Totally OT: Dave Mirra suicide.....

[pitt-girl]

I wouldn't be surprised if CTE doesn't enter the conversation. Also read Ken Stabler has been diagnosed. It's a real thing and glad I'm not a parent with a child who wants to engage in sports with potential head injuries.

http://www.si.com/edge/2016/02/04/dave-mirra-dead-bmx-suicide-dead-41-years-old

 

[BuffetParrothead]

I wouldn't be surprised if CTE doesn't enter the conversation. Also read Ken Stabler has been diagnosed. It's a real thing and glad I'm not a parent with a child who wants to engage in sports with potential head injuries.

http://www.si.com/edge/2016/02/04/dave-mirra-dead-bmx-suicide-dead-41-years-old

It's a real thing?
So is the Easter Bunny.
It's more of a new thing and a way for some retired and low on money athletes and families to cash in. Like other "trendy" new medical conditions.
Its also being pushed by those in the " I hate football community" who wish it would be gone as a sport.
Football has been around for a longtime and its never been a safer sport than it is now!
Some on the board played back in the day with inferior head protection and I doubt are making a CTE claim today.
Diagnosing CTE is very subjective and linking it only to football is a stretch. The equipment and testing is very new. But it works for the alarmist types who buy every new thing they here.
One of the newest models of the gravy train for medical and sports community.

 

[Las Panteras]

It's a real thing?
So is the Easter Bunny.
It's more of a new thing and a way for some retired and low on money athletes and families to cash in. Like other "trendy" new medical conditions.
Its also being pushed by those in the " I hate football community" who wish it would be gone as a sport.
Football has been around for a longtime and its never been a safer sport than it is now!
Some on the board played back in the day with inferior head protection and I doubt are making a CTE claim today.
Diagnosing CTE is very subjective and linking it only to football is a stretch. The equipment and testing is very new. But it works for the alarmist types who buy every new thing they here.
One of the newest models of the gravy train for medical and sports community.

Interesting take, BP......

I will add this; the "I hate football crowd" is poised to end HS football in several more liberal pockets of America. The liability to the school districts....when mom and dad sue because their kid was concussed....will be the lynchpin. "School districts cant afford the liability.......football isnt that big a deal around here......lets drop the sport altogether......"

Some of you may laugh. But in liberal strongholds in America, the drums will only beat louder to get rid of HS football.

 

[pitt-girl]

Interesting take, BP......

I will add this; the "I hate football crowd" is poised to end HS football in several more liberal pockets of America. The liability to the school districts....when mom and dad sue because their kid was concussed....will be the lynchpin. "School districts cant afford the liability.......football isnt that big a deal around here......lets drop the sport altogether......"

Some of you may laugh. But in liberal strongholds in America, the drums will only beat louder to get rid of HS football.

I'm really not sure how to take all of this. You're saying that this is all made up?

 

[ECUPittfan]

Its a sad day around here. I live in Greenville, NC where ECU is and Dave resided. He was a good guy, did a lot for the community and stayed out of any trouble. My wife knew him and used to hang out with him years ago and had nothing but good things to say about him. Despite all his money and fame he was still just a regular guy who stayed in eastern NC. I feel terrible for his family. My first thought is it was a very selfish thing to do.

 

[pitt-girl]

It's a real thing?
So is the Easter Bunny.
It's more of a new thing and a way for some retired and low on money athletes and families to cash in. Like other "trendy" new medical conditions.
Its also being pushed by those in the " I hate football community" who wish it would be gone as a sport.
Football has been around for a longtime and its never been a safer sport than it is now!
Some on the board played back in the day with inferior head protection and I doubt are making a CTE claim today.
Diagnosing CTE is very subjective and linking it only to football is a stretch. The equipment and testing is very new. But it works for the alarmist types who buy every new thing they here.
One of the newest models of the gravy train for medical and sports community.

So - CTE is real or not?

 

[drunkinoakland]

So - CTE is real or not?

I think it is real, I think the link to football is real, and I think football is dangerous.

I also think not nearly enough research has been done on "regular" brains to determine how much of it occurs (I don't want to say naturally, because it isn't natural, but just in the general population from regular bumps and falls).

 

[Parkview57]

I'm really not sure how to take all of this. You're saying that this is all made up?

My take is that it isn't "all made up" but certainly many of the people sounding the alarms have an agenda, as BPH indicates in his post.

 

[Ski11585]

Yes, this is just another big conspiracy by the evil liberals to wage a war on football!

Morons.

 

[ncyajleel]

How many people have played organized football in the U.S. Not all of them have this condition. I believe it to be a real condition, but I am wondering if it may be caused by some pre-existing condition.

 

[bobfree]

It's a real thing?
So is the Easter Bunny.
It's more of a new thing and a way for some retired and low on money athletes and families to cash in. Like other "trendy" new medical conditions.
Its also being pushed by those in the " I hate football community" who wish it would be gone as a sport.
Football has been around for a longtime and its never been a safer sport than it is now!
Some on the board played back in the day with inferior head protection and I doubt are making a CTE claim today.
Diagnosing CTE is very subjective and linking it only to football is a stretch. The equipment and testing is very new. But it works for the alarmist types who buy every new thing they here.
One of the newest models of the gravy train for medical and sports community.

I like you a lot, think you're a good poster.

But this is an all time top ten dumbest thing I have read on here. I hope you're just joking.

 

[Dr. von Yinzer]

It's a real thing?
So is the Easter Bunny.
It's more of a new thing and a way for some retired and low on money athletes and families to cash in. Like other "trendy" new medical conditions.
Its also being pushed by those in the " I hate football community" who wish it would be gone as a sport.
Football has been around for a longtime and its never been a safer sport than it is now!
Some on the board played back in the day with inferior head protection and I doubt are making a CTE claim today.
Diagnosing CTE is very subjective and linking it only to football is a stretch. The equipment and testing is very new. But it works for the alarmist types who buy every new thing they here.
One of the newest models of the gravy train for medical and sports community.

Yeah, thanks Obama for ruining football!

 

[BuffetParrothead]

How many people have played organized football in the U.S. Not all of them have this condition. I believe it to be a real condition, but I am wondering if it may be caused by some pre-existing condition.

Headline-Researcher says in 5 years, CTE test can be given to living. Right now the only testing possible is after death.
This headline above was in a February article about CTE. So its not an exact science at this point. People seem to be jumping to the football is an unsafe sport. Since there's no reliable test for the living researchers can't test football and non football participants which is important. If non football participants have the same test patters as football participants than football isn't the culprit. But if the football participants test positive and others don't yes there is a link to football.
Pre-existing condition do come into play. Certain people will end up with CTE whether they play football or not.
Mood and behavior issues are common between soldiers and athletes because they participate in very aggressive activities. When those activities stop these individuals have trouble managing their behaviors.
IMO the jury is still out on this one but activists who want football banned are taking this opportunity to reduce the participation levels in youth football, scare HS's & U's into thinking about liability issues etc. If they kill the feeder programs they esstenially kill football.

• The annual suicide rate is 12.93 per 100,000 individuals.

• Men die by suicide 3.5x more often than women.

• On average, there are 117 suicides per day.

• The Rate of suicide is highest in middle age — white men in particular.

• White males accounted for 7 of 10 suicides in 2013.

Given few football player suicides its hard for me to connect this to football when this is a significant problem in the US 42k deaths per year.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

It's a real thing but clearly it doesn't effect everyone. Hopefully they'll find some kind of marker or indication of who may be more prone to it.

 

[UPitt '89]

Yes, this is just another big conspiracy by the evil liberals to wage a war on football!

Morons.

Now that the "war on Christmas" has been won.....

 

[ncyajleel]

Well I'm screwed! I'm a middle aged, white male. I played football from LL all the way up to high school, wrestled in college because I'm not big or fast enough for football. And I served my country for five years during the Iraq War. And up until a couple of years ago I was having problems managing my behavior. I've gotten help since then though.

Headline-Researcher says in 5 years, CTE test can be given to living. Right now the only testing possible is after death.
This headline above was in a February article about CTE. So its not an exact science at this point. People seem to be jumping to the football is an unsafe sport. Since there's no reliable test for the living researchers can't test football and non football participants which is important. If non football participants have the same test patters as football participants than football isn't the culprit. But if the football participants test positive and others don't yes there is a link to football.
Pre-existing condition do come into play. Certain people will end up with CTE whether they play football or not. Lots of the mood and behavior are common between soldiers and athletes who participate in very aggressive activities and when those activities stop these individuals have trouble managing their behaviors.
IMO the jury is still out on this one but activists who want football banned are taking this opportunity to reduce the participation levels in youth football, scare HS's & U's into thinking about liability issues etc. If they kill the feeder programs they esstenially kill football.

• The annual suicide rate is 12.93 per 100,000 individuals.

• Men die by suicide 3.5x more often than women.

• On average, there are 117 suicides per day.

• The Rate of suicide is highest in middle age — white men in particular.

• White males accounted for 7 of 10 suicides in 2013.

Given few football player suicides its hard for me to connect this to football when this is a significant problem in the US 42k deaths per year.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

That's a shame. Obviously my biggest exposure to Mirra was on MTV's RoadHouse/Real World challenge. Tragic. But selfish too. My god, you have a family, you can't do that. Kind of leaves me with an empty feeling when I hear stories like that. I am not sure why it bothers me so, but it does.

And unlike others, I am not one to always look for reasons or blame. Sometimes, people have a defective chip. I don't know how or why, but they do. Even if you are feeling pressure and all of that, again you have a family, you can't just check out and leave them holding that over them the rest of their lives.

 

[Consultant Panther]

It's a real thing but clearly it doesn't effect everyone. Hopefully they'll find some kind of marker or indication of who may be more prone to it.

As they study the brains of more deceased football players they will get better data. I believe that over 90% of the brains of former football players that have been studied have CTE. That number is probably artificially high, because they tend to study people that showed signs of CTE when they were alive. Still, it is very alarming. It has been found in the brains of former football players that died when they were very young (27 in one case).

 

[Swervin27]

Dave Mirra? Isn't this the dude that was dating Pink? Sorry if I missed it but how is this connected to football

 

[Swervin27]

Dave Mirra? Isn't this the dude that was dating Pink? Sorry if I missed it but how is this connected to football

Wow, just researched it, I am not even close. My apologies, i'll just shut up now and go sit in the corner..

depression seems to be a growing issue in this country. Very sad, 41 years old is way too young.

 

[bobfree]

That's a shame. Obviously my biggest exposure to Mirra was on MTV's RoadHouse/Real World challenge. Tragic. But selfish too. My god, you have a family, you can't do that. Kind of leaves me with an empty feeling when I hear stories like that. I am not sure why it bothers me so, but it does.

And unlike others, I am not one to always look for reasons or blame. Sometimes, people have a defective chip. I don't know how or why, but they do. Even if you are feeling pressure and all of that, again you have a family, you can't just check out and leave them holding that over them the rest of their lives.

"Selfish". That is really just you not understanding mental illness.

 

[upj87]

As they study the brains of more deceased football players they will get better data. I believe that over 90% of the brains of former football players that have been studied have CTE. That number is probably artificially high, because they tend to study people that showed signs of CTE when they were alive. Still, it is very alarming. It has been found in the brains of former football players that died when they were very young (27 in one case).

Which is all somewhat meaningless unless they are studying a large sample of brains from the general populace as a baseline. The assumption seems to be football players are the only people who exhibit CTE. I have yet to hear if aging or other factors outside of football contribute to it or it the average deceased 70 year old brain shows signs of it or if any comparative study has ever been done in regards to this....I sure miss the scientific method being applied sans media reports and will smith movies.......

 

[BuffetParrothead]

Wow, just researched it, I am not even close. My apologies, i'll just shut up now and go sit in the corner..

depression seems to be a growing issue in this country. Very sad, 41 years old is way too young.

For "stars" sports or other life is tough sometimes. You're a nothing, you get famous, you get rich, 24/7 media attention, groupies, entourages, life is great, oh no you're no so good anymore, not so famous, not so much attention, no groupies, no entourages because you blew your money, you no other skills but the sports, acting, or dancing, you're a nothing with no money and no job = depression and other not so good things.

Today the media dismisses how a person mismanaged their life because that would be cruel and looks for other excuses like medical issues CTE being one of them.

I predict the media will blame CTE for Johnie Manziels problems??? The real story is he's just an out of control loser.

 

[Consultant Panther]

Which is all somewhat meaningless unless they are studying a large sample of brains from the general populace as a baseline. The assumption seems to be football players are the only people who exhibit CTE. I have yet to hear if aging or other factors outside of football contribute to it or it the average deceased 70 year old brain shows signs of it or if any comparative study has ever been done in regards to this....I sure miss the scientific method being applied sans media reports and will smith movies.......

I believe they are starting to do the things you mentioned. They don't only study football players. Part of the issue is that most people don't want to donate the brains of their deceased loved ones. They are actively trying to come up with a way to test for CTE in living people. It will take a while, because they want to make sure they can distinguish between CTE, Alzheimer's and other brain damaging diseases.

 

[Consultant Panther]

By the way, if you don't think there's much scientific study/research is being done:

Selected CTE Center Original Research Articles

Baugh CM, Kiernan PT, Kroshus E, Daneshvar DH, Montenigro PH, McKee AC, Stern R. “Frequency of head impact related outcomes by position in NCAA Division I collegiate football players,” J Neurotrauma. 2014 Aug 26.

Robbins CA, Daneshvar DH, Picano JD, Gavett BE, Baugh CM, Riley DO, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Cantu RC, Stern RA. “Self-Reported Concussion History: Impact of Providing a Definition of Concussion,” Open Access Journal of Sports Medicine. 5: 99-103. 2014. [PDF]

Kroshus E, Baugh CM, Daneshvar DH, Viswanath K. “Understanding concussion reporting using a model based on the Theory of Planned Behavior,” Journal of Adolescent Health. 45(3):269-274.e2. 2014. [PDF]

Stern, R.A., Daneshvar, D.H., Baugh, C.M., Seichepine, D.R., Montenigro, P.H., Riley, D.O., Fritts, N.G., Stamm, J.M., Robbins, C.A., McHale, L., Simkin, I., Stein, T.D., Alvarez, V., Goldstein, L.E., Budson, A.E., Kowall, N.W., Nowinski, C.J., Cantu, R.C., & McKee, A.C. Clinical presentation of Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Neurology. 2013 August 21; 81: 1122-1129. [PDF]

Kroshus E, Daneshvar DH, Baugh CM, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC. NCAA concussion education in ice hockey: an ineffective mandate. BJSM. 2013 Aug 20. E-publication. [PDF]

Seichepine DR, Stamm JM, Daneshvar DH, Riley DO, Baugh CM, Gavett BE, Tripodis Y, Martin B, Chaisson C, McKee AC, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, Stern RA. Profile of self-reported problems with executive functioning in college and professional football players. J Neurotrauma. 2013 Jul 15; 30(14):1299-304. [PDF]

McKee AC, Stern RA, Nowinski CJ, Stein TD, Daneshvar DH, Alvarez VE, Lee HS, Hall GF, Wojtowicz SM, Baugh CM, Riley DO, Kubilus CA, Cormier KA, Jacobs MA, Martin BR, Abraham CR, Ikezu T, Reichard RR, Wolozin BL, Budson AE, Goldstein LE, Kowall NW, Cantu RC. The Spectrum of Disease in Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Brain, 2013; 136(Pt 1): 43-64. [PDF]

Goldstein LE, Fisher AM, Tagge CA, Zhang XL, Velisek L, Sullivan JA, Upreti C, Kracht JM, Ericsson M, Wojnarowicz MW, Goletiani CJ, Maglakelidze GM, Casey N, Moncaster JA, Minaeva O, Moir RD, Nowinski CJ, Stern RA, Cantu RC, Geiling J, Blusztajn JK, Wolozin BL, Ikezu T, Stein TD, Budson AE, Kowall NW, Chargin D, Sharon A, Saman S, Hall GF, Moss WC, Cleveland RO, Tanzi RE, Stanton PK, McKee AC. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy in blast-exposed military veterans and a blast neurotrauma mouse model. Sci Transl Med, 2012; 4(134ra60): 1-40. [PDF]

McKee AC, Gavett BE, Stern RA, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, Kowall NW, Perl D, Hedley-Whyte ET, Price B, Sullivan C, Morin P, Lee HS, Kubilus CA, Daneshvar DH, Wulff M, Budson AE. TDP-43 Proteinopathy and Motor Neuron Disease in Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. J Neuropath Exp Neurol, 2010; 69(9): 918-929.[PDF]

McKee AC, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, Hedley-Whyte ET, Gavett BE, Budson AE, Santini VE, Lee H-Y, Kubilus CA, Stern RA. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy in Athletes: Progressive Tauopathy following Repetitive Head Injury. J Neuropath Exp Neurol, 2009; 68(7): 709-735. [PDF]

Selected CTE Center Review Articles

Baugh CM, Robbins CA, Stern RA, McKee AC. “Current understanding of chronic traumatic encephalopathy,” Current Treatment Options in Neurology. 2014. Epub ahead of print. [PDF]

McKee AC, Robinson ME. “Military-related traumatic brain injury and neurodegeneration,” Alzheimers Dement. 2014 Jun;10. [PDF]

Stein TD, Alvarez VE, McKee AC. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy: a spectrum of neuropathological changes following repetitive brain trauma in athletes and military personnel. Alzheimers Res Ther. 2014 Jan 15;6(1):4. [PDF]

McKee AC, Daneshvar DH, Alvarez VE, Stein TD. The neuropathology of sport. Acta Neuropathol. 2014 Jan;127(1):29-51. doi: 10.1007/s00401-013-1230-6. 2013 Dec 24. [PDF]

Mez J, Stern RA, McKee AC. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy: Where Are We and Where Are We Going? Curr Neurol Neurosci Rep. 2013 Dec 1;13(12):1–12. [PDF]

Baugh CM, Stamm JM, Riley DO, Gavett BE, Shenton ME, Lin A, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC, Stern RA. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy: Neurodegeneration following repetitive concussive and subconcussive brain trauma. Brain Imaging and Behavior, 2012; 6(2): 244-254. [PDF]

Gavett BE, Cantu RC, Shenton M, Lin AP, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA. Clinical appraisal of chronic traumatic encephalopathy: current perspectives and future directions. Current Opinion in Neurology, 2011; 24(6): 525-531. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Riley DO, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA, Cantu RC. Long-Term Consequences: Effects on Normal Development Profile After Concussion. Phys Med Rehabil Clin N Am, 2011; 4(22): 603-670. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Cantu RC. The Epidemiology of Sports-Related Concussion. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30(1): 1-17. [PDF]

Stern RA, Riley DO, Daneshvar DH, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC. Long-term Consequences of Repetitive Brain Trauma: Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Phys Med Rehabil Clin N Am, 2011; 3(10S2): S460-S467. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Baugh CM, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA, Cantu RC. Helmets and Mouth Guards: The Role of Personal Equipment in Preventing Sport-Related Concussions. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30 (1): 145-163. [PDF]

Gavett BE, Stern RA, McKee AC. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy: A Potential Late Effect of Sport-Related Concussive and Subconcussive Head Trauma. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30(1): 179-188. [PDF]

Stern RA, Gavett BE, Baugh C, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC. Recurrent sports-related traumatic brain injury and tauopathy. Edited by M. Oria and J. Erdman. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press, 2011.

Gavett BE, Stern RA, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC. Mild traumatic brain injury: a risk factor for neurodegeneration. Alzheimer’s Research & Therapy, 2010; 2(3): 18. [PDF]

 

[President Stache]

Headline-Researcher says in 5 ye

• The annual suicide rate is 12.93 per 100,000 individuals.

• Men die by suicide 3.5x more often than women.

• On average, there are 117 suicides per day.

• The Rate of suicide is highest in middle age — white men in particular.

• White males accounted for 7 of 10 suicides in 2013.

Given few football player suicides its hard for me to connect this to football when this is a significant problem in the US 42k deaths per year.

Well.... this doesnt really mean anything does it?? I mean, people that play football are usually men?? So, whos to say that most the white male suicides in the world used to play midget and hs football?

 

[pitt-girl]

That's a shame. Obviously my biggest exposure to Mirra was on MTV's RoadHouse/Real World challenge. Tragic. But selfish too. My god, you have a family, you can't do that. Kind of leaves me with an empty feeling when I hear stories like that. I am not sure why it bothers me so, but it does.

And unlike others, I am not one to always look for reasons or blame. Sometimes, people have a defective chip. I don't know how or why, but they do. Even if you are feeling pressure and all of that, again you have a family, you can't just check out and leave them holding that over them the rest of their lives.

Although it grabs headlines, suicide is very, very rare. And that's because one of the strongest natural instincts humans (and animals) have is that of self-preservation. I understand from the outside looking in suicide seems selfish, but it isn't. It's an act caused by something very wrong in the brain to be able to hurdle over our most basic instinct.

I have a friend whose son committed suicide when he was 17. A beautiful, well-adjusted, wonderfully raised young man. It has taken them decades to come to grips with the guilt and anger that suicide provokes. There was something very wrong with Mirra and obviously common, household depression wasn't it. That's why I brought up CTE given how many times he suffered head injuries in his lifetime.

 

[pitt-girl]

Headline-Researcher says in 5 years, CTE test can be given to living. Right now the only testing possible is after death.
This headline above was in a February article about CTE. So its not an exact science at this point. People seem to be jumping to the football is an unsafe sport. Since there's no reliable test for the living researchers can't test football and non football participants which is important. If non football participants have the same test patters as football participants than football isn't the culprit. But if the football participants test positive and others don't yes there is a link to football.
Pre-existing condition do come into play. Certain people will end up with CTE whether they play football or not.
Mood and behavior issues are common between soldiers and athletes because they participate in very aggressive activities. When those activities stop these individuals have trouble managing their behaviors.
IMO the jury is still out on this one but activists who want football banned are taking this opportunity to reduce the participation levels in youth football, scare HS's & U's into thinking about liability issues etc. If they kill the feeder programs they esstenially kill football.

• The annual suicide rate is 12.93 per 100,000 individuals.

• Men die by suicide 3.5x more often than women.

• On average, there are 117 suicides per day.

• The Rate of suicide is highest in middle age — white men in particular.

• White males accounted for 7 of 10 suicides in 2013.

Given few football player suicides its hard for me to connect this to football when this is a significant problem in the US 42k deaths per year.

Football will never be banned in this country. But it will and should be made safer. As a parent I don't want Friday night HS games to cease, however, if I had a small child who showed any interest I would be hard pressed to let them go forward, especially under the age of 14. Just being honest.

 

[PSU_Nut]

As they study the brains of more deceased football players they will get better data. I believe that over 90% of the brains of former football players that have been studied have CTE. That number is probably artificially high, because they tend to study people that showed signs of CTE when they were alive. Still, it is very alarming. It has been found in the brains of former football players that died when they were very young (27 in one case).

Like you said the results are worthless because they only did the study on people who shown symptoms. It would be like testing people who have symptoms of having the flu and being shocked that they tested positive of the flu. Honestly what do they expect? However it hasn't stopped the media reporting it as if it was a study that found most former players have it. The media have fueled the hysterics. Films like Concussion at time flat out made things up. What has not been found is causation. For example a guy kills himself and has CTE. Does that mean CTE caused his suicide. In the movie they talk about the NFL suicides. They ignored the fact that many of the suicides had individual or family history of suicide or mental illness. They ignore the substance abuse history. They ignore the fact the former NFL players actually have a lower suicide rate then the general male population.

 

[pittdan77]

For "stars" sports or other life is tough sometimes. You're a nothing, you get famous, you get rich, 24/7 media attention, groupies, entourages, life is great, oh no you're no so good anymore, not so famous, not so much attention, no groupies, no entourages because you blew your money, you no other skills but the sports, acting, or dancing, you're a nothing with no money and no job = depression and other not so good things.

Today the media dismisses how a person mismanaged their life because that would be cruel and looks for other excuses like medical issues CTE being one of them.

I predict the media will blame CTE for Johnie Manziels problems??? The real story is he's just an out of control loser.

BuffetParrothead isn't wrong in that direct links do not exist because it is nearly impossible to do a case study on this group and not have things like mental illness, PED use, and drug and alcohol abuse be identified as possible factors. You can scientifically say many football players that were exposed to repetitive head trauma get CTE but you can't say repetitive head trauma is why football players have CTE.

I tell parents that football is dangerous. So are ATV's, fast cars, soccer, skiing, sled riding...so pick your poison. I also tell them that if their kid (boy or girl) suffers a concussion, get them real help if the rest and a break from school work doesn't help (sleep is a huge deal when it comes to recovery).

Guess what I'm saying is, don't dismiss CTE as the boogeyman that was invented to kill football. It's very, very real. So are the emotional and psychological effects.

 

[pittdan77]

Like you said the results are worthless because they only did the study on people who shown symptoms. It would be like testing people who have symptoms of having the flu and being shocked that they tested positive of the flu. Honestly what do they expect? However it hasn't stopped the media reporting it as if it was a study that found most former players have it. The media have fueled the hysterics. Films like Concussion at time flat out made things up. What has not been found is causation. For example a guy kills himself and has CTE. Does that mean CTE caused his suicide. In the movie they talk about the NFL suicides. They ignored the fact that many of the suicides had individual or family history of suicide or mental illness. They ignore the substance abuse history. They ignore the fact the former NFL players actually have a lower suicide rate then the general male population.

No. Science knows what a normal brain looks like.

 

[ncyajleel]

The only way to make football more safe is to slow it down and eliminate the contact. If you did that, it would cease to be football. Any time you have any type of activity which requires helmets and padding, you are going to have concussions. The concussion is caused by the brain bouncing back and fourth in your skull, so unless you can stop the sudden change in force and motion, you can't stop the concussion.

 

[ncyajleel]

This is exactly right. There is nothing selfish about it. The selfishness comes from those left behind saying how could they do this to me? When you are mentally ill you cannot think rationally, everything is irrational. When I got back from the military, I had problems adjusting and I was not able to think like I do now. I was lucky enough to have people that wanted to help me, and they did. Not everyone has that and it is sad.

Although it grabs headlines, suicide is very, very rare. And that's because one of the strongest natural instincts humans (and animals) have is that of self-preservation. I understand from the outside looking in suicide seems selfish, but it isn't. It's an act caused by something very wrong in the brain to be able to hurdle over our most basic instinct.

I have a friend whose son committed suicide when he was 17. A beautiful, well-adjusted, wonderfully raised young man. It has taken them decades to come to grips with the guilt and anger that suicide provokes. There was something very wrong with Mirra and obviously common, household depression wasn't it. That's why I brought up CTE given how many times he suffered head injuries in his lifetime.

 

[Begbie_Nole]

This reeks of the same motivations people use to state the suicide in the Military is out of control... that is of course until you compare suicide rates for 18-30 year old men not in the military... then you come to find out that the military rates are much lower..

In this case is the suicide rate for ex football players higher then man who did not play??

 

[upj87]

By the way, if you don't think there's much scientific study/research is being done:

Selected CTE Center Original Research Articles

Baugh CM, Kiernan PT, Kroshus E, Daneshvar DH, Montenigro PH, McKee AC, Stern R. “Frequency of head impact related outcomes by position in NCAA Division I collegiate football players,” J Neurotrauma. 2014 Aug 26.

Robbins CA, Daneshvar DH, Picano JD, Gavett BE, Baugh CM, Riley DO, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Cantu RC, Stern RA. “Self-Reported Concussion History: Impact of Providing a Definition of Concussion,” Open Access Journal of Sports Medicine. 5: 99-103. 2014. [PDF]

Kroshus E, Baugh CM, Daneshvar DH, Viswanath K. “Understanding concussion reporting using a model based on the Theory of Planned Behavior,” Journal of Adolescent Health. 45(3):269-274.e2. 2014. [PDF]

Stern, R.A., Daneshvar, D.H., Baugh, C.M., Seichepine, D.R., Montenigro, P.H., Riley, D.O., Fritts, N.G., Stamm, J.M., Robbins, C.A., McHale, L., Simkin, I., Stein, T.D., Alvarez, V., Goldstein, L.E., Budson, A.E., Kowall, N.W., Nowinski, C.J., Cantu, R.C., & McKee, A.C. Clinical presentation of Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Neurology. 2013 August 21; 81: 1122-1129. [PDF]

Kroshus E, Daneshvar DH, Baugh CM, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC. NCAA concussion education in ice hockey: an ineffective mandate. BJSM. 2013 Aug 20. E-publication. [PDF]

Seichepine DR, Stamm JM, Daneshvar DH, Riley DO, Baugh CM, Gavett BE, Tripodis Y, Martin B, Chaisson C, McKee AC, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, Stern RA. Profile of self-reported problems with executive functioning in college and professional football players. J Neurotrauma. 2013 Jul 15; 30(14):1299-304. [PDF]

McKee AC, Stern RA, Nowinski CJ, Stein TD, Daneshvar DH, Alvarez VE, Lee HS, Hall GF, Wojtowicz SM, Baugh CM, Riley DO, Kubilus CA, Cormier KA, Jacobs MA, Martin BR, Abraham CR, Ikezu T, Reichard RR, Wolozin BL, Budson AE, Goldstein LE, Kowall NW, Cantu RC. The Spectrum of Disease in Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Brain, 2013; 136(Pt 1): 43-64. [PDF]

Goldstein LE, Fisher AM, Tagge CA, Zhang XL, Velisek L, Sullivan JA, Upreti C, Kracht JM, Ericsson M, Wojnarowicz MW, Goletiani CJ, Maglakelidze GM, Casey N, Moncaster JA, Minaeva O, Moir RD, Nowinski CJ, Stern RA, Cantu RC, Geiling J, Blusztajn JK, Wolozin BL, Ikezu T, Stein TD, Budson AE, Kowall NW, Chargin D, Sharon A, Saman S, Hall GF, Moss WC, Cleveland RO, Tanzi RE, Stanton PK, McKee AC. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy in blast-exposed military veterans and a blast neurotrauma mouse model. Sci Transl Med, 2012; 4(134ra60): 1-40. [PDF]

McKee AC, Gavett BE, Stern RA, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, Kowall NW, Perl D, Hedley-Whyte ET, Price B, Sullivan C, Morin P, Lee HS, Kubilus CA, Daneshvar DH, Wulff M, Budson AE. TDP-43 Proteinopathy and Motor Neuron Disease in Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. J Neuropath Exp Neurol, 2010; 69(9): 918-929.[PDF]

McKee AC, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, Hedley-Whyte ET, Gavett BE, Budson AE, Santini VE, Lee H-Y, Kubilus CA, Stern RA. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy in Athletes: Progressive Tauopathy following Repetitive Head Injury. J Neuropath Exp Neurol, 2009; 68(7): 709-735. [PDF]

Selected CTE Center Review Articles

Baugh CM, Robbins CA, Stern RA, McKee AC. “Current understanding of chronic traumatic encephalopathy,” Current Treatment Options in Neurology. 2014. Epub ahead of print. [PDF]

McKee AC, Robinson ME. “Military-related traumatic brain injury and neurodegeneration,” Alzheimers Dement. 2014 Jun;10. [PDF]

Stein TD, Alvarez VE, McKee AC. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy: a spectrum of neuropathological changes following repetitive brain trauma in athletes and military personnel. Alzheimers Res Ther. 2014 Jan 15;6(1):4. [PDF]

McKee AC, Daneshvar DH, Alvarez VE, Stein TD. The neuropathology of sport. Acta Neuropathol. 2014 Jan;127(1):29-51. doi: 10.1007/s00401-013-1230-6. 2013 Dec 24. [PDF]

Mez J, Stern RA, McKee AC. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy: Where Are We and Where Are We Going? Curr Neurol Neurosci Rep. 2013 Dec 1;13(12):1–12. [PDF]

Baugh CM, Stamm JM, Riley DO, Gavett BE, Shenton ME, Lin A, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC, Stern RA. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy: Neurodegeneration following repetitive concussive and subconcussive brain trauma. Brain Imaging and Behavior, 2012; 6(2): 244-254. [PDF]

Gavett BE, Cantu RC, Shenton M, Lin AP, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA. Clinical appraisal of chronic traumatic encephalopathy: current perspectives and future directions. Current Opinion in Neurology, 2011; 24(6): 525-531. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Riley DO, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA, Cantu RC. Long-Term Consequences: Effects on Normal Development Profile After Concussion. Phys Med Rehabil Clin N Am, 2011; 4(22): 603-670. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Cantu RC. The Epidemiology of Sports-Related Concussion. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30(1): 1-17. [PDF]

Stern RA, Riley DO, Daneshvar DH, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC. Long-term Consequences of Repetitive Brain Trauma: Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Phys Med Rehabil Clin N Am, 2011; 3(10S2): S460-S467. [PDF]

Daneshvar DH, Baugh CM, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC, Stern RA, Cantu RC. Helmets and Mouth Guards: The Role of Personal Equipment in Preventing Sport-Related Concussions. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30 (1): 145-163. [PDF]

Gavett BE, Stern RA, McKee AC. Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy: A Potential Late Effect of Sport-Related Concussive and Subconcussive Head Trauma. Clinics in Sports Medicine, 2011; 30(1): 179-188. [PDF]

Stern RA, Gavett BE, Baugh C, Nowinski CJ, Cantu RC, McKee AC. Recurrent sports-related traumatic brain injury and tauopathy. Edited by M. Oria and J. Erdman. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press, 2011.

Gavett BE, Stern RA, Cantu RC, Nowinski CJ, McKee AC. Mild traumatic brain injury: a risk factor for neurodegeneration. Alzheimer’s Research & Therapy, 2010; 2(3): 18. [PDF]

very nice and informative, but in just glancing at a few, the comparisons are to damaged brains in athletes in comparison to what is considered a "normal" brain....fine. Damage readily seen. However, as far as I can tell there is no information on how many "normal" brains (as used for comparison) are present in deceased men over the age of 60. Are concussions and head trauma the only causese of the symptons? Anybody know?...Ken Stabler died of cancer. His brain showed signs of CTE. What is the brain condition of all men over 60 who die of cancer? I'm guessing that is not known (and I could easily stand corrected) . What if 20% show CTE? What does that mean? ....

 

[Hailpitt]

Here is an interesting study which goes beyond CTE

http://www.ajconline.org/article/S0002-9149(11)03387-X/fulltext

 

[bobfree]

This is honestly the worst part of anonymous message boards. A bunch of ill informed ignorant opinions all attached to no name aliases. I'm sure you're all good people but some of these comments are ludicrous

 

[Panther Parrothead]

Interesting take, BP......

I will add this; the "I hate football crowd" is poised to end HS football in several more liberal pockets of America. The liability to the school districts....when mom and dad sue because their kid was concussed....will be the lynchpin. "School districts cant afford the liability.......football isnt that big a deal around here......lets drop the sport altogether......"

Some of you may laugh. But in liberal strongholds in America, the drums will only beat louder to get rid of HS football.

Since when did parents' concerns about their kids getting their brains scrambled turn into a liberal-versus-conservative issue?

I swear that some of you must look under your beds with a flashlight before you go to sleep, just to be sure that there are no "hated liberals" hiding beneath it who might pop-out in the middle of the night and put water filters on all of your faucets. Your way of thinking belongs up in Happy Valley.

 

[Panther Parrothead]

Like you said the results are worthless because they only did the study on people who shown symptoms. It would be like testing people who have symptoms of having the flu and being shocked that they tested positive of the flu. Honestly what do they expect? However it hasn't stopped the media reporting it as if it was a study that found most former players have it. The media have fueled the hysterics. Films like Concussion at time flat out made things up. What has not been found is causation. For example a guy kills himself and has CTE. Does that mean CTE caused his suicide. In the movie they talk about the NFL suicides. They ignored the fact that many of the suicides had individual or family history of suicide or mental illness. They ignore the substance abuse history. They ignore the fact the former NFL players actually have a lower suicide rate then the general male population.

I knew Mike Webster personally. He was one of the brightest and most articulate athletes I've ever known, and I've know plenty (thru professional relationships). When I watched him deteriorate from what he'd been to a guy who was delusional, unbearable for his family to live with, literally living in his car, then finally unable to care for himself at all, then something went wrong. When I hear other football players such as Troy Polamalu and others say that they're steering their kids away from football and toward other sports such as soccer, there's a good reason for it.

I was fortunate enough to watch Tony Dorsett for four years here at Pitt; I saw many of the hits that he took - both legal and illegal. And he now he's come out and revealed the mental and emotional problems that he's been having.

The fact that the NFL is finally addressing the matter - after denying it for so many years - should tell us all that we need to know. They were no better than the tobacco industry who denied responsibility for the physical damage of cigarettes and snuff, until even they could no longer deny the truth.

 

[PSU_Nut]

I knew Mike Webster personally. He was one of the brightest and most articulate athletes I've ever known, and I've know plenty (thru professional relationships). When I watched him deteriorate from what he'd been to a guy who was delusional, unbearable for his family to live with, literally living in his car, then finally unable to care for himself at all, then something went wrong. When I hear other football players such as Troy Polamalu and others say that they're steering their kids away from football and toward other sports such as soccer, there's a good reason for it.

I was fortunate enough to watch Tony Dorsett for four years here at Pitt; I saw many of the hits that he took - both legal and illegal. And he now he's come out and revealed the mental and emotional problems that he's been having.

The fact that the NFL is finally addressing the matter - after denying it for so many years - should tell us all that we need to know. They were no better than the tobacco industry who denied responsibility for the physical damage of cigarettes and snuff, until even they could no longer deny the truth.

Webster was a sad story but he also had a long history of drug abuse and a family history of mental abuse. I think todays athletes benefit a lot from the new rules and equipment. The biggest difference is that they are not allowing players to comeback as soon. For example when I played the rule was headache free. Now they have cognitive tests you must pass.

One study has actually said that soccer may have more impact then football. The paper I read said soccer players suffer multiple mini concussion which has a cumulative effect.