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OT Best Athlete to come out of Western PA?

David Alston " The Forgotten Legend "

On August 15, 1942, Dave Alston, star of the 1941 Penn State freshman football team, died from complications following a tonsillectomy operation about 6 weeks prior to his highly anticipated regular season varsity football debut. The 20 year old sophomore pre-medical student had been a dominant halfback on the undefeated Penn State freshman football squad (freshman were not allowed to play varsity football at that time), and was expected to lead the varsity squad to a similar record during the 1942 season. Alston and his younger brother Harry – who also played on the 1941 freshman team – are reported to be the first African American football players at Penn State.



Weighing over 200 lbs and standing well over six foot tall, Alston was a triple-threat on the gridiron. He ran with amazing speed, was an exceptionally accurate passer, and could kick more than 60 yards. He was often compared with such greats as Jim Thorpe and Paul Robeson by Penn State football coach, Bob Higgins, and other football experts. Higgins called Alston “the greatest player I ever coached.” Alston had been named the top sophomore football player in the nation by the Saturday Evening Post and a preseason All-American by Esquire Magazine.

Alston was exceptional off the field as well. The son of a minister, he had been president and class valedictorian at a mostly white Midland High School (Midland, PA), as well as a basketball, baseball and football star. In addition, he was an accomplished singer and pianist. At Penn State he was known as a friendly, intelligent, and fun loving excellent student who wanted to be a “good doctor” one day.

This post was edited on 3/28 7:27 PM by Drax1975
 
If you are talking about "athletes" only, I would nominate Gateway High School's and Pitt grad, Curtis Bray. I believe I read somewhere that he earned 14 varsity letters during his time at Gateway. He earned his letters in football, basketball and track/field.
Also, I believe that he won the Gatorade National High School Football Player of the Year in 1987.
Earned 4 varsity letters while at Pitt, if I'm not mistaken.
Sadly, he is no longer with us, but he was a truly great athlete and an even better person.
 
I love these conversations re "best athletes." But the OP, imo, both opens and closes the argument. Hands down, Richard Morrow Groat. The OP listed Groat's accomplishments at both Duke and the Pirates, but let us not forget what he did for the St. Louis Cardinals in 1964. Won the World Series, was the starting SS, had 636 at bats, 70 RBI, batted .292 and struck out only 42 times and had OBP of .335. And he was 33 years old. His resume is unparalleled. But after all is said, what is most impressive, as stated, is that his uniform hangs from Cameron. For all of us follicle challenged, Groat is The Man.
 
Originally posted by ricflair4LIFE:

Originally posted by HonestPitt:
Did Groat play against African Americans?
Yes.

Guys like Willie Mays, Earnie Banks, etc.
I am not talking sprinkles, I am talking full integration. The first African American did not play in the ACC until 1965, so that one goes out the door. If you are not playing against the best, then you are not the best. Please take Babe Ruth with you also.
 
https://espn.go.com/sportscentury/athletes.html

I used the google tool like someone suggested and Groat is on no Greatest Athlete lists, but Marino, Montana, and Unitas are. Are you guys old? That would explain a lot. Not sure Bo Jackson won any MVP's and he is not from WPA, but he is the athlete and there is no comparison.
 
Originally posted by Las Panteras:


Originally posted by quip:
It has to be Aliquippa native Pistol Pete Maravich. He averaged over 40 points per game for his career without the 3 point shot at LSU!
Question......

How many high school games did Maravich play in western Pa?

Since he left this area at age 10.....and starred at a high school in south Carolina......the answer is zero.

I would say that pistol Pete was every bit as much the greatest from this area as I was.. Which is to say he isn't even in the discussion.

D minus

This post was edited on 3/28 4:32 PM by Las Panteras
Another question, what other sport was Maravich great at?
 
Re: Brian Davis


Originally posted by recruitsreadtheseboards:
Originally posted by daminals76:
Brian Davis going away... Nobody else is even close.
Brian Davis over Dick Groat? Are you stupid?
Davis was the best ever to come out of PA.

Its not even close.
 
Originally posted by HonestPitt:

Originally posted by ricflair4LIFE:


Originally posted by HonestPitt:
Did Groat play against African Americans?
Yes.

Guys like Willie Mays, Earnie Banks, etc.
I am not talking sprinkles, I am talking full integration. The first African American did not play in the ACC until 1965, so that one goes out the door. If you are not playing against the best, then you are not the best. Please take Babe Ruth with you also.

Originally posted by HonestPitt:

Originally posted by ricflair4LIFE:


Originally posted by HonestPitt:
Did Groat play against African Americans?
Yes.

Guys like Willie Mays, Earnie Banks, etc.
I am not talking sprinkles, I am talking full integration. The first African American did not play in the ACC until 1965, so that one goes out the door. If you are not playing against the best, then you are not the best. Please take Babe Ruth with you also.
True, but actually there were more African Americans in MLB during Groat's career than there are now. For that matter, the NBA didn't have black players until 1954. But, how about the WPIAL (he did play for Swissvale High School)?
 
So he is the greatest athlete of their era. You cannot dismiss guys so fast because someone starred in sports that barely allowed everyone to participate. Marino and Montana are greats at what they did, this dude is not mentioned as being great at anything except here.
 
Re: Brian Davis

Originally posted by daminals76:


Originally posted by recruitsreadtheseboards:

Originally posted by daminals76:
Brian Davis going away... Nobody else is even close.
Brian Davis over Dick Groat? Are you stupid?
Davis was the best ever to come out of PA.

Its not even close.
Really? What major league sports did he play? We are not talking "potential" here. We are talking "best". You are getting this confused. Brian Davis did NOTHING with those talents.
 
This post should continue as "other than Dick Groat...."

Honorable Mention....Carlton Haselrig..Won state heavyweight wrestling championship from a high school without a wrestling program and went on to win two division 1 national championships coming out of division II UPJ. Went on to earn a pro bowl status as a lineman in the NFL without every playing football in college. Most notably however, he was my backup at Garfield Jr High in Johnstown....
 
If you competed against watered down competition, you should not be on this list. Do you know how many yards Brian Davis would run for against Hickory High? How many points Major Harris would score? How many yards Montana and Marino would throw for? It is weird that sports publications have Marino and Montana on greatest list of ALL TIME everywhere, but no mention of Groat. Did those publications forget all his accolades? He would not even get a scholarship to Duke today and if by chance he did, he would never play. You cannot just discard guys because they do not have their jersey retired from a Era that did not have the best athletes playing.
 
The pitching in baseball today is nowhere near as good as what Groat saw.

Guys pitched inside....knocked batters down. And the pitching wasnt as diluted as it is today.

Groat would be a star in MLB today.
 
Re: Brian Davis


Originally posted by daminals76:

Originally posted by recruitsreadtheseboards:
Originally posted by daminals76:
Brian Davis going away... Nobody else is even close.
Brian Davis over Dick Groat? Are you stupid?
Davis was the best ever to come out of PA.

Its not even close.
Brian Davis was the national HS player of the year. A phenomenal talent that as we all know....pissed his future away.

But Lavar Arrington and Bill Fralic were ALSO national high school players of the year.....and went on to do far more with their careers than that bum Brian Davis did.

So by extension.....Arrington and Fralic would be far better nominees than Brian Davis, a lifetime member of the Bum of the Month Club.

Comparing Brian Davis to Groat, or Marino, or Montana or even Pryor is like comparing Subway to Ruth Criss.
 
It is weird that sports publications have Marino and Montana on greatest list of ALL TIME everywhere......they are on greatest "athlete" lists? Pretty sure that Jim Thorpe is listed in a lot of "sports publications" but competed against watered down competition.
 
Originally posted by Las Panteras:
The pitching in baseball today is nowhere near as good as what Groat saw.

Guys pitched inside....knocked batters down. And the pitching wasnt as diluted as it is today.

Groat would be a star in MLB today.
They were throwing in the 100's? Could he play at Duke now? So he was good in basketball, but questionable in basketball? If these questions need to be asked, there is a problem. He obvious was slow and could not jump, kind of requirements for atheltes.
 
Originally posted by HonestPitt:


Originally posted by Las Panteras:
The pitching in baseball today is nowhere near as good as what Groat saw.

Guys pitched inside....knocked batters down. And the pitching wasnt as diluted as it is today.

Groat would be a star in MLB today.
They were throwing in the 100's? Could he play at Duke now? So he was good in basketball, but questionable in basketball? If these questions need to be asked, there is a problem. He obvious was slow and could not jump, kind of requirements for atheltes.
He is 80something, of course he can't play at Duke now.

Let me say this s-l-o-w-l-y. "So he was good in basketball, but questionable in basketball"? What on hell does this mean? English please.

He was NATIONAL PLAYER OF THE YEAR. 2 TIME ALL AMERICAN. He was drafted 3rd overall in the NBA draft. That is not 3rd rd, but 3rd overall.

Whether his skills translates from then to now is immaterial. The guy was an MVP and All Star in MLB. He was an All American and POY at Duke. What aren't you getting?
 
Did someone really say Brian Davis? Why, because he had a nice run against Boston College?? Hilarious, I'm gonna go ahead and assume that person was joking..
 
Originally posted by Pghfan:

Did someone really say Brian Davis? Why, because he had a nice run against Boston College?? Hilarious, I'm gonna go ahead and assume that person was joking..
Well that and the fact that he jumped Center for Wash High when they won the AA PIAA title. I guess that is more impressive than being All American (twice) and player of the Year in College BB at Duke. I guess in some people's minds....of course seeing the aptitude in Pittsburgh it is not surprising.
 
Funny! I watched Carlton win 3 D1 NCAA championships. Also won 3 D 2 championships.
 
Originally posted by YourPittDanceTeam:
If you are talking about "athletes" only, I would nominate Gateway High School's and Pitt grad, Curtis Bray. I believe I read somewhere that he earned 14 varsity letters during his time at Gateway. He earned his letters in football, basketball and track/field.
Also, I believe that he won the Gatorade National High School Football Player of the Year in 1987.
Earned 4 varsity letters while at Pitt, if I'm not mistaken.
Sadly, he is no longer with us, but he was a truly great athlete and an even better person.
Curtis Bray recruited me coming out of high school when he was at Villanova. As classy of a guy as you could find in the profession - even when I chose to go elsewhere. Truly was a great person.
 
Originally posted by recruitsreadtheseboards:

Originally posted by Pghfan:

Did someone really say Brian Davis? Why, because he had a nice run against Boston College?? Hilarious, I'm gonna go ahead and assume that person was joking..
Well that and the fact that he jumped Center for Wash High when they won the AA PIAA title. I guess that is more impressive than being All American (twice) and player of the Year in College BB at Duke. I guess in some people's minds....of course seeing the aptitude in Pittsburgh it is not surprising.
In high school. You are comparing a black Ed Bundy to a COLLEGE all American and Hall of fame player and a Professional baseball player.. Hey recruits, there was this kid down the street from me growing up who was awesome at HORSE, should we compare him to Connie Hawkins??
 
What your not getting is that he did not play basketball against the best "athletes" so his basketball accomplishments are sketchy. I understand you guys are old and want to hold on to that for good Ole western Pa.
 
Originally posted by Drax1975:

Maybe this will satisfy some people here, good read. A few athletes not mentioned before , or for that matter, not known to some of you.
Mike (August 27, 2006). "WPIAL 100 years: These are the athletes who have helped define it". Pittsburgh Post-Gazette.
Look everyone the Post Gazette is now a credible source. When it does not fit everyone's argument here, it is not worth shit, but now it is the authority. Use your friends tool google and type best athletes ever by state. I have yet to find Dick Groat on any of these lists.
 
Re: Brian Davis

Originally posted by daminals76:
Brian Davis going away... Nobody else is even close.
Brian Davis over Dick Groat? Are you stupid?
Davis was the best ever to come out of PA.

Its not even close.
Really? What major league sports did he play? We are not talking "potential" here. We are talking "best". You are getting this confused. Brian Davis did NOTHING with those talents.
Lol all your little rules are ridiculous... Davis easily was the best ever to come out of PA.
Its not even an argument...
 
You are comparing a black Ed Bundy ....Who the hell is Ed Bundy?
 
I cannot believe that no one has mentioned Carnegie native Honus Wagner. Until the coming of Babe Ruth many considered him the greatest baseball player ever (including Ty Cobb), a status few others named here can claim. As far as other sports go Wagner was also considered very proficient in basketball, which was then in it's infancy.

Jim Thorpe would obviously trump any previously mentioned, but he was Oklahoma born and raised.

Brian Davis is a poor mans Marcus Dupree, who accomplished about 1/10th of what Dupree did.

If you wanted to talk about greatest athletes ever to go along with Bo Jackson, look at what Jackie Robinson did in a wide variety of sports. I've always maintained that Robinson was overrated as a baseball player, but way underrated as an overall athlete. Wilt Chamberlain is another who could excel in almost any sport he chose.
 
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