Detroit Game & Other Dribbles ...

[DT_PITT]

** I’m a bit tardy on my thoughts this evening. But this game really can be summed up quite easily.

** Through the first 24 minutes, we played good offense. Through those same first 24 minutes, we played lousy defense. There’s no other way to explain it.

** For those first 24 minutes, this often looked like the same defensive team we saw last year. Titans were getting by us on the dribble with ease. It was troubling actually.

** And more than troubling, it put us at a deficit, and Dixon’s time out followed. It had to be called.

** So the Panthers took the ball, and Damon Wilson answered with a three. On the other end, the Panthers answered with a zone. And from that moment, the game was over.

** From that moment until around under 5:00 minutes to go, the Panthers went on a 37-10 run, that offered Detroit only two baskets in that period.

** As bad as the Panther defense had been to the 16:00 minute mark in second half, it was that good for the next 11 minutes.

** And Anton Wilson who torched the Panthers for 20 points in the first 20 minutes didn’t score again in the next 20.

** It looked simple for Detroit to score in the first 24 minutes. It was nearly impossible after the move to zone.

** So this begs the question … do the Panthers need zone to become their main defense? Well, one game is hardly a big enough sample size to make this claim. But this sample presented quite a difference.

** I assume Dixon will make sure the Panthers keep working on their man to man defense. And in this particular game, I don’t fault the Dixon for holding out so long to see if the man defense would come around. But again, our difference in defense between man and zone was fairly hard to fathom.

** Maybe the bigger question should be however, is our offense as good as it seemed to be today. Let’s use some efficiency stats for perspective. 46 points on 36 first half possessions. 49 points on 41 second half possessions. Both solid, but not very high level numbers.

** What’s most interesting is that the Panthers played a game with 77 possessions. I can’t imagine the last time that happened. It may have been before Dixon was Head Coach.

** As for individuals, we all must acknowledge how much Ryan Luther stuck out. Maybe the strategy going forward will always be to play which of our three headed center is at his best. That was Ryan today, and it wasn’t close.

** It’s worth noting that when the Panthers played zone, it was actually Mike who played the middle spot in the zone when Ryan was alongside him. But that matters little, I suppose.

** What may matter more is that Rafel Maia seems to be rounding into form a bit, especially in a game when Alonzo didn’t seem to be in step.

** Once again, Mike wasn’t just in step, but a step ahead. I can’t wait to see him against ACC competition.

** For the first time this year, Jamel looked the part of the slick and svelte three we hope he can be.

** I’m having a hard time deciding who I like better … Milligan or Wilson. Maybe Dixon agreed, actually playing Robinson at the two for a moment or two.

** I’m still not at the point where I can say I’m excited about this team. They have much more to prove to me to make that claim.

** But it’s pretty easy for me to claim one thing … they are quite a bit more intriguing than any Dixon team for some time.

** Maybe ever.

 

[DT_PITT]

One other thought ...

As much as we may be lamenting the rule changes against grabbing and bumping, etc. as detrimental to the Panthers defense, we might need to begin to acknowledge how much it helping our offense.

Based on the 77 possessions, the Panthers are playing faster.

But they aren't playing any differently, really. They are still executing to get the same good shots they have always worked to get in a Dixon offense. But these good shots seem to be coming more easily and certainly more quickly.

Maybe the rule changes will most benefit a high execution based offense like Dixon's.

 

[PittPoker]

Surprised you didn't mention Jeter, whom I thought was key in the 2nd half offensively when we broke away.

Also would like your thoughts on Robinson during the game. He wasn't great offensively when it seemed everyone else was and just seemed slow out there. Am I being too harsh? I guess Joe in another thread thought his defense was fine but I don't know, his performance against Detroit kinda looked like many of his performances his whole 3+ years, nothing great.

 

[RA time]

Luther was in the middle and not young. Luther went to the wing when Maia was in the game.

 

[Ski11585]

Just want to say, it's good to have the dribbles back.

 

[KiwiJeff]

Surprised you didn't mention Jeter, whom I thought was key in the 2nd half offensively when we broke away.

Also would like your thoughts on Robinson during the game. He wasn't great offensively when it seemed everyone else was and just seemed slow out there. Am I being too harsh? I guess Joe in another thread thought his defense was fine but I don't know, his performance against Detroit kinda looked like many of his performances his whole 3+ years, nothing great.

I don't think he seemed that slow, and he really forced the offense to be faster with a lot of long down court passes.

 

[PittMan 72]

Clearly the zone changed the game, DT. Mentioned to my wife after the first 3 or 4 defensive possessions in the zone that it looked like the Titans were going to have problems with it. The overall length and especially the length at the top and at the wings was a factor. So was the ability to cut off the ball handler and help deter all the 1 on 1 stuff and drive and kick out stuff that Detroit was using so effectively earlier.

Jamie talked about it on the radio after the game and said this team WILL play more zone than some previous ones. A big key will be to see how they can defensive rebound out of the zone against bigger, stronger and better teams, IMO .

Thing that impressed me a lot about Maia was how quickly he was able to outlet the ball after defensive rebounds. Very decisive and quick to hit the outlet man so the ball was in the hands of a faster player right away to trigger transition. Considering how little time he's really had to work with this team that was good to see.

This could be a very interesting team to watch evolve. To see how all of the parts mesh and all the different combos develop. The m-2-m D really needs to get much better, no doubt. Can't allow guys to get into the lane and to the rim so easily, or to collpase the D and then kick out for good looks from 3.

 

[whirlybird optio]

Surprised you didn't mention Jeter, whom I thought was key in the 2nd half offensively when we broke away.

Also would like your thoughts on Robinson during the game. He wasn't great offensively when it seemed everyone else was and just seemed slow out there. Am I being too harsh? I guess Joe in another thread thought his defense was fine but I don't know, his performance against Detroit kinda looked like many of his performances his whole 3+ years, nothing great.

It certainly wasn't James's best game, but he's been pretty good so far this season. I thought he was very good against Gonzaga. He was 2-9 from the floor though which isn't good, although at least he is attempting shots and not being so passive. I like that he looks to get the ball up the court quicker too.

Of all the guards, I thought Chris jones had the best game. Good defense, great hustle, nice stat line. The group of juniors was excellent tonight, and when you have guys, experienced players, like jones and Jeter off the bench it is a major luxury.

The backcourt rotation is gonna be tough. I assume Sterling Smith's minutes may get cut, but he did some good things too. He'll rebound, he took some charges, he hit I think the only shot he took. I see why Jamie likes him, but with Wilson, Milligan, jones, and even cam Johnson around...very tricky for Dixon to get the PT right.

 

[Piranha]

Surprised you didn't mention Jeter, whom I thought was key in the 2nd half offensively when we broke away.

Also would like your thoughts on Robinson during the game. He wasn't great offensively when it seemed everyone else was and just seemed slow out there. Am I being too harsh? I guess Joe in another thread thought his defense was fine but I don't know, his performance against Detroit kinda looked like many of his performances his whole 3+ years, nothing great.

I said the same thing about Jeter. He played very well on both ends of the court in the 2nd half. Good point on him. I disagree on Robinson. He played a solid game. I thought he ran the break well when he had a chance and played solid defense.

 

[PittPoker]

It certainly wasn't James's best game, but he's been pretty good so far this season. I thought he was very good against Gonzaga. He was 2-9 from the floor though which isn't good, although at least he is attempting shots and not being so passive. I like that he looks to get the ball up the court quicker too.

Of all the guards, I thought Chris jones had the best game. Good defense, great hustle, nice stat line. The group of juniors was excellent tonight, and when you have guys, experienced players, like jones and Jeter off the bench it is a major luxury.

The backcourt rotation is gonna be tough. I assume Sterling Smith's minutes may get cut, but he did some good things too. He'll rebound, he took some charges, he hit I think the only shot he took. I see why Jamie likes him, but with Wilson, Milligan, jones, and even cam Johnson around...very tricky for Dixon to get the PT right.

Agree about Jones, played well when he entered the game.

 

[PittPoker]

I said the same thing about Jeter. He played very well on both ends of the court in the 2nd half. Good point on him. I disagree on Robinson. He played a solid game. I thought he ran the break well when he had a chance and played solid defense.

Obviously the zone defense was key and so was Jeter - for a 2-3 minute stretch in the 2nd half he really took over offensively and was nice to see.

 

[DT_PITT]

Luther was in the middle and not young. Luther went to the wing when Maia was in the game.

There were at least 2 tips where Luther was on the wing and Young in the middle.

 

[Harve74]

One other thought ...

As much as we may be lamenting the rule changes against grabbing and bumping, etc. as detrimental to the Panthers defense, we might need to begin to acknowledge how much it helping our offense.

Based on the 77 possessions, the Panthers are playing faster.

But they aren't playing any differently, really. They are still executing to get the same good shots they have always worked to get in a Dixon offense. But these good shots seem to be coming more easily and certainly more quickly.

Maybe the rule changes will most benefit a high execution based offense like Dixon's.

Some good points.

Ths is a deep team with a ton of options. Unfortunately good M2M defense may not be one of them. There is a good amount of offensive firepower. While I don't expect Luther to score 15 every night, we do have a group of 6-7- 6-9 guys who are double-double threats every night. Optimizing to get the most out of them by mixing and matching and getting production from the backcourt is a nice problem for Jamie to have.

Your point on the new defenive rules abd Dixon's high execution offense is VERY interesting. As Many of us, particularly including you expected, Dixon's system with veteran players should have been effective this year anyway and eliminating hand checks and physicl defense just opens things up further.

As a voice of caution, we have yet to see what the rule enforcement will do to us against truly talented teams. They may simply be able to outscore us.

 

[DT_PITT]

As a voice of caution, we have yet to see what the rule enforcement will do to us against truly talented teams. They may simply be able to outscore us.

Indeed.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Indeed.

Harve--IMHO, we will mostly play zone against these teams using a really long lineup on the floor to eliminate their advantage at driving to the hoop. We have the size and depth to do so. Can zone with 6-9, 6-9, 6-8, 6-7, 6-5 lineup, if needed.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

IMHO, if the rules continue to be enforced as is it won't be long before pure man-to-man defense will all but disappear from college basketball in favor of a variety of zones and man defenses with zone principles. Some of these may include a return of the box and one and triangle and two to stop teams with 1 or 2 3-poiint shooters while still clogging the paint against the dribble drive.

Maybe Pitt will bring back the Amoeba, LOL.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

** I’m a bit tardy on my thoughts this evening. But this game really can be summed up quite easily.

** Through the first 24 minutes, we played good offense. Through those same first 24 minutes, we played lousy defense. There’s no other way to explain it.

** For those first 24 minutes, this often looked like the same defensive team we saw last year. Titans were getting by us on the dribble with ease. It was troubling actually.

** And more than troubling, it put us at a deficit, and Dixon’s time out followed. It had to be called.

** So the Panthers took the ball, and Damon Wilson answered with a three. On the other end, the Panthers answered with a zone. And from that moment, the game was over.

** From that moment until around under 5:00 minutes to go, the Panthers went on a 37-10 run, that offered Detroit only two baskets in that period.

** As bad as the Panther defense had been to the 16:00 minute mark in second half, it was that good for the next 11 minutes.

** And Anton Wilson who torched the Panthers for 20 points in the first 20 minutes didn’t score again in the next 20.

** It looked simple for Detroit to score in the first 24 minutes. It was nearly impossible after the move to zone.

** So this begs the question … do the Panthers need zone to become their main defense? Well, one game is hardly a big enough sample size to make this claim. But this sample presented quite a difference.

** I assume Dixon will make sure the Panthers keep working on their man to man defense. And in this particular game, I don’t fault the Dixon for holding out so long to see if the man defense would come around. But again, our difference in defense between man and zone was fairly hard to fathom.

** Maybe the bigger question should be however, is our offense as good as it seemed to be today. Let’s use some efficiency stats for perspective. 46 points on 36 first half possessions. 49 points on 41 second half possessions. Both solid, but not very high level numbers.

** What’s most interesting is that the Panthers played a game with 77 possessions. I can’t imagine the last time that happened. It may have been before Dixon was Head Coach.

** As for individuals, we all must acknowledge how much Ryan Luther stuck out. Maybe the strategy going forward will always be to play which of our three headed center is at his best. That was Ryan today, and it wasn’t close.

** It’s worth noting that when the Panthers played zone, it was actually Mike who played the middle spot in the zone when Ryan was alongside him. But that matters little, I suppose.

** What may matter more is that Rafel Maia seems to be rounding into form a bit, especially in a game when Alonzo didn’t seem to be in step.

** Once again, Mike wasn’t just in step, but a step ahead. I can’t wait to see him against ACC competition.

** For the first time this year, Jamel looked the part of the slick and svelte three we hope he can be.

** I’m having a hard time deciding who I like better … Milligan or Wilson. Maybe Dixon agreed, actually playing Robinson at the two for a moment or two.

** I’m still not at the point where I can say I’m excited about this team. They have much more to prove to me to make that claim.

** But it’s pretty easy for me to claim one thing … they are quite a bit more intriguing than any Dixon team for some time.

** Maybe ever.

Your last two dribbles says it all for me. I was incredibly down on this program a few months ago, but right now my excitement level for this program is incredibly high. And that is because of the intrigue factor. Sure, it was great in some of the teams past when you knew they would be good, but I always thought the most fun seasons where those who kind of sprung from a team that had a lot of question marks that became answers and good answers and the team went onto a season much better than anticipated.

This team has that feel. And it is so different, deep and versatile. I would love to eat crow from a few months ago.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Right, you more or less are going to be looking at an NBA style game with these rules, which means the lesser talented teams won't be able to play man. The good thing is, since there's no defensive 3 seconds, the 3-point arc is smallish, and the lane is narrower, it does make zone defense feasible. If the NCAA ever enacts those rule changes as well, parity will more or less disappear.

People who say there's no defense in the NBA just have no concept of how basketball works. It's damn near impossible to stop an elite level athlete when you're on an island and needing to react to that elite athlete's movements.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

We have a counter punch.

We have length to go zone effectively .

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

We have a counter punch.

We have length to go zone effectively .

Exactly. This team reminds me a lot of the Syracuse teams, minus the punk ass 3 point shooter.