Paul Finebaum: Nailed it

[Pittx9]

Said Miami is a terrible job, a bankrupt program, and the fans are completely delusional. Glad somebody stopped gloating over how it's "the U", some great job. We should have known when a guy dressed up as Joe Paterno and said it was one of the best jobs in the country, that it was no longer a destination job. Finebaum also later said UCF is a better job than Miami. Lol O'Leary made them good, they will no longer be relevant. Even with him this year until this past week they are winless right now.

Being 6-1 right now doesn't mean we have taken a huge step forward and are a national contender right now. But for anyone who's not connected to the U, Pitt and most other P5 jobs are a huge step up from Miami.

 

[phxpanther]

UCF is not a better job, that's laughable. Miami has so much talent in the area, the right coach can win, and win big there. No program is immune to bad coaching hires, its happened to every great program

 

[Pittx9]

UCF is not a better job, that's laughable. Miami has so much talent in the area, the right coach can win, and win big there. No program is immune to bad coaching hires, its happened to every great program

Yeah I agree Miami is not a good job, but UCF, lol! It's pretty hard to make a case for any G5 school as a better job than a P5 school.

 

[phxpanther]

Yeah I agree Miami is not a good job, but UCF, lol! It's pretty hard to make a case for any G5 school as a better job than a P5 school.

There are two resources more important than anything else in college football. Talent and coaching, Miami still brings in talent. The right coach can win big there. It's a very good job

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

2002 was the last time the U played in a national championship. That was thirteen years ago.

A recruit graduating in 2016 would have been four years old.

 

[DruidTM]

UCF is not a better job, that's laughable. Miami has so much talent in the area, the right coach can win, and win big there. No program is immune to bad coaching hires, its happened to every great program

Newsflash...FSU...Florida...USF...UCF...Miami...there is "talent in the area" for all of em.....and some of those schools have improved dramatically (with ups and downs) over the past decade or so.....there is clearly more to the story thn talent in the area.....

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

Some see Miami as a great place now to coach.

Others see Miami as not a great place now to coach.

I see Miami as a great place now for Narduzzi to go get some of their 2016 recruits who are questioning their commitment. Players want to play for a coach they can believe in and who believes in them. Hope Pat and his staff are reaching out to them.

 

[MartyInLawrenceville]

There are two resources more important than anything else in college football. Talent and coaching, Miami still brings in talent. The right coach can win big there. It's a very good job

phx,
If you don't have the facitlities, the commitment of the administration and alumni, you're not going to get the talent. If Miami was the only school in FL, maybe. But, not when FSU, Florida, UCF, SF all competing for the same talent.

 

[WoadBlue]

Paul Finebaum is an SEC shill 24/7/365. He would say the same thing basically about Miami if the Canes had been 10-3 last year. Truth is not the issue - downgrading ACC teams, especially those in states shared with the SEC or in SEC border states, is the issue.

Finebaum fears that a new Miami coach could hurt the SEC a bit. If Narduzzi starts taking FL and GA players from SEC schools, Finebaum will start talking about how Pitt is a dead program with no future.

 

[OriginalEther]

Paul Finebaum is an SEC shill 24/7/365. He would say the same thing basically about Miami if the Canes had been 10-3 last year. Truth is not the issue - downgrading ACC teams, especially those in states shared with the SEC or in SEC border states, is the issue.

Finebaum fears that a new Miami coach could hurt the SEC a bit. If Narduzzi starts taking FL and GA players from SEC schools, Finebaum will start talking about how Pitt is a dead program with no future.

Beat me to it.

 

[PittMan 72]

Paul Finebaum is an SEC shill 24/7/365. He would say the same thing basically about Miami if the Canes had been 10-3 last year. Truth is not the issue - downgrading ACC teams, especially those in states shared with the SEC or in SEC border states, is the issue.

Finebaum fears that a new Miami coach could hurt the SEC a bit. If Narduzzi starts taking FL and GA players from SEC schools, Finebaum will start talking about how Pitt is a dead program with no future.

Truf'.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

phx,
If you don't have the facitlities, the commitment of the administration and alumni, you're not going to get the talent. If Miami was the only school in FL, maybe. But, not when FSU, Florida, UCF, SF all competing for the same talent.

This. Bar none, the most important resource in college football is money. Without it, you won't be able to attract -- and keep -- talent and coaching.

It's why Pitt fell off, it's why Miami has fallen off, and it's why the SEC has become a dominant force. When facilities exploded and coaching salaries skyrocketed, they were the schools with enough financial backing to set the market.

 

[TD_6082]

Miami is one of the few schools that really doesn't need the sparkling new facilities or giant influx of money to succeed. There are many coaches out there who can go to Miami and bring in Top 10 classes every year.

I'm in no way suggesting Narduzzi is going to leave Pitt or is a candidate for the Miami job. I'm just throwing this hypothetical question out there for you... Do you think Narduzzi would sign a lot more talent at Miami or Pitt? Do you think the potential for winning is higher at Miami or Pitt?

That said, if the U can only pay $2 to $3 mil for a coach, then they probably aren't going to get a splash hire and they probably are going to have to deal with turnover. All that is fine too, as they are one of the few schools that can still thrive under those circumstances. Schnellenberger, JJ, Erickson, Davis, Coker had success there, although Coker is the one that let the program fall into the abyss.

No amount of money in the world can make Gainesville or Tallahassee Miami. That's also can't be stressed enough.

 

[vegasgreed]

only thing paul has nailed is big ears.

 

[phxpanther]

You're wrong, Miami is the rare school that can load up on talent without big time facilities.

Miami has had talent, look at recruiting rankings, look at the draft. Talent is not, and never will be the problem at Miami

phx,
If you don't have the facitlities, the commitment of the administration and alumni, you're not going to get the talent. If Miami was the only school in FL, maybe. But, not when FSU, Florida, UCF, SF all competing for the same talent.

You're wrong, Miami still
L

phx,
If you don't have the facitlities, the commitment of the administration and alumni, you're not going to get the talent. If Miami was the only school in FL, maybe. But, not when FSU, Florida, UCF, SF all competing for the same talent.

 

[phxpanther]

Nope. Two most important resources, coaches and talent. Again, Miami still gets talent. Hire the right coach and they will be fine

This. Bar none, the most important resource in college football is money. Without it, you won't be able to attract -- and keep -- talent and coaching.

It's why Pitt fell off, it's why Miami has fallen off, and it's why the SEC has become a dominant force. When facilities exploded and coaching salaries skyrocketed, they were the schools with enough financial backing to set the market.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Nope. Two most important resources, coaches and talent. Again, Miami still gets talent. Hire the right coach and they will be fine

The problem is retention. Without a lot of money, the best you'll have is a flash in the pan type of success. If Miami can only pay up to $3MM, as has been rumored, they won't be able to hang on to anybody who is successful there -- head coach or coordinator.

 

[TD_6082]

Since Schellenberger built the U, retention as always been a problem. They still have 5 National Titles to show for it, and have played for several other national titles... sheesh. So many I can't even name them off the top of my head. And just look at the list of names that have played there in that time span. Unreal.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Since Schellenberger built the U, retention as always been a problem. They still have 5 National Titles to show for it, and have played for several other national titles... sheesh. So many I can't even name them off the top of my head. And just look at the list of names that have played there in that time span. Unreal.

My argument is about sustainability. I agree they've had success, and that another coach could be successful over a 5 year time period or so, but they'll naturally have turnover and have a very small margin for error.

It's more an indictment on the program as a whole, rather than the program's viability as probably the best stepping stone job in the country.

It's certainly superior to the Pitt job. Pitt's poorer than Miami and has less of a surrounding talent base.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Since the move to the ACC starting in 2004:
9-3
9-3
7-6
5-7
7-6
9-4
7-6
6-6
7-5
9-4
6-7
4-3

No BCS Bowls. Looks pretty much like, well Pitt. Guys, arguing that Miami is such a great job right now is like arguing that Pitt was a great job in 1994. They have fallen way, way behind in the facilities and infrastructure needed to support a big time program. True, they are in a great recruiting area, but everyone recruits those kids.

 

[CrazyPaco]

Like it is everywhere else, the primary issue with Miami is coaching. It has had bad coaching for a decade.

Money can cover some warts and minimize downturns during regular cycles ...like a Texas or Alabama, you can go out an buy whatever coach can be bought. But money isn't the end all, otherwise Pitt and Temple wouldn't be ranked ahead of Texas and Auburn right now.

A lack of money means coaching selections become critical. See the last 30 years of Pitt. You have to hire people that are generally more unproven than those coaches only willing to go where there is top money.

And this is Miami's problem. They are a small, private school in an area that doesn't really care that much about sports, and is still filled with pro teams. Their gate revenue is paltry...even worse than Pitt's. They were hurt by losing the Orange Bowl, even if that was off campus, it was still 15 miles closer to campus and close to the metro rail line. Crowds are worse than ever: meaning gate revenue is worse than ever.

Miami's also hurt by being landlocked, not in an urban grid like Pitt, but in a swanky neighborhood of Coral Gables where there is nowhere little space to expand. They had to build their less than 8K seat on-campus basketball arena with empty rows because of ordinances in the Gables that prevent larger structures. It will be hard for them to ever even build proper facilities. They desperately need an indoor football facility. They're one of the only major college football programs without one. Heck Wake is even building one. Pitt has had one since 1990! The money isn't there for UM. I'm not sure the space is either. They really need to find a way to move games back into Miami proper, but it looks like their hope of getting in on Beckham's soccer stadium has fallen through.

What Miami has is unprecedented football talent in its backyard. It should be competitive by default, just by scooping up its annual share of locals. Heck, it has had top 20 recruiting classes for the past four years. Just shows you how bad of a coaching staff they've had in place. Nothing is more damning than losing the team in-season, and this appears to have been the second year in a row when Golden lost the team.

Miami also has unprecedented natural resources that appeal to 17-18 year old men. It should be an easy sell. It still has a national brand.

Miami can come back. It just needs the right coach that is a fit for South Florida...and that also means someone that will bring the 'Canes the flash and swagger of old because that is actually what the city itself is all about. But the U isn't going to be throwing fistfuls of money at coaches like the bigger boys. It needs its alumni and boosters to step up much more if it wants to minimize the down periods.

 

[TD_6082]

recruits, the Canes current class is ranked 9th. Think about that. We would be going nuts on here if we had a class ranked that high. They are in the crapper and still have a class ranked in the top 10. That tells you all you need to know about the U.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

True, they are in a great recruiting area, but everyone recruits those kids.

This is true, but, it's also true that they're still getting those kids, though. I agree, it's not a good program overall when looking at it on a macro level, but you get the right coach in there and they'll win big for a few years before a richer program comes along and poaches them.

They'll be able to get talent, the cash shortage will just preclude them from keeping around their coach and keeping momentum going.

 

[phxpanther]

Exactly. You get it. Even with bad infrastructure, they still get talent. Even had 7 guys drafted last year. The talk of the Senior Bowl, was how did Miami lose all those games with that much talent.



QUOTE="TD_6082, post: 454358, member: 510"]recruits, the Canes current class is ranked 9th. Think about that. We would be going nuts on here if we had a class ranked that high. They are in the crapper and still have a class ranked in the top 10. That tells you all you need to know about the U.[/QUOTE]

 

[CrazyPaco]

They'll be able to get talent, the cash shortage will just preclude them from keeping around their coach and keeping momentum going.

This is not dissimilar to Pitt, if Pitt finally does strike Sherrill again with a coach. It is why I continuously harp on building up the athletic endowments as what should be taking priority.

Pitt will never match the gate revenue of the large schools. It needs alternative sources of revenues, and building the endowments addresses that in a permanent (if not an extremely expensive up front) basis.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

This is not dissimilar to Pitt, if Pitt finally does strike Sherrill again with a coach. It is why I continuously harp on building up the athletic endowments as what should be taking priority.

Pitt will never match the gate revenue of the large schools. It needs alternative sources of revenues, and building the endowments addresses that in a permanent (if not an extremely expensive up front) basis.

100% agree. The whole "lack of commitment from the administration" schtick on the boards is just not realizing how little money the administration has. Subsidizing the athletic department out of the general fund in the amount of high-7 and low-8 figures, and still not spending a whole lot, is a terrible indictment of the cash inflows to the athletic department -- and it's not just a Pederson issue. It's been too long-running and too pervasive to be a Pederson issue.

 

[CrazyPaco]

100% agree. The whole "lack of commitment from the administration" schtick on the boards is just not realizing how little money the administration has. Subsidizing the athletic department out of the general fund in the amount of high-7 and low-8 figures, and still not spending a whole lot, is a terrible indictment of the cash inflows to the athletic department -- and it's not just a Pederson issue. It's been too long-running and too pervasive to be a Pederson issue.

Until there is some recognition among fans that they have to be part of the solution to get Pitt out of the cycles of feast and famine, where famine lasts for extensive periods, those cycles will continue. College athletics is not built at all like the professional sports model. Fans have to get involved with their wallets or with being ambassadors for getting people to games...somehow be involved beyond just being a consumer of sports entertainment... because there just aren't enough Pitt fans for Pitt to be competitive financially. Pitt essentially needs fans to be twice the fans of peer programs, not in a cult way, but in an involved, proactive way. Internet Tough Guy-type of fans that take things into their own hands...we need about 10K more of those. That is what Narduzzi went around 7 different cities begging for. People want to strap on the pads for this guy, well he has flat out stated how everyone can do that.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Until there is some recognition among fans that they have to be part of the solution to get Pitt out of the cycles of feast and famine, where famine lasts for extensive periods, those cycles will continue. College athletics is not built at all like the professional sports model. Fans have to get involved with their wallets or with being ambassadors for getting people to games...somehow be involved above just being a consumer of sports entertainment because there aren't enough of fans for Pitt to be competitive financially. Pitt essentially needs fans to be twice the fans of peer programs, not in a cult way, but in an involved, proactive way. Internet Tough Guy-type of fans that take things into their own hands...we need about 10K more of those.

Yep, wins follow money in college sports. In professional sports, money doesn't really matter. You either have a cap or a system in place that gives you control of your players through their prime years. And, most importantly, in college there isn't a draft every year to give the worst teams the first crack at the best talent. There's no way to break out of of a down cycle, other than the flash-in-the-pan runs.

 

[Dr. von Yinzer]

I am old enough to have been around long enough to remember them saying the same thing about USC when it was down… And UCLA when it was down… And Michigan when it was down… And Alabama when it was down… And LSU when it was down…

The refrain is always the same: the game is different now than it was when ever Program X was dominating. They will never again be what they once were.

Those predictions are always proven wrong.

Look, I have no love for The U so this prediction brings me no joy. However, I do know that they have been through a lot from a sanctions perspective and they have hired a few bad coaches in a row.

They are definitely going to win the big again. I have no doubt whatsoever about that.

You mean to tell me that TCU and Baylor can win big but Miami cannot? You're trying to sell me on the absurd notion that UCF is a better job than Miami because they have an indoor practice facility?

I feel like I'm having my leg pulled here. There is no way anyone is that crazy.

Miami clearly has some cultural and financial hurdles that they need to overcome. However, if they hire a good coach, and if they start to make a real financial commitment to their program, I think you'd have to be insane to think they're not going to win.

 

[Consultant Panther]

Until there is some recognition among fans that they have to be part of the solution to get Pitt out of the cycles of feast and famine, where famine lasts for extensive periods, those cycles will continue. College athletics is not built at all like the professional sports model. Fans have to get involved with their wallets or with being ambassadors for getting people to games...somehow be involved beyond just being a consumer of sports entertainment... because there just aren't enough Pitt fans for Pitt to be competitive financially. Pitt essentially needs fans to be twice the fans of peer programs, not in a cult way, but in an involved, proactive way. Internet Tough Guy-type of fans that take things into their own hands...we need about 10K more of those. That is what Narduzzi went around 7 different cities begging for. People want to strap on the pads for this guy, well he has flat out stated how everyone can do that.

That's the bottom line. We need more fans to step up. Even some of the most prolific posters on this board don't have season tickets and don't go to games.

 

[mdpitt]

Said Miami is a terrible job, a bankrupt program, and the fans are completely delusional. Glad somebody stopped gloating over how it's "the U", some great job. We should have known when a guy dressed up as Joe Paterno and said it was one of the best jobs in the country, that it was no longer a destination job. Finebaum also later said UCF is a better job than Miami. Lol O'Leary made them good, they will no longer be relevant. Even with him this year until this past week they are winless right now.

Being 6-1 right now doesn't mean we have taken a huge step forward and are a national contender right now. But for anyone who's not connected to the U, Pitt and most other P5 jobs are a huge step up from Miami.

Fine sum would say anything to discredit any southern school that potentially takes away from the SEC shine. I don't find him and o very objective at all.

Miami is potentially a great job in a terrible stadium.

 

[Tigertown_a_Rick]

Fine sum would say anything to discredit any southern school that potentially takes away from the SEC shine. I don't find him and o very objective at all.

Miami is potentially a great job in a terrible stadium.

Finebum has NO credibility when discussing teams other than the SEC, and it's because he will never give ANY conference or team any credit because of his slanted and biased view of the SEC....!....I turn the TV station every time I see his face!

As for Miami, have to agree with Dr. Yinzer, that Miami just has too much of a built-in advantage recruiting-wise for their football program to be down indefinitely, and the right Coach who places an emphasis on defense will get the job done....There's always going to be skill players a plenty at Miami, and always should be, but their defense has been downright terrible for the most part over the past 10yrs, and that as most know wasn't the case when they were winning national championships...

 

[raleighpanther]

If I were an up and coming coach, I'd prefer the UCF job over the Miami job.

You'd probably be paid the same amount. And you'd get tons of good talent; it might be a step below what you'd get at Miami, but that's fine, since you'd be playing in a non-P5 conference. Better facilities, fans, stadium, etc.

Win there for a few years, and you could get a good P5 job -- one NOT named Miami -- by-passing all the pressure and problems that come with the Miami job.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I am old enough to have been around long enough to remember them saying the same thing about USC when it was down… And UCLA when it was down… And Michigan when it was down… And Alabama when it was down… And LSU when it was down…

The refrain is always the same: the game is different now than it was when ever Program X was dominating. They will never again be what they once were.

Those predictions are always proven wrong.

Look, I have no love for The U so this prediction brings me no joy. However, I do know that they have been through a lot from a sanctions perspective and they have hired a few bad coaches in a row.

They are definitely going to win the big again. I have no doubt whatsoever about that.

You mean to tell me that TCU and Baylor can win big but Miami cannot? You're trying to sell me on the absurd notion that UCF is a better job than Miami because they have an indoor practice facility?

I feel like I'm having my leg pulled here. There is no way anyone is that crazy.

Miami clearly has some cultural and financial hurdles that they need to overcome. However, if they hire a good coach, and if they start to make a real financial commitment to their program, I think you'd have to be insane to think they're not going to win.

And Baylor and TCU invested millions in their programs. Moreso than ever, EVER, now money, facilities, it is a nuke arms race that this stuff matters and tradition doesn't. When you look at Miami's overall history, long term it is worse than Pitt. And when they came to prominence, it was likely a large booster group got together and said "eff it", we are going to do this thing,

If you think about it when they hired Jimmy Johnson, it was only because another program (ahem) was too stupid and shortsighted to hire him, even though most around the program wanted him (and he wanted them) as their next coach.

Oh...and the school they hired JJ from was Okie State, and I doubt that would happen now.

Miami won and won big in two concentrated times where they just screw it to NCAA rules.

During this time, their facilities and infrastructure either stayed the same or got worse while everyone else passed them by. Sure, a good coach here would turn it around, and he would also likely move on to a bigger school shortly afterwards.

They are going to go the "U" route and fail because they want to create the past, which cannot be recreated in today's environment. IF they were smart and truly committed, they would go after a RichRod, who's offense down here with the athletes available and that 3-3-5 defense would be perfect. And RichRod would demand facility upgrades immediately. Which means he won't come.

 

[Jpripper88]

Paul Finebaum is an SEC shill 24/7/365. He would say the same thing basically about Miami if the Canes had been 10-3 last year. Truth is not the issue - downgrading ACC teams, especially those in states shared with the SEC or in SEC border states, is the issue.

Finebaum fears that a new Miami coach could hurt the SEC a bit. If Narduzzi starts taking FL and GA players from SEC schools, Finebaum will start talking about how Pitt is a dead program with no future.

lolno

 

[psbroderick]

Feinbaum is completely wrong about this. He's just saying what his main constituency (SEC fans) want to hear. And SEC fans hate Miami.

The number of fans in the stands has NEVER mattered down there. If a coach can come in and keep the right Miami-area players in Miami, he'll win like crazy.

Yes, they probably can't afford to pay a coach as much as Alabama or Ohio State and that makes it more likely that a successful coach might leave...but to say that Miami is a terrible job is something that I don't think he believes.

 

[wbrpanther]

Miami is one of the few schools that really doesn't need the sparkling new facilities or giant influx of money to succeed. There are many coaches out there who can go to Miami and bring in Top 10 classes every year.

I'm in no way suggesting Narduzzi is going to leave Pitt or is a candidate for the Miami job. I'm just throwing this hypothetical question out there for you... Do you think Narduzzi would sign a lot more talent at Miami or Pitt? Do you think the potential for winning is higher at Miami or Pitt?

That said, if the U can only pay $2 to $3 mil for a coach, then they probably aren't going to get a splash hire and they probably are going to have to deal with turnover. All that is fine too, as they are one of the few schools that can still thrive under those circumstances. Schnellenberger, JJ, Erickson, Davis, Coker had success there, although Coker is the one that let the program fall into the abyss.

No amount of money in the world can make Gainesville or Tallahassee Miami. That's also can't be stressed enough.

Miami will probably go all out to sign that ubertalented coach up at Happy Valley.

 

[TD_6082]

Recruits, My wife is in academia. I spent a week down in Waco last year. Baylor cheats like crazy.

 

[Pittx9]

Fine sum would say anything to discredit any southern school that potentially takes away from the SEC shine. I don't find him and o very objective at all.

Miami is potentially a great job in a terrible stadium.

After hearing him ramble on about the SEC, I'd agree with that part. I think the terrible stadium is part of it though. Yes, you can most definitely win at Miami. But what do they have to offer a head coach right now?

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

Recruits, My wife is in academia. I spent a week down in Waco last year. Baylor cheats like crazy.

UNC, KANSAS and UCLA Basketball Programs were all built on multiple NCAA Violations and payments made to players by some Boosters over various Decades! It happens!