OT: It's August 8th, month before camp and Sidney Crosby has yet to sign a contract

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

He has a year left and now is the time usually extensions are handed out. You all know I am the biggest Pens fan and big Sid fan. But looking ahead, why really would he want to resign here? He has been great the past two seasons, healthy and the Pens missed the playoffs. If I were him, I would seriously contemplate do I want to go through a true rebuild? Sid owes allegiance to nothing. Really, Mario is gone from ownership, he has Letang and Malkin still, but they are in decline and didn't help make playoffs.

It is a really tough spot for Kyle Dubas and the Fenway Ownership Group. Sid sells tickets and the NHL is a gate driven league. However, he can not just hang out there without an extension and he certainly can't have the opportunity to walk. I know you don't want to draw lines in the sand, but you almost think the Pens have to force him to come to a decision. Because if he wants to move on, the Pens HAVE TO trade him.

Many teams would love to have him (obviously) and he could be a guy who says pushes a desperate Toronto or Edmonton over the top. But what would you want in return?

It is something no one wanted to ever think of. Now I think something gets done, but I thought it would have been done by yesterday. That being said, I really don't know why Sid would want to extend here? I know his legacy, Mario, etc....but Jagr was traded. Gretzky. Messier. Rumors are Malkin may retire after this year and play out his last hockey days in the KHL. So the gang might be getting busted up anyways.

What would you do??

 

[BreakingPitt]

It was fate that Crosby became a Penguin, he will always be a Penguin.
He will never wear another teams jersey.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

pens ownership should let him finish his career with a winner, get one last shot at a cup. it's almost selfish and pointless, and disrespectful to keep him under contract with this talentless roster..

sid has earned the right to go out on top, pens ownership and fans should realize this and make it happen..

 

[BreakingPitt]

pens ownership should let him finish his career with a winner, get one last shot at a cup. it's almost selfish and pointless, and disrespectful to keep him under contract with this talentless roster..

sid has earned the right to go out on top, pens ownership and fans should realize this and make it happen..

LOL
You know the player has to agree to a contract right ?

 

[ThePanthers]

pens ownership should let him finish his career with a winner, get one last shot at a cup. it's almost selfish and pointless, and disrespectful to keep him under contract with this talentless roster..

sid has earned the right to go out on top, pens ownership and fans should realize this and make it happen..

Uh, Sid has to agree to the contract too. That said, I’m not worried and won’t be either unless training camp starts and no extension is signed.

But if Sid wants to extend and finish his career here, he has every right to do that.

 

[HopeandChangeforAntoons]

If he was going to sign, you’d think he would’ve done it yesterday, right? 8/7

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Uh, Sid has to agree to the contract too. That said, I’m not worried and won’t be either unless training camp starts and no extension is signed.

But if Sid wants to extend and finish his career here, he has every right to do that.

sid will never openly say he wants to leave pittsburgh, even if it's best for him and the pens. it's just now how he is wired... guy is too classy...

it's why it's on the pens to kind of make that move. Any hockey fan wants legends like him to end on a winning team, at least making a run in the playoffs. this team and roster isnt even close to being a playoff team.

it's time.

 

[ThePanthers]

If he was going to sign, you’d think he would’ve done it yesterday, right? 8/7

That was just fan speculation. I’m 99.9% sure he’ll sign before camp.

 

[ThePanthers]

sid will never openly say he wants to leave pittsburgh, even if it's best for him and the pens. it's just now how he is wired... guy is too classy...

it's why it's on the pens to kind of make that move. Any hockey fan wants legends like him to end on a winning team, at least making a run in the playoffs. this team and roster isnt even close to being a playoff team.

it's time.

The pens would be stupid to move him if he wants to stay here.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

The pens would be stupid to move him if he wants to stay here.

not if they get something in return. we are in rebuild mode, it's got to happen sooner or later.

 

[wbrpanther]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

He has a year left and now is the time usually extensions are handed out. You all know I am the biggest Pens fan and big Sid fan. But looking ahead, why really would he want to resign here? He has been great the past two seasons, healthy and the Pens missed the playoffs. If I were him, I would seriously contemplate do I want to go through a true rebuild? Sid owes allegiance to nothing. Really, Mario is gone from ownership, he has Letang and Malkin still, but they are in decline and didn't help make playoffs.

It is a really tough spot for Kyle Dubas and the Fenway Ownership Group. Sid sells tickets and the NHL is a gate driven league. However, he can not just hang out there without an extension and he certainly can't have the opportunity to walk. I know you don't want to draw lines in the sand, but you almost think the Pens have to force him to come to a decision. Because if he wants to move on, the Pens HAVE TO trade him.

Many teams would love to have him (obviously) and he could be a guy who says pushes a desperate Toronto or Edmonton over the top. But what would you want in return?

It is something no one wanted to ever think of. Now I think something gets done, but I thought it would have been done by yesterday. That being said, I really don't know why Sid would want to extend here? I know his legacy, Mario, etc....but Jagr was traded. Gretzky. Messier. Rumors are Malkin may retire after this year and play out his last hockey days in the KHL. So the gang might be getting busted up anyways.

What would you do??

Madden already started that crap that if he doesn't sign this week to start worrying. Madden is a tool. Crosby will sign.

 

[Upg bobcat]

I guess I don't understand -- what's the point of signing an extension now? If I were in Sid's shoes, I would consider playing out the season without an extension and seeing if Dubas is finally getting things going in the right direction, seeing what Malkin decides after the season, etc. Why would he commit now without having a better picture of what sort of mess he is signing up for?

From the Pens perspective, does signing him to an extension make it easier to recruit other free agents to come to the team? Kinda late for that, isn't it? If the Pens do seek to move him, does having the extension help?

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

sid will never openly say he wants to leave pittsburgh, even if it's best for him and the pens. it's just now how he is wired... guy is too classy...

it's why it's on the pens to kind of make that move. Any hockey fan wants legends like him to end on a winning team, at least making a run in the playoffs. this team and roster isnt even close to being a playoff team.

it's time.

Hindsight is better than 20/20. And he is a creature of habit. But they should have gotten his buy in around 2020 make a quick rebuild. He was 33 then. They haven't won a playoff series since. (and none the preceeding two years). You trade Letang and Geno, get rid of some others, bring in some young guys and draft picks and by the time Sid would have been 35-36, then maybe make some more runs.

I truly believe this is why Rutherford abruptly stepped down. He wanted to do that but was rebuffed by ownership. And then it made sense on why they wanted to hold on to all of their most marketable assets because the Lemieux/Burkle group was selling it to FSG. Just poor timing.

 

[thebadby2]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

He has a year left and now is the time usually extensions are handed out. You all know I am the biggest Pens fan and big Sid fan. But looking ahead, why really would he want to resign here? He has been great the past two seasons, healthy and the Pens missed the playoffs. If I were him, I would seriously contemplate do I want to go through a true rebuild? Sid owes allegiance to nothing. Really, Mario is gone from ownership, he has Letang and Malkin still, but they are in decline and didn't help make playoffs.

It is a really tough spot for Kyle Dubas and the Fenway Ownership Group. Sid sells tickets and the NHL is a gate driven league. However, he can not just hang out there without an extension and he certainly can't have the opportunity to walk. I know you don't want to draw lines in the sand, but you almost think the Pens have to force him to come to a decision. Because if he wants to move on, the Pens HAVE TO trade him.

Many teams would love to have him (obviously) and he could be a guy who says pushes a desperate Toronto or Edmonton over the top. But what would you want in return?

It is something no one wanted to ever think of. Now I think something gets done, but I thought it would have been done by yesterday. That being said, I really don't know why Sid would want to extend here? I know his legacy, Mario, etc....but Jagr was traded. Gretzky. Messier. Rumors are Malkin may retire after this year and play out his last hockey days in the KHL. So the gang might be getting busted up anyways.

What would you do??

Red Wings fan here. We'll take him.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Red Wings fan here. We'll take him.

Sure. We'll throw in Jarry and Letang. We'll take back Larkin, Mo Seider and Pellikka.

 

[jtownknowitall]

He’s 37 years old and has won three cups. He’s well paid. He plays 82 games and then gets to take the summer off. Why play up to 28 more games for a meager bonus?

 

[h2p_5150]

If he doesn't sign an extension you keep him to sell tickets for this year and market it as his farewell tour before trading him at the deadline. Then prepare for a long period of sucking.

I still have a hard time believing he won't sign though. The org should give him whatever he wants because ticket sales and revenue are going to plummet when he's gone.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Hindsight is better than 20/20. And he is a creature of habit. But they should have gotten his buy in around 2020 make a quick rebuild. He was 33 then. They haven't won a playoff series since. (and none the preceeding two years). You trade Letang and Geno, get rid of some others, bring in some young guys and draft picks and by the time Sid would have been 35-36, then maybe make some more runs.

I truly believe this is why Rutherford abruptly stepped down. He wanted to do that but was rebuffed by ownership. And then it made sense on why they wanted to hold on to all of their most marketable assets because the Lemieux/Burkle group was selling it to FSG. Just poor timing.

I've been saying this for 3-4 years. They kept kicking the can down the road and throwing away picks while resigning old dudes. It's over. It's been over. The sooner they realize it the better, but some people still think they can put together one more run.

That being said, it's too late to trade him unless he really wants to go somewhere else. Let him finish here and retire. They're gonna suck for a long time anyway.

 

[goalieman]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

He has a year left and now is the time usually extensions are handed out. You all know I am the biggest Pens fan and big Sid fan. But looking ahead, why really would he want to resign here? He has been great the past two seasons, healthy and the Pens missed the playoffs. If I were him, I would seriously contemplate do I want to go through a true rebuild? Sid owes allegiance to nothing. Really, Mario is gone from ownership, he has Letang and Malkin still, but they are in decline and didn't help make playoffs.

It is a really tough spot for Kyle Dubas and the Fenway Ownership Group. Sid sells tickets and the NHL is a gate driven league. However, he can not just hang out there without an extension and he certainly can't have the opportunity to walk. I know you don't want to draw lines in the sand, but you almost think the Pens have to force him to come to a decision. Because if he wants to move on, the Pens HAVE TO trade him.

Many teams would love to have him (obviously) and he could be a guy who says pushes a desperate Toronto or Edmonton over the top. But what would you want in return?

It is something no one wanted to ever think of. Now I think something gets done, but I thought it would have been done by yesterday. That being said, I really don't know why Sid would want to extend here? I know his legacy, Mario, etc....but Jagr was traded. Gretzky. Messier. Rumors are Malkin may retire after this year and play out his last hockey days in the KHL. So the gang might be getting busted up anyways.

What would you do??

OK, so what I have heard and read as of now (and what I'm saying could obviously change at any time or not be totally accurate so take it with a grain of salt) is that Sid wants and intends to resign with the Pens ...... that Dubas and Sid's agent have basically worked out a new deal from a financial standpoint but the holdup is term/length of the deal ...... Dubas is flexible with the term but Sid is not sure how much longer he wants to play and it is Sid that is not sure what term he wants on the contract as he doesn't want to sign a contract that is longer than he plays and possibly leave the Pens with a full cap hit for the years remaining if he retires earlier than the end of the contract (a 35+ contract) ....... I am however slightly skeptical about this explanation because there are ways to structure a 35+ contract so that if a player retires early, the cap hit goes away ....... also, if Crosby decides he wants to be traded, Dubas will obviously do it and get the best deal he can get ...... basically, Dubas will do what Sid wants to do regarding resigning with the Pens or being traded.

 

[Islanderpanther]

Heard the Buccos are going to sign him as a DH….the bobblehead possibilities are limitless.

 

[pittdan77]

OK, so what I have heard and read as of now (and what I'm saying could obviously change at any time or not be totally accurate so take it with a grain of salt) is that Sid wants and intends to resign with the Pens ...... that Dubas and Sid's agent have basically worked out a new deal from a financial standpoint but the holdup is term/length of the deal ...... Dubas is flexible with the term but Sid is not sure how much longer he wants to play and it is Sid that is not sure what term he wants on the contract as he doesn't want to sign a contract that is longer than he plays and possibly leave the Pens with a full cap hit for the years remaining if he retires earlier than the end of the contract (a 35+ contract) ....... I am however slightly skeptical about this explanation because there are ways to structure a 35+ contract so that if a player retires early, the cap hit goes away ....... also, if Crosby decides he wants to be traded, Dubas will obviously do it and get the best deal he can get ...... basically, Dubas will do what Sid wants to do regarding resigning with the Pens or being traded.

He could do a two-year contract. That wouldn't exactly hamstring the team so I honestly thinking that he's considering hanging it up. Pens are going to give him a blank check so there really isn't much else standing in the way.

 

[BreakingPitt]

If Crosby averages 1 point a game for the next 4 years ( 82 games ) he will be #2 all time in points behind only Gretzky .
Think he can do it ?
I don't see him finishing his career in any other sweater. He is the ultimate teammate . Lived with 66 and wants to start and finish his career with only 1 team.

The Penguins mistake was resigning 71, which they did for 87. Crosby isn't going to turn around and run away.

 

[Burgh15]

Crosby knows where the team is at and where it will be for the next few seasons. He'll either want to finish his career here (which I hope he does) or he'll want one last chance at playing for a contender. I expect he'll finish his career as a Penguin, but who knows.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

People want to compare things to Mario but there are some big differences. When Mario first retired in 1997, the Pens were still a playoff team, hell in 1996 they went to the Eastern Conference Finals (should have been Stanley Cup). When he returned, obviously he had a much invested reason as he owned (owns...owns) the team. And the Pens went to the second rd of the playoffs that year.

Sid hasn't won a playoff series since Rd 1 in 2018 over the Flyers. Say he signs a 3 year deal, so including this year and then the next 3, how many playoffs will they qualify for? How many playoff series will they win? I think this has to be weighing on him.

Make no mistake Sid has some responsibility in some of the bad contracts on this team. He hates change, and wanted his buddies with him. I am talking more than just Geno and Letang. At some point management needed to be management and do right by the franchise not just what Sid wants. This shows up in the PP where they play guys where they want, not where they should. The players run this franchise.

 

[PittPharm2002]

People want to compare things to Mario but there are some big differences. When Mario first retired in 1997, the Pens were still a playoff team, hell in 1996 they went to the Eastern Conference Finals (should have been Stanley Cup). When he returned, obviously he had a much invested reason as he owned (owns...owns) the team. And the Pens went to the second rd of the playoffs that year.

Sid hasn't won a playoff series since Rd 1 in 2018 over the Flyers. Say he signs a 3 year deal, so including this year and then the next 3, how many playoffs will they qualify for? How many playoff series will they win? I think this has to be weighing on him.

Make no mistake Sid has some responsibility in some of the bad contracts on this team. He hates change, and wanted his buddies with him. I am talking more than just Geno and Letang. At some point management needed to be management and do right by the franchise not just what Sid wants. This shows up in the PP where they play guys where they want, not where they should. The players run this franchise.

Well it’s like the NBA and MLB is that stars have power because their unions are actually strong .

Folks need to accept that and stop thinking it will be NFL like . The players have almost no leverage in the NFL because their contracts can be voided

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Well it’s like the NBA and MLB is that stars have power because their unions are actually strong .

Folks need to accept that and stop thinking it will be NFL like . The players have almost no leverage in the NFL because their contracts can be voided

The NFL's union is absolutely pathetic. I think those unionized in Starbuck's have more backbone.

But that is not what I mean. I mean you can make decisions, you can resign some of these guys and say "but I am not going to give you a No Trade clause" and they can choose to accept or not. And the unions don't tell coaches how to deploy players. That's what I mean by the players dictate all the terms with the Pens.

 

[PITTstorm]

OK, so what I have heard and read as of now (and what I'm saying could obviously change at any time or not be totally accurate so take it with a grain of salt) is that Sid wants and intends to resign with the Pens ...... that Dubas and Sid's agent have basically worked out a new deal from a financial standpoint but the holdup is term/length of the deal ...... Dubas is flexible with the term but Sid is not sure how much longer he wants to play and it is Sid that is not sure what term he wants on the contract as he doesn't want to sign a contract that is longer than he plays and possibly leave the Pens with a full cap hit for the years remaining if he retires earlier than the end of the contract (a 35+ contract) ....... I am however slightly skeptical about this explanation because there are ways to structure a 35+ contract so that if a player retires early, the cap hit goes away ....... also, if Crosby decides he wants to be traded, Dubas will obviously do it and get the best deal he can get ...... basically, Dubas will do what Sid wants to do regarding resigning with the Pens or being traded.

You need to reread Rossi’s Athletic piece…there is no way to structure a player’s 35+ contract so that if the player retires early, the cap hit goes away. Pens would be on the hook for the length of the deal.

 

[goalieman]

You need to reread Rossi’s Athletic piece…there is no way to structure a player’s 35+ contract so that if the player retires early, the cap hit goes away. Pens would be on the hook for the length of the deal.

- What Rossi said in that article is not entirely correct and is not the full extent of what the NHL CBA of 2020 says about the cap hit a team takes if a player 35+ years old signs a contract and retires before the contract ends ........ here is an explanation for you and the posters who "liked" your post above .......

- Generally if a player less than 35 y/o retires any remaining contract and cap hit goes away .....

- Before the 2020 update to the NHL CBA, any player that was 35+ y/o and retired, the full cap hit on his remaining contract stayed with the team ......

- In 2020 the CBA rule for 35+ y/o players contracts was amended ........ now, if a player 35+ y/o signs a contract that is multiple years, and the contract is either front loaded with salary in the year to year breakdown (salary is higher in earlier years), OR the contract has signing bonuses after the first year, then if the player retires before the contract runs out, it is true that the full cap hit on the remaining contract remains with the team .....

- On the other hand since the 2020 CBA amendment, if the 35+ y/o signs a multiyear contract that is not front loaded with salary (base salary is either flat or backloaded) AND has no signing bonuses after the first year, it is exempt from the 35+ contract rules and if the player retires before the contract ends, the remaining contract is void and the team takes no further cap hit ( just like an under 35 player who retires) .....

- For example in October 2020 (after the CBA was amended regarding 35+ contracts), Corey Crawford who was 35+ signed a 2 year contract with the NJD, that had the same salary both years (no front loading) and had no signing bonuses after the first year (actually had no signing bonuses at all) ....... he retired 3 months after signing the 2 year contract and because of the way the contract was structured, it entirely came off the books and the Devils took no further cap hit at all after he retired....... so Sid's contract technically could be structured similarly to prevent any further cap hit if he retires before the contract ends ...... Letang and Malkin both have 35+ contracts that are front loaded and have signing bonuses after the first year so if they retire early their full cap hits remain with the Pens for the length of the remaining contract.

- Below is a link to an article explaining this, read the entire article including the last section that states it would be beneficial to the team to offer 35+ players contracts with no signing bonuses after the first year and a base salary that is flat or backloaded which would eliminate for the team any risk of cap hits if the player retires early ! (the same author had an article last month stating basically the same facts) ......

https://www.dkpittsburghsports.com/...ules-cba-retire-evgeni-malkin-kris-letang-tlh

 

[goalieman]

@PITTstorm, @ChiefJusticeMarshall, @ThePanthers ........ there is a timely article today in Pittsburgh Hockey Now that confirms what I said that players 35 or older in the NHL can have their new contracts structured in a way so that if they retire early before their contract ends that the team takes no further cap hit after they retire ...... it is exactly as I said, the contract is multiyear, can't be front loaded with base salary (has to be structured so the salary is the same each year or backloaded) and there can be no signing bonuses after the first year ..... if that is the case, then if the player retires before the end of the contract, the cap hit does not carry forward on the team.

Rossi did not understand the entire rule in his article ....... Hextall signed Carter, Malkin, and Letang to 35+ contracts that were either front loaded and/or had signing bonuses after the first year so that the Pens would have to keep the full cap hit if they retired before the end of the contract ...... it is an advantage to the player to have a front loaded contract and/or have signing bonuses throughout so that is why it is often done that way ..... it is an advantage to the team to structure it so it is not frontloaded and no signing bonuses after the first year so that the cap hit goes away when they retire even it is before the contract ends ...... Hextall made it even worse by giving Carter, Letang, and Malkin full NMC's as well.

Link below ......

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pit...evgeni-malkin-kris-letang-contracts-mistakes/

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

@PITTstorm, @ChiefJusticeMarshall, @ThePanthers ........ there is a timely article today in Pittsburgh Hockey Now that confirms what I said that players 35 or older in the NHL can have their new contracts structured in a way so that if they retire early before their contract ends that the team takes no further cap hit after they retire ...... it is exactly as I said, the contract is multiyear, can't be front loaded with base salary (has to be structured so the salary is the same each year or backloaded) and there can be no signing bonuses after the first year ..... if that is the case, then if the player retires before the end of the contract, the cap hit does not carry forward on the team.

Rossi did not understand the entire rule in his article ....... Hextall signed Carter, Malkin, and Letang to 35+ contracts that were either front loaded and/or had signing bonuses after the first year so that the Pens would have to keep the full cap hit if they retired before the end of the contract ...... it is an advantage to the player to have a front loaded contract and/or have signing bonuses throughout so that is why it is often done that way ..... it is an advantage to the team to structure it so it is not frontloaded and no signing bonuses after the first year so that the cap hit goes away when they retire even it is before the contract ends ...... Hextall made it even worse by giving Carter, Letang, and Malkin full NMC's as well.

Link below ......

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pit...evgeni-malkin-kris-letang-contracts-mistakes/

Hextall was a Flyer plant.

 

[PITTstorm]

@PITTstorm, @ChiefJusticeMarshall, @ThePanthers ........ there is a timely article today in Pittsburgh Hockey Now that confirms what I said that players 35 or older in the NHL can have their new contracts structured in a way so that if they retire early before their contract ends that the team takes no further cap hit after they retire ...... it is exactly as I said, the contract is multiyear, can't be front loaded with base salary (has to be structured so the salary is the same each year or backloaded) and there can be no signing bonuses after the first year ..... if that is the case, then if the player retires before the end of the contract, the cap hit does not carry forward on the team.

Rossi did not understand the entire rule in his article ....... Hextall signed Carter, Malkin, and Letang to 35+ contracts that were either front loaded and/or had signing bonuses after the first year so that the Pens would have to keep the full cap hit if they retired before the end of the contract ...... it is an advantage to the player to have a front loaded contract and/or have signing bonuses throughout so that is why it is often done that way ..... it is an advantage to the team to structure it so it is not frontloaded and no signing bonuses after the first year so that the cap hit goes away when they retire even it is before the contract ends ...... Hextall made it even worse by giving Carter, Letang, and Malkin full NMC's as well.

Link below ......

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pit...evgeni-malkin-kris-letang-contracts-mistakes/

Thanks goalieman…I’ll check it out.

 

[BreakingPitt]

Penguins swing blockbuster trade of winger prospects​

Penguins swing blockbuster trade of winger prospects, shipping Brayden Yager to Jets for Rutger McGroarty

Earlier this summer, a rift between the Winnipeg Jets and their 2022 first-round draft pick, winger Rutger McGroarty, became public. The 20-year-old McGroarty, selected 14th overall two years ago, was reportedly concerned with the Jets’ developmental plan for him, desiring a quicker path to the...

triblive.com

 

[pittiswhereiamfrom2]

There is no such person called Rutger McGroarty.

 

[JD1976]

There is no such person called Rutger McGroarty.

McGroarty was a lottery caliber player who was at one time a candidate to be the top overall pick in his draft year. There’s a lot to like about his ceiling. I just wish they didn’t have to give up their #1 prospect but I still think it’s a net positive.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

McGroarty was a lottery caliber player who was at one time a candidate to be the top overall pick in his draft year. There’s a lot to like about his ceiling. I just wish they didn’t have to give up their #1 prospect but I still think it’s a net positive.

I mean in the Athletic's top 100 prospects McGroarty was ranked 33rd and Yager is 58, not that is the definitive answer on who won the trade. It is a pure hockey trade. I really like Yager, but he is a couple of years away. McGroarty maybe ready this season. He's a much bigger, more physical player.