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Stallings, Panthers searching for answers to return to past glory (PG Article)

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By Craig Meyer:

Even at its best, questions always faced the Pitt men’s basketball program. What did it need to keep doing to remain in the top tier of the ruthlessly competitive Big East Conference? Could a program so often on the cusp of greatness break through and make a Final Four?

The questions now are more dire. A program that won an average of 26.5 games per season, captured some form of a conference championship five times and made the NCAA tournament 12 times in 13 seasons from 2001-14 has averaged 18.7 wins the past three seasons and has missed out on the NCAA tournament twice. It’s reeling from its first losing season since 2000 and is slated to return all of two players from that underachieving squad, a duo that averaged a combined 7.9 points per game.

What was already a difficult situation for coach Kevin Stallings has devolved from bleak to alarming. Next season will be the first of several that will determine whether the Panthers’ recent slump is a momentary dip or something more damaging.

In the past three years, going back to its later years under former coach Jamie Dixon, the program has faded from the national relevancy it once relished. In that time, it has posted a win percentage of .560, down significantly from the .763 percentage it posted in its 13-year peak from 2001-14. If anything, its recent mark is a regression to the mean, much closer to the .550 all-time win percentage the program owned prior to the 2001-02 season.

With those numbers come pressing queries. What can this program become? And where does it go from here?

“It’s as pivotal a point in Pitt basketball as there has probably been since [former coach] Ben Howland was hired in 1999,” said Jon Rothstein, a college basketball analyst for CBS Sports. “It’s all of a sudden time where you’re going to be starting from scratch with a brand-new roster in the ACC. That doesn’t make for a lot of sleep-filled nights.”

A fall from grace

The stakes of Pitt’s present situation are unquestionably high. The history of college basketball is littered with examples of programs rising to join the sport’s elites for a brief period. Some recovered after a stretch in which the wins dissipated, while others never returned to the lofty standing they once enjoyed, at least not on a consistent basis.

Arizona and Georgetown, after a few years of tumult following the retirement of legendary coaches, both re-established themselves with successful hires (Sean Miller and John Thompson III, respectively). Maryland, an ACC power in the 1970s and 1980s, floundered for seven years after the resignation of coach Lefty Driesell before regaining its footing under Gary Williams, who led the Terrapins to their only national championship in 2002.

Then there’s the less desirable end of the spectrum. Once a Big East bottom-feeder, Seton Hall made a surprise run to the NCAA championship in 1989, but in the 21 seasons after coach P.J. Carlisimo left for the NBA in 1994, it made the NCAA tournament just three times. Georgia Tech, a perennial top-20 team under coach Bobby Cremins, has averaged 16.3 wins per season and has made it past the first weekend of the NCAA tournament once since 1996.

Perhaps the most recent and hopeful example of a turnaround from a non-traditional power is the school that deprived Pitt of its best chance at a Final Four since World War II — Villanova. Jay Wright returned a languishing program to relevance, leading it to a Final Four in 2009, before the Wildcats began to slip, going 37-43 over an 80-game stretch from 2011-13. Over the next four seasons, though, they never won fewer than 29 games, a run highlighted by a national title in 2016.

What exactly changed? While the move to a rebranded, 10-team Big East helped, Wright returned to a recruiting philosophy that had helped him achieve what he had earlier in his tenure. Instead of continuing to chase top-10 recruits he felt compelled to given Villanova’s newfound standing, he refocused his efforts on top-50 or top-100 prospects he believed had a better chance of staying in school for three or four years.

“That’s the lesson to learn, that you have to understand the lane you’re in and realize how to maximize it,” said college basketball writer Dana O’Neil, author of ‘Long Shots: Jay Wright, Villanova, and College Basketball’s Most Unlikely Champion.’ “Don’t try to be something that you’re not. Be who you can be and figure out how to make that successful.”

For Pitt, that search for an identity comes at the highest level of the sport. The Panthers thrived under Howland and Dixon as a quintessential Big East team, one defined by its rugged, physical and deliberate style. Since joining the ACC in 2013, however, their fortunes have waned, with a win percentage of .603 and just one season with at least 25 wins (it had nine such seasons in the previous 12 years).

After Stallings replaced Dixon in 2016, the style-of-play questions surrounding the move to the ACC became more moot. The concerns about what Pitt can become in a relatively unfamiliar league, though, remain. The Panthers are financially competitive, with a men’s basketball budget of $8.8 million, the sixth-most of any ACC school, according to the most recent data from the Department of Postsecondary Education. Given the ages of coaches at some of the conference’s top programs — Syracuse’s Jim Boeheim (72), Duke’s Mike Krzyzewski (70), North Carolina’s Roy Williams (66), Louisville’s Rick Pitino (64) and even Miami’s Jim Larranaga (67) — there’s a prevailing sentiment that there might be a window of opportunity for those outside the league’s upper echelon once those coaches retire.

Though it’s unrealistic to expect Pitt to compete annually with more storied and better-resourced programs, there is what many believe to be a model of success for it that utilizes well-regarded prospects who become three- and four-year players. If that sort of recruiting is done on a consistent basis, there’s a level of depth that is built, meaning that losing players to graduation or the professional ranks doesn’t deal a devastating blow and it can be annually competitive. The recent accomplishments of programs such as Virginia and Notre Dame lend credence to that philosophy and are a reminder to Pitt of what it can once again be.

“If your program wanes, it’s going to take some time to recover because most of the programs in the ACC are developmental programs,” Wake Forest athletic director Ron Wellman said. “That’s not to say we don’t get great players; we do. But everybody gets great players in the ACC. How are you going to develop those players? That isn’t done in a year or two. It takes some time to establish that mindset. It takes some time to develop those players.”

Finding a niche

Beyond the nuances of the ACC, the key to building any program, particularly a non-traditional power, is determined almost entirely by two things — coaching and recruiting. It’s a simple but all-important formula.

“There’s no big secret about that,” said Larry Keating, Seton Hall athletic director from 1985-97. “As you see teams come up periodically for a couple of years, typically it’s because they’ve latched on to someone who was probably a better coach than anybody thought when they hired him and ends up doing a good job and gets players. That’s really what it’s all about.”

Despite an underwhelming first season at the school, and a turbulent offseason, Stallings’ 17-year run at Vanderbilt, one in which he compiled a 332-220 record, only provides so many clues into how he might fare at Pitt. It’s simply too early to judge what he and his teams might be able to do.

Whether his tenure is a success or failure will be determined primarily by how he is able to recruit and, more specifically, whether he can identify a recruiting niche in which his program can thrive.

The New York-New Jersey pipeline that helped transform Pitt into a power has dried up with the move from the Big East, which has forced it to look elsewhere for players in recent years, particularly with little in the way of high-level local prospects. At Vanderbilt, due in some part to the school’s academic restrictions, Stallings had to be selective and creative, recruiting nationally and internationally. His 2017 class features two players from Canada, a growing hotbed for basketball talent that, if connections are forged, could be a valuable asset.

“It doesn’t feel like there’s a niche out there for us right now,” Stallings said. “We have to find one. We have to get one. I think that’s going to be something that’s going to be critical to our success moving forward is establishing some places we can get players. We’ve got our ideas about that without making them public, but that’s something we’re pursuing.”

There’s a belief, according to a national recruiting writer, that the program has lost some momentum on the recruiting trail, particularly after guard Aaron Thompson, one of the Panthers’ top signees in their 2017 class, was granted a release from his national letter of intent in late April. Though Pitt is less than a decade removed from the height of its greatest success, time is a precious resource for a program in its position. Perception can change quickly and sometimes irreparably for an entity with a smaller margin of error than some of its conference counterparts.

While they’ve unquestionably regressed from where they once were, the Panthers haven’t been objectively bad the past three seasons. With at least seven new players on the 2017-18 roster, six of whom currently have no Division I experience, next season has the potential to be one of the program’s worst in the past 40 years.

Craig Meyer: cmeyer@post-gazette.com and Twitter @CraigMeyerPG.
 
Give me a break, the hire when it's all said and done, will have taken Pitt basketball to the Willard years and most likely worse. Nothing this guy will do in the 2 years he has left before he is canned/bought out will change that. He is a terrible mediocre coach who can't recruit.
 
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Give me a break, the hire when it's all said and done, will have taken Pitt basketball to the Willard years and most likely worse. Nothing this guy will do in the 2 years he has left before he is canned/bought out will change that. He is a terrible mediocre coach who can't recruit.
Tell us how you really feel?
 
The problem with the article is that the writer made quite a few assumptions that will prove to be totally incorrect. Under Stallings, this program will be lucky to get to double digit total wins most years. Maybe he might sniff 12 wins one year, but not much beyond that. That winning % is well below 0.500. He just reached his high water mark at Pitt this past year in total wins.

Also, the idea to concentrate on top 50 and top 100 guys, instead of the top 25 elite players, is great. The problem is that Stallings is only capable of getting top 200 or below guys. If he happens to land someone in ranked close to top 100, he's very lucky and it won't happen very often, if at all. I'd love if he was able to recruit top 100 guys because that would mean we're getting back to our old ways of recruiting in that niche. But he has no capability to recruit at that level. So until he's gone, we're going to get more of the same as last year, only worse.
 
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"The Panthers are financially competitive, with a men’s basketball budget of $8.8 million, the sixth-most of any ACC school, according to the most recent data from the Department of Postsecondary Education."
So how old/what year is the above $ from and are we still at that level now? Would seem to counter all the continual gripes that our BB program doesn't have sufficient financial resources??
 
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The problem with the article is that the writer made quite a few assumptions that will prove to be totally incorrect. Under Stallings, this program will be lucky to get to double digit total wins most years. Maybe he might sniff 12 wins one year, but not much beyond that. That winning % is well below 0.500. He just reached his high water mark at Pitt this past year in total wins.

Also, the idea to concentrate on top 50 and top 100 guys, instead of the top 25 elite players, is great. The problem is that Stallings is only capable of getting top 200 or below guys. If he happens to land someone in ranked close to top 100, he's very lucky and it won't happen very often, if at all. I'd love if he was able to recruit top 100 guys because that would mean we're getting back to our old ways of recruiting in that niche. But he has no capability to recruit at that level. So until he's gone, we're going to get more of the same as last year, only worse.
We must have read two totally different articles. I didn't see even one small positive assumption let alone any real assumptions in that article regarding Pitt's current situation or future prospects. Seems to me all it is doing is raising the multitude of questions we all know exist regarding our future prospects, whether under Stallings or someone else.
 
The problem with the article is that the writer made quite a few assumptions that will prove to be totally incorrect. Under Stallings, this program will be lucky to get to double digit total wins most years. Maybe he might sniff 12 wins one year, but not much beyond that. That winning % is well below 0.500. He just reached his high water mark at Pitt this past year in total wins.

Also, the idea to concentrate on top 50 and top 100 guys, instead of the top 25 elite players, is great. The problem is that Stallings is only capable of getting top 200 or below guys. If he happens to land someone in ranked close to top 100, he's very lucky and it won't happen very often, if at all. I'd love if he was able to recruit top 100 guys because that would mean we're getting back to our old ways of recruiting in that niche. But he has no capability to recruit at that level. So until he's gone, we're going to get more of the same as last year, only worse.

Carr is top 100 lol
 
Carr is top 100 lol

He's #157 and the #30 PG nationally according to 247 sports. On ESPN, he's the #60 PG and grades out at a 75. Not in top 100. On rivals, he does sneak into the top 100 at #97, but that's barely. He isn't top 100 material but probably in top 150 anyhow.

We don't have anyone on the current roster, including recruits, that is a clear top 100 or top 50 guy. Most are top 150 to top 200. That won't work in the ACC. The top 100 guys are going to elsewhere for good reason.
 
We must have read two totally different articles. I didn't see even one small positive assumption let alone any real assumptions in that article regarding Pitt's current situation or future prospects. Seems to me all it is doing is raising the multitude of questions we all know exist regarding our future prospects, whether under Stallings or someone else.

I didn't say anything about a "positive" assumption. The assumptions are that we will settle in at a 0.500 - 0.550 winning %. That is incorrect and is way high. Also, that Stallings can recruit top 100 guys, since he can't and won't. Not now.
 
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Lol Stallings will go down as the worst Pitt Hoops coach ever
Lots of posters not catching on?
Why would the PITT AD+ Gallagher+PITT admin hire a "loser" coach who was in a job for 17 yrs with a "needs improvement" job rating, and was about to be fired by Vandy?

To raise the level of PITT basketball, win an ACC title and move on to a top NCAA level?

Answer: NO

The reason they hired Stallings was to reduce basketball costs and be satisfied with wherever PITT ends up in the standings.
Barnes comes in for a "short duration" to complete a project. Check project completed he leaves all part of the plan.

No AD and Chancelor would be ignorant enough to hire Stalling by mistake.

Its Step # 1 in a plan to deemphasize and reduce athletic department costs.

Give me another reason for hiring Stalling and giving him a six year deal?
It wasn't a mistake it as a plan!

Step # 2 in the plan was the hiring of Lyke rather than go after a top notch, highly compensated AD hire the EMU AD, and eventually deemphasize D1 sports and move to an EMU type conference where Stalling will work out just fine!
 
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Give me a break, the hire when it's all said and done, will have taken Pitt basketball to the Willard years and most likely worse. Nothing this guy will do in the 2 years he has left before he is canned/bought out will change that. He is a terrible mediocre coach who can't recruit.
It’s simply too early to judge what he and his teams might be able to do.
Must not have checked this board, no love here, move on.
 
Lots of posters not catching on?
Why would the PITT AD+ Gallagher+PITT admin hire a "loser" coach who was in a job for 17 yrs with a "needs improvement" job rating, and was about to be fired by Vandy?

To raise the level of PITT basketball, win an ACC title and move on to a top NCAA level?

Answer: NO

The reason they hired Stallings was to reduce basketball costs and be satisfied with wherever PITT ends up in the standings.
Barnes comes in for a "short duration" to complete a project. Check project completed he leaves all part of the plan.

No AD and Chancelor would be ignorant enough to hire Stalling by mistake.

Its Step # 1 in a plan to deemphasize and reduce athletic department costs.

Give me another reason for hiring Stalling and giving him a six year deal?
It wasn't a mistake it as a plan!

Step # 2 in the plan was the hiring of Lyke rather than go after a top notch, highly compensated AD hire the EMU AD, and eventually deemphasize D1 sports and move to an EMU type conference where Stalling will work out just fine!
But, they really didn't lower the basketball costs much, at all. They gave Stallings a top 20 salary and a 6 year deal. The reason Barnes hired Stallings is because he was doing a favor and didn't give a flying F--K about Pitt and was trying to get out of Dodge.

Also, Pitt is not going to deemphasize sports or go to a lower conference. They can be crappy and stay in the ACC and make tons of money, if they want to.
 
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But, they really didn't lower the basketball costs much, at all. They gave Stallings a top 20 salary and a 6 year deal. The reason Barnes hired Stallings is because he was doing a favor and didn't give a flying F--K about Pitt and was trying to get out of Dodge.

Also, Pitt is not going to deemphasize sports or go to a lower conference. They can be crappy and stay in the ACC and make tons of money, if they want to.

Would hope not but something doesn't add up with the Stallings and Lyke hires.

If PITT wanted to be Great Again they would have made different hires. Stalling isn't going to bring PITT basketball to the promised land and Lyke isn't going to put PITT athletics on the top of the list.

IMO these were on purpose strategic hires to put PITT athletics in a position to stay at the bottom of where they are now ACC or move to a lower level conference and be at the top of that one.

I think it all depends on how PITT football does in the next three years and what Narduzzi's plans include!
We'll see!
 
Would hope not but something doesn't add up with the Stallings and Lyke hires.

If PITT wanted to be Great Again they would have made different hires. Stalling isn't going to bring PITT basketball to the promised land and Lyke isn't going to put PITT athletics on the top of the list.

IMO these were on purpose strategic hires to put PITT athletics in a position to stay at the bottom of where they are now ACC or move to a lower level conference and be at the top of that one.

I think it all depends on how PITT football does in the next three years and what Narduzzi's plans include!
We'll see!

Where are we going to get an AD from a Power type of team anyway??

As for our hoops coach, hiring a hungry & ready to work young mid major coach would have been better than Stallings.
 
Would hope not but something doesn't add up with the Stallings and Lyke hires.

If PITT wanted to be Great Again they would have made different hires. Stalling isn't going to bring PITT basketball to the promised land and Lyke isn't going to put PITT athletics on the top of the list.

IMO these were on purpose strategic hires to put PITT athletics in a position to stay at the bottom of where they are now ACC or move to a lower level conference and be at the top of that one.

I think it all depends on how PITT football does in the next three years and what Narduzzi's plans include!
We'll see!
There is no chance they would position themselves for a lower conference. You can debate whether they think it is better to just be in the ACC and not try to succeed, but it is certifiably insane to think they would try to get relegated to a lower conference. No offense, but you have to be insane to think that, just from a revenue standpoint. Those schools lose even more money on sports.
 
There is no chance they would position themselves for a lower conference. You can debate whether they think it is better to just be in the ACC and not try to succeed, but it is certifiably insane to think they would try to get relegated to a lower conference. No offense, but you have to be insane to think that, just from a revenue standpoint. Those schools lose even more money on sports.
It seems to this Pitt fan that Pitt is totally fine being BC in Hoops and collecting those big ACC check$.
 
It seems to this Pitt fan that Pitt is totally fine being BC in Hoops and collecting those big ACC check$.
I think Scott Barnes was fine getting the hell out and not giving a crap about Pitt. We will find out about Pitt, as a whole, in the next 20 months.
 
But, they really didn't lower the basketball costs much, at all. They gave Stallings a top 20 salary and a 6 year deal. The reason Barnes hired Stallings is because he was doing a favor and didn't give a flying F--K about Pitt and was trying to get out of Dodge.

Also, Pitt is not going to deemphasize sports or go to a lower conference. They can be crappy and stay in the ACC and make tons of money, if they want to.
People claim they gave him a 2 mil/yr , but I've never seen anything substantiating that amount . They'd have to be fools to pay him that much . ( and yes they were fools to hire him )
 
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People claim they gave him a 2 mil/yr , but I've never seen anything substantiating that amount . They'd have to be fools to pay him that much . ( and yes they were fools to hire him )

If PITT is paying Stallings 2 mill / yr they should have their collective heads examimed, drop all athletics due to total incompetence, and resign their positions at PITT!


I bet Stallings is being paid between 1.1-1.5 mill. He had zero barginning power leaving Vandy with a 17 yr below avg performance and he was about to be fired! He ended up with a six yr deal for taking less compensation per year!
 
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The Stallings hire by Barnes was malevolence. Everything before it (and maybe Lyke after it) was Pitt's incompetence.

Pitt doesn't know what it wants to be athletically, let alone how to achieve it or who to hire for help.

I'd be relieved to know dropping D1 was actually the plan -- Pitt's ass-backward decision making would probably land us in pretty competitive position in the ACC.

This school has historically been led by athletic doofuses.
 
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The Stallings hire by Barnes was malevolence. Everything before it (and maybe Lyke after it) was Pitt's incompetence.

Pitt doesn't know what it wants to be athletically, let alone how to achieve it or who to hire for help.

I'd be relieved to know dropping D1 was actually the plan -- Pitt's ass-backward decision making would probably land us in pretty competitive position in the ACC.

This school has historically been led by athletic doofuses.
The thousands of empty seats occurred at the same time Dixon started making 3 mil+. The fans are culpable in this mess as well.
 
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The thousands of empty seats occurred at the same time Dixon started making 3 mil+. The fans are culpable in this mess as well.

Agree. But fans had seen the movie plenty of times before. Watered down non-conf, fizzle out in March. Rinse, repeat.

Needed to rejuvenate the schedule and the approach ro recruiting/assistant hiring. Admin was woefully impotent on that issue.
 
Agree. But fans had seen the movie plenty of times before. Watered down non-conf, fizzle out in March. Rinse, repeat.

Needed to rejuvenate the schedule and the approach ro recruiting/assistant hiring. Admin was woefully impotent on that issue.
It is a business. Do the math. If more money was coming into the program, then Dixon would still be here, and more money would have been available for assistants.
 
It is a business. Do the math. If more money was coming into the program, then Dixon would still be here, and more money would have been available for assistants.

The old chicken-or-egg debate.

Who should invest first, the fans or the athletic department?
 
People claim they gave him a 2 mil/yr , but I've never seen anything substantiating that amount . They'd have to be fools to pay him that much . ( and yes they were fools to hire him )
Stallings makes significantly more than $2m per year.
 
Lots of posters not catching on?
Why would the PITT AD+ Gallagher+PITT admin hire a "loser" coach who was in a job for 17 yrs with a "needs improvement" job rating, and was about to be fired by Vandy?

To raise the level of PITT basketball, win an ACC title and move on to a top NCAA level?

Answer: NO

The reason they hired Stallings was to reduce basketball costs and be satisfied with wherever PITT ends up in the standings.
Barnes comes in for a "short duration" to complete a project. Check project completed he leaves all part of the plan.

No AD and Chancelor would be ignorant enough to hire Stalling by mistake.

Its Step # 1 in a plan to deemphasize and reduce athletic department costs.

Give me another reason for hiring Stalling and giving him a six year deal?
It wasn't a mistake it as a plan!

Step # 2 in the plan was the hiring of Lyke rather than go after a top notch, highly compensated AD hire the EMU AD, and eventually deemphasize D1 sports and move to an EMU type conference where Stalling will work out just fine!
 
Your hatred for the Ad demonstrates clearly how an ignorant person can spread his hatred endlessly and some people will actually start beleiving your BS. Come back in a couple years and grovel. Try a new agenda, like when I grow up I want to be more than a jerk. Mommy needs to start spanking you and taking away your privileges.
 
FWIW, here's some parting Vandy financial info on KS:

Kevin Stallings spent 17 seasons in charge of the Vanderbilt Commodores basketball program, building an 332-220 record and seven trips to the NCAA Tournament. He resigned in 2016 after a run of four disappointing seasons and accepted the job at Pittsburgh.

He was also well paid, according to newly released tax records. During the 2015-16 season, Stallings received a base salary of $2,020,368 and also was compensated with $174,595 in bonuses and other earnings that put his yearly pay from Vanderbilt at nearly $2.3 million.

Stallings is the current leader in wins as a Commodores basketball coach, taking the job in 1999 after a successful stint at Illinois State. He led the Redbirds to back-to-back NCAA Tournament appearances before departing for Nashville.

Since Vanderbilt is a private institution, the coaches salaries are not readily available as with public schools. However, the university must file tax returns to the IRS on a yearly basis as a part of being a non-profit organization.

In Stallings’ first season at Pittsburgh, the Panthers were 16-17, including 4-14 in the Atlantic Coast Conference. Stallings signed a six-year contract with Pittsburgh when he accepted the job. He replaced Jamie Dixon, who is now the head coach at TCU.
 
Because coaches don't typically take pay cuts for lateral moves?
He was about to be without employment so a lateral move is irrelevant if you believe the rumors . Your just assuming and you know what that means . Until it's documented I just don't believe Pitt was that dumb to pay him that much .
 
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He was about to be without employment so a lateral move is irrelevant if you believe the rumors . Your just assuming and you know what that means . Until it's documented I just don't believe Pitt was that dumb to pay him that much .

I don't want to believe Pitt paid him that much ..... more than I can even explain.
 
Stallings makes significantly more than $2m per year.
No he doesn't! That would put him at a higher compensation level than Dixon.
He makes between 1.2 and 1.5 mill.

If they paid that mediocore coach 2 mill they should shutdown the University and charge every PITT U officier with Executive Malpractise and Extreme Stupidity In the 1st Degree punishable by common sense law of dismissal and banishment to Kansas or Oklahoma where its flat as a pancake and the wind never stops!!
 
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