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Bowl experience thoughts

Sean Miller Fan

Lair Hall of Famer
Oct 30, 2001
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I have said many times that I think bowl games are stupid for many reasons. I always like watching Pitt play in bowl games but not because its a bowl, just simply because I enjoy watching Pitt play. There are many reasons I feel this way, with the biggest being the fact that bowls are legalized scams and it p***** me off to no end that the NCAA outsources their football post-seasons to these corrupt organizations.

Bowls are 501C non-profits. They make money through ticket sales, sponsorships, and their TV contract, so what do they do with all the money? They donate a small amount to charities or their own charitable fund but the vast majority goes to pay 1 or 2 bowl executives. These CEOs of these non-profits make anywhere from 300K to 600K to put on 1 football game a year. Think about how easy of a job that is. An intelligent middle school student could do that. I totally hate that there are many people getting rich off staging 1 football game. Its a total scam. So, I threw up in my stomach a little bit when they interviewed the Military Bowl CEO and they asked him what Christmas is like for him with the bowl game so close and he said "I guess I'll celebrate it tomorrow." For half a million, for a job requiring no more than 200 hours of work per year, I think we'd all celebrate Christmas on Dec 29.

OK, with that out of the way, I do admit the Annapolis trip changed my feelings just a bit about bowl games. I still think they are corrupt scams but being there with the most Pitt fans I've ever seen at a non-Pittsburgh based event was pretty cool to say the least. The weather in Annapolis on Sunday was unbelievable. 71 degrees......even at night. I was walking around in shorts and a t-shirt. Being on the water, it really felt like Florida so it made me think how neat it would be to go to a good Florida bowl. The reality, though, is 90% of bowl games are cold-weather bowls. Some may be 40 or 50 degrees. Really only the FL bowls plus the SD, LA, and AZ bowls are warm weather.

I've never seen Pitt fans travel like that. The entire town of Annapolis was covered with Pitt fans. Every bar, restaurant, gift shop, etc. It made me feel like what it must be like to be a fan of a diploma mill who travels tens of thousands to road games and bowl games. Its a pretty cool feeling and it was good to see. Our hotel was filled with Pitt fans. I heard the receptionist comment to a coworker how many check-ins she had to do. A local Annapolis resident who asked me at the parade "where is Pitt," commented how many of our fans we brought. I head another local comment that for a minor bowl game, he couldn't believe the place was packed as he was expecting 15-20K.

The parade was nice and had a pretty good turnout despite colder weather in the morning. Main St was lined with Pitt and Navy flags. Annapolis is a great bowl town. I've never been there and have always heard nice things but its truly one of the nicest small towns you could ever visit. Its got that college town feel mixed in with the touristy and historical stuff. Honestly, I was surprised of how collegiate the town felt. Lots of Navy souvenir stores. Lots of cool shops and restaurants that you often see in college towns. I guess the best way I can put it is that Annapolis felt more like a college town than a military town.

All this made the build-up to the game exciting. It didn't have the feel of a Tier 2 bowl game. They had skydivers and a flyover before the game and Miss America singing the National Anthem. Her mic went off and the entire crowd sang it while the mic was off. I got goosebumps then and now while I'm typing it. It was a really cool moment and being there in that moment, singing that song, made me very proud to be an American. So, by kick, Pitt fans were fired up like crazy. There was a buzz. There was excitement. Honestly, I cant remember the last time I was that fired up for a Pitt game. Its been a long time since I've gone to a game with that buzz. Part of that was because the stadium was packed. Now, it only seats 34K and I don't want to turn this into a stadium thread but 34K in that stadium was absolutely electric. 34K in a 70K seat stadium makes you want to fall asleep. It had the feel of like a conference championship game and in a way, it was, playing for the Championship of the Northeast. One side all Navy. The other side all Pitt. And when Henderson took that kick back, Pitt fans were delirious. Then, Navy got the ball and it was over.

The game, obviously, was disappointing but I cant help but think that maybe the experience helped change the travel culture a bit. I will never go to El Paso or a Dec. 26 bowl unless I can drive it the day of the game but I look forward to the next bowl. I think Pitt showed that if its not in El Paso or Shreverport and not Dec 26, we will buy a lot of tickets and hopefully some of these bowls realize this for next year. Pitt has had mediocre teams playing in far-flung bowl games on terrible dates.

Hopefully, our turnout changed the perception.....but again, fan travel should not determine the quality of your bowl game but when you outsource your postseason to scam artists, you have to live with that.
 
A 50k stadium would be perfect for us. Just tarp off the upper deck of the side opposite the camera. Pretty simple.
 
Agreed. Bowls should be eliminated and the NCAA should have their own post season games. Trouble is the bowls are now very powerful and the NCAA is scared they would lose complete control of their top revenue source. Maybe Obama can help ?
 
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I have said many times that I think bowl games are stupid for many reasons. I always like watching Pitt play in bowl games but not because its a bowl, just simply because I enjoy watching Pitt play. There are many reasons I feel this way, with the biggest being the fact that bowls are legalized scams and it p***** me off to no end that the NCAA outsources their football post-seasons to these corrupt organizations.

Bowls are 501C non-profits. They make money through ticket sales, sponsorships, and their TV contract, so what do they do with all the money? They donate a small amount to charities or their own charitable fund but the vast majority goes to pay 1 or 2 bowl executives. These CEOs of these non-profits make anywhere from 300K to 600K to put on 1 football game a year. Think about how easy of a job that is. An intelligent middle school student could do that. I totally hate that there are many people getting rich off staging 1 football game. Its a total scam. So, I threw up in my stomach a little bit when they interviewed the Military Bowl CEO and they asked him what Christmas is like for him with the bowl game so close and he said "I guess I'll celebrate it tomorrow." For half a million, for a job requiring no more than 200 hours of work per year, I think we'd all celebrate Christmas on Dec 29.

OK, with that out of the way, I do admit the Annapolis trip changed my feelings just a bit about bowl games. I still think they are corrupt scams but being there with the most Pitt fans I've ever seen at a non-Pittsburgh based event was pretty cool to say the least. The weather in Annapolis on Sunday was unbelievable. 71 degrees......even at night. I was walking around in shorts and a t-shirt. Being on the water, it really felt like Florida so it made me think how neat it would be to go to a good Florida bowl. The reality, though, is 90% of bowl games are cold-weather bowls. Some may be 40 or 50 degrees. Really only the FL bowls plus the SD, LA, and AZ bowls are warm weather.

I've never seen Pitt fans travel like that. The entire town of Annapolis was covered with Pitt fans. Every bar, restaurant, gift shop, etc. It made me feel like what it must be like to be a fan of a diploma mill who travels tens of thousands to road games and bowl games. Its a pretty cool feeling and it was good to see. Our hotel was filled with Pitt fans. I heard the receptionist comment to a coworker how many check-ins she had to do. A local Annapolis resident who asked me at the parade "where is Pitt," commented how many of our fans we brought. I head another local comment that for a minor bowl game, he couldn't believe the place was packed as he was expecting 15-20K.

The parade was nice and had a pretty good turnout despite colder weather in the morning. Main St was lined with Pitt and Navy flags. Annapolis is a great bowl town. I've never been there and have always heard nice things but its truly one of the nicest small towns you could ever visit. Its got that college town feel mixed in with the touristy and historical stuff. Honestly, I was surprised of how collegiate the town felt. Lots of Navy souvenir stores. Lots of cool shops and restaurants that you often see in college towns. I guess the best way I can put it is that Annapolis felt more like a college town than a military town.

All this made the build-up to the game exciting. It didn't have the feel of a Tier 2 bowl game. They had skydivers and a flyover before the game and Miss America singing the National Anthem. Her mic went off and the entire crowd sang it while the mic was off. I got goosebumps then and now while I'm typing it. It was a really cool moment and being there in that moment, singing that song, made me very proud to be an American. So, by kick, Pitt fans were fired up like crazy. There was a buzz. There was excitement. Honestly, I cant remember the last time I was that fired up for a Pitt game. Its been a long time since I've gone to a game with that buzz. Part of that was because the stadium was packed. Now, it only seats 34K and I don't want to turn this into a stadium thread but 34K in that stadium was absolutely electric. 34K in a 70K seat stadium makes you want to fall asleep. It had the feel of like a conference championship game and in a way, it was, playing for the Championship of the Northeast. One side all Navy. The other side all Pitt. And when Henderson took that kick back, Pitt fans were delirious. Then, Navy got the ball and it was over.

The game, obviously, was disappointing but I cant help but think that maybe the experience helped change the travel culture a bit. I will never go to El Paso or a Dec. 26 bowl unless I can drive it the day of the game but I look forward to the next bowl. I think Pitt showed that if its not in El Paso or Shreverport and not Dec 26, we will buy a lot of tickets and hopefully some of these bowls realize this for next year. Pitt has had mediocre teams playing in far-flung bowl games on terrible dates.

Hopefully, our turnout changed the perception.....but again, fan travel should not determine the quality of your bowl game but when you outsource your postseason to scam artists, you have to live with that.

I echo your thoughts, mostly.

The game itself was a dud for Pitt...... but the alumni tailgate party was fantastic. 3000+ Pitt fans under a giant tent with booze, food, and music. That was fun.

Sunday night in town was awesome as well. Very warm weather and crawling with Pitt fans everywhere.

The stadium was definitely small-time as far as amenities.... not enough bathrooms, concessions, or souvenirs.... but the atmosphere really was electric. Taking over half of an opponent's stadium was very cool.

Even with the loss, this bowl and this year felt "different". Good times ahead.
 
You don't understand, Tourism is still the Number 1 Employer in the world and US Sports Contribute to its health and wealth and Bowls came about to make money for those cities Hotel, Restaurants and Travel Businesses!

Sports also cause changes in cultures, integration and breakdowns old societal prejudices and the gaming business on Sports Books is over $500 Billion A Year!

Bowls still are the Milk of College Football now joined by TV Contracts and Sponsors pay for much of the opportunity to bring those games to various cities. Attendance is becoming less important but needed for excitement!

The CFB Playoffs bringing in $200 Million alone!

This economic impact theme was an underlining concept mention in the recent concussion Movie made in Pittsburgh! The High Schools, Colleges, and Pro Sports of Football is pretty big business and if kids quit playing a major impact can happen on these games and tourism?

One reason why Terrorists attack Hotel, Airlines, Sporting Events and Tourism in all nations especially the developing ones is because they employ many people undermine that culture and economic interests, following in the roots why Mohammed attacked the economic interests of the Caravans of Mecca!
 
Agreed. Bowls should be eliminated and the NCAA should have their own post season games. Trouble is the bowls are now very powerful and the NCAA is scared they would lose complete control of their top revenue source. Maybe Obama can help ?

Bowls are powerful because the NCAA allows them to be. The NCAA can outlaw private bowl games tomorrow and completely control its own post-season if they wanted. They could call up 30-40 stadiums (same stadiums where bowls are currently played) and ask them if they want to host an NCAA-owned and NCAA-controlled bowl game. Those stadiums will not say no.
 
I have said many times that I think bowl games are stupid for many reasons. I always like watching Pitt play in bowl games but not because its a bowl, just simply because I enjoy watching Pitt play. There are many reasons I feel this way, with the biggest being the fact that bowls are legalized scams and it p***** me off to no end that the NCAA outsources their football post-seasons to these corrupt organizations.

Bowls are 501C non-profits. They make money through ticket sales, sponsorships, and their TV contract, so what do they do with all the money? They donate a small amount to charities or their own charitable fund but the vast majority goes to pay 1 or 2 bowl executives. These CEOs of these non-profits make anywhere from 300K to 600K to put on 1 football game a year. Think about how easy of a job that is. An intelligent middle school student could do that. I totally hate that there are many people getting rich off staging 1 football game. Its a total scam. So, I threw up in my stomach a little bit when they interviewed the Military Bowl CEO and they asked him what Christmas is like for him with the bowl game so close and he said "I guess I'll celebrate it tomorrow." For half a million, for a job requiring no more than 200 hours of work per year, I think we'd all celebrate Christmas on Dec 29.

OK, with that out of the way, I do admit the Annapolis trip changed my feelings just a bit about bowl games. I still think they are corrupt scams but being there with the most Pitt fans I've ever seen at a non-Pittsburgh based event was pretty cool to say the least. The weather in Annapolis on Sunday was unbelievable. 71 degrees......even at night. I was walking around in shorts and a t-shirt. Being on the water, it really felt like Florida so it made me think how neat it would be to go to a good Florida bowl. The reality, though, is 90% of bowl games are cold-weather bowls. Some may be 40 or 50 degrees. Really only the FL bowls plus the SD, LA, and AZ bowls are warm weather.

I've never seen Pitt fans travel like that. The entire town of Annapolis was covered with Pitt fans. Every bar, restaurant, gift shop, etc. It made me feel like what it must be like to be a fan of a diploma mill who travels tens of thousands to road games and bowl games. Its a pretty cool feeling and it was good to see. Our hotel was filled with Pitt fans. I heard the receptionist comment to a coworker how many check-ins she had to do. A local Annapolis resident who asked me at the parade "where is Pitt," commented how many of our fans we brought. I head another local comment that for a minor bowl game, he couldn't believe the place was packed as he was expecting 15-20K.

The parade was nice and had a pretty good turnout despite colder weather in the morning. Main St was lined with Pitt and Navy flags. Annapolis is a great bowl town. I've never been there and have always heard nice things but its truly one of the nicest small towns you could ever visit. Its got that college town feel mixed in with the touristy and historical stuff. Honestly, I was surprised of how collegiate the town felt. Lots of Navy souvenir stores. Lots of cool shops and restaurants that you often see in college towns. I guess the best way I can put it is that Annapolis felt more like a college town than a military town.

All this made the build-up to the game exciting. It didn't have the feel of a Tier 2 bowl game. They had skydivers and a flyover before the game and Miss America singing the National Anthem. Her mic went off and the entire crowd sang it while the mic was off. I got goosebumps then and now while I'm typing it. It was a really cool moment and being there in that moment, singing that song, made me very proud to be an American. So, by kick, Pitt fans were fired up like crazy. There was a buzz. There was excitement. Honestly, I cant remember the last time I was that fired up for a Pitt game. Its been a long time since I've gone to a game with that buzz. Part of that was because the stadium was packed. Now, it only seats 34K and I don't want to turn this into a stadium thread but 34K in that stadium was absolutely electric. 34K in a 70K seat stadium makes you want to fall asleep. It had the feel of like a conference championship game and in a way, it was, playing for the Championship of the Northeast. One side all Navy. The other side all Pitt. And when Henderson took that kick back, Pitt fans were delirious. Then, Navy got the ball and it was over.

The game, obviously, was disappointing but I cant help but think that maybe the experience helped change the travel culture a bit. I will never go to El Paso or a Dec. 26 bowl unless I can drive it the day of the game but I look forward to the next bowl. I think Pitt showed that if its not in El Paso or Shreverport and not Dec 26, we will buy a lot of tickets and hopefully some of these bowls realize this for next year. Pitt has had mediocre teams playing in far-flung bowl games on terrible dates.

Hopefully, our turnout changed the perception.....but again, fan travel should not determine the quality of your bowl game but when you outsource your postseason to scam artists, you have to live with that.

I agree with your bowl game thoughts up until Pitt returned the opening kickoff. After the game I was really down - so much so that if you asked me right now, I'd say I never want to go to another bowl game.

But the day after the game, before driving home, the wife and I did a guided tour of the Naval Academy. That helped my frame of mind somewhat.

Pitt beating the Orange helped some too...

Go Pitt.
 
I agree with your bowl game thoughts up until Pitt returned the opening kickoff. After the game I was really down - so much so that if you asked me right now, I'd say I never want to go to another bowl game.

But the day after the game, before driving home, the wife and I did a guided tour of the Naval Academy. That helped my frame of mind somewhat.

Pitt beating the Orange helped some too...

Go Pitt.

We were going to tour the Academy before driving home Tuesday but I was too depressed and didnt want to be reminded that we were manhandled by a group of men who truly put football third behind country and school.
 
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Bowls are powerful because the NCAA allows them to be. The NCAA can outlaw private bowl games tomorrow and completely control its own post-season if they wanted. They could call up 30-40 stadiums (same stadiums where bowls are currently played) and ask them if they want to host an NCAA-owned and NCAA-controlled bowl game. Those stadiums will not say no.
Nope, the NCAA has control over the Basketball Tournament because Conferences and Teams allow it, but not the Bowls!

The NCAA lost in the Supreme Court over Property Rights in Football! The Schools decide and have them not the NCAA! This is why the BCS once control the Top Bowls and now College Football Playoff Committee not the NCAA!


In reality, the Free Market decides the Bowls in most cities and NCAA is just going to start looking at it, but does not have control! Each University has its own Property Rights and where and how they assign them gets to use them in exchange for money by contracts and assignments, but does not own or control them and the NCAA is limited by this Ruling!

A good read for you:
http://www.courant.com/sports/college/hc-cutting-back-bowls-1210-20151209-story.html
"The NCAA has largely removed itself from the bowl business, allowing conferences, communities and television networks to create postseason games. The NCAA is not looking to take control of the bowls, but everyone agrees adjustments are needed."
 
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Nope, the NCAA has control over the Basketball Tournament because Conferences and Teams allow it, but not the Bowls!

The NCAA literally is the conferences and teams so that statement doesnt make sense. They run every other postseason in every division. There is no reason, none at all, that they HAVE TO outsoruce the D1 postseason. They do because the NCAA allows them to, primarily because of the lobbying (ie bribes) that the bowl coalition lobbying group does. There's 50-75 old men getting very wealthy off this system and they have to ensure it continues. Its disgusting.
 
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"Sean Miller Fan, post: 694283, member: 704"]The NCAA literally is the conferences and teams so that statement doesnt make sense.
No it is not and go read the Supreme Court Ruling. The Universities own and control their Property Rights and can assign them! Not the NCAA!

The NCAA is Non-Profit Association so long as the Universities want to associate with it and most do because it is a workable organization!


They run every other postseason in every division. There is no reason, none at all, that they HAVE TO outsoruce the D1 postseason. They do because the NCAA allows them to, primarily because of the lobbying (ie bribes) that the bowl coalition lobbying group does. There's 50-75 old men getting very wealthy off this system and they have to ensure it continues. Its disgusting.
Just wrong! The NCAA also once tried to control Coaching Salaries and lost that case too!
 
"Sean Miller Fan, post: 694283, member: 704"]The NCAA literally is the conferences and teams so that statement doesnt make sense.
No it is not and go read the Supreme Court Ruling. The Universities own and control their Property Rights and can assign them! Not the NCAA!

The NCAA is Non-Profit Association so long as the Universities want to associate with it and most do because it is a workable organization!


They run every other postseason in every division. There is no reason, none at all, that they HAVE TO outsoruce the D1 postseason. They do because the NCAA allows them to, primarily because of the lobbying (ie bribes) that the bowl coalition lobbying group does. There's 50-75 old men getting very wealthy off this system and they have to ensure it continues. Its disgusting.
Just wrong! The NCAA also once tried to control Coaching Salaries and lost that case too!

I am saying the NCAA (ie all the schools) can take a vote tomorrow to stop outsourcing its postseason. Pitt can vote yes or no as a member of the NCAA.

By the same token, if they think outsourcing is such a great thing, they can similarly vote to outsource the bball postseason.

The NCAA is its members. If the members want to control the postseason and keep all the money instead of letting these bowl execs make hundreds of thousands, they could do it.
 
"Sean Miller Fan, post: 694364, member: 704"]I am saying the NCAA (ie all the schools) can take a vote tomorrow to stop outsourcing its postseason.
Good luck with that belief but if they could they would, and won't and can't without the approval of the Universities. They will put up a study Committee and make suggestions but they do not own or control any property rights of any university.

Pitt can vote yes or no as a member of the NCAA. By the same token, if they think outsourcing is such a great thing, they can similarly vote to outsource the bball postseason.
The FBS Power Conferences can leave the NCAA anytime they choose and the NCAA cannot do anything about it, get a clue! This has been talked about and why the NCAA Voting was changed and the NCAA other Divisions no longer have the same power they had before with one equal vote because it no longer exists. The Universities that own their Property Rights make the Gold and the one has the Gold Rules!

The NCAA again IS a Non-Profit Association and good way for all schools to work on collective matters together, but does not Own Any Property Rights and only so long as FBS Power Conferences made up of the Schools want to associate with them they will use it as place to regulate all schools that belong to it.


The NCAA is its members. If the members want to control the postseason and keep all the money instead of letting these bowl execs make hundreds of thousands, they could do it.
The Membership is made up of the Universities that own the Property rights and assign them and work as an "Association" so long as they want it that way. Read the Link Articles and Supreme Court Cases!

National Collegiate Athletic "ASSOCIATION"!

There has been talk about the Power Conference Schools forming a "For Profit League" under each University in those Conferences, and that would be without the NCAA and set up their own Organization and that would badly hurt the NCAA Econoimically and remaining over 1,000 Member Schools!

The Power Conferences have been controlling the Bowl Season and get over 90% on that income goes to the Power Conferences and the NCAA accepts it place because they cannot do anything about anymore after the 1980s Supreme Court Rulings!

You don't know the history, and at one time the NCAA did bully Universities on what and where and whom and how they would allow what Schools to play on TV and in Bowls, but Georgia and Oklahoma challenged them and the NCAA lost in the Supreme Court and ruled Property Rights belong solely to each University and they only they own and can assign them as they want to and TV Networks love it and more money was made and then Conference TV Networks were formed and more money was made, and Bowls expanded and more money was made! There are 128 FBS Football Programs but the Power Conferences Members get over 90% the most money from Bowls!

At anytime of their choosing the 5 Power Conferences can also take away the NCAA Rights to run the March Madness if they so choose and there are 300 Schools that participate in that Tournament as assigned to the NCAA to run it, that is why it is called, The NCAA Basketball Tournament and the NCAA contracts with CBS and others to show the games and then shares the money with schools that make the Tournament.
 
"Sean Miller Fan, post: 694364, member: 704"]I am saying the NCAA (ie all the schools) can take a vote tomorrow to stop outsourcing its postseason.
Good luck with that belief but if they could they would, and won't and can't without the approval of the Universities. They will put up a study Committee and make suggestions but they do not own or control any property rights of any university.

Pitt can vote yes or no as a member of the NCAA. By the same token, if they think outsourcing is such a great thing, they can similarly vote to outsource the bball postseason.
The FBS Power Conferences can leave the NCAA anytime they choose and the NCAA cannot do anything about it, get a clue! This has been talked about and why the NCAA Voting was changed and the NCAA other Divisions no longer have the same power they had before with one equal vote because it no longer exists. The Universities that own their Property Rights make the Gold and the one has the Gold Rules!

The NCAA again IS a Non-Profit Association and good way for all schools to work on collective matters together, but does not Own Any Property Rights and only so long as FBS Power Conferences made up of the Schools want to associate with them they will use it as place to regulate all schools that belong to it.


The NCAA is its members. If the members want to control the postseason and keep all the money instead of letting these bowl execs make hundreds of thousands, they could do it.
The Membership is made up of the Universities that own the Property rights and assign them and work as an "Association" so long as they want it that way. Read the Link Articles and Supreme Court Cases!

National Collegiate Athletic "ASSOCIATION"!

There has been talk about the Power Conference Schools forming a "For Profit League" under each University in those Conferences, and that would be without the NCAA and set up their own Organization and that would badly hurt the NCAA Econoimically and remaining over 1,000 Member Schools!

The Power Conferences have been controlling the Bowl Season and get over 90% on that income goes to the Power Conferences and the NCAA accepts it place because they cannot do anything about anymore after the 1980s Supreme Court Rulings!

You don't know the history, and at one time the NCAA did bully Universities on what and where and whom and how they would allow what Schools to play on TV and in Bowls, but Georgia and Oklahoma challenged them and the NCAA lost in the Supreme Court and ruled Property Rights belong solely to each University and they only they own and can assign them as they want to and TV Networks love it and more money was made and then Conference TV Networks were formed and more money was made, and Bowls expanded and more money was made! There are 128 FBS Football Programs but the Power Conferences Members get over 90% the most money from Bowls!

At anytime of their choosing the 5 Power Conferences can also take away the NCAA Rights to run the March Madness if they so choose and there are 300 Schools that participate in that Tournament as assigned to the NCAA to run it, that is why it is called, The NCAA Basketball Tournament and the NCAA contracts wit CBS and others to show the games.

The 128 D1 football schools can do whatever they want. They are the NCAA. If they voted to have their football teams play cornhole instead of bowl games, they coud do it. They just need the votes.
 
The 128 D1 football schools can do whatever they want. They are the NCAA. If they voted to have their football teams play cornhole instead of bowl games, they coud do it. They just need the votes.
SMF, I enjoy your post and reading them and respect them....let me put your words another way,.....The 65 FBS (Former DI) Power Conference Football Schools can do whatever they want. They use the NCAA to do their bidding and have far more votes now in the way the NCAA changed the Rules and without their money making the NCAA would not be the same and many of them are making big money too!
 
I have said many times that I think bowl games are stupid for many reasons. I always like watching Pitt play in bowl games but not because its a bowl, just simply because I enjoy watching Pitt play. There are many reasons I feel this way, with the biggest being the fact that bowls are legalized scams and it p***** me off to no end that the NCAA outsources their football post-seasons to these corrupt organizations.

Bowls are 501C non-profits. They make money through ticket sales, sponsorships, and their TV contract, so what do they do with all the money? They donate a small amount to charities or their own charitable fund but the vast majority goes to pay 1 or 2 bowl executives. These CEOs of these non-profits make anywhere from 300K to 600K to put on 1 football game a year. Think about how easy of a job that is. An intelligent middle school student could do that. I totally hate that there are many people getting rich off staging 1 football game. Its a total scam. So, I threw up in my stomach a little bit when they interviewed the Military Bowl CEO and they asked him what Christmas is like for him with the bowl game so close and he said "I guess I'll celebrate it tomorrow." For half a million, for a job requiring no more than 200 hours of work per year, I think we'd all celebrate Christmas on Dec 29.

OK, with that out of the way, I do admit the Annapolis trip changed my feelings just a bit about bowl games. I still think they are corrupt scams but being there with the most Pitt fans I've ever seen at a non-Pittsburgh based event was pretty cool to say the least. The weather in Annapolis on Sunday was unbelievable. 71 degrees......even at night. I was walking around in shorts and a t-shirt. Being on the water, it really felt like Florida so it made me think how neat it would be to go to a good Florida bowl. The reality, though, is 90% of bowl games are cold-weather bowls. Some may be 40 or 50 degrees. Really only the FL bowls plus the SD, LA, and AZ bowls are warm weather.

I've never seen Pitt fans travel like that. The entire town of Annapolis was covered with Pitt fans. Every bar, restaurant, gift shop, etc. It made me feel like what it must be like to be a fan of a diploma mill who travels tens of thousands to road games and bowl games. Its a pretty cool feeling and it was good to see. Our hotel was filled with Pitt fans. I heard the receptionist comment to a coworker how many check-ins she had to do. A local Annapolis resident who asked me at the parade "where is Pitt," commented how many of our fans we brought. I head another local comment that for a minor bowl game, he couldn't believe the place was packed as he was expecting 15-20K.

The parade was nice and had a pretty good turnout despite colder weather in the morning. Main St was lined with Pitt and Navy flags. Annapolis is a great bowl town. I've never been there and have always heard nice things but its truly one of the nicest small towns you could ever visit. Its got that college town feel mixed in with the touristy and historical stuff. Honestly, I was surprised of how collegiate the town felt. Lots of Navy souvenir stores. Lots of cool shops and restaurants that you often see in college towns. I guess the best way I can put it is that Annapolis felt more like a college town than a military town.

All this made the build-up to the game exciting. It didn't have the feel of a Tier 2 bowl game. They had skydivers and a flyover before the game and Miss America singing the National Anthem. Her mic went off and the entire crowd sang it while the mic was off. I got goosebumps then and now while I'm typing it. It was a really cool moment and being there in that moment, singing that song, made me very proud to be an American. So, by kick, Pitt fans were fired up like crazy. There was a buzz. There was excitement. Honestly, I cant remember the last time I was that fired up for a Pitt game. Its been a long time since I've gone to a game with that buzz. Part of that was because the stadium was packed. Now, it only seats 34K and I don't want to turn this into a stadium thread but 34K in that stadium was absolutely electric. 34K in a 70K seat stadium makes you want to fall asleep. It had the feel of like a conference championship game and in a way, it was, playing for the Championship of the Northeast. One side all Navy. The other side all Pitt. And when Henderson took that kick back, Pitt fans were delirious. Then, Navy got the ball and it was over.

The game, obviously, was disappointing but I cant help but think that maybe the experience helped change the travel culture a bit. I will never go to El Paso or a Dec. 26 bowl unless I can drive it the day of the game but I look forward to the next bowl. I think Pitt showed that if its not in El Paso or Shreverport and not Dec 26, we will buy a lot of tickets and hopefully some of these bowls realize this for next year. Pitt has had mediocre teams playing in far-flung bowl games on terrible dates.

Hopefully, our turnout changed the perception.....but again, fan travel should not determine the quality of your bowl game but when you outsource your postseason to scam artists, you have to live with that.
Not sure where you got info on the execs who run bowls. I checked the 990 (IRS return) for the Granddaddy......think it was 2011?? That event grossed $107 million from all the activities, netted $7 million+. Ya think an op that big takes only 200 hours to run?? The CEO was paid $254K. The Board members got paid NOTHING. Ever put on an event of any size??? Get the facts before you start slandering good people.
 
SMF, I enjoy your post and reading them and respect them....let me put your words another way,.....The 65 FBS (Former DI) Power Conference Football Schools can do whatever they want.

True. If the 65 schools wanted to get rid of bowl games and "own" them instead, they could. In many ways, the P5 schools own the National Champuonship game since that one isnt outsourced.

Similarly, to get a more profitable deal, the SEC and Big 12 bid out their "Champions Bowl" to many different cities. It was always going to be played in NO under the Sugar Bowl umbrella but they needed other sites to compete with the Sugar so the Sugar would offer more money and control.
 
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Not sure where you got info on the execs who run bowls. I checked the 990 (IRS return) for the Granddaddy......think it was 2011?? That event grossed $107 million from all the activities, netted $7 million+. Ya think an op that big takes only 200 hours to run?? The CEO was paid $254K. The Board members got paid NOTHING. Ever put on an event of any size??? Get the facts before you start slandering good people.
OUTSTANDING
 
Not sure where you got info on the execs who run bowls. I checked the 990 (IRS return) for the Granddaddy......think it was 2011?? That event grossed $107 million from all the activities, netted $7 million+. Ya think an op that big takes only 200 hours to run?? The CEO was paid $254K. The Board members got paid NOTHING. Ever put on an event of any size??? Get the facts before you start slandering good people.

$254K to oversee a football game and parade. Not bad for a job anybody can do in their spare time. Read Death to the BCS and get back to me. The facts you are seeking are in there.
 
$254K to oversee a football game and parade. Not bad for a job anybody can do in their spare time. Read Death to the BCS and get back to me. The facts you are seeking are in there.
So the annual, REQUIRED IRS report is wrong?? Who says that book.....written for profit, is right?? And you couldn't tie the shoes of people who run charities that large. Just more crapola from a jackass.
 
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True. If the 65 schools wanted to get rid of bowl games and "own" them instead, they could. In many ways, the P5 schools own the National Champuonship game since that one isnt outsourced.

Similarly, to get a more profitable deal, the SEC and Big 12 bid out their "Champions Bowl" to many different cities. It was always going to be played in NO under the Sugar Bowl umbrella but they needed other sites to compete with the Sugar so the Sugar would offer more money and control.
Now you are talking Turkey are you not, Agree! There were 28 Programs that made over $100 Million last year and 18 from SEC and B1G??? I see and agree with your points on that aspects and it was more semantics now that I read this post from you!

When the NCAA Study Commission Report is over, it will favor the 65 Schools even more!
 
Spot on analysis of the experience in Annapolis. Great Pitt turnout and Annapolis was a great host. I told my fiance that some snow on those X-mas decorations downtown would've been pretty as a postcard. Only real compliant (other than Pitt's play) was the terrible pregame traffic.
 
So the annual, REQUIRED IRS report is wrong?? Who says that book.....written for profit, is right?? And you couldn't tie the shoes of people who run charities that large. Just more crapola from a jackass.

They used many IRS reports and go into unbelievable detail, even talking about the fringe benefits these bowl execs get.
 
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They used many IRS reports and go into unbelievable detail, even talking about the fringe benefits these bowl execs get.
You hit on another reason why a "For Profit College League" would be preferred over being a Non-Profit. The Non-Profits have to publish and disclose all Income Publicly.

The NFL dropped Tax Exemption Status and did not have to do it! The Commissioner Salary and Benefits are no longer Public!
LINK:

http://fortune.com/2015/04/29/nfl-tax-exempt-status/

Excerpts:
The tax-exempt status of the National Football League has long rankled many.

Its 501(c)(6) designation, which the league has enjoyed since 1966 (though it has been labeled a non-profit since 1942), has not meant that the league does not pay taxes. Teams and players have always been taxed, but the league office, which includes Roger Goodell and other high-paid executives, has not.

For years, the fact that anyone could consider the NFL a nonprofit has been a cause for criticism and complaint in the press. The web site Sports on Earth called the league and the corporate guests that it fetes at each Super Bowl “America’s miserly guests.” Lynda Woolard, an activist who created a Change.org petition last year for the league to lose its status, told USA Today that someone needed to tell the NFL, “You’re being a bad actor.”......................The twist? Goodell’s salary will no longer be public. As a result of giving up the nonprofit designation, the NFL will no longer have to publicly disclose how much it pays its top dog. That figure for last year, the period ending in March 2014, was $35 million in salary and bonuses. The year before, it was $44.2 million. And the year before that, Goodell earned $29.5 million. The league will have to release one more report that will disclose what Goodell made for the period ending in March 2015—that is, during the 2014 season, NFL’s very bad year.
 
For the most part I thought things in Annapolis were great. It would have been nice if we'd have played well to give everyone involved with Pitt a happy ending to the season. The weather wasn't great, and the stadium definitely left something to be desired. Other than those issues, this was the first bowl where our turnout wasn't discussed in a negative light since probably the 80's. Unfortunately we just didn't come through on the field which still really sticks in my craw.
 
SMF, I enjoy your post and reading them and respect them....let me put your words another way,.....The 65 FBS (Former DI) Power Conference Football Schools can do whatever they want. They use the NCAA to do their bidding and have far more votes now in the way the NCAA changed the Rules and without their money making the NCAA would not be the same and many of them are making big money too!
In fact, they did this once. Does anyone recall the CFA? It was formed as a shot across the bow of the NCAA and achieved enough to shift power to the schools over revenue.
The P5 is a reincarnation of the CFA.
THE NCAA has tons of member schools all the way down to D3 in all sports.
The hook the NCAA has is the administrative infrastructure that in place, paid by the NCAA and the critical aspect of having virtually all the expertise in the details of operations.
Look at CFB and CBB as the sausage and the NCAA as the logistics that deliver and then sell.
The P5 exists only in football because the schools are increasingly incestuous in terms of playing only each other. As we at Pitt are aware, that does not happen in CBB.
It is similar to the Cold War and the threat of mutual destruction that keeps the alliance together.
 
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In fact, they did this once. Does anyone recall the CFA? It was formed as a shot across the bow of the NCAA and achieved enough to shift power to the schools over revenue.
The P5 is a reincarnation of the CFA.
THE NCAA has tons of member schools all the way down to D3 in all sports.
The hook the NCAA has is the administrative infrastructure that in place, paid by the NCAA and the critical aspect of having virtually all the expertise in the details of operations.
Look at CFB and CBB as the sausage and the NCAA as the logistics that deliver and then sell.
The P5 exists only in football because the schools are increasingly incestuous in terms of playing only each other. As we at Pitt are aware, that does not happen in CBB.
It is similar to the Cold War and the threat of mutual destruction that keeps the alliance together.
And that's the way it is....:cool:;)
 
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