Recruiting Quantity - Where we stand vs ACC

[SoufOaklin4Life]

You realize Macvittie and Ford have mostly MAC offers (i.e. teams like Toledo and Bowling Green). Some of our offers as of late have been to kids with limited offers or low level teams as well. I'm not saying we are not going to land a lot of good kids, but I don't think the reason for our slow start is waiting on bigger fish like you say.

Of course, the only difference is the staff is more visible and selling themselves as recruiters...not really the results of those efforts.
So, it's misleading some folks into believing the results are different, too...because they are hearing more about the efforts.

Frankly, there is a reason why most staffs don't publicize their efforts....because, when they fail...they look bad publicly. Coaches are by nature, risk-adverse.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

You realize Macvittie and Ford have mostly MAC offers (i.e. teams like Toledo and Bowling Green). Some of our offers as of late have been to kids with limited offers or low level teams as well. I'm not saying we are not going to land a lot of good kids, but I don't think the reason for our slow start is waiting on bigger fish like you say.

Dokish apparently reading this thread and disagreed with you. I'll take his word over yours.

 

[H2Pittisit]

Dokish apparently reading this thread and disagreed with you. I'll take his word over yours.

If you want sunshine blown up your rear end, that is a good person to follow. I deal in realities. Doke deals in dream scenarios. Currently, we have 3 commits and 1 is wavering. I think Damar Hamlin will eventually land with the Panthers. It will mostly be due to his baby brother being born. I hope he can get some other locals to commit. I'd love Doke to name the big fish outside of Pittsburgh that Pitt is waiting on and going to land. Maybe Zach Gilbert? That's about it.

It's kind of like stating people were waiting for the lynchpin to commit last year (Whitehead)....they would have waited until November.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Dokish apparently reading this thread and disagreed with you. I'll take his word over yours.

I'd find that shocking that Dokish reads these forums and then derives his content from them.
His opinion is like anyone else's.

The commit's offers aren't a matter of opinion.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I'd find that shocking that Dokish reads these forums and then derives his content from them.
His opinion is like anyone else's.

The commit's offers aren't a matter of opinion.

Come on man.....Doke is "connected". Connected to who, what, etc....now that is an interesting question.....but his opinion means, well.....it means something. Doesn't it?

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Come on man.....Doke is "connected". Connected to who, what, etc....now that is an interesting question.....but his opinion means, well.....it means something. Doesn't it?

As much as ours. Which says it all.

He buddies up with an assistant or two to get "scoop" on recruiting..that's about it.

 

[H2Pittisit]

Chris Dokish knows what we all know. Pitt is in on Damar Hamlin. If Hamlin commits, many others could follow locally. I've read a lot of National Writers think he is leaning OSU. I've heard Peal and Karlo say we lead. Regardless, we need some positive news outside of Hamlin, because I don't get the feeling he is committing before the end of summer.

 

[vulcan80]

I think Hamlin will commit to Pitt.The reason is simply,early playing time.Look at The Ohio State roster and their 2015-16 recruits.In 2015 OSU signed 4 CBs,two 3* and two 4*,plus another 3* in 2016.PSU signed one 4* in 2015 and has two 4* committed for 2016.If he wants early playing time he'll get it at Pitt before the other two.Heck right now WVU has a way better secondary and way more depth than Pitt does.BWDIK

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

If you want sunshine blown up your rear end, that is a good person to follow. I deal in realities. Doke deals in dream scenarios. Currently, we have 3 commits and 1 is wavering. I think Damar Hamlin will eventually land with the Panthers. It will mostly be due to his baby brother being born. I hope he can get some other locals to commit. I'd love Doke to name the big fish outside of Pittsburgh that Pitt is waiting on and going to land. Maybe Zach Gilbert? That's about it.

It's kind of like stating people were waiting for the lynchpin to commit last year (Whitehead)....they would have waited until November.

Butler has stated many times he is committed so not sure where you get the wavering idea. And dokish is not perfect, but is on target with a lot of opinions. He called Chryst an average hire on day 1 and was right about that. Let's see how this plays out. Still early.

 

[H2Pittisit]

Butler has stated many times he is committed so not sure where you get the wavering idea. And dokish is not perfect, but is on target with a lot of opinions. He called Chryst an average hire on day 1 and was right about that. Let's see how this plays out. Still early.

Maybe the fact that he is visiting Michigan in 12 days. Dokish raved about things Chryst did

 

[Dr. von Yinzer]

I predict that Narduzzi will do very well with PC's recruits and that there are more than a few people who will never admit to that either.

From your lips/keyboard to God's ears.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

If you want sunshine blown up your rear end, that is a good person to follow. I deal in realities. Doke deals in dream scenarios. Currently, we have 3 commits and 1 is wavering. I think Damar Hamlin will eventually land with the Panthers. It will mostly be due to his baby brother being born. I hope he can get some other locals to commit. I'd love Doke to name the big fish outside of Pittsburgh that Pitt is waiting on and going to land. Maybe Zach Gilbert? That's about it.

It's kind of like stating people were waiting for the lynchpin to commit last year (Whitehead)....they would have waited until November.

Butler has stated many times he is committed so not sure where you get the wavering idea. And dokish is not perfect, but is on target with a lot of opinions. He called Chryst an average hire on day 1 and was right about that. Let's see how this plays out. Still early.

Maybe the fact that he is visiting Michigan in 12 days. Dokish raved about things Chryst did

Are you kidding? Dokish was the anti-Chryst. Rarely had much positive to say about him. And visits will happen, Boyd visited Tennessee about 2 weeks before signing day. Sanders is supposedly visiting as well. For now, I'll take both Butler and sanders at their word.

 

[vegasgreed]

maybe butler and sanders are solid as "oak".

 

[OriginalEther]

Butler has stated many times he is committed so not sure where you get the wavering idea. And dokish is not perfect,
Are you kidding? Dokish was the anti-Chryst. Rarely had much positive to say about him. And visits will happen, Boyd visited Tennessee about 2 weeks before signing day. Sanders is supposedly visiting as well. For now, I'll take both Butler and sanders at their word.

Dokish would defend Chryst from the lunatic fringe, but I agree, as a whole he was pretty critical of him.

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

I think we can expect to see some commits after a couple of Duzzi's prospect camps. He's off to a bit of a slow start, but as i have said many times, Pitt has become (over the past 30 years) a very tough place to recruit to. Extended mediocrity and a carousel of coaches will do that to a program. I think he;s going about it the right way, he will need to build some relationships and credibility with WPIAL coaches and prospects before he's stacking up 10 commits by June 1 every year--and he is working hard to do that.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

Let's also not forget that PN has something quite special he can use as a great selling tool: 2 preseason All-Americans... Not just all-ACC.

I can see a situation where 7-10 of Narduzzi's top targets (who are not committed or who are a soft commit elsewhere) are invited to Heinz Field to watch Pitt's two NFL bound / preseason All-Americans in action (possibly against Notre Dame). Having many of your top targets accept that kind of invitation should be easy. Then it's up to the coaches to prove they can win that game, along with the games they are expected to win and at least a few that they are not.

Do that and we could see two targets deciding to commit who then turn around and convince a few others who went to the game to pull the trigger who together convince a few others to do the same. You gotta win though.

 

[deepelemblues]

I hope you're right. But, he's never coached a game before.

I'm expecting more of the same, until proven otherwise.

I expect that the next 2-3 years of Narduzzi trying to win with PC's players will show that PC was a far better recruiter than the wits think he is, and a worse gameday coach than his defenders think he was.

 

[thebadby2]

I expect that the next 2-3 years of Narduzzi trying to win with PC's players will show that PC was a far better recruiter than the wits think he is, and a worse gameday coach than his defenders think he was.

His legacy was to build the nucleus of a strong offense. Period. There is no question that he failed miserably when it came to recruiting defense. He has left the cupboard nearly bare on that side.

 

[geeman2001]

Agreed. Our Defensive 2 deep (ahead of incoming transfers and freshmen) is almost shocking in lack of playmakers. Even by random luck, a team usually has a couple. Other than possibly Grigsby (and that's largely based on special teams play), I don't see even that. Again, almost shocking, really. If Duz can mold anything respectable out of them, he's automatic COY.

On the flip side, Chryst deserves great credit for securing a bona fide OL with solid depth. I don't minimize this in the least, as it's been a Pitt problem for years. And kudos as well for Boyd and Conner (if Voytik blossoms further, I'm willing to give Chryst props too, though he's Graham's recruit and I think his success is largely due to his best attribute, which appears to be strong internal fortitude).

Give him credit for decent PK and P as well. Key elements.

But, even acknowledging the credit on offense, there are quibbles there too. He brought in two rock stars for sure but he was greatly unimaginative in utilizing them. Since he had put literally all his focus in offense at the expense of the defense, he simply had to score many more points than his offense did. They piled up a bunch of yards but simply did not score nearly enough. And he didn't seem to see the urgency in this at all.

Duz hopefully will, despite his background. This team still will need to score a sh!tload of points for a chance at an 8-4 or better ... and he badly needs such a record to get some traction in recruiting next year.

 

[thebadby2]

Agreed. Our Defensive 2 deep (ahead of incoming transfers and freshmen) is almost shocking in lack of playmakers. Even by random luck, a team usually has a couple. Other than possibly Grigsby (and that's largely based on special teams play), I don't see even that. Again, almost shocking, really. If Duz can mold anything respectable out of them, he's automatic COY.

On the flip side, Chryst deserves great credit for securing a bona fide OL with solid depth. I don't minimize this in the least, as it's been a Pitt problem for years. And kudos as well for Boyd and Conner (if Voytik blossoms further, I'm willing to give Chryst props too, though he's Graham's recruit and I think his success is largely due to his best attribute, which appears to be strong internal fortitude).

Give him credit for decent PK and P as well. Key elements.

But, even acknowledging the credit on offense, there are quibbles there too. He brought in two rock stars for sure but he was greatly unimaginative in utilizing them. Since he had put literally all his focus in offense at the expense of the defense, he simply had to score many more points than his offense did. They piled up a bunch of yards but simply did not score nearly enough. And he didn't seem to see the urgency in this at all.

Duz hopefully will, despite his background. This team still will need to score a sh!tload of points for a chance at an 8-4 or better ... and he badly needs such a record to get some traction in recruiting next year.

But, even acknowledging the credit on offense, there are quibbles there too. He brought in two rock stars for sure but he was greatly unimaginative in utilizing them.

I agree 100%--I was not impressed with the stone age offensive scheme and was even less impressed with the play calling. Only 3-4 players ever really touched the ball in PC's Pitt offense, and even though we didn't have strong complimentary playmakers to Boyd, we had other guys who could catch the ball, and we had an excellent group of TEs and RBs that we never took advantage of. I thought we badly underutilized our personnel. Exhibit 1 would be that our passing game consisted of Voytik to Boyd to the point where it was almost comical. To Boyd's credit, he found a way to get open and make plays even though the opposing Ds knew nearly every pass was going his way. That is no way to run an offense.

PC did build a solid and deep O line, and that is critically important. Without that, your O is going to struggle no matter how talented the skill position players are. He also toughened us up offensively, and changed the mentality. On the other hand, he struggled to bring in a legit QB--Bertke may be that guy, but we don't know yet--and one QB in 3 years isn't gonna cut it. PC deserves his share of credit for leaving us in good shape on the offensive side, and he deserves his share of criticism for the other shortcomings. I will not miss him, no matter how Narduzzi pans out.

 

[deepelemblues]

Incoming freshmen are PC's players. He recruited them. Narduzzi had what, something like 34 days recruiting them? PC had 11+ months.

The only unit that was truly left bare by PC was defensive line. A very important unit and it's pretty inexcusable that there is minimal talent there at best, but the defense is not an empty cupboard. Guys like Maddox, Amara, Mitchell, are players PC brought here who are good to really good players. Folston, Davis and Wirginis should turn out to be decent college LBs.

And he did more than build the nucleus of a strong offense. He couldn't get QBs to stay committed. He got a nice crop of WRs coming in who will be true freshmen or redshirted this year. Offensive line and RB and TE are stacked. So again, one position, yes the most critical one, badly recruited on that side of the field. The rest, not so badly recruited at all.

 

[OriginalEther]

I wouldn't even say the DL is bare. I think there are numbers and some talent at DT. It's the DE's that are extremely questionable.

As for the D itself, I know people will think I'm nuts, but I don't think it was nearly as bad as some people made it out to be. Yes, they had some bad games. Four stand out to me: Akron, Georgia Tech, Duke, North Carolina

We all know about the Akron game. But the other three, yeah the D wasn't good, but those 3 teams put points on a lot of teams. And we all know how the Georgia Tech game started.
I'll have to take the time to look at the numbers, and maybe they'll prove me wrong, but I think Pitt's D did pretty much what you'd expect a team to do.

The other teams, with less potent offenses, the D did at least average or better. Was anyone really fussing about the D against BC or Miami?
Bottom line is, I don't think this season's D is a completely lost cause.

 

[Pitt is #1]

I wouldn't even say the DL is bare. I think there are numbers and some talent at DT. It's the DE's that are extremely questionable.

As for the D itself, I know people will think I'm nuts, but I don't think it was nearly as bad as some people made it out to be. Yes, they had some bad games. Four stand out to me: Akron, Georgia Tech, Duke, North Carolina

We all know about the Akron game. But the other three, yeah the D wasn't good, but those 3 teams put points on a lot of teams. And we all know how the Georgia Tech game started.
I'll have to take the time to look at the numbers, and maybe they'll prove me wrong, but I think Pitt's D did pretty much what you'd expect a team to do.

The other teams, with less potent offenses, the D did at least average or better. Was anyone really fussing about the D against BC or Miami?
Bottom line is, I don't think this seoason's D is a completely lost cause.

The entire problem with PC and his staff was their inability to be flexible. House ran a good scheme...the problem was college limits practice time. His scheme was more suited to the Pro's. PC had the same problem. He wanted Voytik to be a Pro-Style QB. It took him 1/2 a season to finally bend and realize he never was going to be one. I still the Chryst and his staff were good coaches. They belong in the NFL though and not college. College ball is more coach fundamentals and put players in a position to succeed.

 

[geeman2001]

I wouldn't even say the DL is bare. I think there are numbers and some talent at DT. It's the DE's that are extremely questionable.

As for the D itself, I know people will think I'm nuts, but I don't think it was nearly as bad as some people made it out to be. Yes, they had some bad games. Four stand out to me: Akron, Georgia Tech, Duke, North Carolina

We all know about the Akron game. But the other three, yeah the D wasn't good, but those 3 teams put points on a lot of teams. And we all know how the Georgia Tech game started.
I'll have to take the time to look at the numbers, and maybe they'll prove me wrong, but I think Pitt's D did pretty much what you'd expect a team to do.

The other teams, with less potent offenses, the D did at least average or better. Was anyone really fussing about the D against BC or Miami?
Bottom line is, I don't think this season's D is a completely lost cause.

Hope you're right. The D was spunky at times, such as the Miami game. Not nearly often enough, but perhaps a specialist like Duz can make a big diff. I do feel the more lost potential was with the offense, and if the offense isn't tragically set way back by a new OC, it actually should be able score more. For example, while the defense was not great by any means in Akron or Iowa games, it was actually the offense that let them down in those two games. The offense was putrid, and these were mediocre opponents that other teams scored pretty easy on. The offense got better after that, but still left many points on the field.

Just get a little better on both sides (which better coaches should hopefully be able to deliver), and a 6-6 team with its best players returning, and a non-grueling schedule, could plausibly go 8-4. Given the growing pains with a new staff, and the "same ole Pitt" factor, probably won't ... but shouldn't be impossible.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I agree, start ridding the program of the 'same ole pitt' factor to start. Its not impossible and would give Pitt some quick credibility. As for more, I don't know with Meyer and Franklin and 100m budgets on either side.

 

[bmejnes]

Pitt has a lot of work to do...

Dead last in the ACC and roughly 80th in the nation.