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Izzo sounding like SMF on transfer portal

Sean Miller Fan

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Oct 30, 2001
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Pretty much exact quotes.

Also, this plays a big part: BballinsiderfromPitt actually had a contribution to this board a few months ago when he said something like "kids like to be recruited, they don't like to be coached." We are going so over the top in recruiting, treating these kids like heads of state on their OV's that its leaving that subliminal impression on them. Why stay and play for a coach who yelled at you or who doesn't play you 32 minutes per game when you can go get RECRUITED again and 20 college coaches can tell you that you're the next Kobe.
 

Pretty much exact quotes.

Also, this plays a big part: BballinsiderfromPitt actually had a contribution to this board a few months ago when he said something like "kids like to be recruited, they don't like to be coached." We are going so over the top in recruiting, treating these kids like heads of state on their OV's that its leaving that subliminal impression on them. Why stay and play for a coach who yelled at you or who doesn't play you 32 minutes per game when you can go get RECRUITED again and 20 college coaches can tell you that you're the next Kobe.
I don’t know. Duke UNC final 4 was one of the largest watched F4 games in recent history. The same 4 programs we see every other year were in the final 4. His best shooter was from the transfer portal. Coaches crying about the portal is pretty lame but at least Izzo hasn’t jumped jobs 5 times. Someone like Tubby Smith crying about it last year when he left Minnesota and Texas tech during their basketball banquets is rich.
 
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I don’t know. Duke UNC final 4 was one of the largest watched F4 games in recent history. The same 4 programs we see every other year were in the final 4. His best shooter was from the transfer portal. Coaches crying about the portal is pretty lame but at least Izzo hasn’t jumped jobs 5 times. Someone like Tubby Smith crying about it last year when he left Minnesota and Texas tech during their basketball banquets is rich.
Well, lets not congratulate college basketball on getting people to watch a Duke/UNC FF game. Duke/UNC in Coach K's potential last game is honestly the best college basketball matchup of all time.
 
Well, lets not congratulate college basketball on getting people to watch a Duke/UNC FF game. Duke/UNC in Coach K's potential last game is honestly the best college basketball matchup of all time.
All time. Right? How bout UCLA vs Houston-Astrodome in 1968. Even Ewing vs Sampson in the early 80s. Or NCState vs UCLA in 1974.
 

Pretty much exact quotes.

Also, this plays a big part: BballinsiderfromPitt actually had a contribution to this board a few months ago when he said something like "kids like to be recruited, they don't like to be coached." We are going so over the top in recruiting, treating these kids like heads of state on their OV's that its leaving that subliminal impression on them. Why stay and play for a coach who yelled at you or who doesn't play you 32 minutes per game when you can go get RECRUITED again and 20 college coaches can tell you that you're the next Kobe.
Ummmm.....haven't I been saying the same thing. Kids want attention, want to be told their the greatest, how they can help a team. Once they are recruited, they are nothing but pond scum who is yelled at, and realize they aren't so special after all. So why not be loved again?

I mean this is basic human wants and needs. Why get married, when you can have that "new" relationship feeling again and again.

I firmly believe this is solely responsible for 50% of these transfers, has nothing to do with situation and PT. Secondly, these kids have been cultivated and expect this type of behavior because now most of them go to 2, maybe 3 different High Schools before college.
 
All time. Right? How bout UCLA vs Houston-Astrodome in 1968. Even Ewing vs Sampson in the early 80s. Or NCState vs UCLA in 1974.
Yea, you can certainly make the case that Duke/UNC in the FF was the best matchup ever. Just based on the rivalry, stage, and Coach K.
 
Ummmm.....haven't I been saying the same thing. Kids want attention, want to be told their the greatest, how they can help a team. Once they are recruited, they are nothing but pond scum who is yelled at, and realize they aren't so special after all. So why not be loved again?

I mean this is basic human wants and needs. Why get married, when you can have that "new" relationship feeling again and again.

I firmly believe this is solely responsible for 50% of these transfers, has nothing to do with situation and PT. Secondly, these kids have been cultivated and expect this type of behavior because now most of them go to 2, maybe 3 different High Schools before college.
They start that now at age 8 or 9. These kids change travel baseball, soccer, etc teams every year for various reasons. Their parents instill the attitude in them that if things aren't absolutely perfect, they look for a new team.
 
It now makes sense why lots of folks have thought Izzo has been losing his touch in last couple of years. His mind has fallen to the point of thinking at the same level of a registered moron.
 
Yea, you can certainly make the case that Duke/UNC in the FF was the best matchup ever. Just based on the rivalry, stage, and Coach K.

I can see someone making that argument, just not you, what with your often stated opinion of ACC ball.
 
And he’s 100% in the right.


Sure.

I mean assuming that you think that the people who get paid millions should be treated better than the people who make relatively speaking almost nothing.

It is astounding the number of people who side with the millionaires over the people who actually play the game. If the current transfer rules are so onerous to Izzo or any other coach feels the need to quit the game will survive just fine without him. I wonder what the game would look like without the players?
 
Sure.

I mean assuming that you think that the people who get paid millions should be treated better than the people who make relatively speaking almost nothing.

It is astounding the number of people who side with the millionaires over the people who actually play the game. If the current transfer rules are so onerous to Izzo or any other coach feels the need to quit the game will survive just fine without him. I wonder what the game would look like without the players?
Define what “just fine” looks like. Because if the current portal/transfer rules continue as is for a few years, this game won’t look anything like the one I have known and loved my whole life.
 
Define what “just fine” looks like. Because if the current portal/transfer rules continue as is for a few years, this game won’t look anything like the one I have known and loved my whole life.


Sure it will. College basketball has always been made up of transient rosters that change every year. All that the current rules have done is accelerate what had always been happening.

And even if the game won't look exactly the same, so what? Why is it that you want the game to cater to the millionaires and the schools instead of the players? The coaches aren't the game, as much as ESPN and some others might want you to think so. The schools certainly aren't the game. The players are the game. If they can do something that benefits the players who play the game that makes the millionaire's job slightly more difficult, so what?

But hey, maybe this would be a good compromise. Instead of the coaches getting all the money and the players having the freedom to transfer, let's make the transfer rules go back to exactly the way that they were before, and in exchange we can take all the money that the coaches and administrators make and pay it to the players instead. Have coaches like Izzo make, say, $100K per year. But they can have the old roster rules.

Do you think Izzo or any of the other coaches go for that? Of course not, because at the end of the day what they want is their money.
 
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Sure it will. College basketball has always been made up of transient rosters that change every year. All that the current rules have done is accelerate what had always been happening.

And even if the game won't look exactly the same, so what? Why is it that you want the game to cater to the millionaires and the schools instead of the players? The coaches aren't the game, as much as ESPN and some others might want you to think so. The schools certainly aren't the game. The players are the game. If they can do something that benefits the players who play the game that makes the millionaire's job slightly more difficult, so what?

But hey, maybe this would be a good compromise. Instead of the coaches getting all the money and the players having the freedom to transfer, let's make the transfer rules go back to exactly the way that they were before, and in exchange we can take all the money that the coaches and administrators make and pay it to the players instead. Have coaches like Izzo make, say, $100K per year. But they can have the old roster rules.

Do you think Izzo or any of the other coaches go for that? Of course not, because at the end of the day what they want is their money.
We will never agree on this subject.my perspective on this is as a lifelong college basketball fan. I don’t give a shit that until now 18-22 year old kids didn’t make money in addition to getting a free college education while playing 3-4 years of basketball at the school they chose to attend. I don’t give a shit that the schools generate a ton of revenue from their basketball and football programs. It doesn’t bother me that coaches get paid big sums of money to run those programs. Tradition, love of team and school, and the passion of competing and playing for something beyond money or selfish motivation-those are the reasons I live college basketball. The absence of those things is the reason I could care less about pro basketball.

Now we are turning the college game into a quasi-professional sport, the players are just mercenaries with less regulation or restraint than actual pro athletes have.

The game already has one NBA. And it totally sucks. It’s garbage. I can’t understand why anyone would want another one.
 
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We will never agree on this subject.my perspective on this is as a lifelong college basketball fan. I don’t give a shit that until now 18-22 year old kids didn’t make money in addition to getting a free college education while playing 3-4 years of basketball at the school they chose to attend. I don’t give a shit that the schools generate a ton of revenue from their basketball and football programs. It doesn’t bother me that coaches get paid big sums of money to run those programs. Tradition, love of team and school, and the passion of competing and playing for something beyond money or selfish motivation-those are the reasons I live college basketball. The absence of those things is the reason I could care less about pro basketball.

Now we are turning the college game into a quasi-professional sport, the players are just mercenaries with less regulation or restraint than actual pro athletes have.

The game already has one NBA. And it totally sucks. It’s garbage. I can’t understand why anyone would want another one.
Tell me you don't understand NBA basketball without saying you don't understand NBA basketball.
 
Tell me you don't understand NBA basketball without saying you don't understand NBA basketball.
I understand the NBA game just fine. What does that have to do with my opinion? I don’t enjoy the NBA product for a multitude of reasons. Plenty of people do. I’m not one of them. I don’t like NFL football either, whereas I love college football. For the same reasons. College basketball does a lot more for me than the pro game. But it’s rapidly trending away from what I love about it.
 
We will never agree on this subject.my perspective on this is as a lifelong college basketball fan. I don’t give a shit that until now 18-22 year old kids didn’t make money in addition to getting a free college education while playing 3-4 years of basketball at the school they chose to attend. I don’t give a shit that the schools generate a ton of revenue from their basketball and football programs. It doesn’t bother me that coaches get paid big sums of money to run those programs. Tradition, love of team and school, and the passion of competing and playing for something beyond money or selfish motivation-those are the reasons I live college basketball. The absence of those things is the reason I could care less about pro basketball.

Now we are turning the college game into a quasi-professional sport, the players are just mercenaries with less regulation or restraint than actual pro athletes have.

The game already has one NBA. And it totally sucks. It’s garbage. I can’t understand why anyone would want another one.
Rip Van Winkle… is that you?
 
All time. Right? How bout UCLA vs Houston-Astrodome in 1968. Even Ewing vs Sampson in the early 80s. Or NCState vs UCLA in 1974.
Or Pitt vs. UCONN twice in 2009???? Or Pitt vs. OK at the Pete??? Pitt vs. Duke in 2007?
 
We will never agree on this subject.my perspective on this is as a lifelong college basketball fan. I don’t give a shit that until now 18-22 year old kids didn’t make money in addition to getting a free college education while playing 3-4 years of basketball at the school they chose to attend. I don’t give a shit that the schools generate a ton of revenue from their basketball and football programs. It doesn’t bother me that coaches get paid big sums of money to run those programs. Tradition, love of team and school, and the passion of competing and playing for something beyond money or selfish motivation-those are the reasons I live college basketball. The absence of those things is the reason I could care less about pro basketball.


But here's the thing. The coaches aren't coaching for the tradition or the love of the team or the school, and they certainly aren't coaching for something beyond money or selfish motivations. And if you want to argue that the schools have these programs for those same sorts of reasons, assuming we are talking about schools at the P6 level, well that's just so far divorced from reality that it's hilarious.

You have this idealize version of college athletics in your head that at the highest levels simply has not existed in literally decades. Perhaps you have been able to fool yourself into thinking that everything is still like it was in the 50s. But it isn't. It hasn't been in a long time. The notion that the schools should be making millions of dollars and the coaches should be making millions of dollars, all while not giving a rat's ass about things like tradition and competing for something beyond money, but the players, well, hey, the players should be the ones to care about those things and not the money is nuts. Simply nuts.
 
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]
Not all trends are good ones. But since this is such a great thing for the sport and the athletes, let’s restrict their money to crypto.
You pine for a game that hasn't existed since before you were born.
 
... because now most of them go to 2, maybe 3 different High Schools before college.
IMO opinion, the places many of them go are not even high schools, they're basketball or football teams with online GED programs only having that level of academics so they can claim they are a high school! I'd like to get a copy of the Bishop Sycamore year book? I'd love to see a picture of their homecoming queen :)
 
]

You pine for a game that hasn't existed since before you were born.
Until recently, enough vestiges of that game you mock still existed to at least maintain a pretty stark surface differential between college and pro basketball, even to the extent it's somewhat of a facade. The big money has always been there in the shadows, but the appearance of amateur athletics was at least there.

I suspect there are a lot more college sports fans, alums of schools, and current students that see this whole picture my way than yours or Joe's, including the younger fans that you are absurdly relating yourselves to. This idea that the poor college revenue sport athletes are just being ruthlessly exploited for the financial gain of the universities etc. is quaint but laughable. Those guys have always lived like kings at their schools, with privileges non-athlete students can't comprehend. This working class hero, stand up for the poor downtrodden 18 year old major college basketball player is utter nonsense. Playing college basketball in exchange for a free $200-$300,000 education is not a job, it's a privilege. You want to see real exploitation, look at where and how your shoes or your shirt are made.
 
Sure it will. College basketball has always been made up of transient rosters that change every year. All that the current rules have done is accelerate what had always been happening.

And even if the game won't look exactly the same, so what? Why is it that you want the game to cater to the millionaires and the schools instead of the players? The coaches aren't the game, as much as ESPN and some others might want you to think so. The schools certainly aren't the game. The players are the game. If they can do something that benefits the players who play the game that makes the millionaire's job slightly more difficult, so what?

But hey, maybe this would be a good compromise. Instead of the coaches getting all the money and the players having the freedom to transfer, let's make the transfer rules go back to exactly the way that they were before, and in exchange we can take all the money that the coaches and administrators make and pay it to the players instead. Have coaches like Izzo make, say, $100K per year. But they can have the old roster rules.

Do you think Izzo or any of the other coaches go for that? Of course not, because at the end of the day what they want is their money.
- The NCAA has to look out for 2 groups of people: the players and the paying customers (ie fans). The rule sounds like the right thing to do for players though when you really think about, I'm not sure giving these kids easy outs is the best thing for them long-term.

- The NCAA has to be greatly concerned about the effect on its paying customers. Its a billion dollar business and its customers liked the old setup of HS recruiting and watching kids develop over 4 years. That is now gone. Its a completely different game now as most teams are now just AAU teams or pickup-style teams of players nobody knows which change year to year.
 
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- The NCAA has to look out for 2 groups of people: the players and the paying customers (ie fans). The rule sounds like the right thing to do for players though when you really think about, I'm not sure giving these kids easy outs is the best thing for them long-term.

- The NCAA has to be greatly concerned about the effect on its paying customers. Its a billion dollar business and its customers liked the old setup of HS recruiting and watching kids develop over 4 years. That is now gone. Its a completely different game now as most teams are now just AAU teams or pickup-style teams of players nobody knows which change year to year.
I don't think the NCAA owes the fans anything. They can always revert to StubHub, or just watch at home. But I'm guessing this nonsense will reduce grad rates. Hope I'm wrong on that.
 
I don't think the NCAA owes the fans anything. They can always revert to StubHub, or just watch at home. But I'm guessing this nonsense will reduce grad rates. Hope I'm wrong on that.
Yes, it makes great business sense to ignore the preferences of the paying customers
 
Yes, it makes great business sense to ignore the preferences of the paying customers
The NCAA doesn't deal directly with the fans, they are a voluntary organization that services the schools and the athletes. The schools should attempt to keep the fans happy, but some don't much care. Fans don't fund the NCAA.
 
The NCAA doesn't deal directly with the fans, they are a voluntary organization that services the schools and the athletes. The schools should attempt to keep the fans happy, but some don't much care. Fans don't fund the NCAA.
Fans fund the NCAA's schools' basketball and football programs. The NCAA absolutely has to answer to its paying fans. Pick-up ball isnt going to sell over the long-term.
 
Fans fund the NCAA's schools' basketball and football programs. The NCAA absolutely has to answer to its paying fans. Pick-up ball isnt going to sell over the long-term.
So the NCAA should fire coaches?? Help with recruiting?? Design unis?
No... they MUST stay out of the relationships between the NCAA & the fans. Those dickheads just screw things up. So if Idaho Fracking College hires Todd Graham or Book Richarardson they have to get the consequences. Otherwise, theNCAA fan favorites will get even more special treatment.
Should the Feds tell people how to run their businesses?? Or will the consumer establish the level of success??
 
So the NCAA should fire coaches?? Help with recruiting?? Design unis?
No... they MUST stay out of the relationships between the NCAA & the fans. Those dickheads just screw things up. So if Idaho Fracking College hires Todd Graham or Book Richarardson they have to get the consequences. Otherwise, theNCAA fan favorites will get even more special treatment.
Should the Feds tell people how to run their businesses?? Or will the consumer establish the level of success??
No, they should make rules that help, not hurt the business of NCAA Basketball. Customers dont want to see pick-up teams
 
No, they should make rules that help, not hurt the business of NCAA Basketball. Customers dont want to see pick-up teams
The solution is to stop pretending and collectively bargain with a yet-to-be formed player union. Schools/ fans get less player movement. Players get more money and control. How Title IX requirements will conflict with NLRB rules might make a few lawyers mighty wealthy.
 
No, they should make rules that help, not hurt the business of NCAA Basketball. Customers dont want to see pick-up teams
Nice try. It;s STILL the schools' responsibility. The portal and NIL are a disaster, Thanks, NCAA.
Relationships between people & schools shouldn't be handled by bureaucrats.
 
But here's the thing. The coaches aren't coaching for the tradition or the love of the team or the school, and they certainly aren't coaching for something beyond money or selfish motivations. And if you want to argue that the schools have these programs for those same sorts of reasons, assuming we are talking about schools at the P6 level, well that's just so far divorced from reality that it's hilarious.

You have this idealize version of college athletics in your head that at the highest levels simply has not existed in literally decades. Perhaps you have been able to fool yourself into thinking that everything is still like it was in the 50s. But it isn't. It hasn't been in a long time. The notion that the schools should be making millions of dollars and the coaches should be making millions of dollars, all while not giving a rat's ass about things like tradition and competing for something beyond money, but the players, well, hey, the players should be the ones to care about those things and not the money is nuts. Simply nuts.
I actually totally agree with you on this subject and have been saying this for awhile . Offering kids who’ve come to your school to primarily play bb and pursue bb as a career a chance to take English lit for free while paying their coach 3.5 million seems criminal to me .

The transfer portal is proof enough that playing ball is the main reason these kids choose their schools .

Pay the kids and the longer you stay at your original school the more you get and if you transfer you it costs you money unless there’s a coaching change .
 
Ummmm.....haven't I been saying the same thing. Kids want attention, want to be told their the greatest, how they can help a team. Once they are recruited, they are nothing but pond scum who is yelled at, and realize they aren't so special after all. So why not be loved again?

I mean this is basic human wants and needs. Why get married, when you can have that "new" relationship feeling again and again.

I firmly believe this is solely responsible for 50% of these transfers, has nothing to do with situation and PT. Secondly, these kids have been cultivated and expect this type of behavior because now most of them go to 2, maybe 3 different High Schools before college.
Yeah it's a Robbie Benson world in ONE on One. Not happy, shove it where the sun don't shine with a red hot poker!
 
Nice try. It;s STILL the schools' responsibility. The portal and NIL are a disaster, Thanks, NCAA.
Relationships between people & schools shouldn't be handled by bureaucrats.
Should the NCAA have no rules then? Should players be able to change teams on a weekly basis without sitting out? Are you for complete college basketball anarchy? I think I already know that answer.
 
Should the NCAA have no rules then? Should players be able to change teams on a weekly basis without sitting out? Are you for complete college basketball anarchy? I think I already know that answer.


You know that the NCAA is just the schools, right? And that there are no NCAA rules that aren't approved by the schools, right?

The current transfer rules aren't in place because the NCAA wanted them, they are in place because the schools wanted them.
 
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