If Edelman is correct then college

[Swervin27]

Yeah, but juggling all of that while at the same time being responsible for "doing the work", getting up every day, dealing with your freedoms, getting out of your comfort zone, I think is all important. You are right, some of the degrees are just that, a 4 year party, and I am guessing this is where colleges start taking more of a hit and these superfluous degrees go by the wayside. But I think the college experience is irreplaceable, provided you do the work and acquire some meaningful skills. Then again, you are either a dumbass or smart. Unless you are a basic retard or genius. So you can probably get trained for 75% of the jobs/skills out there is you have a modicum of intelligence. With, or without a degree.

come on, who are you fooling. taking 4 or 5 classes a week that are 50 minutes long then going back to your dorm room to sleep isn't exactly teaching you valuable life lessons.. Actual Real life teaches you life lessons, college just delays that back 4 (or 5) years.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Isn't part of the goal of STEM education to make life better, easier and more efficient for people? If so, then what is wrong with people attempting to do what they want (i.e. non STEM degree) in a society that is continually becoming more productive and efficient?

Nothing wrong with it at all--being an educated person is a good thing!

It just may not be something a parent may want to invest in (or a kid want to rack up student loans for) if it costs $120K to $260K, or so, depending on the particular school for your current live on campus college experience; and, if the result is an educated person who is unemployed or under-employed with little prospect for a career that will provide a comfortable middle class lifestyle. Much better to get this kind of education online (at as little as 1/4 the cost of a live-on-campus B.A. in the humanities and many of the social sciences) if that is what the parent or kid is interested in doing.

 

[Darth_VadEER]

I just read that NWPA is starting a regional community college, which is probably a good thing. However, I read that the first group of classes being offered are Intro to Music, Intro to Lit, Intro to Philosophy, and Philosophy of Ethical Responsibility (among others).

Now someone answer me this, why the does some poor kid from Crawford County need to study that, and why does NWPA NEED mostly poor kids from Warren, Crawford and Venango counties to learn Music, Literature and Philosophy?

Why aren't they teaching IT, Computer Programming, Geographic Information Systems, ect.? What about skills that are in demand in drilling operations? Supposedly this region lacks skilled employees and finding a good machinist who shows up on time and can pass a drug test is like finding a Unicorn.

Also, whatever happened to on the job training? My father told me that when he was in high school, most kids weren't focused on college but on getting apprenticeships with some of the major employers - because they'd hire you, pay to teach you and then mostly had a good job for life.

 

[SVPanther]

Maybe therein lies the answer to fix the state university system. Convert them to a more technical focus with AA degree after two years. After two years, assuming some GPA cut off, and the student has been taking a more traditional college course load, they are guaranteed admission to one of the 4 state related schools. Might be something there. Just an idea.

 

[SVPanther]

I just read that NWPA is starting a regional community college, which is probably a good thing. However, I read that the first group of classes being offered are Intro to Music, Intro to Lit, Intro to Philosophy, and Philosophy of Ethical Responsibility (among others).

Now someone answer me this, why the does some poor kid from Crawford County need to study that, and why does NWPA NEED mostly poor kids from Warren, Crawford and Venango counties to learn Music, Literature and Philosophy?

Why aren't they teaching IT, Computer Programming, Geographic Information Systems, ect.? What about skills that are in demand in drilling operations? Supposedly this region lacks skilled employees and finding a good machinist who shows up on time and can pass a drug test is like finding a Unicorn.

Also, whatever happened to on the job training? My father told me that when he was in high school, most kids weren't focused on college but on getting apprenticeships with some of the major employers - because they'd hire you, pay to teach you and then mostly had a good job for life.

Fact is, there are no good jobs for life anymore. That was a 1950's relic. You better always have two thoughts in forefront. 1. What's my next job, and 2. How soon can I move to where that job is.
Tech may appear hot today. But so did working in the mill at one time.

 

[Darth_VadEER]

My kid's Kindergarten teachers all have advanced degrees and certificates. You can read their biographies on the school website and you'd almost think they were recruited from the Executive Offices of GE and Westinghouse.

I went to the same school as a kid and was taught by nuns. I have no idea what advanced education Sister Teresa Marie had but whatever formal training she lacked she made up for it in pure grit.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

 

[Darth_VadEER]

I actually own that.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I like when you land on "Lose a Turn" it takes you immediately to Downtown Sabraton.

 

[eastcoasthoops]

I like when you land on "Lose a Turn" it takes you immediately to Downtown Sabraton.

Hahahahaha

 

[joeydavid]

Education is going to be obsolete. With the return of coal mining and steel mills no-one will need a degree.

Fact is, there are no good jobs for life anymore. That was a 1950's relic. You better always have two thoughts in forefront. 1. What's my next job, and 2. How soon can I move to where that job is.
Tech may appear hot today. But so did working in the mill at one time.

 

[pitt-girl]

Is there any evidence that our economy is in need of continuous waves of college graduates (none STEM)?

Most the folks pouring my drinks are college graduates. Meanwhile, it's hard to find a young, trustworthy tradesman.

I'm saving for my kids college, but if they have other plans I won't discourage them. I'm going to tell them to join the military and get their education paid for them, and then I will just gift them their college fund so they can buy a home and actually start a life.

I'm not dumping cash on a sociology degree.

100% agree. We know a number of families with college grads who are really scrambling. College was never intended for everybody. I also think the easy access to federal financial aid needs to tighten up also.

 

[RaleighPittFan]

It's interesting that the "cost" of attending college rose dramatically when the federal government dramatically increased guaranteed loan amounts.

Here's a quick google result:

https://www.usnews.com/opinion/arti...government-is-to-blame-for-high-college-costs

I was going to cut and paste a few highlights, but it's a good read all the way through for those who are interested.

 

[cruzer]

Fact is that academia is fat, dumb, and happy. They have had a monopoly on the educational process and more importantly, the credentialing process. If you think that there is a serious value proposition to listen to half the blow-hard professors pontificate I have only a two letter response - AI. It will happen, it's only a matter of time.

Cruzer

 

[Revenge Of The Noise]

Vicious cycle. In some cases jobs like mill or mine work dried up. But also, people who worked hard at physical or technical jobs wanted things to be "easier"for their kids. So the kids went to college instead of military or trade schools (or simply getting similar jobs as their parents). Some took tech or premed or engineering but most gravitated to the softer subjects. Alarming numbers of English, sociology, "popular culture" majors. College admins themselves come from this background so emphasize the BS classes needed to take. Not many actual jobs in private business requiring these majors so government absorbed many of them.

In turn, government magnified the importance of college and provided more opp for grants and "low interest" college loans. More and more kids ( mostly pushed by their parents who had those soft majors themselves) who had drifted through high school (which also had been softened) then drifted into college to major in communications, literature, etc. Colleges loved that, jacked up tuitions, provided more amenities to compete for students etc ... including offering more fruit pie majors.

But even the government couldn't absorb more of those kind of grads, so they're back living in their parents basements (or old rooms).

There are at least 6 houses on my block where exactly this has been the case. Multiple kids went off to college, majored in fun things like Art Therapy (taking 5 or 6 years in some cases), had great times, but now back at home working in retail or Starbucks (at least they are working). Multiple have their girlfriend or boyfriend living with em too! There are 5 cars crowding driveway, street etc that should only ever have two. Parents who had thought they could retiree and downsize are now stuck.

And I'm not judging, I have a kid entering high school, loathes math and science (which seems the attitude encouraged by celebrity culture) and mentions "graphic arts" and "theatre arts"as fields of interest, and I cringe about what we're gonna do.

Meanwhile it took me days to get a plumbing company that could change out my water heater last month. They claim they can't find enough workers.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Vicious cycle. In some cases jobs like mill or mine work dried up. But also, people who worked hard at physical or technical jobs wanted things to be "easier"for their kids. So the kids went to college instead of military or trade schools (or simply getting similar jobs as their parents). Some took tech or premed or engineering but most gravitated to the softer subjects. Alarming numbers of English, sociology, "popular culture" majors. College admins themselves come from this background so emphasize the BS classes needed to take. Not many actual jobs in private business requiring these majors so government absorbed many of them.

In turn, government magnified the importance of college and provided more opp for grants and "low interest" college loans. More and more kids ( mostly pushed by their parents who had those soft majors themselves) who had drifted through high school (which also had been softened) then drifted into college to major in communications, literature, etc. Colleges loved that, jacked up tuitions, provided more amenities to compete for students etc ... including offering more fruit pie majors.

But even the government couldn't absorb more of those kind of grads, so they're back living in their parents basements (or old rooms).

There are at least 6 houses on my block where exactly this has been the case. Multiple kids went off to college, majored in fun things like Art Therapy (taking 5 or 6 years in some cases), had great times, but now back at home working in retail or Starbucks (at least they are working). Multiple have their girlfriend or boyfriend living with em too! There are 5 cars crowding driveway, street etc that should only ever have two. Parents who had thought they could retiree and downsize are now stuck.

And I'm not judging, I have a kid entering high school, loathes math and science (which seems the attitude encouraged by celebrity culture) and mentions "graphic arts" and "theatre arts"as fields of interest, and I cringe about what we're gonna do.

Meanwhile it took me days to get a plumbing company that could change out my water heater last month. They claim they can't find enough workers.

I feel for you. Have a kid who earned a B.F.A. in Theatre and only has had some work as an extra (no speaking parts) in two mini-series filmed in Virginia and mostly waits table in restaurants for a living. It is what the kid loves and is saving up to move to L.A. Fortunately, he went to college in-state and doesn't have too large a student loan debt.

 

[rojo36]

Don't kids learn life skills in normal life? you don't have to drop $120,000 over four years to learn how to talk to a girl or learn how to eat on $100 a week. I know people that haven't gone to a four-year college and they seem to have figured it out.

if anything these four year schools are a protective cocoon for a young adult delaying the normal life challenges that come up in life.

Four year schools are not a protective cocoon for everyone. It always seems to be Liberal Arts people making these dire predictions.