Is Franklin On the Hot Seat?
- Thread starter 9nationalchampionships
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I sure hope not. Almost as mediocre as the last 10 years or so of the Weekend at Bernie's act "coaching" from the press box.
He could be 12 - 11 overall and 5 - 10 in conference by years end and that coaching staff is costing them quite a bit.
He can’t play either of the dual threat QBs this year due to them not being ahead enough to justify it!
He will be on Sunday September 11th 2016 the day after Narduzzi whips him. The butthurt rage from cultdom will be legendary.
His recruiting and soft OOC schedule will keep a respectable win total going, but the disgruntlement will continue to rise as he continues to lose and get outcoached by Meyer, Harbaugh and Dantonio. His record against good teams is awful.
BTW, in his five B10 road games, his team has never scored more than 14 points.
BTW, in his five B10 road games, his team has never scored more than 14 points.
So at 4.2m/yr. the nits will take whatever due to the 12.6M? I respectfully disagree. He will most likely end the season at 5 - 10 in conference over 2 yrs.
lotta. $$$ for mediocrity
lotta. $$$ for mediocrity
There is a great thread on the cult board about the actual sanctions vs usc. From 2012 through the end of the sanctions psu lost 24 players including the 9 that left right after paterno was fired for harboring a rapists. Compare that to usc that lost 30 scholarships during the same time. Basically psu cult members are claiming the 6 -8 players lost on average per year depending upon where you consider the sanctions to end are what makes the difference between the dominator getting to 6 or 7 wins and being the big 10 champs.
Delusional
Delusional
Then why the need to pay him so much $$$&&?
BOB was a great hire but he probably was creeped out eating next to babysitter George Mitchell in the cafeteria.
BOB was a great hire but he probably was creeped out eating next to babysitter George Mitchell in the cafeteria.
Given the situation he inherited, what would you expect his record to be against good teams? Narduzzi is currently 0-1 against good teams, but we aren't complaining. Let the guy get a few full recruiting classes under his belt and wait until they are juniors or seniors. Then if he isn't winning, he should be on the hotseat.
I don't see any possible way Franklin is under any pressure until at least 2017.
He is not on the hot seat. I believe any coach that takes the PSU job and wins about 8 games (against ANY competition) with no sordid off field problems will be retained, at least for the next 5 to 6 years. The football first crowd, while still influential, has lost some power to Academia, which (like everywhere else) has no real interest in supporting athletics unless financial realities affect their domain. Time will tell.
They have a 100,000 plus seat stadium, and the seats being filled along with an athletic budget the relies on football to carry everything else that trumps academia.
Here is the thing. The bubble got broke with JoPa getting the ax and Sandusky breaking. Every coach for the rest of our lives will be measured up to Joe, maybe no directly, but in the minds of the fan base. And, that isn't just about Ws and Ls, it also is about "CULTURE."
BOB was their kind of guy, conservative. So, even though he left after two seasons people generally are OK with him.
Franklin is not a perfectly square fit in terms of culture. I know this, I live in PSU country, and I can tell the difference with how people talk and act about them. People wanted the chance to meet and talk to O'Brien. They aren't so quick to want to meet and talk to Franklin. His flashy style generates energy generally, and is OK for the most part. But, it isn't something that a lot of the more conservative types really like. And, this is a overall a fairly conservative fanbase.
So, he isn't going to be able to clock 8 win seasons like Weekend at Bernies, because he isn't Joe, and he isn't BOB, either. He is going to have actually win something.
So, yeah, it isn't going to end in the next or two, but if he goes the next three seasons and they don't win something, the fan base IS going to turn on him. And, if the fan base turns on him you will see even more empty seats in Beaver Stadium and when the powers to be see an athletic budget upside down, THAT will drive decision making ...
I say at least 3 years because of his recruiting classes. The one he had last year. And the one he's getting this year. Those classes are pretty good. I think he'll get the chance to coach his own recruits.
No way!!! The guy will get every benefit of the doubt given the situation they're coming out of and the fact he hasn't laid a complete egg. As long as he can keep them bowl eligible and show improvement over the next few years he'll be fine for awhile.
He openly admits to going the Paterno route and scheduling cupcakes OOC. Gonna be hard even for him to not win 8 games per year. He'll continue to rack up meaningless wins and lose the big games and people will think every year they're getting closer. If he keeps recruiting well, maybe they can have a good year every now and then. He will not be on the hot seat any time in the near future. Which could end up being bad for them, which is a plus in my book.
The best thing is that with the teams in their division, they will never win the division, never play for a Big 10-12 title, never be in the playoffs. Ever.
That's impossible to say. These things tend to run in cycles. Who is to say if Harbaugh is going to remain in the college game for an extended period of time? Who is to say if Urban Meyer can keep the Buckeyes at a high level, or the pressure gets to him the way it did at Florida, where he totally let it turn into a dumpster fire before skipping town.
That's impossible to say. These things tend to run in cycles. Who is to say if Harbaugh is going to remain in the college game for an extended period of time? Who is to say if Urban Meyer can keep the Buckeyes at a high level, or the pressure gets to him the way it did at Florida, where he totally let it turn into a dumpster fire before skipping town?
1. James is only leaving if it is on his terms. Firing him is admitting failure and that can't be allowed.
2. If they hold serve, they still finish with eight or nine wins. Most years, that is worthy of an "acceptable" bowl game for a B1G school.
3. They will draw 90k or more with a terrible home schedule and a 6-6 team. Their attendance is more about the party than the game. (See Buffalo this year)
4. The "sanctions" excuse will have legs as long as they want it to. Damaged reputation and all. It's in their mind every single day.
5. The guy is a salesman first. He'll talk himself out of hot water with the AD and the alumni.
2. If they hold serve, they still finish with eight or nine wins. Most years, that is worthy of an "acceptable" bowl game for a B1G school.
3. They will draw 90k or more with a terrible home schedule and a 6-6 team. Their attendance is more about the party than the game. (See Buffalo this year)
4. The "sanctions" excuse will have legs as long as they want it to. Damaged reputation and all. It's in their mind every single day.
5. The guy is a salesman first. He'll talk himself out of hot water with the AD and the alumni.
"TD_6082, post: 427160, member: 510"]Given the situation he inherited, what would you expect his record to be against good teams?
I agree, he has enter a Bigger program that gives him far bigger Resources and he needs tome to adjust to that too, to be fair. he may make some changes in Assistant Coaches and Players Starting too, just like Jackie Sherrill did after his first year as Head Coach and other Great Coaches.
Narduzzi is currently 0-1 against good teams, but we aren't complaining.
No comparisin as far as I am concern. Pitt is a Top 40 Program with Top 50-60 Program in Resources, Attendance, Revenues, Recruiting, Salaries, support, trying to become a Top 25 Program in winning. It is easier to rebuild such a Program but has to regain stability at Chancellor, Athletic Director, Coaches, and adjusting to New ACC Resources being brought to Pitt the last 6 to 7 years. Pitt's goal is re-establishing Stability to increase and rebuild resources to support a Top 25 Program!
Penn State is already a Top 15 Program handling the after effects of a Major Scandal, NCAA Sanctions, President, Athletic Director, Coaches changes with far more Resources and well established (Since 1994) in the Big Ten? They have the Recruiting Camps, Coaching Clinics, Attendance, Revenues and can pay far more with more Staffers. Franklin has them Recruiting at a Higher Level that Paterno only achieved a few times over his 46 years of coaching and recruiting? Franklin job is not just win more but on a Top 25, Top 15, & Top 10 Level and that means beating Big Ten and Top 15 Programs that right now are MSU, Michigan, & Ohio State. That is different goal than the Pitt Program?
Let the guy get a few full recruiting classes under his belt and wait until they are juniors or seniors. Then if he isn't winning, he should be on the hotseat.
Agree, but Franklin has three the problems in accomplishing those goals:
1. EXPECTATIONS: Recruiting in the Top 25, Top 15, and now Top 6th this year has raised Penn State Fans Expectations and has to show he can beat MSU, Michigan and Ohio State and he did not do that last year. If he beats one this year everything will be fine, if not we shall see? In an ironic way, Franklin has to perform and win more now that he is recruiting better than Paterno ever did? Replacing a Legend takes time and years and sometime decades, especially one that was not in compliance with all rules and regulations??
2. DAY GAME COACHING QUESTIONS-Regardless of how great recruiting has been, Penn State still has to compete with Michigan, Ohio State, and MSU and other Big Ten Programs that have just as much Resources. Franklin's Coaching should not be a 6-6 level and should be improving this year by beating Rutgers, Indiana, Maryland, Illinois, and Northwestern this year and either this year MSU, Michigan or OSU with the next 2 years? People have a right to question this about Franklin until he does it?
3. INSTABILITY AT PENN STATE-Penn State University is unstable at the Top due to the scandal remnants, trials, and challenges to Trustees by other Trustees as well Paterno Lawsuits presence in seeking a position for Jay Paterno sooner or later? This is threat to Franklin's Coaching until he wins in the Top 25 and Top 15 and beats MSU, Michigan and OSU?
I don't see any possible way Franklin is under any pressure until at least 2017.
I disagree based on my points above, pressure was on O'Brien and is also more Franklin, because of reduced sanctions, great recruiting and his own success in recruiting and not winning more last and this year so far? The way Franklin conducted his Press Conferences and bragged about being the Dominatrix and now his Qb, OLs, Wrs still have not improved in spite of more game experience and Players drafted in the NFL are bad mouthing his coaching after leaving Penn State?
The pressure on Franklin has come from Franklin is my point!
Bottom line, no question Franklin has to beat MSU, Michigan, and OSU since he is recruiting in their level and he will get his opportunity to do that this and ext 2 to 3 years? Yet, it won't happen beating Army, SDSU, Rutgers, Buffalo, Indiana, and losing to Temple?
Narduzzi is putting pressure on himself as well, but has nothing to lose by doing it! Franklin looks weak running from it too?
I agree, he has enter a Bigger program that gives him far bigger Resources and he needs tome to adjust to that too, to be fair. he may make some changes in Assistant Coaches and Players Starting too, just like Jackie Sherrill did after his first year as Head Coach and other Great Coaches.
Narduzzi is currently 0-1 against good teams, but we aren't complaining.
No comparisin as far as I am concern. Pitt is a Top 40 Program with Top 50-60 Program in Resources, Attendance, Revenues, Recruiting, Salaries, support, trying to become a Top 25 Program in winning. It is easier to rebuild such a Program but has to regain stability at Chancellor, Athletic Director, Coaches, and adjusting to New ACC Resources being brought to Pitt the last 6 to 7 years. Pitt's goal is re-establishing Stability to increase and rebuild resources to support a Top 25 Program!
Penn State is already a Top 15 Program handling the after effects of a Major Scandal, NCAA Sanctions, President, Athletic Director, Coaches changes with far more Resources and well established (Since 1994) in the Big Ten? They have the Recruiting Camps, Coaching Clinics, Attendance, Revenues and can pay far more with more Staffers. Franklin has them Recruiting at a Higher Level that Paterno only achieved a few times over his 46 years of coaching and recruiting? Franklin job is not just win more but on a Top 25, Top 15, & Top 10 Level and that means beating Big Ten and Top 15 Programs that right now are MSU, Michigan, & Ohio State. That is different goal than the Pitt Program?
Let the guy get a few full recruiting classes under his belt and wait until they are juniors or seniors. Then if he isn't winning, he should be on the hotseat.
Agree, but Franklin has three the problems in accomplishing those goals:
1. EXPECTATIONS: Recruiting in the Top 25, Top 15, and now Top 6th this year has raised Penn State Fans Expectations and has to show he can beat MSU, Michigan and Ohio State and he did not do that last year. If he beats one this year everything will be fine, if not we shall see? In an ironic way, Franklin has to perform and win more now that he is recruiting better than Paterno ever did? Replacing a Legend takes time and years and sometime decades, especially one that was not in compliance with all rules and regulations??
2. DAY GAME COACHING QUESTIONS-Regardless of how great recruiting has been, Penn State still has to compete with Michigan, Ohio State, and MSU and other Big Ten Programs that have just as much Resources. Franklin's Coaching should not be a 6-6 level and should be improving this year by beating Rutgers, Indiana, Maryland, Illinois, and Northwestern this year and either this year MSU, Michigan or OSU with the next 2 years? People have a right to question this about Franklin until he does it?
3. INSTABILITY AT PENN STATE-Penn State University is unstable at the Top due to the scandal remnants, trials, and challenges to Trustees by other Trustees as well Paterno Lawsuits presence in seeking a position for Jay Paterno sooner or later? This is threat to Franklin's Coaching until he wins in the Top 25 and Top 15 and beats MSU, Michigan and OSU?
I don't see any possible way Franklin is under any pressure until at least 2017.
I disagree based on my points above, pressure was on O'Brien and is also more Franklin, because of reduced sanctions, great recruiting and his own success in recruiting and not winning more last and this year so far? The way Franklin conducted his Press Conferences and bragged about being the Dominatrix and now his Qb, OLs, Wrs still have not improved in spite of more game experience and Players drafted in the NFL are bad mouthing his coaching after leaving Penn State?
The pressure on Franklin has come from Franklin is my point!
Bottom line, no question Franklin has to beat MSU, Michigan, and OSU since he is recruiting in their level and he will get his opportunity to do that this and ext 2 to 3 years? Yet, it won't happen beating Army, SDSU, Rutgers, Buffalo, Indiana, and losing to Temple?
Narduzzi is putting pressure on himself as well, but has nothing to lose by doing it! Franklin looks weak running from it too?
Yeah, he's not going to get a bunch of years to work this out, especially because his team has seemed to regress this year. He talked a lot about what he will do. Winning 7 or 8 games per year against a bad OOC schedule will not be tolerated for too long, especially since they are paying him $4.4 million/year. O'Brien at least had his team getting better in his two seasons.
The excuses will wear out and he will have to make noise in the conference. He can't win 7 or 8 games but have a losing conference record and not expect to feel some pressure.
His problem is that his game day coaching has always been called into question. If he continues to pull in some players, he still needs to work on his coaching because Meyer, Harbaugh, and Dantonio can all coach and pull in players, too. They also have a track record of winning a lot of games. Franklin does not.
"Jeffburgh, post: 427364, member: 204"]They have a 100,000 plus seat stadium, and the seats being filled along with an athletic budget the relies on football to carry everything else that trumps academia.
Right on, and the current Trustees in Charge & New President & AD want to change that Penn State Culture while other Trustees PS4RS and Alumni want to regain and maintain it?
Here is the thing. The bubble got broke with JoPa getting the ax and Sandusky breaking.
Don't forget the Non-Compliance with NCAA Rules, Clery/Title IX and Laws that allowed the Penn State Players being treated differently from other Students while Publicly saying they were not and they were better than other Programs. It was Paterno's Public Relations along with Sandusky Crimes, and Penn State University refusal to do anything about them that brought down Penn State Program.
Every coach for the rest of our lives will be measured up to Joe, maybe no directly, but in the minds of the fan base. And, that isn't just about Ws and Ls, it also is about "CULTURE."
Spot on for at least 2 to 3 Decades until older Alumni die!
BOB was their kind of guy, conservative. So, even though he left after two seasons people generally are OK with him.
Paterno's undercut him too?
Franklin is not a perfectly square fit in terms of culture. I know this, I live in PSU country, and I can tell the difference with how people talk and act about them.
I agree, there exists some skepticism on Franklin but if he wins and recruits in the top 15 they will embrace and accept him as some as he keeps doing it? The question is like O'Brien does that mean Franklin will accept and forgive them or leave like Bob???
People wanted the chance to meet and talk to O'Brien. They aren't so quick to want to meet and talk to Franklin. His flashy style generates energy generally, and is OK for the most part. But, it isn't something that a lot of the more conservative types really like. And, this is a overall a fairly conservative fanbase.
Exactly, but winning solves it all, so long as it is 10+ games and winning ion the Big Ten and beating Pitt, if he loses to Pitt all 4 years Franklin could be in trouble even if he wins 10+ games?
So, he isn't going to be able to clock 8 win seasons like Weekend at Bernies, because he isn't Joe, and he isn't BOB, either. He is going to have actually win something.
True!
So, yeah, it isn't going to end in the next or two, but if he goes the next three seasons and they don't win something, the fan base IS going to turn on him. And, if the fan base turns on him you will see even more empty seats in Beaver Stadium and when the powers to be see an athletic budget upside down, THAT will drive decision making ...
Dead spot on! Including losing to Pitt! Narduzzi can erase Franklin as threat by beating him all 4 years? So, on Narduzzi too?
Right on, and the current Trustees in Charge & New President & AD want to change that Penn State Culture while other Trustees PS4RS and Alumni want to regain and maintain it?
Here is the thing. The bubble got broke with JoPa getting the ax and Sandusky breaking.
Don't forget the Non-Compliance with NCAA Rules, Clery/Title IX and Laws that allowed the Penn State Players being treated differently from other Students while Publicly saying they were not and they were better than other Programs. It was Paterno's Public Relations along with Sandusky Crimes, and Penn State University refusal to do anything about them that brought down Penn State Program.
Every coach for the rest of our lives will be measured up to Joe, maybe no directly, but in the minds of the fan base. And, that isn't just about Ws and Ls, it also is about "CULTURE."
Spot on for at least 2 to 3 Decades until older Alumni die!
BOB was their kind of guy, conservative. So, even though he left after two seasons people generally are OK with him.
Paterno's undercut him too?
Franklin is not a perfectly square fit in terms of culture. I know this, I live in PSU country, and I can tell the difference with how people talk and act about them.
I agree, there exists some skepticism on Franklin but if he wins and recruits in the top 15 they will embrace and accept him as some as he keeps doing it? The question is like O'Brien does that mean Franklin will accept and forgive them or leave like Bob???
People wanted the chance to meet and talk to O'Brien. They aren't so quick to want to meet and talk to Franklin. His flashy style generates energy generally, and is OK for the most part. But, it isn't something that a lot of the more conservative types really like. And, this is a overall a fairly conservative fanbase.
Exactly, but winning solves it all, so long as it is 10+ games and winning ion the Big Ten and beating Pitt, if he loses to Pitt all 4 years Franklin could be in trouble even if he wins 10+ games?
So, he isn't going to be able to clock 8 win seasons like Weekend at Bernies, because he isn't Joe, and he isn't BOB, either. He is going to have actually win something.
True!
So, yeah, it isn't going to end in the next or two, but if he goes the next three seasons and they don't win something, the fan base IS going to turn on him. And, if the fan base turns on him you will see even more empty seats in Beaver Stadium and when the powers to be see an athletic budget upside down, THAT will drive decision making ...
Dead spot on! Including losing to Pitt! Narduzzi can erase Franklin as threat by beating him all 4 years? So, on Narduzzi too?
"TD_6082, post: 431372, member: 510"]That's impossible to say. These things tend to run in cycles. Who is to say if Harbaugh is going to remain in the college game for an extended period of time? Who is to say if Urban Meyer can keep the Buckeyes at a high level, or the pressure gets to him the way it did at Florida, where he totally let it turn into a dumpster fire before skipping town?
Well, I AM GOING TO SAY IT.......Meyers has proven it at every place he has gone and the first coach to win 20 games at 4 Schools, 2 more seasons than any coach in CFB History? THAT IS FACT that Meyer has proven and Franklin has not????
Harbaugh wins any place he goes including the NFL and CFB and that is a Fact too, that FRANKLIN will have to match at Penn State???
Meyer and Harbaugh have a better Probable to prove than the IMPOSSIBLE just on looking at their Coaching histories, Franklin has to overcome the IMPOSSIBLE by showing he can do the PROBABLE???
Meyers and Harbaugh have done that and I don't have to say it, they have done it?
Well, I AM GOING TO SAY IT.......Meyers has proven it at every place he has gone and the first coach to win 20 games at 4 Schools, 2 more seasons than any coach in CFB History? THAT IS FACT that Meyer has proven and Franklin has not????
Harbaugh wins any place he goes including the NFL and CFB and that is a Fact too, that FRANKLIN will have to match at Penn State???
Meyer and Harbaugh have a better Probable to prove than the IMPOSSIBLE just on looking at their Coaching histories, Franklin has to overcome the IMPOSSIBLE by showing he can do the PROBABLE???
Meyers and Harbaugh have done that and I don't have to say it, they have done it?
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So are you saying that Franklin needs those coaches to be gone in order to be successful in the Big 10? If so, we actually agree on something. That's not a ringing endorsement for Franklin.
Yes, things go in cycles, but those coaches have maintained success for an extended period of time. They seem to make it through cycles.
No, He can still be successful in tbe Big 10 & I think he will be. It depends on how you define success. The SEC has several successful coaches even though not all of them have a SEC Title to show for it.
Meyer & Harbaugh are 2 of the top 3 coaches in the game. Of course Franklin isnt in the same class as those guys. Let's not get crazy.
The Big 10 is full of good coaches. We are in a league where arguably the best coach couldn't CUT it in the SEC. Did you like the pun?
"TD_6082, post: 431834, member: 510"]No, He can still be successful in tbe Big 10 & I think he will be.
I agree in part but Franklin still has not proven it:
2014:
L- Northwestern 29-6
L- Michigan State 34-10
L- Ohio State 31-24
L- Michigan 18-13
L- Illinois 16-14
L- Maryland 20-19
W- Indiana 13-7
W- Rutgers 13-10
2-6 Big Ten First Year:
2015:
L- Ohio State 38-10
W- Rutgers 28-3
W- Indiana 29-7
?- Maryland
?- Ilinois
?- Northwestern
?- Michigan
?- Michigan State
Any Guesses?
It depends on how you define success. The SEC has several successful coaches even though not all of them have a SEC Title to show for it.
Every Conference has that not just SEC & Big Ten?
Meyer & Harbaugh are 2 of the top 3 coaches in the game.
Also, Two Programs with most Wins, Revenues, and Resources and so is Nebraska, Penn State, & Wisconsin, but have been beaten by MSU, Iowa, Northwestern and other less Historical & Prolific Programs?
Of course Franklin isnt in the same class as those guys. Let's not get crazy.
This is the point is it NOT???? Franklin has to be just as good as them with a Program just as Rich as them, and if he isn't, Penn State Fans won't accept Franklin like they did under Paterno that had trouble beating Michigan, Ohio State, Nebraska, Wisconsin Iowa, and some others since joining the Big Ten???
I agree in part but Franklin still has not proven it:
2014:
L- Northwestern 29-6
L- Michigan State 34-10
L- Ohio State 31-24
L- Michigan 18-13
L- Illinois 16-14
L- Maryland 20-19
W- Indiana 13-7
W- Rutgers 13-10
2-6 Big Ten First Year:
2015:
L- Ohio State 38-10
W- Rutgers 28-3
W- Indiana 29-7
?- Maryland
?- Ilinois
?- Northwestern
?- Michigan
?- Michigan State
Any Guesses?
It depends on how you define success. The SEC has several successful coaches even though not all of them have a SEC Title to show for it.
Every Conference has that not just SEC & Big Ten?
Meyer & Harbaugh are 2 of the top 3 coaches in the game.
Also, Two Programs with most Wins, Revenues, and Resources and so is Nebraska, Penn State, & Wisconsin, but have been beaten by MSU, Iowa, Northwestern and other less Historical & Prolific Programs?
Of course Franklin isnt in the same class as those guys. Let's not get crazy.
This is the point is it NOT???? Franklin has to be just as good as them with a Program just as Rich as them, and if he isn't, Penn State Fans won't accept Franklin like they did under Paterno that had trouble beating Michigan, Ohio State, Nebraska, Wisconsin Iowa, and some others since joining the Big Ten???
He isnt going to be as good as them and there is no hire they can make that will be as good as them.
Funny how the biggest criticism of Franklin on this board is that he hasn't beaten any good teams. We are slobbering all over Narduzzi and he has yet to win a game against a decent opponent. Very strange.
Funny how the biggest criticism of Franklin on this board is that he hasn't beaten any good teams. We are slobbering all over Narduzzi and he has yet to win a game against a decent opponent. Very strange.
