OT: Will Orioles get to Nashville before the Pirates?
- Thread starter Saboteur II
- Start date
Also......wasn't Dave Parker the first or one of the first "million dollar" players? And I can remember, yes, when the Pirates payroll and the Yankees were fairly close to each other.
Sad fact... the four best baseball organizations in the early 1970's were Baltimore, Oakland, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati. Today these four are at/near the bottom of MLB.
The Inner Harbor is already collapsing, Most of Harbor Place is empty especially since the pandemic.
That’s sad, that was an incredible area to visit and hang out in the 90s. It is reminiscent of Station Square here, though SS was never as dynamic as the Inner Harbor in its heyday. But in both situations you have a great spot like they have and it just seems incredible that neither could sustain excellence as an entertainment destination.
I don't know much about Baltimore, but couldn't you say the same thing about parts of Pittsburgh? You don't have to venture too far from Shadyside or the happening part of East Liberty to find tons of blight and abandoned lots.
But not because I am a Yinzer, but you don't see the rampant blight like you do in Baltimore or Cleveland or Detroit, where large swaths of the city look like Mogadishu more than a US city.
I’ll give Cleveland credit. At least most of their blight occurs outside of city limits (e.g. East Cleveland). Fun city to explore if you know what you’re looking for.
Haven't read this whole thread, but wouldn't Tampa Bay relocate before just about anybody? They play in an absolute dump and couldn't sell out Game 7 of a World Series if they had to. Not sure what Oakland's attendance is, but they also play in a dump. If they can lose a football team, I'm sure they can lose a baseball team.
Dirty little secret. It is hard to fill a stadium and keep people's interest over 81 home games and 6 months. NFL is the easiest sell, only 8-9 home games over 4 months. Once a week.
No metro area under 5 million should build a baseball stadium over 40K in seats.
When the Pirates had that little run, they were doing just fine. You just want to stay afloat on the weekdays and then fill it up on the weekends. Looking at average attendance so far this year... the A's are at 8,283?!?! I'm sure that's a gorgeous site in a 60,000-seat dump.
The Rays lease runs until 2027, apparently the only buyout clause is if they move within the Tampa Bay Area. I don't think MLB wants any team to move, they'd rather make whoever in Las Vegas, Portland, Charlotte or Nashville pay a massive expansion fee.
I'm trying to think of the last time an MLB team did move. The Expos, maybe? I'm pretty sure the Rays, D-backs, Marlins, and Rockies all started from scratch.
You can literally take a wrong turn and go one block in Baltimore and go from tourist area to some of the saddest neighborhoods on the east coast. It's pretty wild, actually.
Baltimore sunk everything into a couple of areas and forgot that urban planning is a bit more than getting Target or Trader Joes to show up. There are a lot of great neighborhoods that seem purposely difficult to find and enjoy but they get overshadowed but the tourist traps and the blight.
We could use “forlorn” I guess, but Walt’s agent might have that term copyrighted
So in the best case scenerio the pirates averaged 9th out of 15 teams in per game attendance -
Tell me again how baseball isn’t dying
I will still go to a few games , eat concessions , hang with my family - and enjoy the great views
But am never under any illusion the pirates Matter at all
Maybe way down the line MLB will adopt the USFL strategy with a twist. All the NL teams will be actually located in LA and all play in Dodger stadium. Multiple games a day. Split them between there and the Giants stadium if too unwieldy. No crowds expected for the non Dodger and non Giant games; all revenue comes from TV. Likewise the American League teams are all located in New York/Boston and all play in one of those two venues. World Series alternates. Most likely the WS will always be a combo of the Dodgers or Giants vs the Yankees or Red Sox anyway, so why keep the pretense of the other teams actually playing in the other cities (other than their names of course).
If feasible or necessary to expand additional ‘hubs’ in Atlanta (or Houston) and Chicago, maybe that would work also. But either way, this means the myriad of “small market” sacrificial lamb teams like the Pirates don’t have to even worry about attendance in their market anymore. They’ll all play in one of those 2 (or 4) cities.
If feasible or necessary to expand additional ‘hubs’ in Atlanta (or Houston) and Chicago, maybe that would work also. But either way, this means the myriad of “small market” sacrificial lamb teams like the Pirates don’t have to even worry about attendance in their market anymore. They’ll all play in one of those 2 (or 4) cities.
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True. I should have known better…time moves slowly in Pittsburgh…75 years is the blink of an eye in ‘burgh time. Those blurs were all the places like Nashville blowing by.
Nashville is going to be EV capital of the US very soon with volkswagen, GM and Ford all building assembly and battery plants there. Pittsburgh and PA in general are stuck or even dying in population. The state needs to be a right to work state soon to survive. Very little big time investment or company relocation to PA. US Steel will be out of Pgh within 5-6 years and the Mon Valley works will be closed. There new investments are in Arkansas with two huge non-union mini mills. Question is will Pgh be able tohold on to pro sports with the southern cities growing so fast over the next 30 years.
Spot on. Always has been. It's block by block but the inner harbor has been a disaster for over a decade. I'm afraid to go now. I live in nova and went 3-4 x a year but ain't worth your life. I'd go straight to Fell Point now. Aquarium children museum and inner harbor are unreal but just watch the wire and we own this city to see the problem.
Yep. Nashville gonna contend with the atl and Charlotte. It's amazing the hoops teams is in memphis. It should be in Nashville but the grizzlies draw in a city people don't want to go to anymore despite the blues bbq and Elvis.
When I was a kid (in the past ) I could name the complete roster and the batting averages from 1987-2010.
Now the Pirates might as well be an out of town team, I know maybe 2 of their players.
Interest level is zero.
Now the Pirates might as well be an out of town team, I know maybe 2 of their players.
Interest level is zero.
No. It will keep the Steelers. Penguins and Pirates will be gone.
Do you think Nashville is big enough to host the NBA and NHL? Heck, it may have every major sports league soon.
Pittsburgh will get a NBA team before the Penguins ever leave Pittsburgh.
If there was 8 teams left in the NHL, Pittsburgh would have a team.
I wish that we had a NBA team. I like basketball but I find it hard to follow without a rooting interest. I’m more-or-less a Cavs fan since we lived in Ohio for a bit… feels wrong! Plus, I’d be very prideful of our city joining the select few with every major sports league represented.
With that being said, I don’t think it’d work out so I won’t keep my hopes up.
Its funny, you would think with climate change and Pittsburgh's relatively benign weather, as energy costs continue to rise, Pittsburgh would be more of a desirable location.
But............factors working against? For one, the topography makes land and access really expensive and somewhat scarce. Secondly, the political climate, the 10000 little fiefdoms all with their individual overlords (government) make not just taxes but consensus on how to approach businesses. Thirdly, the political climate, and i am sorry but you hear it straight from the horse's mouth "I support good UNION jobs". No folks, you should support GOOD JOBS period. But always has to have that U word. Companies run. I worked for both, Unions are somewhat obsolete now. Competition is out there where companies have to "behave" or they won't be able to hire good people. The local politicians would rather celebrate a Starbucks becoming unionized then Intel building a plant of 3000 people making on average 6 figure salaries without a union.
It is just this antiquated, parochial over taxed, over regulated, supporting too many little fiefdoms and their kings and queens. It's really frustrating. It is rinse and repeat over and over again.
I love this area but you're right that there is a lot of antiquated ideas holding us back. I was just in Seattle and I've never seen so much construction in my life. There are places that talk about growth and development and other areas that make it happen. Too much talk in this area and not enough action.
Let's see to name only a few;
* a new $billion plus airport is being constructed,
* UPMC is constructing three new hospitals within the city, including 1.6 billion one in Oakland.
* $6 billion natural gas processing plant is set to open in the region which will have countlee spinoff companies.
* Carnegie Mellon has become an international juggernaut in robotics. Been to their main campus or the strip lately?
No region in the U.S has ever experienced the economic devastation Pittsburgh did in the 1980's. 250K family sustaining jobs vanished almost overnight.
Some of you are stil not able to comprehend the extent of this devastation and the positive methodical econmic transformation that continues to take place in the Burgh.
But I do agree, Pa and specifically Pittsburgh would be well served by becoming a "right to work" state and continue to lower the corporate tax rate.
* a new $billion plus airport is being constructed,
* UPMC is constructing three new hospitals within the city, including 1.6 billion one in Oakland.
* $6 billion natural gas processing plant is set to open in the region which will have countlee spinoff companies.
* Carnegie Mellon has become an international juggernaut in robotics. Been to their main campus or the strip lately?
No region in the U.S has ever experienced the economic devastation Pittsburgh did in the 1980's. 250K family sustaining jobs vanished almost overnight.
Some of you are stil not able to comprehend the extent of this devastation and the positive methodical econmic transformation that continues to take place in the Burgh.
But I do agree, Pa and specifically Pittsburgh would be well served by becoming a "right to work" state and continue to lower the corporate tax rate.
I think there’s also the possibility that Pittsburgh and other Rust Belt cities will see an uptick in population over the long-term future due to climate change and climate refugees. We will (should) be just fine.
Pittsburgh itself is looking solid, especially in light of the UPMC and Carnegie Mellon presence you mentioned. The larger region, however, looks like it could use some creative solutions and perhaps municipal consolidation or something like that could help; I see a lot of communities with aging populations. The other two projects you referenced are along 376 in the west/northwest direction. The Cranberry area is growing. But the areas that could really use a boost are east and down through the Mon Valley. Westinghouse's fall has really hurt the eastern suburbs as well as Westmoreland County. The Mon Valley was absolutely annihilated by the loss of the steel industry and has never recovered. It would be great to see a cracker plant level project down that valley.
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Hi! Raising my hand for the land that time forgot. The AK Valley. It is 1977 every day here. We haven't been devastated like the Mon Valley or Aliquippa, but we have been allowed to rust out. This place has aged, the schools have shrunk. Christ they put in a giant mall and the mall barely lasts 10 years before it starts failing. ATI is still humming. Even New Ken is trying to be revitalized. But it is just so stale, really horrid politicians and parochial vision from long time residents that simply "don't want that here".
The AK Valley has rt 28 and the Turnpike cuts through, but what it really needs is a northern beltway, across southern Butler County connecting 79 and 28.
I’d point out that those driving forces are not contributing to the tax base .
Racing to the bottom for corporate tax rates always creates corporate flight as they chase the next haven for incentives
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