How I would fix CBB recruiting

[Sean Miller Fan]

Real simple:

Ban all coaches from attending AAU and AAU-like events. Have NCAA-sponsored recruiting events/tournaments with plenty of "NCAA police" on hand. Have the NCAA identify the Top 200 recruits and assign each an NCAA Compliance Monitor. No communications with that player can begin without first contacting the NCAA Monitor. The Monitor's job is also to prevent any recruiting communications between "handlers" and coaches. The only player representatives that can speak to coaches are parents or guardians. In a case where the player's parents/guardians are unable, the NCAA monitor can work with the family to have someone else speak on the player's behalf.

This would not eliminate ALL cheating, but it would eliminate SOME....and it would be extremely easy to implement. But the NCAA isnt serious about preventing teams like Auburn and LSU from paying players.

 

[below0w]

Congrats, you've created a needlessly byzantine system that is now even more open to corruption than before. That would solve nothing.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Congrats, you've created a needlessly byzantine system that is now even more open to corruption than before. That would solve nothing.

Explain

 

[redbyrds]

Typical solution. Rules, restrictions, government monitoring.

Better way is to punish the cheaters. Coaches 5 year bans. Schools 5 year bans. No TV. No money. ENFORCEMENT WITH TEETH!!

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Typical solution. Rules, restrictions, government monitoring.

Better way is to punish the cheaters. Coaches 5 year bans. Schools 5 year bans. No TV. No money. ENFORCEMENT WITH TEETH!!

Extreme measures must be taken. It is nearly impossible to catch these guys. I mean they only caught ONE AGENT, JUST ONE and look what that turned up.

As long as recruiting is done through AAU, there will be corruption

 

[below0w]

Explain

Sure.

First, you suggest that the NCAA should be responsible for identifying the top 200 recruits. That invites corruption since a regulatory body are now given the responsibility for subjectively evaluating recruits. Second, you suggest that the NCAA should then assign "compliance monitors" to make sure those top 200 recruits are recruited within the rules. Uh, you just created 200 individual points of failure because each and every one of those compliance monitors is now susceptible to corruption. How much do you suggest that they be paid in order to dissuade them from pocketing money from a bag man to "look the other way"? If it's a lot of money, where does it come from? If it's a little money, how do you incentivize honesty?

Beyond that, how do you define guardian? There are legal guardians of players who are nothing more than middle men. How strictly do you define "guardian" to protect against those people? Do you have the appropriate infrastructure to police the compliance monitors? Have you given any thought to the scale of this absurd proposal? You haven't suggested anything that will eliminate corruption and I'm fairly certain that you've just complicated the process to the point where there are more failure points than before, effectively making it easier to obfuscate corruption. I think your system will do the exact opposite of what you claim.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

Simple!
If charged and proven guilty put one high profile elite AD, coach, player, and shoe executive in jail charged with appropriate crimes like bribery, wire fraud, mail fraud, money laundering and more.
It's over!
Works every time.

Lots of these people are breaking the law including players, players families and if nothing is done to set an example the standard it won't stop.

"it's five o'clock somewhere"
Signed: Mr Buffett
Go PITT & CSU Rams!

 

[redbyrds]

How about a whistleblower program to a real compliance area.
Confidential with incentives. There are plenty of scorned players and assistants with a lot to offer in the way of knowledge and info. Make it easier and worth coming forward.

Then hammer the cheaters big time.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I guess jail time has solved a myriad of problems and there’s no longer need for jails anymore !

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Sure.

First, you suggest that the NCAA should be responsible for identifying the top 200 recruits. That invites corruption since a regulatory body are now given the responsibility for subjectively evaluating recruits. Second, you suggest that the NCAA should then assign "compliance monitors" to make sure those top 200 recruits are recruited within the rules. Uh, you just created 200 individual points of failure because each and every one of those compliance monitors is now susceptible to corruption. How much do you suggest that they be paid in order to dissuade them from pocketing money from a bag man to "look the other way"? If it's a lot of money, where does it come from? If it's a little money, how do you incentivize honesty?

Beyond that, how do you define guardian? There are legal guardians of players who are nothing more than middle men. How strictly do you define "guardian" to protect against those people? Do you have the appropriate infrastructure to police the compliance monitors? Have you given any thought to the scale of this absurd proposal? You haven't suggested anything that will eliminate corruption and I'm fairly certain that you've just complicated the process to the point where there are more failure points than before, effectively making it easier to obfuscate corruption. I think your system will do the exact opposite of what you claim.

1. If their guardian is also a handler/middleman, well, the NCAA is just out of luck. The African kids will still have their guardian/handlers, so those guys can still get paid off but most recruits will have legitimate parents or guardians.

2. Yes, it will be possible to bribe an NCAA Compliance monitor but if you have the balls to do that, knowing they have the Feds on Speed Dial, then full props to you. I am sorry but there will be less cheating with each recruit having a Compliance officer monitor their receuitment.

3. I am sure the NCAA can create an expert panel to rank the kids 1-200. So, ok, some kids dont make it and slip through the cracks. Fine, you can have easier access to pay the kid who didnt make the Top 200

 

[below0w]

1. If their guardian is also a handler/middleman, well, the NCAA is just out of luck. The African kids will still have their guardian/handlers, so those guys can still get paid off but most recruits will have legitimate parents or guardians.

2. Yes, it will be possible to bribe an NCAA Compliance monitor but if you have the balls to do that, knowing they have the Feds on Speed Dial, then full props to you. I am sorry but there will be less cheating with each recruit having a Compliance officer monitor their receuitment.

3. I am sure the NCAA can create an expert panel to rank the kids 1-200. So, ok, some kids dont make it and slip through the cracks. Fine, you can have easier access to pay the kid who didnt make the Top 200

1. African kids aren't the only ones with handlers like that.
2. It doesn't take balls to bribe a compliance monitor.
2a. Where are you going to find these compliance monitors that are above reproach?
2b. How much do you pay them to ensure they stay above reproach?
3. You've created an incentive to try and keep players out of the top 200 and you don't seem to realize it.

This solves nothing. You've created an environment where cheating now takes a few extra steps, but there are new ways to game the system as a result. A simple cost-benefit analysis would have shown you what an awful idea this is.

More to the point, people need to understand that sports are a microcosm of society at large. Cheating pays, there's ample evidence for anyone who pays attention. The people who say that you need to absolutely hammer somebody are right, but you also need to show that you'll do it consistently. I shouldn't need to explain why that's more of a utopian pipe dream than something any of us will experience in our lifetimes.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

I guess jail time has solved a myriad of problems and there’s no longer need for jails anymore !

Jail does solve white collar crime. Let's see if the Hollywooders try to bribe their kids into another school.
I doubt it.

It doesn't seem to have the same impact on low level street crime but those people think jail is as good as home. Maybe better! So it doesn't matter to them.

When a white collar criminal compares the sq footage of their mansion to jail cell jail time becomes an incentive to go straight.

 

[Voice of Danno]

Here are my solutions.

Have all the shoe companies pay the NCAA a fee to allow its players to wear its their shoes. If Under Armour doesn't want to pay the fee, players aren't allowed to wear them. The NFL has the policy.

The money the shoe companies pay to the NCAA is then split evenly among all D1 scholarship players. Players can then choose whatever shoe they want. Pitt's starters could have 5 different brands being worn.

Problem is. The schools make a shit of money of their shoe deals. Some use it to pay for their coaches. Schools can still sign merchandise agreements with these comings but not the shoes. So we can have X wearing Nike jerseys, sweats, Ts but addidas shoes if he desires. But it will be a huge cut in revenue for the schools.

Allow players to sign with agents once they hit 18 and only after they sign a NCAA LOI. Signings can include signing bonuses but no loans. Top players get the most money and doesn't cost the schools a penny. The reason kids have to wait until after their LOI is so these sleazeballs don't put crap in the contracts that take advantage of these kids. The schools' lawyers can help their players with that. There will obviously be language for kids to break the contract (with penalties - fair but not obsessive). The agents take all the risk. If they sign a top 10 kid for $100K but the kids busts out and is working McDonalds in 4 years. The agent loses out not the kid or the school.

The third was mentioned earlier. If a program breaks a serious NCAA rule it's a 5 year suspension for the head coach. This way a strippergate doesn't allow a coach to slip by. Pittino said he didn't know about the parties. And he probably didn't "know: what was happening, But this makes him need to know everything. If these guys are going to make the largest salary on their campuses then they should have the most accountability.

Finally. Hopefully the NBA allows HS grads in to the league. Get rid of the pretenders. Do you realize a student only needs to pass 3 classes by the end of the Fall semester to be eligible. He can take blow off courses in the Summer pass 3 classes (Ds) and doesn't have to open a book before the June draft.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Jail does solve white collar crime. Let's see if the Hollywooders try to bribe their kids into another school.
I doubt it.

It doesn't seem to have the same impact on low level street crime but those people think jail is as good as home. Maybe better! So it doesn't matter to them.

When a white collar criminal compares the sq footage of their mansion to jail cell jail time becomes an incentive to go straight.

They won’t do with intermediaries. A nice donation here and there has done it for yrs !

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Let's see if the Hollywooders try to bribe their kids into another school.

Its just Hollywood kids that are getting into college on bribes?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

1. African kids aren't the only ones with handlers like that.
2. It doesn't take balls to bribe a compliance monitor.
2a. Where are you going to find these compliance monitors that are above reproach?
2b. How much do you pay them to ensure they stay above reproach?
3. You've created an incentive to try and keep players out of the top 200 and you don't seem to realize it.

This solves nothing. You've created an environment where cheating now takes a few extra steps, but there are new ways to game the system as a result. A simple cost-benefit analysis would have shown you what an awful idea this is.

More to the point, people need to understand that sports are a microcosm of society at large. Cheating pays, there's ample evidence for anyone who pays attention. The people who say that you need to absolutely hammer somebody are right, but you also need to show that you'll do it consistently. I shouldn't need to explain why that's more of a utopian pipe dream than something any of us will experience in our lifetimes.

1. Most of the Top 100s have handlers but they aren't guardians like the African kids. No guardian, no dice.

2. It sure does take balls when you get prison if caught. How many people bribe cops? Not many.

2a. Anywhere

2b. 80K? Yes, they may accept a 25K, 50K bribe but they wont be offered that

3. What? You think a guy like Zion Williamson or RJ Barrett wont be ranked in the Top 200? Everyone agrees on 100 of the 200. That other 200, sure there will be some disagreements but those aren't the guys you pay to get anyway.

SMF wins again.

 

[burnie1105]

Here are my solutions.

Have all the shoe companies pay the NCAA a fee to allow its players to wear its their shoes. If Under Armour doesn't want to pay the fee, players aren't allowed to wear them. The NFL has the policy.

The money the shoe companies pay to the NCAA is then split evenly among all D1 scholarship players. Players can then choose whatever shoe they want. Pitt's starters could have 5 different brands being worn.

Problem is. The schools make a shit of money of their shoe deals. Some use it to pay for their coaches. Schools can still sign merchandise agreements with these comings but not the shoes. So we can have X wearing Nike jerseys, sweats, Ts but addidas shoes if he desires. But it will be a huge cut in revenue for the schools.

Allow players to sign with agents once they hit 18 and only after they sign a NCAA LOI. Signings can include signing bonuses but no loans. Top players get the most money and doesn't cost the schools a penny. The reason kids have to wait until after their LOI is so these sleazeballs don't put crap in the contracts that take advantage of these kids. The schools' lawyers can help their players with that. There will obviously be language for kids to break the contract (with penalties - fair but not obsessive). The agents take all the risk. If they sign a top 10 kid for $100K but the kids busts out and is working McDonalds in 4 years. The agent loses out not the kid or the school.

The third was mentioned earlier. If a program breaks a serious NCAA rule it's a 5 year suspension for the head coach. This way a strippergate doesn't allow a coach to slip by. Pittino said he didn't know about the parties. And he probably didn't "know: what was happening, But this makes him need to know everything. If these guys are going to make the largest salary on their campuses then they should have the most accountability.

Finally. Hopefully the NBA allows HS grads in to the league. Get rid of the pretenders. Do you realize a student only needs to pass 3 classes by the end of the Fall semester to be eligible. He can take blow off courses in the Summer pass 3 classes (Ds) and doesn't have to open a book before the June draft.

I like these ideas.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Simple. No one who after some future date certain who plays AAU ball is eligible for a basketball ship at an NCAA school. That would put things back to only the HIgh Schools and HS coaches like it once was. Ever since AAU happened things have gotten corrupt and too many players aren’t trained properly in hoops skills since AAU is just roll the ball out and play without sufficient time practicing basics in the gym.​

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Simple. No one who after some future date certain who plays AAU ball is eligible for a basketball ship at an NCAA school. That would put things back to only the HIgh Schools and HS coaches like it once was. Ever since AAU happened things have gotten corrupt and too many players aren’t trained properly in hoops skills since AAU is just roll the ball out and play without sufficient time practicing basics in the gym.​

I like that but some other organization would just take its place. I cannot believe the NCAA allows recruiting to take place at these things.

 

[Ski11585]

1. Most of the Top 100s have handlers but they aren't guardians like the African kids. No guardian, no dice.

2. It sure does take balls when you get prison if caught. How many people bribe cops? Not many.

2a. Anywhere

2b. 80K? Yes, they may accept a 25K, 50K bribe but they wont be offered that

3. What? You think a guy like Zion Williamson or RJ Barrett wont be ranked in the Top 200? Everyone agrees on 100 of the 200. That other 200, sure there will be some disagreements but those aren't the guys you pay to get anyway.

SMF wins again.

Saying you win doesn’t actually mean you win...

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Saying you win doesn’t actually mean you win...

Forget it, he's rolling.

 

[MyNameisJoe]

So

Real simple:

Ban all coaches from attending AAU and AAU-like events. Have NCAA-sponsored recruiting events/tournaments with plenty of "NCAA police" on hand. Have the NCAA identify the Top 200 recruits and assign each an NCAA Compliance Monitor. No communications with that player can begin without first contacting the NCAA Monitor. The Monitor's job is also to prevent any recruiting communications between "handlers" and coaches. The only player representatives that can speak to coaches are parents or guardians. In a case where the player's parents/guardians are unable, the NCAA monitor can work with the family to have someone else speak on the player's behalf.

This would not eliminate ALL cheating, but it would eliminate SOME....and it would be extremely easy to implement. But the NCAA isnt serious about preventing teams like Auburn and LSU from paying players.

So many flaws with your theory, but I'll just start with - then I recruit the monitor and find what he/she needs.

The problem with recruiting is human nature and you ain't never gonna fix that.

 

[HailToPitt1985]

The whole basis of this proposal is that the NCAA would be the overseer. That won't work under any circumstances. The NCAA is a corrupt, poorly run organization and can't effectively do what it's supposed to be doing right now let alone take on other responsibilities. The punishment for the offenders, and there are many, needs to be much more severe. And it needs to be enforced by an organization other than the NCAA.

 

[efkemanas]

Simple. No one who after some future date certain who plays AAU ball is eligible for a basketball ship at an NCAA school. That would put things back to only the HIgh Schools and HS coaches like it once was. Ever since AAU happened things have gotten corrupt and too many players aren’t trained properly in hoops skills since AAU is just roll the ball out and play without sufficient time practicing basics in the gym.​

That will just hurt the quality of the player. Kids don't play 3-4 sports like they used to they have 1 or 2. Systems like WPIAL have restrictions on when high school kids can practice and they use AAU and other travel teams so that they can play year round and not just for 3-4 months a year. You will never eliminate AAU cause it is allowing these kids to improve faster.

I know this will upset most, but college sports is basically a free minor league system for major sports such as football and basketball. Until both those leagues have true developmental leagues that these kids can go and get paid in it will never be fixed. These kids are forced to go to these school because it is the best option to go pro. Some just don't care if they are bribed cause they want to get paid and get to the league. The main issue is that those 2 leagues don't want to pay for a minor league system and let the NCAA do it. You don't see this in hockey, soccer, and baseball cause they all have other developmental options.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

That will just hurt the quality of the player. Kids don't play 3-4 sports like they used to they have 1 or 2. Systems like WPIAL have restrictions on when high school kids can practice and they use AAU and other travel teams so that they can play year round and not just for 3-4 months a year. You will never eliminate AAU cause it is allowing these kids to improve faster.

I know this will upset most, but college sports is basically a free minor league system for major sports such as football and basketball. Until both those leagues have true developmental leagues that these kids can go and get paid in it will never be fixed. These kids are forced to go to these school because it is the best option to go pro. Some just don't care if they are bribed cause they want to get paid and get to the league. The main issue is that those 2 leagues don't want to pay for a minor league system and let the NCAA do it. You don't see this in hockey, soccer, and baseball cause they all have other developmental options.

They can play all the AAU basketball they want. You just cant recruit at their events. A college coach should not even know the name of their AAU coach. It should be irrelevant. All contact should be done at NCAA sponsored events or through their HS, which leads me to cracking down on "basketball factory HS's" but I haven't thought of a good enough solution for that yet.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

Saying you win doesn’t actually mean you win...

Do you mean you actually have to win?

Oh wow that makes things more difficult.
Darn.

 

[efkemanas]

They can play all the AAU basketball they want. You just cant recruit at their events. A college coach should not even know the name of their AAU coach. It should be irrelevant. All contact should be done at NCAA sponsored events or through their HS, which leads me to cracking down on "basketball factory HS's" but I haven't thought of a good enough solution for that yet.

You have to change the whole system then starting with high school restrictions and allow these coaches to coach them 24/7 & 365. I played soccer 12 months a year. My AAU coach coached me for 8 of those 12 months, and knew my game a lot better. AAU programs take you to tournaments were college scouts are present. Most college staffs don't waste time in high school gyms unless the kid was seen on the AAU circuit cause they don't have the time and AAU has a better overall talent level.

I had teammates went D1 and they NEVER told coaches to talk to the high school coach and only wanted them to talk to our AAU coach because the coach new them better and they trusted them. To most kids AAU is more important then high school cause it gives you more exposure to get to the next level. If you eliminate recruiting at AAU events you will hurt so many kids that don't play at power house programs cause they will never be seen.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

You have to change the whole system then starting with high school restrictions and allow these coaches to coach them 24/7 & 365. I played soccer 12 months a year. My AAU coach coached me for 8 of those 12 months, and new my game a lot better. AAU programs take you to tournaments were college scouts are present. Most college staffs don't waste time in high school gyms unless the kid was seen on the AAU circuit cause they don't have the time and AAU has a better overall talent level.

I had teammates went D1 and they NEVER told coaches to talk to the high school coach and only wanted them to talk to our AAU coach because the coach new them better and they trusted them. To most kids AAU is more important then high school cause it gives you more exposure to get to the next level. If you eliminate AAU you will hurt so many kids that don't play at power house programs cause they will never be seen.

Again, I didn't say to eliminate AAU. I said to ban recruiting at their events or talking to their coaches. There is simply too much corruption in the AAU game.

 

[Voice of Danno]

AAU is the main culprit in all of this mess. It used to be recruited was run through the high schools with the coach taking the lead. There was an accountability with that. HS coach doing something dishonest or illegal, he would have to answer to his AD and Superintendent. AAU guys only answer to themselves and the main question is "did your actions help us make even more money?"

Unfortunately with the recruiting scandal and the rise of HS AAU teams, er I mean prep schools, the accountability is also gone. I could be wrong about prep schools though. I am looking forward to the Lincoln Park kids starring in Cats later this month. After all, isn't LP a performing arts charter school?

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

That will just hurt the quality of the player. Kids don't play 3-4 sports like they used to they have 1 or 2. Systems like WPIAL have restrictions on when high school kids can practice and they use AAU and other travel teams so that they can play year round and not just for 3-4 months a year. You will never eliminate AAU cause it is allowing these kids to improve faster.

I know this will upset most, but college sports is basically a free minor league system for major sports such as football and basketball. Until both those leagues have true developmental leagues that these kids can go and get paid in it will never be fixed. These kids are forced to go to these school because it is the best option to go pro. Some just don't care if they are bribed cause they want to get paid and get to the league. The main issue is that those 2 leagues don't want to pay for a minor league system and let the NCAA do it. You don't see this in hockey, soccer, and baseball cause they all have other developmental options.

"You will never eliminate AAU cause it is allowing these kids to improve faster."

That's simply not really true for many kids. AAU often actually impedes many kids progress since it takes away from time that would be better spent learning fundamental all-round hoops skills and often reinforces bad habits. This is because it substitutes playing tons of games for the basic gym time needed to learn proper shooting and other techniques. Those techniques are now often learned from basketball trainers outside of AAU and high school seasons and these trainers charge $$$ for their services.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

You have to change the whole system then starting with high school restrictions and allow these coaches to coach them 24/7 & 365. I played soccer 12 months a year. My AAU coach coached me for 8 of those 12 months, and knew my game a lot better. AAU programs take you to tournaments were college scouts are present. Most college staffs don't waste time in high school gyms unless the kid was seen on the AAU circuit cause they don't have the time and AAU has a better overall talent level.

I had teammates went D1 and they NEVER told coaches to talk to the high school coach and only wanted them to talk to our AAU coach because the coach new them better and they trusted them. To most kids AAU is more important then high school cause it gives you more exposure to get to the next level. If you eliminate recruiting at AAU events you will hurt so many kids that don't play at power house programs cause they will never be seen.

The way it is for sure--but not the way it should be. And, basketball AAU appears to be very different from soccer. When I was involved with it on the women's hoops side the team never had any practices. They just went out every weekend and played 5-7 games in two days.

 

[Fredact]

Real simple:

Ban all coaches from attending AAU and AAU-like events. Have NCAA-sponsored recruiting events/tournaments with plenty of "NCAA police" on hand. Have the NCAA identify the Top 200 recruits and assign each an NCAA Compliance Monitor. No communications with that player can begin without first contacting the NCAA Monitor. The Monitor's job is also to prevent any recruiting communications between "handlers" and coaches. The only player representatives that can speak to coaches are parents or guardians. In a case where the player's parents/guardians are unable, the NCAA monitor can work with the family to have someone else speak on the player's behalf.

This would not eliminate ALL cheating, but it would eliminate SOME....and it would be extremely easy to implement. But the NCAA isnt serious about preventing teams like Auburn and LSU from paying players.

What "problem" are you trying to fix? Preventing kids from getting wined and dined and courted? Why would you care?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

What "problem" are you trying to fix? Preventing kids from getting wined and dined and courted? Why would you care?

I think they should be paid but Pitt wont do it so I dont want anyone else to either

 

[BuffetParrothead]

I think they should be paid but Pitt wont do it so I dont want anyone else to either

SMF atleast for once your're honest and correct!
I say no pay for play but if the NCAA league was 20 top teams with the majority going to the NFL I might change my mind.
It's not!
NCAA basketball is what ? 160 teams same as football and if all teams were required to pay players most would drop D1 football for sure and maybe basketball!
PITT would be one of the first.
Let top players benefit from endorsements!

 

[HailToPitt1985]

All of this is moot since maybe 1% of all kids who play sports in college will eventually play that sport professionally. They're in college to be prepared to do something other than sports to make a living after graduation. Even if 1 or 2 of them play professionally, it will be for an average of 3 years. What then? You don't believe that what I'm saying is true or valid? Ask Nick Saban. This is exactly what he said. And it applies to football, basketball, name the sport.

It's great that kids are playing sports in college. It's the vehicle they can use to get their degree so they can make a living when they graduate. Doing otherwise and trying to deceive the kids into believing they'll play professionally someday is doing a disservice to them.

 

[joeydavid]

Posts about Trump should be on the Locker Room board...

Simple!
If charged and proven guilty put one high profile elite AD, coach, player, and shoe executive in jail charged with appropriate crimes like bribery, wire fraud, mail fraud, money laundering and more.
It's over!
Works every time.

Lots of these people are breaking the law including players, players families and if nothing is done to set an example the standard it won't stop.

"it's five o'clock somewhere"
Signed: Mr Buffett
Go PITT & CSU Rams!

 

[pittzap]

SMF atleast for once your're honest and correct!
I say no pay for play but if the NCAA league was 20 top teams with the majority going to the NFL I might change my mind.
It's not!
NCAA basketball is what ? 160 teams same as football and if all teams were required to pay players most would drop D1 football for sure and maybe basketball!
PITT would be one of the first.
Let top players benefit from endorsements!

There are over 350 men's Division 1 basketball teams.