Womens hoops continues to suck now down 40
- Thread starter pittizit
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Lost by 50.
What to make of this team? Start with a train wreck or dumpster fire, but maybe the train and dumpster might object.
Verdi the answer? No. If Suzie could not turn it around, no one will. You never say never, but it may apply here.
Well that doesn't make any sense. I mean I guess if you are arguing that Pitt isn't going to win a national championship in women's basketball then OK, they aren't. But it's not like Pitt has never had any success at women's basketball. It's not like Pitt has never been in the top 25. It's not like Pitt hasn't won multiple games in the NCAA tournament in some seasons.
Pitt has been good at women's basketball before. Maybe you don't remember, because it was before Suzie was here screwing things up.
First of all, some of you guys aren't going to like what I have to say.
A number of us have been posting all season how lacking of talent
this team is. Last week LeMoyne, maybe the worst team I've seen
in awhile, hung with us for most of the game. We lost to Duquesne
in a close game. We have Atlantic 10 talent (maybe) and it was shown
as we struggled in the OC against some pretty weak teams from
far lesser conferences. All the while the regulars on here were saying,
we're gonna get destroyed once the ACC begins. Today against the #14
team proves it. Watching it, I felt we'd lose to their substitutes, that's
how lopsided the team talent was. Now, did I feel we'd lose by 50? No,
but 30+ wouldn't have surprised me. VT shot 52% FG's, 48% 3's, and
90% Ft's. That's great shooting even in a game of HORSE.
This year it's not going to get much better in this conference, as Louisville,
ND, Syracuse , and others are light years better than we are. I've been
posting all year that I just hope they keep their spirits up. Verdi, if you
know anything about bball has them at least trying to do the right
things bball wise. They just aren't good enough to do it.
By the way, King showed today she is has ACC talent. After that, not a lot
there if we're gonna play in this confference. This a TOTAL rebuild. As
JPN said yesterday, Gino Arremina couldn't win with this group. I'll add
to that....neither could John Wooden, Bobby Knight or Duke's Coach K.
Get real folks!
A number of us have been posting all season how lacking of talent
this team is. Last week LeMoyne, maybe the worst team I've seen
in awhile, hung with us for most of the game. We lost to Duquesne
in a close game. We have Atlantic 10 talent (maybe) and it was shown
as we struggled in the OC against some pretty weak teams from
far lesser conferences. All the while the regulars on here were saying,
we're gonna get destroyed once the ACC begins. Today against the #14
team proves it. Watching it, I felt we'd lose to their substitutes, that's
how lopsided the team talent was. Now, did I feel we'd lose by 50? No,
but 30+ wouldn't have surprised me. VT shot 52% FG's, 48% 3's, and
90% Ft's. That's great shooting even in a game of HORSE.
This year it's not going to get much better in this conference, as Louisville,
ND, Syracuse , and others are light years better than we are. I've been
posting all year that I just hope they keep their spirits up. Verdi, if you
know anything about bball has them at least trying to do the right
things bball wise. They just aren't good enough to do it.
By the way, King showed today she is has ACC talent. After that, not a lot
there if we're gonna play in this confference. This a TOTAL rebuild. As
JPN said yesterday, Gino Arremina couldn't win with this group. I'll add
to that....neither could John Wooden, Bobby Knight or Duke's Coach K.
Get real folks!
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In the 3rd quarter Virginia Tech shot 10-14 from the field, 5-6 on threes and 6-6 on ones, and then in the 4th quarter they again shot 10-14 from the field, 4-6 on threes and 2-3 on ones. So overall for the second half, 11-16 on twos, 9-12 on threes and 8-9 on ones.
Ouch.
Hey! You stole my "OUCH." LOL
Yup, unreal shooting %'s. Some of it was great ball
rotation, just as good ball movement...and some of
it was our poor defense. But still, they hit em at a
pretty damn good rate.
their offense is bad. Every time they set up it is to the right side to a hand off. There is no down screens off ball screens no flare screens. A defense can just stand in one spot because they do the same thing every time down the court. There is no movement. No outside game at all. King did well and it was nice to see Malcolm get to the rim. Hopefully they can learn a little from todays game
Of course, the program has had winning seasons, although precious few. Agnus had the best success until she took her turn driving the program off the cliff.
Since you are a stat/number guy perhaps you may be interested in this: In the last 40 years........
20 win seasons: 6
Losing seasons: A hell of a lot more than 6
Year-end Final AP ranking: 1
Tournament Appearances 4 (3 Agnus) 1 Suzie)
Again, this in 40 years.
So it appears that a lot more people than Suzie were screwing things up. Even with Agnus's early success. the program is/has been abysmal. There is no way to sugarcoat it. And I don't believe it is getting any better in my lifetime.
And by the way, this new guy is staring down the barrel of another winless conference season.
Yes, it is bad, but a lot of it is who's out there doing it.
Marley W struggled at the point as she has all year. Today
she had 1 assist and 4TO's. She was our leading rebounder
though. That tells you how bad things are when your pg
leads in rebounds aand TO's.
As you said, King did well, and Malcolm had a few moments
getting to the rim. I'd like to see her do more shot wise. She
can hit, but she's also a liability out front as she's a bit slow
and not quick. She has to shoot more. Marley W on the other
hand can't shoot, 0-4 FG's, 0-1 on her 3's and Zero FT. Perkins,
1-9 FG's for 4 total pts. This ain't bad coaching, it's very poor
talent up against a ranked team. More of the same is coming.
Hopefully not by 50. I hope they keep their spirits up, but it
ain't gonna be easy. Just as a number of us expected.
So if you don't think it's possible for Pitt to compete in women's basketball, why not? There has to be a reason. What is it? What make's Pitt uniquely unable to compete in a sport that lots of other programs do?
First off, I take no delight posting in this thread. I go out of my way to avoid trashing coaches and players. (AD is another story)
It's possible they can compete, but highly, highly improbable given a ten to fifteen-year window. That is three more coaching changes to get it right. I just don't see a sweet sixteen season any time before I kick the bucket. Disagree? Care to bet?
Why do I think that? Well, for starters look again at their history. Perhaps you should reread my prior post. It is a testament to ineptitude.
The short answer is we cannot recruit at a level to compete. I don't know why but I do think it is more institutional than coaching. If Suzie could not get it turned around, I don't know who can. (And why I am so pessimistic.) Lack of support, and an empty Pete doesn't help. Take your pick.
You don't feel the same way. So tell me, why should I feel differently?
It's possible they can compete, but highly, highly improbable given a ten to fifteen-year window. That is three more coaching changes to get it right. I just don't see a sweet sixteen season any time before I kick the bucket. Disagree? Care to bet?
Why do I think that? Well, for starters look again at their history. Perhaps you should reread my prior post. It is a testament to ineptitude.
The short answer is we cannot recruit at a level to compete. I don't know why but I do think it is more institutional than coaching. If Suzie could not get it turned around, I don't know who can. (And why I am so pessimistic.) Lack of support, and an empty Pete doesn't help. Take your pick.
You don't feel the same way. So tell me, why should I feel differently?
I do believe some of our transfers are sitting out. Suzie's mouth and treatment of players did her in. H2P
Well someone who was actually a good coach would have a much better chance.
It's not like Agnus Beranato was was some sort of coaching savant, but she did a hell of a lot better here than Suzie did. A good coach could win as much as she did here.
Is Verdi that guy? Who knows? But the notion that you can determine that from his coaching with this team up until this point is laughable.
With her resume, I thought Suzie was a great hire. She had a nice first year with Agnus’ players and the volleyball player she found. She was awful after that and it was telling that her best player transferred out each season…
It will be interesting to see if the no-nonsense Coach Verdi can convince good-enough players to come to Pitt. We have some depth players, we need 2 or 3 stars (like Agnus was somehow able to find —e.g., Mercedes Walker, Zellous, Keisel…).
Go Pitt.
It will be interesting to see if the no-nonsense Coach Verdi can convince good-enough players to come to Pitt. We have some depth players, we need 2 or 3 stars (like Agnus was somehow able to find —e.g., Mercedes Walker, Zellous, Keisel…).
Go Pitt.
These are both good responses to the question about Suzie and
any other coach "turning it around" at Pitt. Can Verdi do it.? Get
"players good enough to come to Pitt," and yes, it can be done.
What we have now couldn't beat Duquesne, Coppin St., Ball St, etc,
struggled with LeMoyne, and lost by 50 to ranked VT. We're going
to see more of that in upcoming ACC games. Hopefully not by 50,
but it's gonna be by a lot. At this point I just want to see improvement
and staying positive if possible.
It's not the fault of these current players. They're simply not good enough.
As for Verdi, he was hired late and was able to get a few at best, mid level
players to transfer, and Battle a UMASS (A-10 and mid level) player. All
he can do now is work with what he has, and recruit MUCH better talent.
If he can, Pitt can compete in this conference. If he can't, it's gonna remain
pretty much the same. This a total rebuild, plain and simple.
I thought she was too. But she wasn't good here, and Dan Burt, who was her top assistant, has actually done better than her at Duquesne after replacing her.
That tells you how bad she turned out to be. That her replacement at Duquesne, who has done better than her there, not only wasn't a candidate to replace her or to replace Lance White, but that people would have considered him to be an awful hire if they got him instead of Verdi.
McConnell was not a great hire. She was the easy, expected hire who had never anything of note at Duquesne to actually deserve the Pitt job except for the fact she was the local hero. I don't think it was a bad hire. But it wasn't some great, can't miss hire like Vidovich or Waldrum.
Suzie was 4-2 against Pitt, with those 4 wins coming against very to historically bad Pitt teams, 3 of which had losing records and two being 0-16 ACC teams.
She never finished higher than 3rd in the A10 (which she only did once), only once won more than one game in the A10 tourney, and never got to the NCAAs. If she and the McConnell family coaching tree lived in Philly and she had coached La Salle to those same results, no one would have been ooohing and awing over that hire, nor would she would have even been a candidate for the job, to be honest.
Dan Burt has gotten Duquesne to the NCAA 2nd round, and finished 1st, 2nd and 3rd in the A10. Pre-Covid, he had a better stretch than Suszie ever did. Since Covid, he has struggled though. However, no one has ever clamored for Dan Burt to be interviewed.
It is far too early to pass judgment on Verdi after the first ACC game. Unlike the misuse of the idiom applied to other coaches, he was actually left with an absolutely barren cupboard. The program has been an absolute dumpster fire for a decade. He's going to get 5 years barring scandal or something unforseen because no one is going to flip this switch overnight unless NIL $ gets plowed into it, which is unlikely.
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I shouldn't do this, but Pitt fell behind 16th ranked Notre Dame 26-6 at the start of the game tonight.
It is now late in the 3rd quarter and Liatu King just made two foul shots to tie the game at 41.
It's on the ACC Network if anyone is interested.
It is now late in the 3rd quarter and Liatu King just made two foul shots to tie the game at 41.
It's on the ACC Network if anyone is interested.
And King just made a traditional three point play to give Pitt a 46-45 lead.
Should have rearranged my schedule so I could have gone down tonight.
Should have rearranged my schedule so I could have gone down tonight.
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48-47 Pitt at the end of the 3rd.
Notre Dame has only played seven players so far today. One of them has already fouled out. Possibly their best player has four. They have three other players with three fouls. They could start running out of players here if Pitt can keep drawing fouls.
At the end of the 3rd, Liatu King 24 points on 8-13 from the field, 8-11 from the line, and a game leading 12 rebounds.
Notre Dame has only played seven players so far today. One of them has already fouled out. Possibly their best player has four. They have three other players with three fouls. They could start running out of players here if Pitt can keep drawing fouls.
At the end of the 3rd, Liatu King 24 points on 8-13 from the field, 8-11 from the line, and a game leading 12 rebounds.
Notre Dame pulls away in the 4th by making 10 of 11 from the line. Notre Dame 71-66.
King finishes with 34 points on 13-18 from the field and 8-11 from the line, and had 13 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 blocks and 1 steal.
The end of this game was another example of a difference between men's and women's college basketball that I just don't understand. King made a layup with 38.6 seconds left in the game to cut ND's lead to five. And Pitt doesn't foul. They let ND run almost the whole 30 seconds off the clock before shooting. So yeah, they missed, and Pitt got the rebound, but by that time there were about 10 seconds left to go in the game. So you need to score five points in 10 seconds just to tie the game.
I see that all the time in the women's game, and I just don't get it. A men's coach that allowed the end of a game to play out like that would get roasted for it. But other than the PBP announcer saying that Pitt wasn't fouling (like she couldn't believe it) there will be nothing said.
King finishes with 34 points on 13-18 from the field and 8-11 from the line, and had 13 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 blocks and 1 steal.
The end of this game was another example of a difference between men's and women's college basketball that I just don't understand. King made a layup with 38.6 seconds left in the game to cut ND's lead to five. And Pitt doesn't foul. They let ND run almost the whole 30 seconds off the clock before shooting. So yeah, they missed, and Pitt got the rebound, but by that time there were about 10 seconds left to go in the game. So you need to score five points in 10 seconds just to tie the game.
I see that all the time in the women's game, and I just don't get it. A men's coach that allowed the end of a game to play out like that would get roasted for it. But other than the PBP announcer saying that Pitt wasn't fouling (like she couldn't believe it) there will be nothing said.
He might not be, but if you (meaning not necessarily you, but you as in anyone) have already come to that conclusion, or anything even close to a conclusion, you just aren't very bright.
The team won three ACC games and lost most of the players on the team in the portal after the coaching change. No one would have this team winning right now. Literally, no one.
You are not going to know if Verdi is the right guy for the job probably for at least several years. He took over a situation every bit as bad (given the transfers) that Capel did after the 0 for the ACC season.
You were disappointed losing to ND by 5? I thought they played great tonight. Played super hard. This was always going to be a tough year.
King is an awesome player
Yeah, to take a top 20 team pretty much down to the wire with this roster was certainly unexpected. I didn't go in large part because I expected that they were going to get crushed and I had some other stuff I needed to get done. If I would have thought the game would have been as close as it was I would have shifted some things around and gone.
As we've said previously, John Wooden, Nick Pitino, Coach K; for that
matter name anyone and they couldn't coach this team to wins. If we
were in the A-10 we'd be competitive. The ACC is a whole different level.
This really isn't directed to you JPF, I know you are more than aware of
Pitt's present plight and why.
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I think it fair to question one thing though…how in the world do you not foul down 5 with like 38 seconds left. They played it out and we got the ball with like 10 seconds down 5. Bub and Lowe were screaming to foul lol. Just seemed like a massive error. I understand trapping…but then at like 25 seconds you just have to foul.
C'mon Pittzit, you gotta be aware by now what's happening
with this program. Now, If you want to blame her for Coach
White, go right ahead. Given what Verdi has inherited as a
program, and it's players, it's going to take a major rebuild
in a VERY tough conference. It's gonna take time.
I talked about that in one of my other posts up above. It boggles my mind when coaches do that, and yet it seems like women's coaches do that on a pretty frequent basis. Almost like it's unsporting to foul in the women's game or something. It really makes no sense, and tonight it absolutely reduced Pitt's chance to win.
I mean a win was unlikely any way, but you've got to foul there and extend the game. You just have to.
Not only that, the last few ND possessions we sat back in a zone.
Let me repeat that, A ZONE! No double teams, no fouls. Totally
passive. I couldn't believe it.
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Ok, some other thoughts other than the game ending passive
D by our players. To be fair, ND had at least three starters out
injured. that certainly helped. But make no mistake, we played
as well as I've seen this year, King was GREAT and once again
proved she's a legit ACC talent. That's two games in a row against
a ranked opponent where she's done this.
What had the most impact in this game was Verdi's switch of the
guards out front. Marley and Perkins came out and never re entered
the game. Battle and Timmerson basically brought the team back into
it along with King of course. It's going to be interesting if Verdi makes
them the starters. I feel he should. Perkins is largely ineffective and
sometimes kinda wild in her play. Marley W? She just isn't improving,
and of course has no shot. Battle and Timmerson played so much
better tonight than did the startes. They did this for qtr's 1, 2, and 3.
This was nice improvement tonight, but what we're gonna see are
more ACC teams with better talent than what ND put on the floor
tonight. They're not the same without those injured starters.
D by our players. To be fair, ND had at least three starters out
injured. that certainly helped. But make no mistake, we played
as well as I've seen this year, King was GREAT and once again
proved she's a legit ACC talent. That's two games in a row against
a ranked opponent where she's done this.
What had the most impact in this game was Verdi's switch of the
guards out front. Marley and Perkins came out and never re entered
the game. Battle and Timmerson basically brought the team back into
it along with King of course. It's going to be interesting if Verdi makes
them the starters. I feel he should. Perkins is largely ineffective and
sometimes kinda wild in her play. Marley W? She just isn't improving,
and of course has no shot. Battle and Timmerson played so much
better tonight than did the startes. They did this for qtr's 1, 2, and 3.
This was nice improvement tonight, but what we're gonna see are
more ACC teams with better talent than what ND put on the floor
tonight. They're not the same without those injured starters.
Okay, maybe we can win a game in the ACC. That is, if Liatu doesn’t get totally worn out!
So Liatu scored 34. The other 4 starters scored a total of 5 points. Huh?
The bench scored 27 points. What Liatu is doing is amazing.
Go Pitt.
So Liatu scored 34. The other 4 starters scored a total of 5 points. Huh?
The bench scored 27 points. What Liatu is doing is amazing.
Go Pitt.
