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OT - Pirates and baseball draft

President Stache

Heisman Winner
Dec 4, 2010
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Being a baseball guy my whole life, Ive always loved the draft and love college baseball, I keep up with all prospects and probably study it and know it better than the football draft. Last few years I am pretty ehhh with most of the Pirates drafts, but this year they seem to be on point (although prep kids are totally unpredictable), I like the draft, and like the prospects, plus we needed the youth in the minors. Good job all around!

By the way, the draft is funny... they have x dollars to spend in rounds 1-10, so probably 25% of the guys taken rounds 3-10 are marginal players with limited upside just taken to save money to get the other guys, leads to some excited prospects and good smiles. I love Jason Delay of Vanderbilt, great arm as a catcher, but at round 4 and a college senior that hits lightly definitely a cap saver.

Jennings, Mitchell, Uselton and of course Baz were all very good picks in my opinion.
 
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A Pitt commit was drafted in 5th round. High School 3B from New Jersey. If he signs, that will be a big blow to the incoming class.
 
The bucs seemed to have taken several talented guys that are gonna be tough to sign. If they're able to sign them, this could be a pretty good draft.
 
How about a rundown

Sure,
first round:

Shane Baz (RHPitcher) - Baz can put on a show in batting practice, as evidenced by the 18 balls he blasted out of the park in the first round of the Area Code Games home run derby last August. He's an intriguing third-base prospect from the same Concordia Lutheran High (Tomball, Texas) program that produced a 2015 late first-round pick at that position in Ke'Bryan Hayes. Baz will be one of the first prepsters taken in the 2017 Draft -- but as a pitcher. Baz may have the deepest arsenal in the 2017 high school class. His fastball has kicked up a notch to 92-96 mph with a peak of 98 this spring, and he has shown the ability to run and sink it while maintaining its velocity throughout a game. His 84-88 mph cutter generates a lot of swings and misses, and he also can turn the cutter into more of a true slider, spin a curveball that's a distinctly different pitch and unveil a changeup that could develop into a solid offering. Baz's athleticism and clean delivery should yield consistent strikes, though he sometimes has control issues when he falls in love with his secondary pitches and doesn't work off his fastball enough. Scouts rave about his makeup as well as his stuff and physicality. He'll play both ways if he attends Texas Christian, but his upside as a frontline starter should get him drafted high enough to turn pro.

second round:

Steve Jennings - P
A star quarterback who was the offensive MVP of his Tennessee high school district as a junior, Jennings tore the anterior cruciate ligament in his knee during a game in September. While the injury ended his football season, he not only recovered in time to play baseball this spring but also has emerged as the top prep prospect in the state. His stock has risen so much that he could go as high as the second round. Jennings didn't spend much time on the showcase circuit because of his football commitments, so he has been a bit of a revelation. His loose, quick arm generates a fastball that sits at 89-92 mph, reaches 95 and should add some more velocity in the future. His hard slider can hit 85 mph and shows the upside of a plus offering, and he also has unveiled a curveball that can be a solid breaking pitch as well. Though he hasn't had much need for a changeup yet, Jennings shows some aptitude for the pitch. He's athletic and has an easy delivery, which enables him to throw strikes. He's committed to Mississippi but figures to get drafted early enough to lure him away from the Rebels.

Cal Mitchell - OF
A product of the famed San Diego high school program Rancho Bernardo that produced big leaguers like Hank Blalock and Cole Hamels, Mitchell's strong summer, including hitting well for Team USA, had him poised to be considered as one of the better high school bats in the country. A change in his approach, however, has hurt his performance this spring, thus dampening enthusiasm about the outfielder. Over the summer, Mitchell showed plus raw power, driving balls to all fields. He's changed his setup at the plate now, with his hands into his body more, with a top-hand heavy, pull side approach. Perhaps he's trying to show more in-game power, but this spring it's resulted in a lot more swing-and-miss with no feel to go the other way. The main issue is that Mitchell's carrying tool is his bat. He's acceptable in left field, but while he has solid instincts, he's not a runner. Based on his performance this spring, Mitchell might not be a top three rounds candidate, which could mean he might be headed to the University of San Diego. But because there's some history and a track record of previous success, a team that feels they can get Mitchell back to where he was last summer could roll the dice that early.

Conner Uselton - RHP
Uselton started at quarterback at Southmoore High (Oklahoma City) as a freshman, and his athleticism and arm strength made him a promising college football prospect. He gave up the gridiron as a sophomore, however, and has blossomed into one of the toolsier high school players available in the 2017 Draft. He has eased some worries about his bat with a strong spring, and a club that fully believes in his hitting ability could pluck him in the first round. Uselton's bat speed, strength and leverage give him some of the best raw power in this year's high school crop. His right-handed swing has some arm bar and got out of sync on the showcase circuit, but he has done a nice job of quieting and repeating his stroke as a senior. He's doing a better job of using the entire field and scouts feel better about his chances of tapping into his considerable pop. A solid runner who covers ground with long strides, Uselton may lose a half-step as he fills out. That would prompt a move from center field to right, where his cannon arm would fit perfectly. He's a 19-year-old high schooler, which some teams see as a red flag and would make him Draft-eligible after two years at Oklahoma State if he attends college.

Third Round

Dylan Busby - 3B
A three-year starter at Florida State, Busby started to show his power potential as a sophomore, leading the Seminoles with 14 homers. That continued during his stint in the Cape Cod League last summer and again this spring, as his 13 long balls once again led his team as he helped FSU gain host a Regional. Busby started the season off slowly as he was coming back from hernia surgery in the fall. By the second half of the season, his hips were exploding better and the power started to show up consistently. There is some swing and miss to his game, but he can be an effective hitter when he uses the entire field. Busby is fairly athletic and some give him a chance to stick at third with a decent arm and hands. Others see him moving to first or perhaps being able to handle left field. Wherever he plays, he looks like he has the power to profile at any corner. College performers with pop tend to do better than expected and Busby could go easily in the top five rounds, easily surpassing his father, a 17th-rounder in 1988.

Jumping to 7th round, made a good pick:
Jared Oliva - CF
Oliva comes from a baseball family, with his father and uncle both having played pro ball. Until this spring, though, the redshirt junior's performance didn't attract scouts so he could follow in their footsteps, and he went undrafted in 2016. But he has elevated himself with how he's performed for Arizona this season. Oliva has always been athletic, with speed that can work on both sides of the ball. The biggest difference in 2017 has been his ability to square balls up more consistently. Most of it has resulted in doubles power, but there is raw pop the right-handed-hitting outfielder has yet to tap into during games. His swing can get grooved at times, leading to some swing and miss. He has been inconsistent at times in the outfield, showing good reads and routes on one day, struggling another, with some scouts wishing he had better instincts. Long and lean, he's drawn some comparisons to a Drew Stubbs type of outfielder. With his athleticism, upside, strong performance and signability -- he graduates this spring -- he could very easily hear his name called in the top five rounds.
 
A Pitt commit was drafted in 5th round. High School 3B from New Jersey. If he signs, that will be a big blow to the incoming class.


The worst part about it is that if the past is any indication, if the guy signs a pro contract it will come as a complete and utter shock to the Pitt coaching staff.
 
The worst part about it is that if the past is any indication, if the guy signs a pro contract it will come as a complete and utter shock to the Pitt coaching staff.

Not much you can do about that in baseball recruiting though. That happens to a lot of schools. It is not like you have back up scholarship money to have a back up plan. The back up plans are going to already be committed to another school.

That is the tough part about recruiting in baseball. All schools deal with it but schools up North normally don't get many kids of this quality to come to their school so it is a blow when they get drafted and sign.
 
It. Doesn't. Matter.

How can the Pirates expect to be good if they are drafting to save money?
 
It. Doesn't. Matter.

How can the Pirates expect to be good if they are drafting to save money?

Look I kill the Pirates as much as anyone does but their draft strategy is good and is NOT about saving money. You are 100% incorrect here.

They spend to their limit every draft under these new draft rules. All teams draft kids in the early rounds now to save money per that kids slot value in order to use the excess to pay over slot money to tough to sign kids who want more than their slotted value or they will not sign. This is the result of the new system MLB uses that slots picks and gives team a Max amount to spend.

And under the old system, the Pirates spent more money than any other team by paying big bonuses to draft and sign tough to sign kids. It is one of the reasons MLB changed the rules. God forbid small market teams like the Pirates used something to their advantage that the Yankees and Red Sox didn't causing MLB to change the rules. MLB sucks by the way.

The Pirates ownership stinks overall and should get killed for how cheap they are at the Major League level but the draft strategy is one area where they do seem to get it.
 
Not much you can do about that in baseball recruiting though. That happens to a lot of schools. It is not like you have back up scholarship money to have a back up plan. The back up plans are going to already be committed to another school.

That is the tough part about recruiting in baseball. All schools deal with it but schools up North normally don't get many kids of this quality to come to their school so it is a blow when they get drafted and sign.


What you can do about it is to at least understand the rules and prepare for what is likely to happen. Only at Pitt does one of the best players in the conference get drafted and it comes as a complete shock to the coaching staff because apparently none of them know the rules about who is and isn't eligible for the draft.
 
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What you can do about it is to at least understand the rules and prepare for what is likely to happen. Only at Pitt does one of the best players in the conference get drafted and it comes as a complete shock to the coaching staff because apparently none of them know the rules about who is and isn't eligible for the draft.

Who said they are not prepared? Do you know this? Maybe they expected this?

You act like it is possible to just have multiple top notch IF recruits on stand by in case one they recruited ahead of them get drafted. I am sure they knew he would get drafted but maybe he went alot higher than anyone expected. Maybe they feel like he will still come to school and pass on signing, etc..

Not sure what your angst is about already.
 
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What you can do about it is to at least understand the rules and prepare for what is likely to happen. Only at Pitt does one of the best players in the conference get drafted and it comes as a complete shock to the coaching staff because apparently none of them know the rules about who is and isn't eligible for the draft.

You have to be kidding right? Jordano knows the rules very well. He is a solid coach in every way shape and form. I played before he arrived, and wish I did play for the guy.
 
Sure,
first round:

Shane Baz (RHPitcher) - Baz can put on a show in batting practice, as evidenced by the 18 balls he blasted out of the park in the first round of the Area Code Games home run derby last August. He's an intriguing third-base prospect from the same Concordia Lutheran High (Tomball, Texas) program that produced a 2015 late first-round pick at that position in Ke'Bryan Hayes. Baz will be one of the first prepsters taken in the 2017 Draft -- but as a pitcher. Baz may have the deepest arsenal in the 2017 high school class. His fastball has kicked up a notch to 92-96 mph with a peak of 98 this spring, and he has shown the ability to run and sink it while maintaining its velocity throughout a game. His 84-88 mph cutter generates a lot of swings and misses, and he also can turn the cutter into more of a true slider, spin a curveball that's a distinctly different pitch and unveil a changeup that could develop into a solid offering. Baz's athleticism and clean delivery should yield consistent strikes, though he sometimes has control issues when he falls in love with his secondary pitches and doesn't work off his fastball enough. Scouts rave about his makeup as well as his stuff and physicality. He'll play both ways if he attends Texas Christian, but his upside as a frontline starter should get him drafted high enough to turn pro.

second round:

Steve Jennings - P
A star quarterback who was the offensive MVP of his Tennessee high school district as a junior, Jennings tore the anterior cruciate ligament in his knee during a game in September. While the injury ended his football season, he not only recovered in time to play baseball this spring but also has emerged as the top prep prospect in the state. His stock has risen so much that he could go as high as the second round. Jennings didn't spend much time on the showcase circuit because of his football commitments, so he has been a bit of a revelation. His loose, quick arm generates a fastball that sits at 89-92 mph, reaches 95 and should add some more velocity in the future. His hard slider can hit 85 mph and shows the upside of a plus offering, and he also has unveiled a curveball that can be a solid breaking pitch as well. Though he hasn't had much need for a changeup yet, Jennings shows some aptitude for the pitch. He's athletic and has an easy delivery, which enables him to throw strikes. He's committed to Mississippi but figures to get drafted early enough to lure him away from the Rebels.

Cal Mitchell - OF
A product of the famed San Diego high school program Rancho Bernardo that produced big leaguers like Hank Blalock and Cole Hamels, Mitchell's strong summer, including hitting well for Team USA, had him poised to be considered as one of the better high school bats in the country. A change in his approach, however, has hurt his performance this spring, thus dampening enthusiasm about the outfielder. Over the summer, Mitchell showed plus raw power, driving balls to all fields. He's changed his setup at the plate now, with his hands into his body more, with a top-hand heavy, pull side approach. Perhaps he's trying to show more in-game power, but this spring it's resulted in a lot more swing-and-miss with no feel to go the other way. The main issue is that Mitchell's carrying tool is his bat. He's acceptable in left field, but while he has solid instincts, he's not a runner. Based on his performance this spring, Mitchell might not be a top three rounds candidate, which could mean he might be headed to the University of San Diego. But because there's some history and a track record of previous success, a team that feels they can get Mitchell back to where he was last summer could roll the dice that early.

Conner Uselton - RHP
Uselton started at quarterback at Southmoore High (Oklahoma City) as a freshman, and his athleticism and arm strength made him a promising college football prospect. He gave up the gridiron as a sophomore, however, and has blossomed into one of the toolsier high school players available in the 2017 Draft. He has eased some worries about his bat with a strong spring, and a club that fully believes in his hitting ability could pluck him in the first round. Uselton's bat speed, strength and leverage give him some of the best raw power in this year's high school crop. His right-handed swing has some arm bar and got out of sync on the showcase circuit, but he has done a nice job of quieting and repeating his stroke as a senior. He's doing a better job of using the entire field and scouts feel better about his chances of tapping into his considerable pop. A solid runner who covers ground with long strides, Uselton may lose a half-step as he fills out. That would prompt a move from center field to right, where his cannon arm would fit perfectly. He's a 19-year-old high schooler, which some teams see as a red flag and would make him Draft-eligible after two years at Oklahoma State if he attends college.

Third Round

Dylan Busby - 3B
A three-year starter at Florida State, Busby started to show his power potential as a sophomore, leading the Seminoles with 14 homers. That continued during his stint in the Cape Cod League last summer and again this spring, as his 13 long balls once again led his team as he helped FSU gain host a Regional. Busby started the season off slowly as he was coming back from hernia surgery in the fall. By the second half of the season, his hips were exploding better and the power started to show up consistently. There is some swing and miss to his game, but he can be an effective hitter when he uses the entire field. Busby is fairly athletic and some give him a chance to stick at third with a decent arm and hands. Others see him moving to first or perhaps being able to handle left field. Wherever he plays, he looks like he has the power to profile at any corner. College performers with pop tend to do better than expected and Busby could go easily in the top five rounds, easily surpassing his father, a 17th-rounder in 1988.

Jumping to 7th round, made a good pick:
Jared Oliva - CF
Oliva comes from a baseball family, with his father and uncle both having played pro ball. Until this spring, though, the redshirt junior's performance didn't attract scouts so he could follow in their footsteps, and he went undrafted in 2016. But he has elevated himself with how he's performed for Arizona this season. Oliva has always been athletic, with speed that can work on both sides of the ball. The biggest difference in 2017 has been his ability to square balls up more consistently. Most of it has resulted in doubles power, but there is raw pop the right-handed-hitting outfielder has yet to tap into during games. His swing can get grooved at times, leading to some swing and miss. He has been inconsistent at times in the outfield, showing good reads and routes on one day, struggling another, with some scouts wishing he had better instincts. Long and lean, he's drawn some comparisons to a Drew Stubbs type of outfielder. With his athleticism, upside, strong performance and signability -- he graduates this spring -- he could very easily hear his name called in the top five rounds.
Thank you for taking the time to do this.
 
Who said they are not prepared? Do you know this? Maybe they expected this?

You act like it is possible to just have multiple top notch IF recruits on stand by in case one they recruited ahead of them get drafted. I am sure they knew he would get drafted but maybe he went alot higher than anyone expected. Maybe they feel like he will still come to school and pass on signing, etc..

Not sure what your angst is about already.


Last season, Charles Leblanc was one of the best players in the ACC. Half way through the season I posted on the Olympic sports board that one of the bad things about him blowing up the way he did was that even though he was only a sophomore he was almost certainly eligible for the major league draft, because after he graduated from high school he played a year at a prep school before he went to college. The MLB rule doesn't say that guys at a four year college can be drafted after their junior year, it says they can be drafted three years after their class graduates from high school. For Leblanc, that was his year at prep school, and then his freshman and sophomore years at Pitt.

As the season was winding down and official word came out from MLB that Leblanc was, indeed, eligible to be drafted Jordano and his coaching staff were completely taken by surprise by the whole thing. They absolutely did NOT know that LeBlanc was eligible to be drafted last season. That is inexcusable that a college coach would not know the rule on who was eligible to be drafted an who was not.

On several occasions this year Jordano has blamed Pitt's lack of success on the fact that they had two guys drafted last year that they thought were going to be on the team this year. Leblanc was one of them The other was Nick Yarnall, who was a junior last year and was one of the better hitters on the team. What college baseball coach in America, with the exception of Joe Jordano apparently, is surprised when one of his best players who is a junior gets picked in the MLB draft and signs a pro contract?

On the Sunday night game late in the season against Georgia Tech that was broadcast on Root Sports one of the announcers said that they talked to Jordano about the problems the team was having this season, and he said that Jordano told him that the biggest problem was probably that they lost two guys to the MLB draft last year that they were not expecting to lose. The only two choices are that Jordano doesn't understand the draft rules and the way that the draft works, or Jordano spent the whole season lying about why the team was so bad so that he didn't have to take any of the blame for himself. You wouldn't think that first one could be possible, and yet he admitted as much in the case of Leblanc on more than one occasion.

Pitt had three junior pitchers drafted today. Assuming that they all sign pro contracts, what are the odds that at some point next season Jordano blames his lack of pitching depth on the fact that they lost three guys to the MLB draft today? Even money? He talks like as if Pitt is the only program in America that loses guys like this. Which is hilarious, because Pitt actually loses far fewer guys like that than a really good program does.
 
And speaking of cleanup hitters, at the Saturday North Carolina game earlier this season Jordano had a guy batting .181 with a .361 slugging percentage batting 4th. Relatively speaking, that might be even worse than Jaso!

Well, OK, probably not.
 
Look I kill the Pirates as much as anyone does but their draft strategy is good and is NOT about saving money. You are 100% incorrect here.

They spend to their limit every draft under these new draft rules. All teams draft kids in the early rounds now to save money per that kids slot value in order to use the excess to pay over slot money to tough to sign kids who want more than their slotted value or they will not sign. This is the result of the new system MLB uses that slots picks and gives team a Max amount to spend.

And under the old system, the Pirates spent more money than any other team by paying big bonuses to draft and sign tough to sign kids. It is one of the reasons MLB changed the rules. God forbid small market teams like the Pirates used something to their advantage that the Yankees and Red Sox didn't causing MLB to change the rules. MLB sucks by the way.

The Pirates ownership stinks overall and should get killed for how cheap they are at the Major League level but the draft strategy is one area where they do seem to get it.

Under this new system, the Pirates had the 5th lowest total spending on signing their picks. Sounds like the ownership has found another way to convince the fans that spending fewer dollars is really better for the success of the team. THEY know better then most of the other MLB teams. Spending less = better teams!

Hook. Line. And... Sinker.
 
That's a good point, but then again I've never seen Hurdle have his number three hitter sacrifice bunting in the first inning after the first two guys got on base, and I've seen Jordano do that several times.

Well, actually, it isnt a bad move to bunt down the third base line with runners on first and second, make the third baseman give himself up and make the play.
Good hitters are supposed to hit the ball the right side in that situation anyways
 
Under this new system, the Pirates had the 5th lowest total spending on signing their picks. Sounds like the ownership has found another way to convince the fans that spending fewer dollars is really better for the success of the team. THEY know better then most of the other MLB teams. Spending less = better teams!

Hook. Line. And... Sinker.

The draft picks have slotted bonus amounts and each team gets a bonus pool to spend based upon number of picks and position. If they don't sign a guy, they lose the amount of bonus money for that pick. If a team spends more than 110% of the pool they lose a 1st round pick in the next year.

The Pirates Competitive Balance pick opted to go to college and they lost that slot's $1.5 million from their pool of $6.9million. They offered him the max amount that they could without exceeding that 110% and forfeiting picks, but it wasn't enough. Are you suggesting that they should have forfeited their 1st round pick to sign him?
 
The draft picks have slotted bonus amounts and each team gets a bonus pool to spend based upon number of picks and position. If they don't sign a guy, they lose the amount of bonus money for that pick. If a team spends more than 110% of the pool they lose a 1st round pick in the next year.

The Pirates Competitive Balance pick opted to go to college and they lost that slot's $1.5 million from their pool of $6.9million. They offered him the max amount that they could without exceeding that 110% and forfeiting picks, but it wasn't enough. Are you suggesting that they should have forfeited their 1st round pick to sign him?

How convenient. The Pirates selected one of the two (out of over 300) players who decided not to sign. Keep making excuses.
 
Under this new system, the Pirates had the 5th lowest total spending on signing their picks. Sounds like the ownership has found another way to convince the fans that spending fewer dollars is really better for the success of the team. THEY know better then most of the other MLB teams. Spending less = better teams!

Hook. Line. And... Sinker.

What year were they the 5th lowest? Just 2016 when they were allotted 7 million and spent 6.4 million of it.

From 2012 to 2015 they spent 13th most on the draft and that includes Appel not signing with them which lowers their amount by a few million but also lowers their allocated amount.

The below link has the spending from 2012, 13, 14, and 15 of which the Pirates spent all of what was allocated to them.

Again, kill the ownership for being cheap. They certainly deserve that criticism overall. But the draft is not an area where they should be criticized. In 2008 they spent a record on signing bonuses which included 8 Million to Cole and 5 million to Bell. This record was just broke last year I think by Atlanta.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/draft/draft-bonus-spending-drops-2015-despite-larger-pools/
 
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How convenient. The Pirates selected one of the two (out of over 300) players who decided not to sign. Keep making excuses.

It is not excuses, it is the new system. You clearly want to just be critical of them and overall that is fine. Again, they deserve most of it especially around how they run their MLB team, but spending in the draft is not one of them. The rules were changed in part because of how they operated the system prior to this new set up where they were taking kids like Josh Bell who know one thought would sign and threw big time money at them to get them to sign.
 
Well, actually, it isnt a bad move to bunt down the third base line with runners on first and second, make the third baseman give himself up and make the play.
Good hitters are supposed to hit the ball the right side in that situation anyways

Having the best hitter on your team sacrifice bunting in the first inning with two guys on and no outs is ALWAYS the wrong move. In fact it is so stupid that any baseball manager that does it should be told by their boss that if they do it again they are fired.

Pitt did that during one of the televised Georgia Tech games this year, and when the batter pulled back and didn't attempt to bunt the first pitch the commentator said that the batter must have done that on his own, because you would never call for a bunt in that situation. When the hitter attempted to bunt the second pitch as well the guy was pretty much speechless. Nobody ever does that!

Except Pitt under Joe Jordano. He does it pretty frequently.
 
Having the best hitter on your team sacrifice bunting in the first inning with two guys on and no outs is ALWAYS the wrong move. In fact it is so stupid that any baseball manager that does it should be told by their boss that if they do it again they are fired.

Pitt did that during one of the televised Georgia Tech games this year, and when the batter pulled back and didn't attempt to bunt the first pitch the commentator said that the batter must have done that on his own, because you would never call for a bunt in that situation. When the hitter attempted to bunt the second pitch as well the guy was pretty much speechless. Nobody ever does that!

Except Pitt under Joe Jordano. He does it pretty frequently.

I agree generally that is terrible strategy.

But in saying that, is Pitt 3 hole hitter really their best hitter? There could be a number of factors that go into that equation.

You seem to follow them more closely than I do and that is an honest question.

From what I know of their lineup they don't have many good hitters so scratching out runs seems to be a priority for them.

But again, I don't follow them that closely.
 
I agree generally that is terrible strategy.

But in saying that, is Pitt 3 hole hitter really their best hitter? There could be a number of factors that go into that equation.

You seem to follow them more closely than I do and that is an honest question.

From what I know of their lineup they don't have many good hitters so scratching out runs seems to be a priority for them.

But again, I don't follow them that closely.

Seems to me that a team's "best hitter" has nothing to do with it. One team's best hitter might be the best player in the league, or could be only the 4th best hitter on a different team, so the distinction is arbitrary. Those who follow baseball analytics will know better, but take the stats from a player like batting average, HR likelihood, etc and compare with the expected success of bunting vs not bunting. Generate a formula that gives an expected run value for each decision.
 
How convenient. The Pirates selected one of the two (out of over 300) players who decided not to sign. Keep making excuses.

So they intentionally selected one of the two guys that they knew wouldn't sign? Interesting angle. Why didn't they take both of them?
 
I agree generally that is terrible strategy.

But in saying that, is Pitt 3 hole hitter really their best hitter? There could be a number of factors that go into that equation.

You seem to follow them more closely than I do and that is an honest question.

From what I know of their lineup they don't have many good hitters so scratching out runs seems to be a priority for them.

But again, I don't follow them that closely.


I agree that there probably are times when they aren't batting their best hitter third, but that guy is at least close to the best hitter. In a run scoring environment like there currently is in college baseball playing for one run is almost always the wrong strategy. Unless the guy hitting is a truly awful hitter, sacrifice bunting in the first inning of a game is always the wrong strategy. And even if the guy batting third isn't your best hitter, he certainly isn't awful enough for bunting to be the smart play.

In MLB right now the break even point for whether a guy should sacrifice bunt or not is a less than .200 batting average (I don't know the current exact number, but it's less than .200). In college baseball, more runs are scored on average than in MLB. That means that the break even point in college baseball is well less than .200.

There is a reason that with the exception of pitchers in the National League sacrifice bunting has mostly disappeared MLB. Because other than someone who hits like a pitcher, it is a losing play to sacrifice bunt. A lot of college managers haven't caught up to that yet, and Pitt has one of the worst examples of them all. Like I said, in the Georgia Tech game the color commentator assumed that the Pitt hitter was bunting on his own, because "nobody bunts in a situation like this." Nobody except Joe Jordano.
 
Having the best hitter on your team sacrifice bunting in the first inning with two guys on and no outs is ALWAYS the wrong move. In fact it is so stupid that any baseball manager that does it should be told by their boss that if they do it again they are fired.

Pitt did that during one of the televised Georgia Tech games this year, and when the batter pulled back and didn't attempt to bunt the first pitch the commentator said that the batter must have done that on his own, because you would never call for a bunt in that situation. When the hitter attempted to bunt the second pitch as well the guy was pretty much speechless. Nobody ever does that!

Except Pitt under Joe Jordano. He does it pretty frequently.

That is a silly thing to say. I already explained why you do it. Third baseman is back, you are advancing runners and trying to bunt for a hit, worst case the batter is thrown out. Should a top hitter do this? Probably not, I agree, but it isnt unheard of.
 
That is a silly thing to say. I already explained why you do it. Third baseman is back, you are advancing runners and trying to bunt for a hit, worst case the batter is thrown out. Should a top hitter do this? Probably not, I agree, but it isnt unheard of.


Tell me the last time a major league team had their number three hitter bunting with guys on first and second and no outs in the top of the first inning. Has it happened in the last decade? The last 25 years? The last 50 years? I'm guessing you won't be able to think of a single instance where it has happened. And you know why? Because it is absolutely unheard of. Like I said, the game announcer even said "nobody bunts in a situation like this."

And the problem with your bunting for a hit theory is that that isn't what he was trying to do. Speaking specifically about the Georgia Tech game since it was the most recent (but they've done it this way in the past as well) the hitter didn't square around late to try to fool everyone and drop down a bunt for a hit. The batter squared around to bunt while the pitcher was getting ready to release the ball. It was obviously a sacrifice bunt attempt, because he squared around way too early for it to be an attempt to get a hit on the play.
 
Just saying. 2 guys out of 300+ didn't sign. Pirates had one of them.

In that situation they received an extra pick and additional money in the 2017 Draft. It's why they had 2 2nd rounders this year, just as they had 2 1st rounders in the year after Appel chose not to sign.

This year they used the extra cash and took 2 kids considered extremely difficult signs (Baz and Bolton) and have already agreed to terms.
 
Tell me the last time a major league team had their number three hitter bunting with guys on first and second and no outs in the top of the first inning. Has it happened in the last decade? The last 25 years? The last 50 years? I'm guessing you won't be able to think of a single instance where it has happened. And you know why? Because it is absolutely unheard of. Like I said, the game announcer even said "nobody bunts in a situation like this."

And the problem with your bunting for a hit theory is that that isn't what he was trying to do. Speaking specifically about the Georgia Tech game since it was the most recent (but they've done it this way in the past as well) the hitter didn't square around late to try to fool everyone and drop down a bunt for a hit. The batter squared around to bunt while the pitcher was getting ready to release the ball. It was obviously a sacrifice bunt attempt, because he squared around way too early for it to be an attempt to get a hit on the play.

Its not a major league team! Anyways, it IS a common play if the batter didnt square around and just give himself up. Especially if the runners were on the move and stealing. I use this play almost weekly managing legion ball. The batter looks at the third basemen as he is bunting, if the third baseman comes in and the shortstop isnt running to cover third you pull the bat back and have your runners advance. If he covers third, you try to bunt down the line such that its either right down the line or foul.
 
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Its not a major league team! Anyways, it IS a common play if the batter didnt square around and just give himself up. Especially if the runners were on the move and stealing. I use this play almost weekly managing legion ball. The batter looks at the third basemen as he is bunting, if the third baseman comes in and the shortstop isnt running to cover third you pull the bat back and have your runners advance. If he covers third, you try to bunt down the line such that its either right down the line or foul.


But that isn't what happened. I agree that if the third baseman is playing back and the batter is a good bunter then occasionally dropping down a bunt trying for a base hit can be a good strategy. Especially if the batter doesn't hit with much power. Or he isn't one of your best hitters. But that most certainly is not what Pitt does. The runners are not on the move. The batter one of Pitt's best hitters. And he is obviously attempting to sacrifice. And that's just plain old stupid.

Like I said, in the Georgia Tech game it was so obvious what Pitt was doing and it was so obviously dumb that the game announcer said that nobody does what Pitt was doing. When the batter squared around on the first pitch he assumed that the guy was doing it on his own. When he did it again on the second pitch the guy just couldn't believe it. And that's because strategically it's a dumb move. And merely calling it dumb is being polite.
 
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