-Pitt's attendance this year is better than at least 2 of those teams listed, and maybe 3 this year, with a 6-4 record.
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-Pitt's attendance this year is better than at least 2 of those teams listed, and maybe 3 this year, with a 6-4 record.
Huh? You do know with a better win loss record and being ranked helps TREMENDOUSLY for the future. How?
Recruiting! Kids and parents want to see tangible evidence the program is turning the corner. Along with wondering are the coaches able to bring out the best in my kid.
If Pitt was 8-2 right now and being talked about every single day by that national media. That would be incredible for recruiting and upgrading talent.
College football is not like the NFL where there is a draft to fix your week spots. You have to separate yourself from all the other programs trying to get the same kids. How? Winning
This thread for the most part is remarkably civil, but honestly, I seriously dislike the thread title. I may or may not agree with TD, but calling anyone out personally like that is in bad taste. I would like to think Pantherlair is better than that. JMO.
I have no idea why you would think pantherlair is better than that. It is an anonymous message board where people have multiple screen names to agree with themselves. it is pretty much open to any type of weirdness
It only helps you when you are ready to seize on the momentum. Teams that spike early almost always crash to earth. Why? Because they create unrealistic expectations too soon.
You have to build it slowly but surely – I believe that with all my heart. I'm not anti-breakout seasons. I'm just saying that a program in our condition is best served for that to happen in year four or five, after the foundation has been laid, not in year one or two because of a fluke.
-I dont understand this. Bobby Petrino is in year 2 at Louisville and is in playoff contention. Next year Louisville will be the runaway favorite in the entire ACC in year 3. Didnt take him long to flex muscle in the ACC.
He's amazing.
However, he inherited the job from Charlie Strong, who had recruited a lot of talent to Louisville – which is why Texas, one of the best jobs in the country, hired him away from Louisville.
It is not remotely analogous to our situation.
However, he inherited the job from Charlie Strong, who had recruited a lot of talent to Louisville – which is why Texas, one of the best jobs in the country, hired him away from Louisville.
It is not remotely analogous to our situation.
I'm sorry, but this makes absolutely no sense. What is best is winning. Not gradually building to winning.
Agree, 4th year will be the better breakout year, but I am not discounting next year either, not disagreeing with your wisdom that is accurate with insightful rationality, Just Have a BIG HUNCH, not Just a Guess!
Going on record saying it too, Pitt Coach Pat & Staff Offense Units, Defense Units & Special Teams Units are built on many Players not just 1 to 3 anymore. Unlike Harris (Fitz-Revis), Wannstedt (Revis-McCoy), Graham (Who Cares) and Chryst (Donald-Boyd)!
I may be wrong, but I think OC Canada can really make Pitt win 10 games next year even with a New QB because he will be surrounded by many more Players at RBs, WRs, TEs, OLs, too.
The Defense will take a few games to come together but far better when it does emerge with stronger DBs, LBs, and DLs! Especially with Pitt's "Paris" A Panther and maybe our Third "Ffrenchmen" in "Lamont" too!
We shall see!
I understand why people feel that way. I just happen to disagree.
I think people are somewhat in denial about the state of our program. We're comparing it to programs like Louisville. There's no comparison there whatsoever. Louisville has been building for several years and it is an extremely well funded program.
It's more accurate to compare us to Purdue or Vanderbilt or Wake Forest or Syracuse. That has been the level of our financial commitment to the sport.
Our program was just devastated a few years ago by the coaching carousel. Steve Pederson really did a number on us.
We never should've let Harris walk and we absolutely should not have fired Wannstedt when we did. Both of those decisions were mistakes.
Also, we never should've hired Todd Graham or Mike Haywood. That's FOUR huge mistakes by the same guy in a relatively short time span.
And yet, for whatever reason, a lot of people just ignore all of that turnover like it was incidental to our current or recent state. That's just not honest.
People bitch about our 6–6 record, but what they don't realize is we probably should have been 2–10, as happened to Colorado when they did the same thing.
You're talking about multiple coaches with multiple systems teaching multiple techniques and nobody monitoring anyone's progress in any way.
Does that sound like a good or even a sane approach to anyone?
Our program was a hot mess when Paul Chryst arrived and it was still very much in the rebuilding phase when Pat Narduzzi succeeded him.
We are obviously still rebuilding the program. I mean have you watched us play defense? There are still holes everywhere and our defensive backfield is not MAC level, much less ACC caliber.
That's why I don't worry about the rankings or the records just yet. I am focused on developing an infrastructure first.
Would being more highly ranked help us with some recruits? Probably. However, if you are any kind of recruiter, you can still sell the vision. Franklin's been doing it for several years now at Penn State. It is not too much to ask Narduzzi to do the same.
Personally, I think we are still in the embryonic stages of the program's development. I think we are still two or three years away from truly competing for our conference championship. If we played Clemson again on a neutral field, with a playoff berth on the line, I think they would destroy us. And I actually picked Pitt to beat them on Saturday (check the archives).
That's a little longer than most programs take but we have screwed up this program a little more than most. This is the price you pay for being a petulant and poorly run "small market franchise" – as it were.
I think people are somewhat in denial about the state of our program. We're comparing it to programs like Louisville. There's no comparison there whatsoever. Louisville has been building for several years and it is an extremely well funded program.
It's more accurate to compare us to Purdue or Vanderbilt or Wake Forest or Syracuse. That has been the level of our financial commitment to the sport.
Our program was just devastated a few years ago by the coaching carousel. Steve Pederson really did a number on us.
We never should've let Harris walk and we absolutely should not have fired Wannstedt when we did. Both of those decisions were mistakes.
Also, we never should've hired Todd Graham or Mike Haywood. That's FOUR huge mistakes by the same guy in a relatively short time span.
And yet, for whatever reason, a lot of people just ignore all of that turnover like it was incidental to our current or recent state. That's just not honest.
People bitch about our 6–6 record, but what they don't realize is we probably should have been 2–10, as happened to Colorado when they did the same thing.
You're talking about multiple coaches with multiple systems teaching multiple techniques and nobody monitoring anyone's progress in any way.
Does that sound like a good or even a sane approach to anyone?
Our program was a hot mess when Paul Chryst arrived and it was still very much in the rebuilding phase when Pat Narduzzi succeeded him.
We are obviously still rebuilding the program. I mean have you watched us play defense? There are still holes everywhere and our defensive backfield is not MAC level, much less ACC caliber.
That's why I don't worry about the rankings or the records just yet. I am focused on developing an infrastructure first.
Would being more highly ranked help us with some recruits? Probably. However, if you are any kind of recruiter, you can still sell the vision. Franklin's been doing it for several years now at Penn State. It is not too much to ask Narduzzi to do the same.
Personally, I think we are still in the embryonic stages of the program's development. I think we are still two or three years away from truly competing for our conference championship. If we played Clemson again on a neutral field, with a playoff berth on the line, I think they would destroy us. And I actually picked Pitt to beat them on Saturday (check the archives).
That's a little longer than most programs take but we have screwed up this program a little more than most. This is the price you pay for being a petulant and poorly run "small market franchise" – as it were.
Yeah, but you are basically saying it would have been bad for our program to not blow those games against UNC and VT. That doesn't make any sense. We would be 8-2 and on the cusp of a division title and CG appearance with a shot at 11 or even 12 wins. There is no world in which we are better off going 8-5 or 9-4 with winning nothing save a bowl game that mostly no one will watch.
-Steve Kragthorpe completely ruined Louisville football from 2007 through 2009. They had 14 wins total in 3 complete seasons, an average of less than 5 wins per year. That program was in the complete dumpster. It took Charlie strong 3 years to rebuild the program. In Strong's 3rd year, Louisville was 12-1. Petrino then took over and they have gone 9-4, 8-5, and now 9-1 again this year.
-So Louisville went from dead last to first place within 3 years. Louisville's football attendance has been roughly 48,000. Pitt is sitting at roughly 51,000 average to date. The attendance the next 2 games will tank, because Pitt over scheduled and is 6-4 with no ranking. Had Pitt been 7-3 with a Top 15 ranking, the attendance would finish way higher.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all.
I was as disappointed as anyone when we lost those games. However, I wasn't disappointed because what it meant for our ranking.
I was disappointed because I thought we should've won those games – especially the North Carolina game. That was a real kick in the balls.
The Virginia Tech game was more frustrating than anything else. They ran the same play 25 different times and we simply could not stop it... because were not good enough… Yet!
I'm more interested in seeing the program develop than I am pulling off fluky wins. I'm proud of how we played against Clemson, and I would've felt that way no matter what happened with Blewitt's final kick.
As I said earlier, I just don't think we are ready to worry about conference races or rankings just yet. Our focus should be on development; both of the individual players and of the program as a whole.
If we focus on that, the areas that we can actually control, the results will take care of themselves and a few years from now we really will be ready to compete with the best teams on our schedule, week in, week out.
Now, if we are still losing those types of games two years from now, I will have an entirely different perspective. However, right now, I am more interested in our progress than anything else.
I was as disappointed as anyone when we lost those games. However, I wasn't disappointed because what it meant for our ranking.
I was disappointed because I thought we should've won those games – especially the North Carolina game. That was a real kick in the balls.
The Virginia Tech game was more frustrating than anything else. They ran the same play 25 different times and we simply could not stop it... because were not good enough… Yet!
I'm more interested in seeing the program develop than I am pulling off fluky wins. I'm proud of how we played against Clemson, and I would've felt that way no matter what happened with Blewitt's final kick.
As I said earlier, I just don't think we are ready to worry about conference races or rankings just yet. Our focus should be on development; both of the individual players and of the program as a whole.
If we focus on that, the areas that we can actually control, the results will take care of themselves and a few years from now we really will be ready to compete with the best teams on our schedule, week in, week out.
Now, if we are still losing those types of games two years from now, I will have an entirely different perspective. However, right now, I am more interested in our progress than anything else.
You realize that Pitt didn't do that either this year, don't you? In the preseason NONE of Pitt's non-conference opponents were in the top 15. Oklahoma State was 21 in the AP, 19 in the coaches. There were 42 teams that got a vote in the AP poll. Penn State wasn't one of them. There were 51 teams that got a vote in the coaches poll. Penn State wasn't one of them. Are you really arguing that someone should have known when they scheduled a game several years ago that a team that wasn't even an afterthought for the top 25 would parlay a decent team with a crappy schedule to end up in the top 10?
That is just way too speculatory for me. Who knows the answers to any of those questions? Certainly not me or you, I do know that.
There's just a lot of assertions/assumptions being made here that I simply don't agree with or can't be sure of.
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