WR talk, Bub, Underwood

[4upmc]

The season has sucked. PN is ultimately responsible. No he won’t be fired. So unless anyone here has multi millions to get rid of the HC it’s dumb to continue with fire the HC posts. Yes our OC needs fired. Yes Powell and special teams have sucked. But this is where we are so I had several FB related areas I wanted to talk about. Too many for one post as the opening is long enough lol.

Looking towards next year, I’ll start with WR talk. And post some more this later or this week.

Bub- kind of funny how the last 2 games with a legit (far from a star, but not horrible like PJ) D1 QB has lead the team in catches, yards and receiving TD’s. No I didn’t say he way Fitzgerald, or even Wayne but he’s a talented guy who can take the top off the D. This O lacks explosion and he’s one of the few who can provide it. I hope he’s back next year.

Johnson will continue to develop and be really good. Mumpfield is a nice possession WR. Reynolds is a big target with good hands. And the other 3 true frosh should develop. PN said Polk has big upside. Good job by our WR coach. This is a position that could be real good (not great) with a legit OC.

Thoughts?

 

[Parkview57]

Good job by our WR coach.

Not really, IMHO

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

The season has sucked. PN is ultimately responsible. No he won’t be fired. So unless anyone here has multi millions to get rid of the HC it’s dumb to continue with fire the HC posts. Yes our OC needs fired. Yes Powell and special teams have sucked. But this is where we are so I had several FB related areas I wanted to talk about. Too many for one post as the opening is long enough lol.

Looking towards next year, I’ll start with WR talk. And post some more this later or this week.

Bub- kind of funny how the last 2 games with a legit (far from a star, but not horrible like PJ) D1 QB has lead the team in catches, yards and receiving TD’s. No I didn’t say he way Fitzgerald, or even Wayne but he’s a talented guy who can take the top off the D. This O lacks explosion and he’s one of the few who can provide it. I hope he’s back next year.

Johnson will continue to develop and be really good. Mumpfield is a nice possession WR. Reynolds is a big target with good hands. And the other 3 true frosh should develop. PN said Polk has big upside. Good job by our WR coach. This is a position that could be real good (not great) with a legit OC.

Thoughts?

Means is a #3 on a good team. And for a lot of good teams, he wouldn't even play. The only thing to "look forward to" is that maybe Villeaux could turn into a legit good QB. Right now, he is average to below average but he's started 3 college games. And average to below average is light years better than Jurkovec. Villeaux has shown potential

 

[4upmc]

Means for a lot of good teams, he wouldn't even play.

Yet he started for a top 25 team last year and came through big in the UCLA win. You don’t think Johnson has really nice upside?

 

[TD_6082]

The season has sucked. PN is ultimately responsible. No he won’t be fired. So unless anyone here has multi millions to get rid of the HC it’s dumb to continue with fire the HC posts. Yes our OC needs fired. Yes Powell and special teams have sucked. But this is where we are so I had several FB related areas I wanted to talk about. Too many for one post as the opening is long enough lol.

Looking towards next year, I’ll start with WR talk. And post some more this later or this week.

Bub- kind of funny how the last 2 games with a legit (far from a star, but not horrible like PJ) D1 QB has lead the team in catches, yards and receiving TD’s. No I didn’t say he way Fitzgerald, or even Wayne but he’s a talented guy who can take the top off the D. This O lacks explosion and he’s one of the few who can provide it. I hope he’s back next year.

Johnson will continue to develop and be really good. Mumpfield is a nice possession WR. Reynolds is a big target with good hands. And the other 3 true frosh should develop. PN said Polk has big upside. Good job by our WR coach. This is a position that could be real good (not great) with a legit OC.

Thoughts?

Does Means have another year of eligibility?

Agree with you on the receivers.

At OC, I think they have to let the season play out. If CV looks like he has the chance to be a really good QB and the offense is starting to click, I don't think a change would necessarily the best way to go.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Yet he started for a top 25 team last year and came through big in the UCLA win. You don’t think Johnson has really nice upside?

Johnson does have potential. He's the only P5 WR we've recruited out of HS since Addison

 

[4upmc]

Does Means have another year of eligibility?

Agree with you on the receivers.

At OC, I think they have to let the season play out. If CV looks like he has the chance to be a really good QB and the offense is starting to click, I don't think a change would necessarily the best way to go.

Yes Bub has the covid year.

IMO CVs play doesn’t have much to do with OC. He has a big arm and super quick release, just needs more experience which he will get the rest of the year. On the first and last drive we opened up the O and went down field where CV has excelled. But a legit OC would have given him more chances in between.

 

[TD_6082]

Yet he started for a top 25 team last year and came through big in the UCLA win. You don’t think Johnson has really nice upside?

That was another garbage SMF take. Means signed with decent SEC program. They wanted him as a DB and he wanted to be a receiver. He was very raw last year and has come a long way. That's a testament to coaching and a lot of hard work by Bub. He's been a pleasant surprise this year. Hope he continues to improve.

 

[4upmc]

Johnson does have potential. He's the only P5 WR we've recruited out of HS since Addison

Glad at least you agree on Johnson lol. You do realize Wayne is on an NFL practice squad and had a 1000 yd year last year… we got him out of high school, right?

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Glad at least you agree on Johnson lol. You do realize Wayne is on an NFL practice squad and had a 1000 yd year last year… we got him out of high school, right?

Wayne - 2019
Addison - 2020

 

[MajorMajors]

Seems like the WR Coach can recruit some, but our WRs continue to do a poor job of adjusting to the ball and high-pointing the ball, IMHO.

We seem to have no concept that on an under-thrown ball the WR should slow down and go up strong - let the DB run into you for the penalty. We seem to just keep running…. And instead of high-pointing the ball, we try to make a basket catch. Maddening.

And being 6-2 and supposedly running a 4.4, Bub should be a monster WR. Nice to see him get it going some…

Go Pitt.

 

[4upmc]

Bub was always known as an athlete but not a pure FB player. I mainly like how we have seen improvement the past 2 games with a legit QB. No doubt he has areas to improve on. But him coming back next year would be a plus because all we have to look forward to is next year…need some hope lol

 

[NCPitt]

Johnson does have potential. He's the only P5 WR we've recruited out of HS since Addison

Guess the UNLV guy failed here.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Glad at least you agree on Johnson lol. You do realize Wayne is on an NFL practice squad and had a 1000 yd year last year… we got him out of high school, right?

That was before Addison

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Guess the UNLV guy failed here.

Position coaches recruit territories, not positions. Not sure what his territory was.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

The problem isn't Bub, it's Bub as a #1. More than adequate #2, but you'd like to have someone else.

Kenny J looks like a keeper. Mump and Reynolds are 3rd and 4th type guys.

Gotta hope the young guys improve and step up. Not a position we're going to bring in a stud from the portal.

 

[4upmc]

The problem isn't Bub, it's Bub as a #1. More than adequate #2, but you'd like to have someone else.

Kenny J looks like a keeper. Mump and Reynolds are 3rd and 4th type guys.

Gotta hope the young guys improve and step up. Not a position we're going to bring in a stud from the portal.

I think Johnson can develop into a #1. PN implied injuries held Polk back as he expected him to play, seems high on him.

Bub may not be a star, I just don’t get how so many really hated the guy with the… bench him he’s a bum, etc. With a real QB he’s showing nice ability. Not a star but is a deep threat.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

I think we're being way too harsh on our receivers based on a few games with Jurkovec. None are like Addison/Boyd level... obviously. None are even Thrash from Louisville. But Means, Mumpfield, and Johnson are all plus players. Reynolds looks solid. Bartholomew is a good receiving option. There are multiple guys to throw to, which is more than can be said for some other Narduzzi receiving corps. It's just that none are first or second team all conference caliber.

 

[cashisking884]

I think Johnson can develop into a #1. PN implied injuries held Polk back as he expected him to play, seems high on him.

Bub may not be a star, I just don’t get how so many really hated the guy with the… bench him he’s a bum, etc. With a real QB he’s showing nice ability. Not a star but is a deep threat.

Johnson’s ceiling is more a few catches a game, take the top of the defense type guy. Like Harrell from Lville a couple of years ago when he didn’t have a ton of catches, but all seemed to go for huge TDs.

But he’s not a number 1.

 

[cashisking884]

I think we're being way too harsh on our receivers based on a few games with Jurkovec. None are like Addison/Boyd level... obviously. None are even Thrash from Louisville. But Means, Mumpfield, and Johnson are all plus players. Reynolds looks solid. Bartholomew is a good receiving option. There are multiple guys to throw to, which is more than can be said for some other Narduzzi receiving corps. It's just that none are first or second team all conference caliber.

Yep. It’s a solid group. But none would take the job of the average P5 team’s receiver if you randomly drew that team from a hat.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Johnson’s ceiling is more a few catches a game, take the top of the defense type guy. Like Harrell from Lville a couple of years ago when he didn’t have a ton of catches, but all seemed to go for huge TDs.

But he’s not a number 1.

I agree with that. Well, at least with him not being a great number one; he might end up being the number one on this team. But those really special ones stick out right away. He looks like he can be really good, but I'm not seeing that special fast twitchy element.

I actually think Mumpfield is the closest thing we have to having a #1 skillset, but it's kind of a watered down variety of it.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I think we're being way too harsh on our receivers based on a few games with Jurkovec. None are like Addison/Boyd level... obviously. None are even Thrash from Louisville. But Means, Mumpfield, and Johnson are all plus players. Reynolds looks solid. Bartholomew is a good receiving option. There are multiple guys to throw to, which is more than can be said for some other Narduzzi receiving corps. It's just that none are first or second team all conference caliber.

They arent plus players. They are average to below average ACC starting WRs. Johnson has potential though

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

They arent plus players. They are average to below average ACC starting WRs. Johnson has potential though

You're overvaluing what an average ACC starter is.

 

[FireballZ]

I think Johnson can develop into a #1. PN implied injuries held Polk back as he expected him to play, seems high on him.

Bub may not be a star, I just don’t get how so many really hated the guy with the… bench him he’s a bum, etc. With a real QB he’s showing nice ability. Not a star but is a deep threat.

Seems to give up on some balls and make poor route reads quite often. No doubt the talent is there.

 

[NCPitt]

Position coaches recruit territories, not positions. Not sure what his territory was.

What territory did the UNLV guy recruit and who did he bring in (at any position)?

Dod you think that the position has anything to do with recruiting his position at all?

 

[Jeffburgh]

I was was high on Means coming into this season. It all looks different if CB had started from game one.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

I was was high on Means coming into this season. It all looks different if CB had started from game one.

Yep. He's even made some pretty nice contested catches on outs. People have a perception about him based on the first few games with Jugs Machine Jurkovec, and it's a shame. I thought the Weah comparison was pretty good. He has this feel where he's not exactly a well-rounded complete receiver or anything, but he's certainly an effective college receiver... which is all that matters at this level.

 

[JohnnyGossamer]

The problem isn't Bub, it's Bub as a #1. More than adequate #2, but you'd like to have someone else.

Kenny J looks like a keeper. Mump and Reynolds are 3rd and 4th type guys.

Gotta hope the young guys improve and step up. Not a position we're going to bring in a stud from the portal.

I'd expect next season to be WR1 Johnson, WR2 Mumpfield, WR3 Means... Then, the rest (Reynolds, the 3 other FR) battle it out for 4, 5, 6, etc. I like what Pitt has returning for sure.

 

[TD_6082]

I'd expect next season to be WR1 Johnson, WR2 Mumpfield, WR3 Means... Then, the rest (Reynolds, the 3 other FR) battle it out for 4, 5, 6, etc. I like what Pitt has returning for sure.

Solid group returning. Really need a big time back and the offense can be very good next year, if CV keeps progressing.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Solid group returning. Really need a big time back and the offense can be very good next year, if CV keeps progressing.

I'm much less bullish on the offense as a whole. There is just no fluidity right now, and the line is bad... real bad. I also need to see more from CV before I'm totally convinced he is the guy. He looks good right now because of the act he followed.

 

[TD_6082]

I'm much less bullish on the offense as a whole. There is just no fluidity right now, and the line is bad... real bad. I also need to see more from CV before I'm totally convinced he is the guy. He looks good right now because of the act he followed.

They're also doing a lot to protect him. He has a long way to go. He's going to have some games where he looks like trash and have his confidence rattled. That's part of it.

He has some obvious talent though. I think he has a fairly high upside.

I'm not as down on the OL. I think they are an average group.

 

[cashisking884]

I'm much less bullish on the offense as a whole. There is just no fluidity right now, and the line is bad... real bad. I also need to see more from CV before I'm totally convinced he is the guy. He looks good right now because of the act he followed.

It’s a lot of just average units.

There’s no reason to think the offense can be “very good.”

If it can just be average, that would be huge.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

They're also doing a lot to protect him. He has a long way to go. He's going to have some games where he looks like trash and have his confidence rattled. That's part of it.

He has some obvious talent though. I think he has a fairly high upside.

I'm not as down on the OL. I think they are an average group.

I guess it depends on which OL we're talking about - this year's or next. Because they're bad currently. Ever watch Collier try to pull or Zubovic/Baer try to get to the next level? It's painful.

If we assume they all get better and then Jacoby returns and plays well next year (will also need to hit on at least one transfer), then there is hope they can be average next season. I assume Goncalves is gone, but we'll see.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

It’s a lot of just average units.

There’s no reason to think the offense can be “very good.”

If it can just be average, that would be huge.

Yeah, I don't see where anyone can say the offense looks like it will be good next season. It's usually not been good under Narduzzi, and that's been our biggest detriment when it comes to winning more games. CV is about what Slovis was last season, give or take. We'll see if he improves, and it's fair to give him time... but I'm not seeing some great commander of the offense or anything.

 

[cashisking884]

Yeah, I don't see where anyone can say the offense looks like it will be good next season. It's usually not been good under Narduzzi, and that's been our biggest detriment when it comes to winning more games. CV is about what Slovis was last season, give or take. We'll see if he improves, and it's fair to give him time... but I'm not seeing some great commander of the offense or anything.

Or any unit or player that keeps an opposing DC up at night.

It’s an offense that ranks 87 in F+.
That’s either the bottom tier or very bad and as close as you can get to the bottom tier without being in it.

Passing success rate is 128.
Quality drives is 127.
Havoc rate allowed is 86.

The rushing success rate is 45 and the line yards are 50. That average-ish is the only thing stopping the offense from being Kent State and Akron level bad offensively.

To go to “very good,” the tier just below elite, in one off-season, would be the greatest offensive turnaround since Leach took over Oklahoma’s option offense in 1999 and made it one of the best offenses in college football with a JUCO QB and DBs playing WR.

And offensively, FCJ wasn’t worthy of even attending Leach’s funeral.

 

[imrealangry]

I'm not as down on the OL. I think they are an average group.

It feels like multiple times a game, we have guys who forget how to play O Line. They are a bad unit right now.

It's common for both of these tackles to get beat out of their stance. They either totally whiff or just get their face crossed immediately.

They don't get a lot of push either, they tend to stand straight up out of their stance. Low man wins is one of the first things you learn as a football player.

They don't pick up blitzes well at all. It caused CV to have an easy TD throw rushed against WF, and was thrown a little too far. The 4th down stop Cincy had against us to end the game was by an unblocked blitzer.

Also, shoutout to Karter Johnson for being consistently one of the worst blockers on this offense, failing to perform that kick out block on a pull (arguably the most important block) on our staple run play.

 

[TD_6082]

It feels like multiple times a game, we have guys who forget how to play O Line. They are a bad unit right now.

It's common for both of these tackles to get beat out of their stance. They either totally whiff or just get their face crossed immediately.

They don't get a lot of push either, they tend to stand straight up out of their stance. Low man wins is one of the first things you learn as a football player.

They don't pick up blitzes well at all. It caused CV to have an easy TD throw rushed against WF, and was thrown a little too far. The 4th down stop Cincy had against us to end the game was by an unblocked blitzer.

Also, shoutout to Karter Johnson for being consistently one of the worst blockers on this offense, failing to perform that kick out block on a pull (arguably the most important block) on our staple run play.

All valid points, but I think they have played much better of late than how they played vs Cincinnati. They were atrocious vs UC. That was the first P5 game of the year though.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

What territory did the UNLV guy recruit and who did he bring in (at any position)?

Good question. I dont know. Maybe someone else does.

 

[imrealangry]

All valid points, but I think they have played much better of late than how they played vs Cincinnati. They were atrocious vs UC. That was the first P5 game of the year though.

A majority of these observations came from when I rewatched the Wake game. There's really not one player on the entire O-line that isn't at fault this year. More often than not, someone is messing up.

 

[NCPitt]

Good question. I dont know. Maybe someone else does.

So you basically invented your previous answer.