate education. Of the few rankings that attempt to do this, US News actually has one of the better methodologies, which tells you how poor some of the other ones are.

 

[TD_istheman]

So we sold out football for academics, and we can't even do that right!

 

[HOF Coach]

So we sold out football for academics, and we can't even do that right!

 

[Panthergrowl13]

As Paco said this US News ranking is primarily for undergraduate programs.

US News has a second publication "Americas Best Graduate Schools" which ranks Graduate Programs.

In this ranking Pitt's Graduate Programs rank well.

As an example, all of Pitt's Health Science Programs (Medicine, Pharmacy, Physical Therapy, Occupational Therapy, Nursing, Clinical Psychology etc.) all rank in the Top 20 in the Nation.

To put this in perspective, the only Medical School ranked higher than Pitt's Med School in the ACC is Duke, and the only Med School ranked higher than Pitt's Med School in the B1G is Michigan.

These are the facts that the Pitt administration needs to advertise to better market themselves.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!