A tiny little private school, mind you. Just saying that anybody who thinks that a big semi-public school like Pitt can't "afford" a new football stadium is kidding themselves. Pitt can easily afford to buy up some buildlings, knock them down, and build a football stadium. Its not a matter of finances, its a matter of what the universities priorities are. Maybe things will change with Gallagher but we're not going to be fully "all in" on this football thing until we can watch the Panthers in a 45,000-50,000 seat stadium in Oakland.
Robert Morris is raising $50 million to build a new basketball arena
- Thread starter Sean Miller Fan
- Start date
Whoa! How about the next Iona or Valparaiso? That's more like it and would be a major step up to "mid-major" status.
"A tiny little private school, mind you. Just saying that anybody who
thinks that a big semi-public school like Pitt can't "afford" a new
football stadium is kidding themselves."
Affordability, maybe. Room for facility? Nowhere on campus. And, if I am correct about that, therein lies the rub.
thinks that a big semi-public school like Pitt can't "afford" a new
football stadium is kidding themselves."
Affordability, maybe. Room for facility? Nowhere on campus. And, if I am correct about that, therein lies the rub.
Like the enthusiasm, but there will never be a new stadium in Oakland. At least in our lifetime. Without the acquisition of considerable real estate which is above and beyond the cost of the stadium, this is dead in the water. And that doesn't include all the infrastructure changes that would entail. $50 Million? Pfffffft. That's a drop in the bucket. Pitt has greater needs than an on campus stadium at this time.
If a little commuter school like Bobby Mo can raise $50 million for basketball, what do you think Pitt is capable of raising for FOOTBALL??? That's my point.
Yea, I know there's no land. We all know that. But a fundraising campaign of several hundred million dollars can buy up a lot of buildings, knock them down, and go a long way towards building a stadium.
Good for them.
Good for Pittsburgh too - wouldn't mind seeing the Dukes come back and a meaningful Steel Bowl resurrected for Ball.
I'd forget about a new football stadium in Oakland. Just win at Heinz - you'd be surprised how the carping about an on campus stadium will disappear.
Good for Pittsburgh too - wouldn't mind seeing the Dukes come back and a meaningful Steel Bowl resurrected for Ball.
I'd forget about a new football stadium in Oakland. Just win at Heinz - you'd be surprised how the carping about an on campus stadium will disappear.
Wait a second. You mean Pitt wouldn't allow the facility to be used for:
- high school football games
- concerts
- international soccer friendlies
- intramurals
- Stanley Cup/World Cup game watches
- students to use on an everyday basis (pick-up football or soccer games)
The facility would be used 365 days per year. So, there's that.
Pitt would be better off dumping that money into the FB program in other ways. Think about it if you are going to spend 500 million dollars you could pay a HC 8 to 10 million a year and get the best one in the business and get more wins than any stadium will get you. I would argue you would also increase revenue more than a stadium will.
By the same token, wouldn't it make more sense for Robert Morris to offer John Calipari $10 million/year for 5 years to come home and lead his hometown team to the Final Four instead of spending it on a new arena? A Final Four or 2 at RMU would change that university forever even post-Calipari.
Key word in your diatribe is FUNDRAISER. It's not like they're pulling it from their savings account.
You want that silly thing built? Get said fundraiser started. I can tell you I won't send a dime.
Frankly, the money would be better served making the athletic department fully funded and self sufficient.
You want that silly thing built? Get said fundraiser started. I can tell you I won't send a dime.
Frankly, the money would be better served making the athletic department fully funded and self sufficient.
congrats on bobby U. BB arena I assume is multi purpose and includes a ice surface as well for their hockey program. Pitt doesn't need a football only structure for 400 to 500 million. Pitt has a stadium that is fine and winning will create the atmosphere that is better than Pitt stadium ever was. Pitt goes 10-2 and Heinz is as good or better than many college stadiums. It is all about PSU envy and their erector set. Who cares.
Ding, ding......
We have a winner. If Pitt started a capital campaign for a football stadium, over any glaring academic needs or like Ether just wrote, fully funding the football scholarships, would be the day I stop donaitng. The good news is Gallagher thinks this is an insane idea also.
Re: Ding, ding......
What are they seeing that Pitt isn't? Those schools have spent a lot of money. It is likely more difficult to pull what they did off in Oakland, but there is obviously a point where the cost of the stadium isn't so astronomical that universities see benefits in going ahead with the project, i.e. they see it as a good investment even though I'm sure they have similar academic needs to Pitt.
I'm on the Heinz Field side just because I see no tangible evidence that Heinz Field holds us back. I grew up spending my falls at Pitt Stadium. The Heinz Field atmosphere when we've been good (VT in 2003, ND in Wanny's first game and again two years ago) was better than anything I ever experienced at Pitt Stadium.
I'm actually on the side that thinks building a stadium in Oakland should not be a top priority. That being said, a lot of schools similar to Pitt (Minnesota, Baylor as examples) have seen value in building an on-campus stadium regardless of how the facility is used the rest of the year.
What are they seeing that Pitt isn't? Those schools have spent a lot of money. It is likely more difficult to pull what they did off in Oakland, but there is obviously a point where the cost of the stadium isn't so astronomical that universities see benefits in going ahead with the project, i.e. they see it as a good investment even though I'm sure they have similar academic needs to Pitt.
I'm on the Heinz Field side just because I see no tangible evidence that Heinz Field holds us back. I grew up spending my falls at Pitt Stadium. The Heinz Field atmosphere when we've been good (VT in 2003, ND in Wanny's first game and again two years ago) was better than anything I ever experienced at Pitt Stadium.
Re: Ding, ding......
1. More research laboratory space is urgently needed including major renovations to current facilities.
2. Campus utility and information technology infrastructure is woefully inadequate and must be significantly upgraded.
3. Major science buildings need modernized - Benedum, Clapp, Langley, Crawford, Chevron, etc.
4. Allen, Thaw, Salk and Victoria Halls also need significant renovations.
Much of Pitt's infrastructure is very old. Conversely much has been done since 1987. However, if Pitt is to continue its ascension as a world class university, facilities must be constantly upgraded. At the end of the day, Pitt is about academics. The past administration proved their committement to athletics building the Pete and other facilities that placed Pitt in a position to be attractive to the ACC. Right now, their attention for any capital campaigns must focus solely on academic, student and research needs.
Sure!
1. More research laboratory space is urgently needed including major renovations to current facilities.
2. Campus utility and information technology infrastructure is woefully inadequate and must be significantly upgraded.
3. Major science buildings need modernized - Benedum, Clapp, Langley, Crawford, Chevron, etc.
4. Allen, Thaw, Salk and Victoria Halls also need significant renovations.
Much of Pitt's infrastructure is very old. Conversely much has been done since 1987. However, if Pitt is to continue its ascension as a world class university, facilities must be constantly upgraded. At the end of the day, Pitt is about academics. The past administration proved their committement to athletics building the Pete and other facilities that placed Pitt in a position to be attractive to the ACC. Right now, their attention for any capital campaigns must focus solely on academic, student and research needs.
Raising money for a new stadium does not mean fewer dollars for academics.
Especially at Pitt, where a big part of their academic donations come from non profit and corporate entities. If this were a big issue, then no school.would build a new stadium, ever.
Especially at Pitt, where a big part of their academic donations come from non profit and corporate entities. If this were a big issue, then no school.would build a new stadium, ever.
Re: Ding, ding......
I'd also say that Pitt could better use that money by hiring full time faculty and minimizing the number of adjunct faculty used. It's better for the faculty and provides a better education for the students as well.
A good list, albeit a bit skewed towards the STEM folk
I'd also say that Pitt could better use that money by hiring full time faculty and minimizing the number of adjunct faculty used. It's better for the faculty and provides a better education for the students as well.
It has nothing to do with being pretentious, just some frickin common sense.
Never mind the academic side, the athletic side has far more pressing needs than another stadium. It's just another dog and pony show
Never mind the academic side, the athletic side has far more pressing needs than another stadium. It's just another dog and pony show
Re: Ding, ding......
However, I don't know if Pitt needs much additional lab space at this time. Federal support for R&D is at epically low levels and it doesn't look to improve. Another major source of health science funding is from UPMC, and current level of support is tenuous as well with all the health care pressures facing the system. I don't think investing in major new lab facilities (like a BST3) makes that much sense because growth and current rates of R&D funding can't be guaranteed. Instead, it likely makes more sense to rent needed lab space so you can add and subtract space as needed. Clapp is currently being rennovated. Most of Langley was recently rennovated. Crawford could use upgrades. Chevron, Allen, Benedum, Salk, and Parran have had major renovation recent and ongoing rennovations. Maintaining and rennovating existing space and renting additional space as need is probably the way to go, and I think that is what you are seeing. All labs, classrooms, and buildings are all rotating through constant renovation at all healthy institutions. Finding ways to offset lost federal R&D funding... now that is a challenge.
I'd say the most glaring academic need is financial aid to offset one of the nation's highest public tuition rates and one of the nation's lowest rates of public financial support. There are tremendous fiscal challenges, and that is why Pitt has recently shut down 100+ year old graduate programs in the humanities and the Titusville campus is hanging on by a thread. Just maintaining the gains it has made over the past 20 years is a major challenge because it is competing against much stronger peers than it was 20 years ago.
However, I don't know if Pitt needs much additional lab space at this time. Federal support for R&D is at epically low levels and it doesn't look to improve. Another major source of health science funding is from UPMC, and current level of support is tenuous as well with all the health care pressures facing the system. I don't think investing in major new lab facilities (like a BST3) makes that much sense because growth and current rates of R&D funding can't be guaranteed. Instead, it likely makes more sense to rent needed lab space so you can add and subtract space as needed. Clapp is currently being rennovated. Most of Langley was recently rennovated. Crawford could use upgrades. Chevron, Allen, Benedum, Salk, and Parran have had major renovation recent and ongoing rennovations. Maintaining and rennovating existing space and renting additional space as need is probably the way to go, and I think that is what you are seeing. All labs, classrooms, and buildings are all rotating through constant renovation at all healthy institutions. Finding ways to offset lost federal R&D funding... now that is a challenge.
For all of you nitwits who think building a stadium means you'd only use it six or seven times a year, you truly are nitwits, and if Pitt built a stadium that was just to be used six or seven times a year then Pitt would be nitwits.
UPitt, have you been to Notre Dame stadium? Big oval bowl right? Well check out the renovations that the House that Rockne Built is going to have (listed below) and tell me how many times a stadium (designed properly) will ACTUALLY be used:
Floor-by-floor plans
Floor-by-floor plans of the three new buildings that the University of Notre Dame plans to add to its 84-year-old football stadium:
Nine-story west building, focusing on student development
Levels 1 and 2: Meeting rooms, graduate and undergraduate student lounges, a dining area, student organization space and administrative offices.
Levels 3 and 4: Recreational sports and fitness facilities, allowing the Rolfs Sports Recreation Center to become the practice home for the men's and women's basketball teams.
Level 5: Career services center with more than 40 interview rooms, training rooms and conference areas, an employer lounge and advising offices. Will include premium seating for football games.
Level 6: Mechanical support.
Level 7: A 500-seat student ballroom, club seating for football and booths for telecasts of football games.
Level 8: Premium stadium seats and terraces that will look onto campus and the playing field.
Level 9: Club seating, boxes for home and visiting coaches, security booths and boxes for administrative and athletic department leaders.
Six-story south building housing the Department of Music and Sacred Music.
Level 1: Recital and rehearsal halls and the Leahy gate grand entrance to the stadium.
Level 2: A large music library, to be relocated from the Hesburgh Library, classrooms and rehearsal and tutoring rooms.
Level 3: A club/lounge.
Level 4: Department of Music offices, practice rooms and storage.
Level 5: The Sacred Music Program, offices, organ practice rooms and storage.
Level 6: Mechanical, with a scoreboard on the exterior.
Nine-story east building with offices and laboratories for the Departments of Anthropology and Psychology, currently housed in several campus buildings.
Level 1: A digital media center with a 2,000-square-foot studio and production, teaching, learning, research and scholarship facilities. A control room will support faith-based programming, such as Masses at the Basilica of the Sacred Heart, as well as athletics events, performing arts presentations and academic lectures and speeches.
Level 2: Anthropology offices, administrative space, conference and tutoring areas and research and teaching labs.
Levels 3, 4 and 5: Psychology offices, classrooms, labs, computer rooms and a student lounge.
Level 6: Mechanical support.
Level 7: Outdoor club seating for football, outdoor terraces and a large space that will double as a club area and flexible classroom.
Level 8: Outdoor club seating for football.
Level 9: Working press box, radio booths and a club area with indoor and outdoor premium seating for football.
Florida State's stadium also used EVERY FRICKIN DAY with offices, shops, classrooms, meeting rooms, etc. That doesn't even touch on what other sports teams could use the field and facility.
ND stadium expansion
UPitt, have you been to Notre Dame stadium? Big oval bowl right? Well check out the renovations that the House that Rockne Built is going to have (listed below) and tell me how many times a stadium (designed properly) will ACTUALLY be used:
Floor-by-floor plans
Floor-by-floor plans of the three new buildings that the University of Notre Dame plans to add to its 84-year-old football stadium:
Nine-story west building, focusing on student development
Levels 1 and 2: Meeting rooms, graduate and undergraduate student lounges, a dining area, student organization space and administrative offices.
Levels 3 and 4: Recreational sports and fitness facilities, allowing the Rolfs Sports Recreation Center to become the practice home for the men's and women's basketball teams.
Level 5: Career services center with more than 40 interview rooms, training rooms and conference areas, an employer lounge and advising offices. Will include premium seating for football games.
Level 6: Mechanical support.
Level 7: A 500-seat student ballroom, club seating for football and booths for telecasts of football games.
Level 8: Premium stadium seats and terraces that will look onto campus and the playing field.
Level 9: Club seating, boxes for home and visiting coaches, security booths and boxes for administrative and athletic department leaders.
Six-story south building housing the Department of Music and Sacred Music.
Level 1: Recital and rehearsal halls and the Leahy gate grand entrance to the stadium.
Level 2: A large music library, to be relocated from the Hesburgh Library, classrooms and rehearsal and tutoring rooms.
Level 3: A club/lounge.
Level 4: Department of Music offices, practice rooms and storage.
Level 5: The Sacred Music Program, offices, organ practice rooms and storage.
Level 6: Mechanical, with a scoreboard on the exterior.
Nine-story east building with offices and laboratories for the Departments of Anthropology and Psychology, currently housed in several campus buildings.
Level 1: A digital media center with a 2,000-square-foot studio and production, teaching, learning, research and scholarship facilities. A control room will support faith-based programming, such as Masses at the Basilica of the Sacred Heart, as well as athletics events, performing arts presentations and academic lectures and speeches.
Level 2: Anthropology offices, administrative space, conference and tutoring areas and research and teaching labs.
Levels 3, 4 and 5: Psychology offices, classrooms, labs, computer rooms and a student lounge.
Level 6: Mechanical support.
Level 7: Outdoor club seating for football, outdoor terraces and a large space that will double as a club area and flexible classroom.
Level 8: Outdoor club seating for football.
Level 9: Working press box, radio booths and a club area with indoor and outdoor premium seating for football.
Florida State's stadium also used EVERY FRICKIN DAY with offices, shops, classrooms, meeting rooms, etc. That doesn't even touch on what other sports teams could use the field and facility.
ND stadium expansion
So if Pitt was to build a football stadium, would you guys protest such an egregiously lowbrow misuse of funds?
Where were all the protests on this board when The Pete was built? There were obvious infrastructure needs at the time. Not to mention Pitt had a perfectly fine and historically significant basketball arena right next door. Doesn't anyone care about tradition anymore?
Maybe they should tear down The Pete and just play basketball next door and at sparkly new Consol. Imagine all the labs, classrooms, and offices that could go up on that land.
LOL
EDIT TO ADD: I was just snarking with this post, but on second thought...what would be your genuine response be if Pitt actually built a football stadium?
Paco's right about research funding, btw. Especially NIH. There's labs at Penn that aren't even being used.
This post was edited on 4/16 12:13 AM by rpost3
Where were all the protests on this board when The Pete was built? There were obvious infrastructure needs at the time. Not to mention Pitt had a perfectly fine and historically significant basketball arena right next door. Doesn't anyone care about tradition anymore?
Maybe they should tear down The Pete and just play basketball next door and at sparkly new Consol. Imagine all the labs, classrooms, and offices that could go up on that land.
LOL
EDIT TO ADD: I was just snarking with this post, but on second thought...what would be your genuine response be if Pitt actually built a football stadium?
Paco's right about research funding, btw. Especially NIH. There's labs at Penn that aren't even being used.
This post was edited on 4/16 12:13 AM by rpost3
I just think its hilarious that so many diehard Pitt football fans are so against a new on-campus stadium. They usually cite the waste of money and how it should be spent on academics. Yet, these same people post continually on a FOOTBALL board. They are so concerned with Pitt academics but I dont see them on the Pitt Biology-lair message board. Nobody is debating the recent Dean hire at the business school. You know why? By and large, NOBODY CARES!!!! People just say they do. I want Pitt academics to stay very strong but raising money, knocking down buildings, and putting up a stadium would do more for this university than all the lab space and building renovations that can be made. Its amazing people don't see the big picture.
An on-campus stadium would be the hub of campus life which would be a 365 day/year use facility. It would increase student attendance and general interest and guess who are the future's donors to academics and athletics? You guessed it, current students!!! If you increase their interest, that's an investment in the future. Some people cant see the big picture. Where does Pitt fall in the next round of expansionapocolypse? Would it hurt our chances if we had a sparkling new on-campus stadium? What happens when Washington County or Butler County build the Rooney's a JerryDome? Decisions have to be made for the long-term.
Hire a dynamic AD, raise a few hundred million dollars (if RMU can raise $50 million, Pitt has to be able to raise 4-5 times that), buy some buildings, knock them down, and build the thing. Somehow I think Pitt's academics will be fine. A new football stadium is not going to turn us into WVU academically. Geez.
This post was edited on 4/16 7:14 AM by Sean Miller Fan
UPitt:
The field would be fieldturf. You can have high school football doubleheader every Friday night of the season (5:30 and 8:30 start times). You could play some Thursday night high school football games. You could play some Saturday games when Pitt isn't there. You could have the WPIAL semifinals there to have that become a new tradition. 5 or 6 HS games? You could conceivably do 40 or 50 and even if the average attendance is 3,000 each, that's 150,000 fans coming to your stadium and spending money.
Since its fieldturf, students COULD use the field to play pick-up and for IMs. When I was at Pitt, we used to play pick-up football at Pitt Stadium all the time. Not sure why you couldn't at Slippery Rock. And it should be built to include a workout facility for students, classroom space, a restaurant, etc.
Then there's the outside the box stuff? Could the stadium attract a Major League Lacrosse team (fast growing sport)? What about an MLS franchise?
What the hell is the $ 3 billion endowment for? Certainly the endowment is for Pitt's ACADEMIC needs (infra structure, subsidizing student education etc). Instead of hoarding the endowment money simply use it for all academic needs and therefore no one needs to feel guilty if Pitt raises money for football. What's wrong with my thinking?
This is what I've been saying for many years. Pitt has one of the largest endowments in the world. The interest/dividends it pays should take care of any academic need that arises. Therefore, Pitt, in theory, should be able to use more "general fund" money on athletics than most other like schools.
The analogy I've made should be simple to understand but nobody gets it:
A relative leaves you a massive trust fund when they pass, but it mandates that the interest/dividends can only be used for certain things (food, shelter, transportation, utilities, general life expenses). So, while that trust fund will not allow you to withdrawal several million to buy a house in the Hamptons, it pays for all your other needs, so you can pay for that house in the Hamptons with your "general fund" money. Its baffling to me how people don't understand this. I will guarantee you that even in saying this, someone will again misunderstand what I'm saying and say, "SMF, you fool, the endowment money can't be spent on a football stadium." Yea, that's not what I'm saying but whatever.
This post was edited on 4/16 8:54 AM by Sean Miller Fan
It's not about academics vs athletics, though the concerns paco listed are far more pressing.
Fully endowing athletic scholarships, increasing their budgets and improving facilities so that they are competitive in the ACC, and getting the athletic department to turn a profit instead of having to borrow from the general fund - which might lessen the influence of the "eggheads" - are far, far more important goals than building a stadium on the edge of campus that some of you comically think will become a hub.
Psu envy really is the best adjective to describe you folks who keep pushing this issue.
I'd also dare say better funding are bagmen would help more also.
Edit : to answer rposts question, a whole lot of meh. I've made it clear that I think the athletic department has much better ways to spend that money. I have zero faith that it would be built and utilized properly, and the "charm" of it would go away after the first loss. I do know the first time I spend two hours looking for a parking spot and/or trying to reach the fort pitt tunnels after a game would be my last.
This post was edited on 4/16 9:55 AM by OriginalEther
This post was edited on 4/16 9:57 AM by OriginalEther
Fully endowing athletic scholarships, increasing their budgets and improving facilities so that they are competitive in the ACC, and getting the athletic department to turn a profit instead of having to borrow from the general fund - which might lessen the influence of the "eggheads" - are far, far more important goals than building a stadium on the edge of campus that some of you comically think will become a hub.
Psu envy really is the best adjective to describe you folks who keep pushing this issue.
I'd also dare say better funding are bagmen would help more also.
Edit : to answer rposts question, a whole lot of meh. I've made it clear that I think the athletic department has much better ways to spend that money. I have zero faith that it would be built and utilized properly, and the "charm" of it would go away after the first loss. I do know the first time I spend two hours looking for a parking spot and/or trying to reach the fort pitt tunnels after a game would be my last.
This post was edited on 4/16 9:55 AM by OriginalEther
This post was edited on 4/16 9:57 AM by OriginalEther
Similar threads
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
Miami's Wooga Poplar and Norchad Omier to the portal- Latest: JohnnyGossamer
-
OK, I got a solution for the NCAA on this portal free agency- Latest: pghsonj1325