Surprise transfer from UM.
We were a finalist out of high school. Any indication where he might go? Highest bidder type?
We were a finalist out of high school. Any indication where he might go? Highest bidder type?
Dickinson Portaling
- Thread starter Pittnerski
- Start date
He’s not coming here so it’s moot. But what would make no sense is not taking him if he wanted to. He’s the best player in the portal and he’s a take and there’s absolutely no question about it.
Of course Dickinson is better than the two centers we have. But getting one year of Dickinson will cost the program that gets him well over $100,000, and probably closer to $200,000 or more. We are currently getting Fede and Guillermo for……..much less. Which frees up resources to use elsewhere.
Is the upgrade in production from our current centers to Dickinson worth the hundreds of thousands of dollars that could be deployed elsewhere for a greater impact? Probably not.
Is the upgrade in production from our current centers to Dickinson worth the hundreds of thousands of dollars that could be deployed elsewhere for a greater impact? Probably not.
Did I somehow miss Fede and GDG being replaced with Tshiebwe and Sanogo?
Yeah, who needs a 7’2 all-American 3 year starter who averaged 17.5 and 9 over a 3 year career with an elite 8 and sweet 16 on his resume when you have two guys that nobody outside of Pittsburgh has ever heard of at center?
Miami is paying Pack $400K/year. I dont know why that booster wouldn't pay Dickinson more than that
Doesn’t fit what Miami does, he’s not an elite defender, he overpaid on Pack, his business is failing and has almost a billion dollar shortfall for this year, and he may not be able to afford anyone next year… including Pack. Go read about LifeWallet’s troubles…. He’s in major trouble.
The market is slightly correcting to where a guy can get a solid pay day but these schools aren’t gonna go crazy for one guy. The going rate for a top 10 center in the portal is around 150-200 right now and I’d bet Dickson will get more, not much more, unless someone like Wichita State just says he’s 750k so you leave your comfort zone.
Buying 5 starters of All-American status for around $1 million each sounds ridiculously cheap.
They are trying to curtail this a bit. It is SUPPOSED to be market value. They aren’t worth 1 million dollars in value to a company that has made 3.9 million dollars to date this year
Hunter Dickinson's value to DMV companies, an area dominated by pro sports is maybe 50K tops. The rest is pay for play. That said, I have been saying from the beginning that anything above market value should be considered pay for play and the player should be deemed a pro and made ineligible but the NCAA doesn't want to enforce this.
Isn’t market value in the NIL context defined by whatever someone is willing to pay? Same as market value for free agency in sports?
$1m is the going rate for a full good roster. Hit that number every year and you’re in a great spot.
I gotta be honest, I’m in the NIL space right now and I have no idea how any NCAA rules are applied to what people are doing.
For example, Youngstown State raised 500k per year for a collective for basketball to be good. They cannot GIVE this money away. They’ve offered 100-120 to several transfers they deemed worthy and it’s just not gonna be enough. There is a whole lot more going on than just the dollar amounts.
They are trying to pay way over what these kids are getting elsewhere and they can’t get them.
Also, everyone is lying when it comes to NIL. Until you see contracts, don’t believe anything. Several schools have been caught this year promising one thing and not paying.
Sure, makes sense. It’s ultimately still the Horizon League. It’s a tough sell when your league isn’t going to expose kids at anything close to the same level…you might get some kids who are chasing the biggest bag they can get. But that tends to create its own issues.
I really don’t think that most kids have NIL as the biggest issue when choosing a school. But you also have to make sure they’re valued and taken care of, because if you aren’t, someone else will try to offer a package that does do that. And about a million a year for a high major feels like the right number.
No. Because most of the "whatever someone is willing to pay" is due to a booster/collective paying that to be good at basketball. The payment amount far exceeds the value to the company. Most of the money is pay for play.
Is Pitt's NIL efforts as bad as I think?
And I told you, the NCAA isnt enforcing anything. You can essentially walk up to a kid, give him a briefcase of a million dollars and say you have to do a couple YouTube videos and that player isnt going to be deemed ineligble.
I’m not sure what kind of hair you’re trying to split. The pure market value of anyone or anything is determined by what someone is willing to pay. Whether it’s an athlete pay to play deal or a house for sale.
I don’t know anything about PITT’s NIL efforts. I know Penn State has about 1 million to field a team. At least that’s what they were told to get away from VCU.
Believe half of everything you hear on NIL and most are lying about what they’re giving or getting.
I seems to me that having watched the NCAA tourney through last night's UConn victory over Miami and recalling the trouble Pitt had against Duke's big men in the ACC tourney that, although there are some numbers at the 5---Pitt is really not very strong at the 5 as you seem to believe.
A fully healthy Fede is a decent defensive center who brings minimal offense and the Twins (at least right now) are too thin and physically weak to be effective against the kind of posts Pitt will face vs really good teams.
So, IMHO, there is a a need for another big (a 4/5) with muscle if next season's Pitt team is to be better than this past season's team.
We can hope, of course, that Fede improves his offensive game and adds at least some weight and muscle to his 220 lbs as well. Similarly, we can really really hope the twins add weight and strength to their currently way too skinny frames. But, for now, these are only hopes and dreams.
So, without those improvements to Fede and the twins, I remain of the personal opinion that Pitt is not strong at the 5 and should add a physically strong big body who will be talented enough to see considerable minutes with Fede at the 5 and allow both twins to play their more natural positions as face the basket 4/3s.
If you play tall basketball players enough minutes, they’re gonna grab rebounds and get putbacks even by accident. Then sometimes they’ll be left all alone and get dunks.
Pitt has 2 backup centers. They could use a starter.
Pitt's is probably a little better than you might expect and I think will be higher for this season too. Also, Hugley leaving frees up NIL money too which helps.
I think it’s definitely better now that boosters know Capel will be here for 2 more years regardless now. I’m not sure many were willing to help before this year.
Having three guys on visas probably helps with the money allocation, too. And I doubt we had to make top-tier offers for any of the incoming recruits. That’s 6/13 guys that are probably in the door at below-market rates.
I agree that the market value for a top player for pay for play is what a booster is willing to pay. But that's pay for play. If Billy Bob Ford Dealers pays a guy $1 million, that is a pay for play $1 million. Probably only $50K of that is for advertising, autograph signings, etc. Remember, these are supposed to be marketing deals. How many NBA or NFL players are making 6 or 7 figures on similar marketing deals that college kids get? Is Billy Bob Ford Dealers paying Pat Mahomes $1 million?
I get all that. But as you yourself has said many times, this really is pay to play, because there’s no enforcement of “true market value” or any mechanism or structure to determine what it is. Can’t the player contract for any amount he wants, just as let’s say Peyton Manning does for Nationwide etc. ?
If pay for play is allowed, then sure, you are worth what a booster wants to pay you. But the NCAA has a rule against that. As we know, they are not enforcing it, so in theory, these pay for play NIL deals are over market value because pay for play isn't allowed by rule. For example, Hines Ward is the spokesman for a Pgh area car dealership. How much could they possibly pay him? 50K/year? Cant be 100K/year. You are talking about one of maybe the 5 biggest celebrities in the Pgh area. Everyone knows him. Now lets say this car dealer is a big Pitt booster and pays Quinton Martin $500K/year. 90% of local Yinzers have no clue who that is. 95% of Yinzers know who Hines Ward is. So you tell me how much of this hypothetical Quinton Martin deal is above market value
A payroll of $1 million sounds ridiculously high for Penn State. They are going to pay $100K/player and you think Dickinson is only getting $250K. That doesn't make sense. I fear Pitt wont have a payroll of 250K total.
I know what Dickinson is getting. And they won’t pay 100k to 10 players. Why are you being this dumb? There are several players who won’t get anything.
You think Youngstown State can come up with 500k a year and Pitt can’t? Cmon
From what I understand, Penn State isn’t at $1M. They’re a few hundred thousand short of that. But $1M is the target number that they want, and they gave the new staff a roadmap for how they think they can get there.
The problem is that a lot of that money that’s currently in the pot was part of the last-ditch fundraising effort to keep Shrewsberry. Will they be able to raise even more money each year going forward when the urgency of the coach leaving for another job isn’t there?
The problem is that a lot of that money that’s currently in the pot was part of the last-ditch fundraising effort to keep Shrewsberry. Will they be able to raise even more money each year going forward when the urgency of the coach leaving for another job isn’t there?
Right. I was told they think they should get to 1 mill every year but I doubt they can even pay that out. Just like YSU is having trouble paying out their money
Yeah, a lot of these are “commitments” or amortized projections of monthly contributions (i.e. a $100 monthly recurring contribution to the collective is considered to be $1,200 a year in the pot, even though those recurring contributions can be turned off at any time) versus actual, physical money in the bank that’s liquid and ready to be disbursed. Seems like they have enough to get the upfront for Ace Baldwin, but I don’t know how much more liquid they have than that. If it was simple, he’d probably be in the boat already.
The best way to go about it seems to basically be appearance fees. Which seems like what we’ve done. Someone commits to contribute $50,000 to Pitt basketball. Alliance 412 has five Pitt basketball players show up somewhere, you give each of them $10,000 in exchange for their trouble, it’s run through the collective so the kid gets an easy tax form and stuff at the end of the year, and everyone’s happy.
