So then is it irresponsible for USC and it's donors to spend hundreds of millions to renovate their stadium when a brand new professional facility is being built 9 miles away?
USC's Published Reasons For Renovating LA Coliseum
- Thread starter GEORGERDOG
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So then is it irresponsible for USC and it's donors to spend hundreds of millions to renovate their stadium when a brand new professional facility is being built 9 miles away?
But it's such a great topic for the BMW club and faux Pitt fans to constantly complain about. You know, the same ones that didn't go to games when Pitt played on campus and, truthfully, would have no intention of going regardless if they did move back now. Because the average attendance figures clearly show that the move to HF has made little difference and in some years has been better than when Pitt play on campus. And now with every game available to watch for free (stream or TV)? There are just too many that want to remain absentee fans and watch all the games for free. Attendance Even on campus could be the same or even lower today because of the availability to see all the games without being there.
The moral of the story remains the same: those that are interested in being there in person go to Pitt home games; those that aren't don't. Those that don't attend will then rationalize the reasons for not going. Right now for many of them it's because they don't like HF or "off-campus" games. (But they also use many other excuses). When the games were at Pitt Stadium on campus? Well, they mustn't have liked that either.
Nobody really argues that an on campus stadium will do much to increase attendance. Our core fanbase has remained pretty much the same. I'd argue that it should have increased much more, considering the increase in enrollment, alumni base and investment in new facilities.
Well, they are spending millions of dollars for a football stadium they will use 6 times each year.
Ahhh land. While not a scarce resource, a land locked, urban campus it is certainly not just a scare resource, but an extremely expensive resource.
But it's such a great topic for the BMW club and faux Pitt fans to constantly complain about. You know, the same ones that didn't go to games when Pitt played on campus and, truthfully, would have no intention of going regardless if they did move back now. Because the average attendance figures clearly show that the move to HF has made little difference and in some years has been better than when Pitt play on campus. And now with every game available to watch for free (stream or TV)? There are just too many that want to remain absentee fans and watch all the games for free. Attendance Even on campus could be the same or even lower today because of the availability to see all the games without being there.
The moral of the story remains the same: those that are interested in being there in person go to Pitt home games; those that aren't don't. Those that don't attend will then rationalize the reasons for not going. Right now for many of them it's because they don't like HF or "off-campus" games. (But they also use many other excuses). When the games were at Pitt Stadium on campus? Well, they mustn't have liked that either.
I went to all the games at Pitt Stadium, I went to all the games at Three Rivers, and I go to all the games at Heinz, and I make all the road trips [so have been in a ton of stadiums where Pitt is playing]...so I believe my opinion has some validity. Moving off campus is/was a horrible mistake--and it has very little to do with attendance. For some reason people have made the link between attendance and whether they play on or off campus. While playing on campus may have some marginal impact on attendance, it is the other things that are much more important. Presumably were Pitt playing at Pitt Stadium, or some similarly sized stadium, it would greatly enhance game day atmosphere--as the stadium would be much fuller, would sound better and look better. Would likely result in higher ticket prices. Playing off campus means that alumni and prospective students do not see or visit campus--part of the reason for actually playing the sport. Part of getting alumni back to campus is for fundraising....which creates an additional hurdle for Pitt. Being off campus in Pittsburgh means playing second fiddle to the Steelers and the Pirates for scheduling. There are so many reasons to play on campus, virtually nobody thinks it is better to play off campus [as indicated by many schools that have built their own on campus facilities over the past few years]. Unfortunately the odds of Pitt ever having an on campus facility are next to nil, due to space and costs. So Pitt fans need to make the best of playing at Heinz, as it really is the only viable option the school has. Hail to Pitt!
None of us can change what was done. There were alternatives at that time. But now there realistically don't seem to be barring a T. Boone Pickens or Phil Knight philanthropist to personally finance Pitt football.
I get my connection to the campus by attending basketball games and the numerous other trips we make to Pittsburgh regularly. I live about 65 miles away; takes me about 1:30 - 1:45 depending on traffic (or weather in the winter). So I recognize and understand not everyone can do that.
But what I have difficulty reconciling is all the complaining done by LOCALS (folks in a roughly 100 mile radius or so) that purport to be Pitt fans who don't attend games now. Then they claim they'd go again if the stadium was on campus. I went to all the home games at those venues as you did. I didn't see those fans then. So based on that, I find it very hard to believe them now. I just don't have the opinion that those that are not willing to tangibly invest in and support Pitt athletics have a meaningful voice. Yet they ridicule and denigrate continually on sites like this. Just my own thoughts.
I think Pitt sees the same thing you do. Hence it's not a priority.
I remember back in 2012 the whole FSU to Big XII thing, tshirt FSU fans were calling and pounding the athletic department to move or they'd hold back donations and stop supporting FSU sports. The department, would ask for their Seminole club membership number and the vast majority of people complaining did not donate or donated very little.
I'm sure it's the same with this.
Agree. I'd love to be on campus in a 50K seat stadium. For reasons you stated. That would be ideal.
Unfortunately, the decision was made to move. And for reasons you state, I doubt I'll ever be on Pitt's campus for a football game in my lifetime.
But I'm supporting the program regardless. That decision is done, and it is not changing. So I'd rather focus on the present/future and hope to make Pitt better.
I tend to agree with you. I suspect, that many of the very same people that complain about attending games at Heinz, also complained about attending games at Pitt Stadium. I've said it before, in many different ways, but Pitt could win a national championship for the excuses its "fans" make for not attending games and not supporting the program. It is frustrating and sad, but it is my alma mater--so I am not going anywhere. Hail to Pitt!
We are comparing apples with oranges.
Are their sports programs fully funded and on the level of every other PAC12 school? Yes.
Is USC's alumni base bigger than Pitt? Yes.
Does USC have more millionaire donors than Pitt? Yes.
Is the commute from place to place worse in LA than it is in Pittsburgh? Yes.
Does the coliseum host more than 6 events per year? Yes.
If the answer is yes to all questions, then they have justification to renovate the stadium. Pitt is a no, to all the above questions, therefore they should not proceed in building an on campus stadium.
Each situation is different...
Win and give the fans a chance to believe we can win is the biggest thing Pitt needs to do. We will have a window when Ben retires. We need to be ready . That is the big question. The Penguins get it and the Pirates not so much. You can see the resultsBut it's such a great topic for the BMW club and faux Pitt fans to constantly complain about. You know, the same ones that didn't go to games when Pitt played on campus and, truthfully, would have no intention of going regardless if they did move back now. Because the average attendance figures clearly show that the move to HF has made little difference and in some years has been better than when Pitt play on campus. And now with every game available to watch for free (stream or TV)? There are just too many that want to remain absentee fans and watch all the games for free. Attendance Even on campus could be the same or even lower today because of the availability to see all the games without being there.
The moral of the story remains the same: those that are interested in being there in person go to Pitt home games; those that aren't don't. Those that don't attend will then rationalize the reasons for not going. Right now for many of them it's because they don't like HF or "off-campus" games. (But they also use many other excuses). When the games were at Pitt Stadium on campus? Well, they mustn't have liked that either.
Sure, winning is the goal. You and me both would love to see it at Pitt again.
But a lot of habits for people that claim to be following the team have apparently changed. There is no blackout of home games not sold out. Virtually every game able to be seen on tv or computers. Affordable big screen HDTV's with excellent pictures and fans having the ability to see games all day Saturday from noon until after midnight. With their own food, beverages and toilets close by. They don't have to spend $$$ on gas or fight traffic or deal with the weather.
I've had people tell me that they're not interested and won't go to games even if they were given free tickets and a ride to and from the game. They prefer to stay home where they can watch Pitt + switch to any other game they want to see. Or they want to follow their college football fantasy team by watching various games instead of being at a live game. Bettors love being able to flip around and watch all the games they have a stake in on tv.
It's a personal choice. We love being at the games. But lots of people don't. Even were the on field results to improve. Attendance in general at college football is on the decline. Per reports, especially it seems among the younger age groups and student sections. Sure there are some exceptions with the very most consistently successful programs. But if you look around at the crowds in the stadiums at a lot of the college games I've seen, there are a lot of empty seats.
USC will be able to raise that kind of money with private donations. Have you ever seen the types of donations given to that school? A couple people have donated $200 million and more have donated over $100 million. They have more $100 million dollar donations that any other school in America. It is amazing the money they can raise.
While we are tooting USC's horn, I was in Newport a few weeks ago and one of the bar/restaurants had a big banner saying "Watch the Trojans this season with USC legend Anthony Davis". The opponent was Central Michigan, but the place looked to be packed and the whole concept seemed pretty cool.
Have you ever heard of an "event"? What about a concert, well that would be an event too. The "six times a year" argument is shortsighted and unimaginative, two key descriptions for Steve Pederson by the way.
Any new on campus stadium should include academic space as well.
Think big, not small.
The Pitt regents screwed the pooch putting BB ahead of football.
Michigan was lucky that Yost put forth a plan to grow a stadium over the years. Michigan Stadium is a huge asset. Get the former alum on campus in "rah rah team" mode, and out come the wallets to donate. Football pays pretty much for all the other athletic programs.
Basketball cant do that.
If the stadium had to come down, a new one should of replaced it. In the past 10 years, we put over 200M more into the Big House. It takes money to make it.
My opinion is this , we have another Nordy as president as far as big time football, and we have a lightweight as an AD.
So far that is what I am seeing with my own two eyes. That's the pessimistic attitude Pitt has instilled in me over the past 30 years!
So far that is what I am seeing with my own two eyes. That's the pessimistic attitude Pitt has instilled in me over the past 30 years!
Anybody watch that game last night.
See pics of that campus?
Familiar with historic and current support for USC Football?
See The stadium IN PLACE right across the street?
It's not hard to figure why CP has labeled as LUNATICS those calling for a new stadium in congested, over crowded and slum encroached OAKLAND????
See pics of that campus?
Familiar with historic and current support for USC Football?
See The stadium IN PLACE right across the street?
It's not hard to figure why CP has labeled as LUNATICS those calling for a new stadium in congested, over crowded and slum encroached OAKLAND????
You should stick to what you are familiar with instead of ignorantly equating completely disparate situations.
Paco, you are a cool cat, but really, many see Nordy, who does love BB better than FB, his own admission, sold football out for basketball. Not just him, more of the face of the plan
Now we are an average program in football, and a laughingstock in basketball. We were actually a good program in basketball for about 10 years, making money, and it benefitted football recruiting as well.
Pittlaw, I cut my teeth on Pitt stadium , walking up that hill with my dad starting in 75! I loved that part of the game. It was those special walks with dad and friends where many good Pitt stories were told and shared. Guess I'm too old school and don't need all the lights and shiney objects to make me happy
The Michigan fan is 100% correct. We should have never moved football off campus to a rented facility. It's a shame that we need fans of other programs to point out the obvious truth. Only the 'smart' Pitt fans think it was great to move the program to Heinz.
Maybe we shouldn't have moved, but Michigan's situation couldn't be more different than Pitt's. He is also absolutely wrong, as is anyone who buys into the concocted myth, that moving off campus was a result of prioritizing basketball over football.
The same people on these boards have been selling that myth for 20 years, despite dozens of conversations about this topic, because of a willful ignorance to support their simpleton narratives.
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Said it then and really say it now, we should have bit the bullet then, developed a plan, worked hard, found a way to stay in campus.
What is there to equate? Our regents weren't stupid enough to tear down the Big House, and put up a new basketball arena in its place.
Pitt had the land on campus, and they used it for something else.
CFB is a different animal than the NFL. NFL teams don't have an athletic department dependent on FB, and the good will that having alums on campus brings.
Hah that's perfect!!!!
You get better than that clown.
Dude unless you have some connection to Pgh you cant even begin to understand the abject stupidity of the Pitt Athletic Drpartment......probably since it's formation.
Pitt fans and the administration dropped the ball between 1975-1995. Pitt Stadium should have been renovated, and the facilities should have been getting upgrades all along rather than when it was too late.
No ,they can't
just bring out their supercilious pompous smart assclown insults.
Their Schtick when they got nothing.
Very little. The fact that you dont know that tells me that you know nothing about the University of Pittsburgh.
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Why don't you read the LA Times Joe the Panther. The Rams play today and for the next 3 years at the Coliseum: http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-inglewood-stadium-delay-20170518-story.html
The palatial, $2.6-billion stadium that is being built for the Rams and Chargers in Inglewood, originally projected to open in 2019, will be delayed almost a year, to the start of the 2020 NFL season.
Take it from someone who lives out there (me)--though that former racetrack was called "Hollywood Park", it was located in . . . Inglewood (nowhere near Hollywood other than being in the same county).
CrazyPaco: For years now, you clearly make my point on the contradiction that is Pitt. On one hand they want alumni to contribute more to the football program and university, and on the other they allow Pitt's current or former employees kick these same alumni in the teeth, belittling them as "plain ole' stupid, intentionally ignorant," and basically uninformed.
Others of us have read in detail Pitt's financial data, and it may surprise you to learn that we are quite capable of understanding the information and reaching our own conclusions (looking at the same facts). Conclusions that are different from yours. That includes taking into consideration Pitt's geographic urban location. Your argument in this area is mute as the simple fact is they had Pitt Stadium - they should have maintained it rather than let it deteriorate and then tear it down. Had they done so, at least we would be able to have an "on campus" game day experience on our trips back to Pittsburgh, rather than a "sterile" football game only experience at Heinz.
In the past you have cited information on Pitt Athletic finances and details that appeared to be "non-public"? I certainly hope that is not true as it likely is a violation of university policy. As would be using Pitt computers for your personal use on these sites. Your post above - calling others on this site "a whack job," "plain ole' stupid," or "some combination of the above" doesn't seem to sit well with the statements in Pitt's Employee Handbook (available online) stating that Pitt employees are expected to be "ambassadors" for the university, or words to that effect!
Weren't you the one who posted you were a professor in Pitt's Medical School and that your area was one of the leading centers on concussions not only in the USA, but in "the world." Yes! I think that was you. I recall questioning, at the time, your complaining on one hand about the lack of respect and recognition your department got in the movie "Concussion" ... while on the other hand constantly complaining about all of us being misguided and uninformed as we try to restore Pitt being perceived as a great university in all areas, particularly football.
Your department seems to be a victim, in part, of this "lack of respect" overall perception problem that Pitt has. In that movie: made in Pittsburgh; about a Pittsburgh Steeler; whose main character is a MD working in a Pittsburgh hospital; who got a good part of his medical education as a "Fellow" in your department; and produced by other people who graduated from or attended Pitt - apparently didn't give your "world class" department "any" credit or "mention."
You seem to minimize the importance of our viewpoint - that we want Pitt to be recognized as a great university in all areas, including yours. That's hard to do, when the football team keeps showing Pitt on National TV as a weak, poorly coached, outplayed, and underperforming team. That tends to give people around the country watching these games, who have little to no knowledge of Pitt, that Pitt is a weak or mediocre school, at best. Seeing schools like OKSU beat us mercilessly, and at will, doesn't help! They ran all over us. As did PSU.
Rightly or wrongly, the perception many people have about a large university comes mainly from their perception of the school's athletic teams, especially football and basketball. We seem to do badly at both sports. Correction, Pitt seems to do badly in most of its athletics programs. It's recent athletic department ranking as #85 out of the 65 P-5 schools, speaks for itself.
Maybe Pitt gets no respect because people like you are "range bound" in your thinking and work against our goal of restoring Pitt's athletic heritage. Many of us disagree with you, and your approach. How does making Pitt great again in football hurts its academic standing? It likely would only help it by making Pitt appear as a strong and vibrant school.
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You guys need to lay off the team and Capel - presser after the loss...
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