And they all are saying, "all we have to do is win and the recruiting will follow." It's amazing how they either never win (because the recruiting never allows them to), or the recruiting never follows.
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- Thread starter DiehardPanther
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And they all are saying, "all we have to do is win and the recruiting will follow." It's amazing how they either never win (because the recruiting never allows them to), or the recruiting never follows.
This is a major issue.
Miami's recruiting is dwarfing us. In another year it's going to be a 2 deep of nothing but Richt classes that probably average out to a Top 10 class.
VT's recruiting has shot up compared to where they were under the end of the Beamer era.
UNC's recruiting was .85ish the previous two years, the standard other posters are holding our classes to. UNC's shot up to .87ish this year, probably due to being free from the sanctions cloud.
We're starting to really fall behind the ACC Coastal. Regardless of where you think our recruiting is at. It has to be acknowledged that the talent gap between us and our biggest threats in the Coastal is growing. And that has to change.
On any kind of consistent basis you do. Or at the very least, recruit at their level.
So, tell me how it is relevant to a discussion about the whole? It is one win from more than a season ago. We really finished that year in 4th place, when you consider we lost to both teams we "tied" with. This year we went 5-7. No one said we haven't had some good things happen. However, we are aren't talking about everything that has happened.
We have recruited below our peers. We have not consistently beaten the teams we should or the teams who are more talented than us, to show we have a coaching level that far surpasses our competition. The win against Clemson is no more relevant than the loss to Northwestern or giving up 61 to Syracuse. We went 0-3 against those in division rivals that year and 1-2 the other 2 years under HCPN. Our HC is supposed to be focused on the defense and in 2016 we were atrocious defensively. We were bad, but slightly less bad, this past season. What does that tell us about the hope that our coaching is going to be so much better we close the talent gap? How about when you consider we lost the OC that lead the offense in 2016 that bailed our terrible defense out time and time again? Was our staff better after that?
No one is saying nothing good has happened under HCPN. Hell, I even said he is our best chance at success. However, you bringing up one instance of fleeting success, which was followed up with average to below average recruiting and a 5-7 season with results as bad as the win over Clemson was good, and saying not mentioning that shows someone as a troll, is beyond idiotic.
So, lets put the cards on the table. You think we can recruit below our competition and still win in the ACC because our coaching is going to "coach em up" better than our competition can. The evidence to support/deny that is:
1. We were the only team to beat Clemson in 2016.
2. We are 2-7 against VT, Miami, and UNC.
3. We were the 1st team (they went on to lose their next/last 2) to beat Miami this year.
4. We were the only P5 team to lose to UNC.
5. We went to OT with a D1AA school, but are 3-0 against YSU and Villanova.
6. We are 11-3 against teams with equal or worse recruiting in the ACC.
7. We are 1-6 against P5 OOC opponents, plus a loss to Navy.
8. We are 3-0 against Akron, Marshall, and Rice.
That accounts for every game we have played under HCPN. We have already acknowledged the recruiting ranking shortfalls, but that covers how we have done in game. We had an awesome offense and a terrible defense in 2016. Both of those coordinators are now gone.
What did I leave out that you think is unfair or negative?
I think you mean Borberly, but maybe you also mean Bates. Borberly is painfully obviously not a recruiter. Bates might be ok, but he certainly doesn't have the reputation as a great recruiter.
So obviously we haven't recruited very well so far under HCPN and the new staff has been around for a very short time. The only new data point we have so far on how recruiting might look in the future, under this new staff, is the JR day we had this weekend. It might have been the worst I have ever remembered for Pitt. The turn out and talent was awful.
Definitely a strong upgrade over this time last year. Getting great recruiters in makes a big difference. We are already recruiting better than the Chryst and fast lane days. I see that continuing under these guys.
Definitely reasons to be optimistic! Cant see even the trolls ripping apart the new hire, he seems like a very good add.
The new guy already seems to be playing dividend getting some Michigan recruits to come have a look. It is pretty obvious this new staff is formulated to recruit. I personally love that. Seems to be vastly better than in years past. Good job Heather.
We have recruited much better under Narduzzi, and with Bates who was highlighted as a coach who recruits well, and this new guy, I think Pitt and Narduzzi will continue to make big strides in the defense from what Chryst left us with, which was abandonment at defense. Should have won 5 straight if not for Weah and the UNC last sec lost, and lots of momentum with an energetic hope at QB for the first time in a long time.
You would have to really hate positivity and Pitt to not see the pluses.
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That's not remotely true. A) Most here don't think he's a troll, B) Don't think he's miserable...quite frankly I think you're all just frustrated because he's poking holes in arguments that are based solely on a fans rooting, hopeful interest and vision. He always says, yet most miss, that he's a fan and hopes the program pushes out of the funk it's been in for 35 years. He's not saying he thinks this area stinks or that area stinks because he thinks that way, he's saying that with at least some form of reality to back his comments. Fact is some don't like what he's saying because he's not sugar coating the truth. The truth hurts at times. It's difficult to admit to yourself that your favorite team has some glaring holes and faults and even more difficult to face those truths
When you have two "fans" like Cash and JP tag-teaming their repetitious message that it's preordained that Pitt can't compete-man it just doesn't get any better. Honestly these guys must laugh at people like me, Joey and Diehard and others who take the bait by attempting to argue against them. As I've said before I'll never know if they are trolls or the most miserable Pitt fans ever but if I had to wager I'd go with the former.
Randy is probably the best position coach we've had at PITT since Gattuso.
Go find me a quote where I mention anything close to Pitt doesn't have holes to fill. That's basically every team but a handful.
There's facts and opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but they are not entitled to their facts. His opinion is consistently slanted to the negative and he's entitled to it. You consistently see other posters point it out.
There's facts and opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but they are not entitled to their facts. His opinion is consistently slanted to the negative and he's entitled to it. You consistently see other posters point it out.
I have NEVER said Pitt can't compete. Pitt cannot compete if they don't majorly improve their recruiting. If they do that, and I believe they can, they certainly can compete.
To say that I think Pitt can't compete is a total, outright lie.
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Bates is the DC, not a position coach.
What are the opinions presented as facts? What facts are missing? I presented every game coached by HCPN and you didn't respond. You said I was a troll because I left out discussion of one game that didn't even happen this past season. I followed that up with a post outlining the entirety of HCPN's time at Pitt. You didn't respond.
One poster said our staff got younger. I said that wasn't true and it isn't. We literally got older with every replacement we hired. How is pointing that out being negative or a troll? I didn't even comment on whether that was a positive or negative.
lol. Never said Pitt can't compete. The issue is is Pitt doing the things it needs to do to have a chance to compete?
It's also kinda funny that my post assessing the new staff, is actually relatively positive. There are some dumb arguments people are using to fill the glass half full, and I've responded to those arguments. But my stand alone point about the staff was that for the first time in a long time, there is a recruiting hope with this new staff. That I like the potential recruiting makeup of these new hires.
But that just isn't enough for the cult.
As I have said before, it's a cult.
It's not enough to even agree with them on the larger point. It's amazing how much they require you to agree with them on all the reasons for that larger point.
BATES IS A GREAT HIRE!!!! HE'S A GREAT HIRE BECAUSE HE'S A TOP 5 RECRUITER IN THE BIG TEN!!!!! YOU MUST AGREE WITH ALL OF THAT!!!
THE STAFF GOT BETTER!!!! IT GOT BETTER BECAUSE IT GOT YOUNGER!!!! YOU MUST AGREE WITH ALL OF THAT!!!!
The probblem is they are all holding on by a string. So any questioning of any aspect of the narrative, makes them scared that it will collapse on itself. So they vigorously defend all of it.
My Lord.... Have a beer.. do you really get this up in arms about a football message board.?
BTW, Duzz did a good job with his hires..
I'm not up in arms about any of it. I actively laugh at it, upvote it, and encourage it. As I frequently say, I find it very entertaining.
