Huh? Why would anyone think it wasn't investigated thoroughly?
The FBI remains involved - and it remains an open case.
I have to admit, the PSU cult/klan are hilarious
- Thread starter TD_istheman
- Start date
Huh? Why would anyone think it wasn't investigated thoroughly?
The FBI remains involved - and it remains an open case.
You have to admit you're not exactly a favorite on the ICP board........... regardless, you are incorrect.
I'm not a "cult member" AT ALL. 0.00000%. You implied that I was, just not "full-fledged." That was a cheap shot.
Anyway, I guess I'm incorrect. I can't say that makes sense (2nd Mile not liable but their insurer is), but I won't argue with someone smarter than me.
Carry on.
If I recall, it stayed within the hands of Bellefonte PD for too long. PSP has the investigation currently.
I'm not sure of the FBI's involvement. Most of their file was compiled pre-disappearance.
Which could well have been complicit in a coverup or a purposely botched investigation.
Honestly that is a dead end as is any SM investigation.
I have read enough of your posts to know that you are far from a Cultist and constantly push back against the crazies among the PSU alumni and fans. I have respect for that.
But trying to shift blame from Paterno and the PSU administrators is a standard response from much of the alumni and fanbase.The whole canard of "Look over there, at the Second Mile" doesn't change anything. Regardless of the Second Mile, the abuse still would have stopped and the scandal would never have happened if the PSU administrators or the football coach had gone to law enforcement instead of being "humane" to Sandusky.
PSU takes all the heat for the Sandusly scandal because there was such a high-profile incident on PSU property that was related to various people up and down the PSU organizational chart without anything being done about it. AFAIK, there was never an incident on Second Mile property like what happened in the Lasch building.
I have read enough of your posts to know that you are far from a Cultist and constantly push back against the crazies among the PSU alumni and fans. I have respect for that.
The whole canard of "Look over there, at the Second Mile" doesn't change anything. Regardless of the Second Mile, the abuse still would have stopped and the scandal would never have happened if the PSU administrators or the football coach had gone to law enforcement instead of being "humane" to Sandusky.
PSU takes all the heat for the Sandusly scandal because there was such a high-profile incident on PSU property that was related to various people up and down the PSU organizational chart without anything being done about it. AFAIK, there was never an incident on Second Mile property like what happened in the Lasch building.
I'm not shifting blame.
But this is true and IMO undeniable --- Jack Raykovitz has completely skated.
It's a known fact that Raykovitz in 2001 had Tim Curley telling him about McQueary's "sighting" (for lack of a better word) of Sandusky.
Raykovitz also knew about the 1998 legal investigation. There is no doubt about that.
2nd Mile Development Director Bonnie Marshall is on the record (in 2009) as saying that Raykovitz told Marshall: "Yes, we knew of something in 2001 that Tim Curley talked to me about.’ At that point, I didn’t particularly want to know any more and he didn’t volunteer anything else.”
If JoePa screwed up in 2001 for not following up with law enforcement given his knowledge of 1998 ---- can't we say the same for Raykovitz? Much like Paterno was the CEO of Penn State Football Inc., Raykovitz was a CEO himself (of the 2nd Mile). Isn't Raykovitz's comment (if true) completely awful, given Raykovitz's knowledge of the 1998 investigation and Raykovitz' position of responsibility?
Raykovitz still has a job as a psychologist in private practice in Central Pennsylvania. I don't find it particularly acceptable that he is still in a position of any responsibility.
Bottom line: he had an opportunity to step up in the 2001-2008 era himself. And just as others did, he failed the test.
And.....what? I get the narrative and hope anyone who is/were complicit with Sandusky's crimes are brought to justice, but what does that have to do with PSU? PSU was the constant perhaps even back to the 1970's. Not the individual players. Deflecting doesn't diminish that responsibility.
Where did I "diminish" PSU's responsibility in my post? What???????
Wanting everybody who failed morally (or criminally) here to face judgment is not a "narrative." It is something you should want too. I would think? You're comfortable that Raykovitz is still out there holding a job of great responsibility as a licensed psychologist?
My apologies for making one post without reference to Penn State and their mistakes. I guess that's a pre-requisite to having a conversation with you.
Come on, you're smarter than this.
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"pabornandraised, post: 1421512, member: 39616"]From what I've seen/heard, Paterno was involved in some non-university related business ventures with a few State College area trustees, like a local retirement community, but other than a paycheck,
Well, there are Corporate Papers the NCAA found in Discovery that show he was indeed in Business with Trustees the same Cult trashes on BWI.
Joe had the University Trustees Pay Legal Fees to fight from the releasing of his Salary as a Public Employee, and they approved such Expenses for years until Spanier got the OK from the Trustees to tell Joe they were not going to pay to fight it anymore, and that is when the Public learn Joe only getting $500,000 a true bargain in light of Franklin's $4.5 Million. Joe went Bonkers when told the fight is over but Spanier ignored him!
Joe's salary was so low is because he was making more money from Private Business and the NCAA has subpoena those Documents in the Paterno Commercial Disparagement Defamation Lawsuit filed against NCAA & Penn State? If the Case goes to trial all that Info will be released! Nike President approach Joe with one their first Shoe contracts. Nothing Illegal about that either. Joe Estate Final Net Worth I think was published at $10 million and PAterno's first tried to keep the will Secret but gave up. Another example, of secrecy and silence was part of Joe.
I don't believe he wasn't getting anything from the university itself.
Joe was only making $60,000 in 1980 as a salary, and needed University Loans twice of $300,000 and the Trustees the BWI PSU Cult trash forgave Paterno $600,000 Loans he did not have to payback on his Buyout Exit from Penn State. I don't fault that at all either. Joe just loved coaching and only at Penn State. Money was important to support his family but Football was more important to Joe.
Other trustees, however, have very lucrative dealings with the university by way of construction projects, food service contracts, credit cards, etc.
I concur and not all on Joe either to be fair. Yet, somehow, arrangements were always made where Penn State Football Players stayed at various Hotels, Resorts, Travel arrangements, High School Coaching Clinics, Summer Recruiting Camps, and various other businesses related to Penn State Football Program? You do know Penn State Football Program is an Annual $100+ Operation? Not saying Paterno order it but many PSU Supporters and Boosters had Businesses like most Programs do as related to Football. Nothing illegal but much Undisclosed prior to 2012 with Joe too.
BOARD OF TRUSTEES CONFLICT OF INTEREST DISCLOSURE AND CERTIFICATION
SUMMARY REPORT
December 18, 2013
LINK:
http://www.psu.edu/trustees/pdf/COI Web posting 12.18.13.pdf
These current Trustee and many others already passed away also proposed and approved new Penn State Conflicts of Interests Policies that no longer allows Undisclosed Contracts and other areas whereby they once had dealings with Joe but not full disclosure. This shows some areas of secrecy and silence but the PSU Cult BWI Posters only blame the Trustees and exempt Joe?
Updated Summary:September 16, 2014 - New policy.
LINK:
http://guru.psu.edu/policies/AD88.html
These same trustees were also very involved with The Second Mile, while Paterno was not.
Well, if that was true, why hasn't the Paterno Family & Lawyers called for a Public Investigation of The Second Mile or hire a private Investigation themselves? They hired other Law Enforcement Experts on other aspects of the Penn State Scandal Investigations? The Football Program, Coaches and Players were certainly involved and that has been well documented as well as Vacation for Paterno's.?
These Two Article Say Paterno Was Involved With The Second Mile Board Members On Investments? If you have other Links that say it was not so, please pu them up, no downside in being fair fro me, I admit errors and accept corrections to learn.
Article:
Former Penn State head football coach Joe Paterno had business ties with board members of The Second Mile, the charity founded by alleged child molester and former Penn State assistant coach Jerry Sandusky, The Daily is reporting.......The Daily reported Monday that Paterno and three fellow investors, including longtime Second Mile board chairman Robert Poole, secured financing to build a $125 million luxury retirement community around 2002, according to public records........As the retirement community project struggled to rent its apartments and cottages -- with entrance fees approaching $500,000 -- Paterno appeared in a 2005 ad promoting the hillside complex with a view of the football stadium as a place he could see himself retiring......As the retirement community project struggled to rent its apartments and cottages -- with entrance fees approaching $500,000 -- Paterno appeared in a 2005 ad promoting the hillside complex with a view of the football stadium as a place he could see himself retiring.........
Ed Lauth, a local businessman who is close friends with both Paterno and Poole, owned Aqua Penn, the bottled water company that Paterno invested in and helped build......He said Paterno was more motivated by bettering the community than reaping profits from his business ventures. Two months after Aqua Penn sold for $112 million to a French company in 1998, Paterno reportedly donated $3.5 million to Penn State.
LINK
http://espn.go.com/college-football...business-leaders-second-mile-according-report
Paterno, Chairman Of Jerry Sandusky's Charity Were Pursuing $125M Real Estate Deal When Sandusky Was Caught Allegedly Sodomizing Boy:
LINK:
http://deadspin.com/5865111/joe-pat...-sandusky-was-caught-allegedly-sodomizing-boy
(Exceeded 1,000 Words) END OF PART I:
Well, there are Corporate Papers the NCAA found in Discovery that show he was indeed in Business with Trustees the same Cult trashes on BWI.
Joe had the University Trustees Pay Legal Fees to fight from the releasing of his Salary as a Public Employee, and they approved such Expenses for years until Spanier got the OK from the Trustees to tell Joe they were not going to pay to fight it anymore, and that is when the Public learn Joe only getting $500,000 a true bargain in light of Franklin's $4.5 Million. Joe went Bonkers when told the fight is over but Spanier ignored him!
Joe's salary was so low is because he was making more money from Private Business and the NCAA has subpoena those Documents in the Paterno Commercial Disparagement Defamation Lawsuit filed against NCAA & Penn State? If the Case goes to trial all that Info will be released! Nike President approach Joe with one their first Shoe contracts. Nothing Illegal about that either. Joe Estate Final Net Worth I think was published at $10 million and PAterno's first tried to keep the will Secret but gave up. Another example, of secrecy and silence was part of Joe.
I don't believe he wasn't getting anything from the university itself.
Joe was only making $60,000 in 1980 as a salary, and needed University Loans twice of $300,000 and the Trustees the BWI PSU Cult trash forgave Paterno $600,000 Loans he did not have to payback on his Buyout Exit from Penn State. I don't fault that at all either. Joe just loved coaching and only at Penn State. Money was important to support his family but Football was more important to Joe.
Other trustees, however, have very lucrative dealings with the university by way of construction projects, food service contracts, credit cards, etc.
I concur and not all on Joe either to be fair. Yet, somehow, arrangements were always made where Penn State Football Players stayed at various Hotels, Resorts, Travel arrangements, High School Coaching Clinics, Summer Recruiting Camps, and various other businesses related to Penn State Football Program? You do know Penn State Football Program is an Annual $100+ Operation? Not saying Paterno order it but many PSU Supporters and Boosters had Businesses like most Programs do as related to Football. Nothing illegal but much Undisclosed prior to 2012 with Joe too.
BOARD OF TRUSTEES CONFLICT OF INTEREST DISCLOSURE AND CERTIFICATION
SUMMARY REPORT
December 18, 2013
LINK:
http://www.psu.edu/trustees/pdf/COI Web posting 12.18.13.pdf
These current Trustee and many others already passed away also proposed and approved new Penn State Conflicts of Interests Policies that no longer allows Undisclosed Contracts and other areas whereby they once had dealings with Joe but not full disclosure. This shows some areas of secrecy and silence but the PSU Cult BWI Posters only blame the Trustees and exempt Joe?
Updated Summary:September 16, 2014 - New policy.
LINK:
http://guru.psu.edu/policies/AD88.html
These same trustees were also very involved with The Second Mile, while Paterno was not.
Well, if that was true, why hasn't the Paterno Family & Lawyers called for a Public Investigation of The Second Mile or hire a private Investigation themselves? They hired other Law Enforcement Experts on other aspects of the Penn State Scandal Investigations? The Football Program, Coaches and Players were certainly involved and that has been well documented as well as Vacation for Paterno's.?
These Two Article Say Paterno Was Involved With The Second Mile Board Members On Investments? If you have other Links that say it was not so, please pu them up, no downside in being fair fro me, I admit errors and accept corrections to learn.
Article:
Former Penn State head football coach Joe Paterno had business ties with board members of The Second Mile, the charity founded by alleged child molester and former Penn State assistant coach Jerry Sandusky, The Daily is reporting.......The Daily reported Monday that Paterno and three fellow investors, including longtime Second Mile board chairman Robert Poole, secured financing to build a $125 million luxury retirement community around 2002, according to public records........As the retirement community project struggled to rent its apartments and cottages -- with entrance fees approaching $500,000 -- Paterno appeared in a 2005 ad promoting the hillside complex with a view of the football stadium as a place he could see himself retiring......As the retirement community project struggled to rent its apartments and cottages -- with entrance fees approaching $500,000 -- Paterno appeared in a 2005 ad promoting the hillside complex with a view of the football stadium as a place he could see himself retiring.........
Ed Lauth, a local businessman who is close friends with both Paterno and Poole, owned Aqua Penn, the bottled water company that Paterno invested in and helped build......He said Paterno was more motivated by bettering the community than reaping profits from his business ventures. Two months after Aqua Penn sold for $112 million to a French company in 1998, Paterno reportedly donated $3.5 million to Penn State.
LINK
http://espn.go.com/college-football...business-leaders-second-mile-according-report
Paterno, Chairman Of Jerry Sandusky's Charity Were Pursuing $125M Real Estate Deal When Sandusky Was Caught Allegedly Sodomizing Boy:
LINK:
http://deadspin.com/5865111/joe-pat...-sandusky-was-caught-allegedly-sodomizing-boy
(Exceeded 1,000 Words) END OF PART I:
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PART II BELOW:
"pabornandraised, post: 1421512, member: 39616"]
Please name the other Paterno's that are/were employed by Penn State. I am aware of only two, his brother (died in 2002) and one daughter.
You forgot Jay and missed a few too!
I am not a Paterno Hater. I admire the Paterno Family and in particular Sue Paterno and her devotion to Joe and her Family and to Special Olympics that I participated in helping raise money through my Penn State Friends. I will not betray their names out of respect for them.
You can go to Penn State Employee Website and put in Maiden Names of Married In Laws Names. You will find what you are searching for but even Sue got a Pension for counseling and helping Players and Students overcome Learning Disabilities and Tutoring. Sue also was marvelous cook and many coaches Joe beat badly were invited to dinners.
You can also google Paterno Son in laws and see articles from married names in laws that work at PSU and paid in six figures. They earned every penny as well as far as I am concern, but it shows Penn State took care of more than one Paterno?
It is still my opinion, there is no question the Paterno's did far more good than anything bad and they all have zeal and pride about Joe and their family and they should.
I don't hate Joe and admire his coaching, family and charity work, but he made misjudgements when building his Program his way is also just a fair comparison too, and never claimed to be a saint, and admitted his wrongs in hindsight on the Victims.
The Victim Voices Allegations have added to Joe's Legacy demise, not me or anyone on the Lair.
In addition, it is the PSU Cult that kills off any good aspects of Joe while thinking that is defending Joe, the JoeBots l& Joehadists are just hateful Posters calling everyone Liars, just as Zeigler was doing.
If that is so, then there are many Nittany Liars according to the Cult, so where is the Success and Honor in that Penn State Way that was a big Grand Experiment failure? After all, Sandusky, Curley, and McQueary were Joe's Players and Coaches and AD?
Look, I get the hatred for all things Penn State and Paterno here.
Look....that is not the sole Picture staring back at you, not here on the Lair. I don't hate all things Penn State and can be fair about what I admire. Additionally, do not think Paterno Era should be discounted nor a Paterno's Errors should be dismissed?
1. Go Look at BWI and see all the Hateful Posts on things about Penn State, and nothing on the Lair compares to your fellow PSU Cult Poster there? The biggest problem is Penn Staters Hate of Penn State more than any other Posters on the Lair or anywhere today.
2. I have some Lair Posters that I respect having their own views that differ from my own, have told me they disagree, and we agree to disagree. They ignore me and so be it! I separate Joe's Great Elite Hard Working Coaching from his building up and running the Penn State Program. The Paterno ERA on Coaching may not always be liked, but I respect it unequivocally. Joe Won 409 due to Game Week Prep 18/7 Work, Marvelous Game Day Plans, and Sideline Coaching. I was on those sidelines a few times by invite and seeing from his excellence and passion from the Stands and enjoying Luxury Suites he help build with Top 10 Winning.
3. Nevertheless Joe's had misjudgments now known that ruined his own Legacy. Paterno's devotion and endurance were abundant, but there was an impending downside. Paterno’s 60+ years at Penn State building a great reputation also created a cult-like following based on non-compliance’s hypocrisy of Joe’s own making. The enormous joy of Top 25 Winning provided an incredible amount of power with not much Institutional Control.
4. How does one know Penn State Football Program Paterno ERA was flawed and built on some mistakes of silence and secrecy? The Penn State 2012 Reform that had to correct Penn State Football Program Paterno’s ERRORS. Joe also had just as much zeal in claiming he was running a Clean Program while attacking, back biting fellow competitive Coaches Character and Programs.
5. It is well documented in Sports Media Joe used silence, secrecy and ignored warnings that cover-ups could back on Penn State. Media did uncovered some but when they question Joe he had them banned just like what they do on BWI. Trustees often were the last to find out problems later. Administrators could not do much about it since some Trustees were in Business with Joe. Administrators took care of such revelations but with intimidation by being told he Wins Games and Raises Money you put up with his Joe's Dark Side or you leave?
Has no one ever wondered why The Second Mile, which employed Sandusky in 2001 and was THE source for his alleged victims, was never investigated?
I have and agree with all those that demand it, but the Paterno's have been just as silent on that as well as the Trustees? I wonder about that too????? But the PSU BWI Cult give Joe Paterno a pass on that too as well!
Good post and thank you!
PITTPOSTSCRIPT-I will be posting short summary narrative on the Penn State Scandal and Updates on Pre-Trial Motions Criminal Trials, and Sandusky Post Conviction Appeal Arguments with analysis and predictions.Come back and feel free to challenge anything.
"pabornandraised, post: 1421512, member: 39616"]
Please name the other Paterno's that are/were employed by Penn State. I am aware of only two, his brother (died in 2002) and one daughter.
You forgot Jay and missed a few too!
I am not a Paterno Hater. I admire the Paterno Family and in particular Sue Paterno and her devotion to Joe and her Family and to Special Olympics that I participated in helping raise money through my Penn State Friends. I will not betray their names out of respect for them.
You can go to Penn State Employee Website and put in Maiden Names of Married In Laws Names. You will find what you are searching for but even Sue got a Pension for counseling and helping Players and Students overcome Learning Disabilities and Tutoring. Sue also was marvelous cook and many coaches Joe beat badly were invited to dinners.
You can also google Paterno Son in laws and see articles from married names in laws that work at PSU and paid in six figures. They earned every penny as well as far as I am concern, but it shows Penn State took care of more than one Paterno?
It is still my opinion, there is no question the Paterno's did far more good than anything bad and they all have zeal and pride about Joe and their family and they should.
I don't hate Joe and admire his coaching, family and charity work, but he made misjudgements when building his Program his way is also just a fair comparison too, and never claimed to be a saint, and admitted his wrongs in hindsight on the Victims.
The Victim Voices Allegations have added to Joe's Legacy demise, not me or anyone on the Lair.
In addition, it is the PSU Cult that kills off any good aspects of Joe while thinking that is defending Joe, the JoeBots l& Joehadists are just hateful Posters calling everyone Liars, just as Zeigler was doing.
If that is so, then there are many Nittany Liars according to the Cult, so where is the Success and Honor in that Penn State Way that was a big Grand Experiment failure? After all, Sandusky, Curley, and McQueary were Joe's Players and Coaches and AD?
Look, I get the hatred for all things Penn State and Paterno here.
Look....that is not the sole Picture staring back at you, not here on the Lair. I don't hate all things Penn State and can be fair about what I admire. Additionally, do not think Paterno Era should be discounted nor a Paterno's Errors should be dismissed?
1. Go Look at BWI and see all the Hateful Posts on things about Penn State, and nothing on the Lair compares to your fellow PSU Cult Poster there? The biggest problem is Penn Staters Hate of Penn State more than any other Posters on the Lair or anywhere today.
2. I have some Lair Posters that I respect having their own views that differ from my own, have told me they disagree, and we agree to disagree. They ignore me and so be it! I separate Joe's Great Elite Hard Working Coaching from his building up and running the Penn State Program. The Paterno ERA on Coaching may not always be liked, but I respect it unequivocally. Joe Won 409 due to Game Week Prep 18/7 Work, Marvelous Game Day Plans, and Sideline Coaching. I was on those sidelines a few times by invite and seeing from his excellence and passion from the Stands and enjoying Luxury Suites he help build with Top 10 Winning.
3. Nevertheless Joe's had misjudgments now known that ruined his own Legacy. Paterno's devotion and endurance were abundant, but there was an impending downside. Paterno’s 60+ years at Penn State building a great reputation also created a cult-like following based on non-compliance’s hypocrisy of Joe’s own making. The enormous joy of Top 25 Winning provided an incredible amount of power with not much Institutional Control.
4. How does one know Penn State Football Program Paterno ERA was flawed and built on some mistakes of silence and secrecy? The Penn State 2012 Reform that had to correct Penn State Football Program Paterno’s ERRORS. Joe also had just as much zeal in claiming he was running a Clean Program while attacking, back biting fellow competitive Coaches Character and Programs.
5. It is well documented in Sports Media Joe used silence, secrecy and ignored warnings that cover-ups could back on Penn State. Media did uncovered some but when they question Joe he had them banned just like what they do on BWI. Trustees often were the last to find out problems later. Administrators could not do much about it since some Trustees were in Business with Joe. Administrators took care of such revelations but with intimidation by being told he Wins Games and Raises Money you put up with his Joe's Dark Side or you leave?
Has no one ever wondered why The Second Mile, which employed Sandusky in 2001 and was THE source for his alleged victims, was never investigated?
I have and agree with all those that demand it, but the Paterno's have been just as silent on that as well as the Trustees? I wonder about that too????? But the PSU BWI Cult give Joe Paterno a pass on that too as well!
Good post and thank you!
PITTPOSTSCRIPT-I will be posting short summary narrative on the Penn State Scandal and Updates on Pre-Trial Motions Criminal Trials, and Sandusky Post Conviction Appeal Arguments with analysis and predictions.Come back and feel free to challenge anything.
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Paterno was one degree of separation from TSM thru many associates, including former players....it was one of the largest charities in the area if not all of PA. Still, I don't believe he or any of his family had direct involvement.
Maybe things stabilized when Freeh was brought in at first, with the thinking that he would do a truly independent investigation, but the crap really hit the fan when he released his report. Since then it has been discovered that the investigation was far from independent, and just about everyone now sees it as worthless, including PSU's current president, PSU's own lawyers (in the ongoing PMA case), and even Freeh himself, who called it nothing more than opinion in defense of his defamation suit vs. Spanier.
The crisis has nothing to do with football money. There is SO much more money involved on the university side.
The real head scratcher for me, though, is how you just ignore TSM. IMHO, TSM is the key to the whole thing.
Pedbornandraised - Please stop with your simple minded babble. You must be on a pilgrimage to lower your tithe to the cult but most people outside the church of paturdo are able to understand what happened!
Sorry, forgot about Jay....he is easy to forget. I know another son is on Alumni Council, but that is not a paid position.
I don't believe Penn Stater's hate Penn State. I believe many hate the way the school has been hijacked by a select few trustees who are in it for their own interests.
As for the rest, I really don't know what the hell you're saying.
I am self employed and in your world means you own your own lawnmower or flock(?) of cows!
The key to this whole thing was Jerry Sandusky (who the cult believes is innocent), followed by PSU leadership.
If you're asking me if a charity founded and run by a serial pedophile, created to give that pedophile direct access to children was also dirty - you betchya (duh).
But, the lid to this situation was blown off when an eye witness saw Sandusky abusing a boy on PSU property, and the situation was improperly managed.
"pabornandraised, post: 1424866, member: 39616"]
Sorry, forgot about Jay....he is easy to forget. I know another son is on Alumni Council, but that is not a paid position.
I don't consider what the Paterno did having his family and helping other relatives be part of Penn State by way of jobs wrong, it what happens at many Colleges when a Winning Coach that brings in Money and can raise Funds happens. However, over time and when being in Business with Trustees and having more Power over any other Employee at PSU actually ended up Shaming not only Penn State Name but Paterno's Name too.
Yet, Sue sought to sue to get it Joe's Reputation Commercial Value back? There is no way that Name nor Reputation can come back now or ever.
How do i know? Because Joe was a Visionary Coach and too cried before he died and said his Name and Reputation will be ruined too. Joe also may have taken more secrets he practiced to to his grave than Sue and Paterno Family ever knew too.
I also do not feel Joe did anything Intentional to advance Sandusky's Pedophilia and just became Victim of his own silence, secrecy, and ignoring signs over time as well of his own making. I don't fault him on not knowing what to do over time either, he was caring and focused on Football and thought The Second Mile was doing good things for Bad Kids, and in that period of time, few knew what to do unlike today.
I don't believe Penn Stater's hate Penn State.
Well, your first point in this thread and Crimson in another was Pitt Posters Hate Penn State and maybe you miss that Pitt Posters, Big Ten Posters and Other Football Posters Hate what Pedophiles do to Unprotected Children and that is what honestly happen only at Penn State???
Penn Staters should consider, Joe Paterno becoming an Icon, Saint with a Halo above his Head on a Mural in State College did caused some of his problems with his Name today, not any Pitt Posters.
After all, Joe Paterno made sure during his Paterno Football Era that Pitt would no longer having nothing to do with Penn State? Joe's own growing Power at Penn State with some arrogance, pomposity, competitive zeal, and then clams of ignorance was part of his problem with Pitt the day became a Coach at Penn State? He admitted in hindsight.
I believe many hate the way the school has been hijacked by a select few trustees who are in it for their own interests.
What you believe is the problem and many Penn Staters blame all others while giving Joseph Vincent Paterno a free pass on his own admitted mistakes and misjudgements and somehow was not part of the problems that happen at Penn State?
If Joe was in Business with Trustees that were suppose to have oversight over him, maybe this caused problem and Joe Paterno was part of that problem too, as the Business Links show!
As for the rest, I really don't know what the hell you're saying.
Well, that may be because you prefer to be blind on Penn State Crimes and then blame Pitt Posters protesting why not protecting Children Victims was not Success with Honor as many Penn Staters demand and claim return to glory.
It is Penn Staters blaming it all on Penn State Trustees that demand the world recognize Paterno Era Football that required Penn State 2012 Legal and Athletic Reforms to correct Paterno Errors Football?
How can you understand when you demand others worship Paterno and choose to remain blind as he did that helped cause the ruination of his own Name that brought Shame to Penn State but you blame on others?
Go forgive all at Penn State not just Paterno and sin no more on the Lair!
Sorry, forgot about Jay....he is easy to forget. I know another son is on Alumni Council, but that is not a paid position.
I don't consider what the Paterno did having his family and helping other relatives be part of Penn State by way of jobs wrong, it what happens at many Colleges when a Winning Coach that brings in Money and can raise Funds happens. However, over time and when being in Business with Trustees and having more Power over any other Employee at PSU actually ended up Shaming not only Penn State Name but Paterno's Name too.
Yet, Sue sought to sue to get it Joe's Reputation Commercial Value back? There is no way that Name nor Reputation can come back now or ever.
How do i know? Because Joe was a Visionary Coach and too cried before he died and said his Name and Reputation will be ruined too. Joe also may have taken more secrets he practiced to to his grave than Sue and Paterno Family ever knew too.
I also do not feel Joe did anything Intentional to advance Sandusky's Pedophilia and just became Victim of his own silence, secrecy, and ignoring signs over time as well of his own making. I don't fault him on not knowing what to do over time either, he was caring and focused on Football and thought The Second Mile was doing good things for Bad Kids, and in that period of time, few knew what to do unlike today.
I don't believe Penn Stater's hate Penn State.
Well, your first point in this thread and Crimson in another was Pitt Posters Hate Penn State and maybe you miss that Pitt Posters, Big Ten Posters and Other Football Posters Hate what Pedophiles do to Unprotected Children and that is what honestly happen only at Penn State???
Penn Staters should consider, Joe Paterno becoming an Icon, Saint with a Halo above his Head on a Mural in State College did caused some of his problems with his Name today, not any Pitt Posters.
After all, Joe Paterno made sure during his Paterno Football Era that Pitt would no longer having nothing to do with Penn State? Joe's own growing Power at Penn State with some arrogance, pomposity, competitive zeal, and then clams of ignorance was part of his problem with Pitt the day became a Coach at Penn State? He admitted in hindsight.
I believe many hate the way the school has been hijacked by a select few trustees who are in it for their own interests.
What you believe is the problem and many Penn Staters blame all others while giving Joseph Vincent Paterno a free pass on his own admitted mistakes and misjudgements and somehow was not part of the problems that happen at Penn State?
If Joe was in Business with Trustees that were suppose to have oversight over him, maybe this caused problem and Joe Paterno was part of that problem too, as the Business Links show!
As for the rest, I really don't know what the hell you're saying.
Well, that may be because you prefer to be blind on Penn State Crimes and then blame Pitt Posters protesting why not protecting Children Victims was not Success with Honor as many Penn Staters demand and claim return to glory.
It is Penn Staters blaming it all on Penn State Trustees that demand the world recognize Paterno Era Football that required Penn State 2012 Legal and Athletic Reforms to correct Paterno Errors Football?
How can you understand when you demand others worship Paterno and choose to remain blind as he did that helped cause the ruination of his own Name that brought Shame to Penn State but you blame on others?
Go forgive all at Penn State not just Paterno and sin no more on the Lair!
"pabornandraised, post: 1424779, member: 39616"]Paterno was one degree of separation from TSM thru many associates, including former players....
Oh, you mean like a Buffer the Mob uses with Shell Corporations? Joe used his Name in ADS to promote those The Second Mile Partners Projects did he not?
Just kidding you on the Buffer Comment! However, Joe was not a Buffer he was one of the Partners is what you have to recognize? In your first post I had to correct you when you posted Joe had nothing to do with TSM? The Links showed that was untrue? If you can't accept all the full Truth on Joe, you can't blame all of Penn State Trustees in Business with Joe?
it was one of the largest charities in the area if not all of PA. Still, I don't believe he or any of his family had direct involvement.
Well, you are not wrong this time, but again not all true for you to form a complete belief if you want to be honest on it.
TSM work with high-at-risk children Commonwealth wide, though most of it was in central and south-central Pennsylvania. TSM used educational motivational training cards called "Nittany Lion Tips," sponsoring conferences for high school “Sophomores” (Some Recruits), on community leadership and week-long camps for children with behavioral and academic problems, and has a mentor program that matches Penn State volunteers with at-risk elementary students. Penn State Football and Athletic Volunteers often use slogans on Penn State Football and taught to say "The children we serve have often experienced many broken promises in their young lives; that's why our mantra has always been 'No Broken Promises, Ever.' We need to continue to be the family they can count on," Second Mile's 2010 annual report said.
Maybe things stabilized when Freeh was brought in at first, with the thinking that he would do a truly independent investigation, but the crap really hit the fan when he released his report.
Maybe is not a Fact, most of Freeh Report was involved in providing 119 Recommendations to correct the Penn State Football Paterno Era and Errors was not following on Educational Laws such as Title IX & Clery Act, Big Ten Athletic Integrity Agreement No Code of Conduct, Factual Intimidation of Employee of PSU Violations of NCAA Rules of Lack of Institutional Control, University Conflicts of Interests, and the University Trustees put in 116 of those Recommendations in Penn State 2012 Reforms that corrected the Penn State Football Program.
(I leave the rest of Freeh Report to Criminal Trials challenges, Spanier, Patrenos, and Other Civil Lawsuits as well PSU-PMA and soon to be PSU-TSM Insurers Contract Lawsuits. to be Fair to All to sort out in Court Discovery, Trials, Pleas, Dismissals or Settlements!)
Since then it has been discovered that the investigation was far from independent, and just about everyone now sees it as worthless, including PSU's current president, PSU's own lawyers (in the ongoing PMA case), and even Freeh himself, who called it nothing more than opinion in defense of his defamation suit vs. Spanier.
This is where and all the Cultist and sincere Alumni Lovers of Penn State some that came to be current Trustees. This is the Ziegler Narrative and includes Sandusky was Innocent but even Zeigler has abandon it now?
The PSU fans and mostly Cult ones are living in Bubbles that the OAG Investigation and Conviction of PSU Sandusky, Trustee's Freeh Report Guidelines, and NCAA Sanctions with Monitor bursted.
Sure it has driven many Penn State Football Fans benn very stressful, feeling they have been wronged, and attracting crazy conspiracy theories you are espousing today.
Yet, it is now the Victim's Voices in Unsealed Settlements that have broken the Slogans and Myths of Paterno Era Football, and they suffered Nightmares from not being protected and ignored, but the Victim's Voices have busted that Bubble once and forever more, and Society and Media will not allow to it forgotten now.
The crisis has nothing to do with football money. There is SO much more money involved on the university side.
No, you are wrong, it has everything to do with Victim Voices now. Penn State football will always make money and now within Rules and Compliances better than ever due to Trustees Reforms recommended by Freeh! All that is happening now is waiting for other Criminal, Contract, and Civil Court Cases to be resolved.
All Penn Staters now have to a better effort to understand it took decades to unite PSU and now it may decades to get over and start to mend the divide and by coming on the Lair where relationships and isolated beliefs based on slogans on BWI can be talked out!
The real head scratcher for me, though, is how you just ignore TSM. IMHO, TSM is the key to the whole thing.
Well, it is time to understand that is not all of it by any means at all?
It is the beliefs and demand that Paterno did not doing anything wrong, did not make mistakes, in fact may have unintentionally ignored more than his family ever knew, and had some bad misjudgements as well, and he admitted it too.
It is time most of you to admit the same about him and quick calling everyone Nittany Liars or the Lair the Liar when lies are only at Penn State many websites?
Penn State Trustees too responsibility for Victim's in settlements, put in Reforms to correct the Football Program, and the NCAA reduced Sanctions and gave back Paterno Vacated Wins, and that Penn State Football Paterno Era is over and buried.
If you are still scratching your head it is because you have been ignoring the Victim's Voices from day one, and still believe in slogans proven false from yesterday, and blaming it all on Penn State Hate?
But that is you beliefs and your isolated bubble fans beliefs that you won't accept it was always a Total Penn State Scandal and Paterno was there too when it happen and it tarnish his Legacy and Statue?
Oh, you mean like a Buffer the Mob uses with Shell Corporations? Joe used his Name in ADS to promote those The Second Mile Partners Projects did he not?
Just kidding you on the Buffer Comment! However, Joe was not a Buffer he was one of the Partners is what you have to recognize? In your first post I had to correct you when you posted Joe had nothing to do with TSM? The Links showed that was untrue? If you can't accept all the full Truth on Joe, you can't blame all of Penn State Trustees in Business with Joe?
it was one of the largest charities in the area if not all of PA. Still, I don't believe he or any of his family had direct involvement.
Well, you are not wrong this time, but again not all true for you to form a complete belief if you want to be honest on it.
TSM work with high-at-risk children Commonwealth wide, though most of it was in central and south-central Pennsylvania. TSM used educational motivational training cards called "Nittany Lion Tips," sponsoring conferences for high school “Sophomores” (Some Recruits), on community leadership and week-long camps for children with behavioral and academic problems, and has a mentor program that matches Penn State volunteers with at-risk elementary students. Penn State Football and Athletic Volunteers often use slogans on Penn State Football and taught to say "The children we serve have often experienced many broken promises in their young lives; that's why our mantra has always been 'No Broken Promises, Ever.' We need to continue to be the family they can count on," Second Mile's 2010 annual report said.
Maybe things stabilized when Freeh was brought in at first, with the thinking that he would do a truly independent investigation, but the crap really hit the fan when he released his report.
Maybe is not a Fact, most of Freeh Report was involved in providing 119 Recommendations to correct the Penn State Football Paterno Era and Errors was not following on Educational Laws such as Title IX & Clery Act, Big Ten Athletic Integrity Agreement No Code of Conduct, Factual Intimidation of Employee of PSU Violations of NCAA Rules of Lack of Institutional Control, University Conflicts of Interests, and the University Trustees put in 116 of those Recommendations in Penn State 2012 Reforms that corrected the Penn State Football Program.
(I leave the rest of Freeh Report to Criminal Trials challenges, Spanier, Patrenos, and Other Civil Lawsuits as well PSU-PMA and soon to be PSU-TSM Insurers Contract Lawsuits. to be Fair to All to sort out in Court Discovery, Trials, Pleas, Dismissals or Settlements!)
Since then it has been discovered that the investigation was far from independent, and just about everyone now sees it as worthless, including PSU's current president, PSU's own lawyers (in the ongoing PMA case), and even Freeh himself, who called it nothing more than opinion in defense of his defamation suit vs. Spanier.
This is where and all the Cultist and sincere Alumni Lovers of Penn State some that came to be current Trustees. This is the Ziegler Narrative and includes Sandusky was Innocent but even Zeigler has abandon it now?
The PSU fans and mostly Cult ones are living in Bubbles that the OAG Investigation and Conviction of PSU Sandusky, Trustee's Freeh Report Guidelines, and NCAA Sanctions with Monitor bursted.
Sure it has driven many Penn State Football Fans benn very stressful, feeling they have been wronged, and attracting crazy conspiracy theories you are espousing today.
Yet, it is now the Victim's Voices in Unsealed Settlements that have broken the Slogans and Myths of Paterno Era Football, and they suffered Nightmares from not being protected and ignored, but the Victim's Voices have busted that Bubble once and forever more, and Society and Media will not allow to it forgotten now.
The crisis has nothing to do with football money. There is SO much more money involved on the university side.
No, you are wrong, it has everything to do with Victim Voices now. Penn State football will always make money and now within Rules and Compliances better than ever due to Trustees Reforms recommended by Freeh! All that is happening now is waiting for other Criminal, Contract, and Civil Court Cases to be resolved.
All Penn Staters now have to a better effort to understand it took decades to unite PSU and now it may decades to get over and start to mend the divide and by coming on the Lair where relationships and isolated beliefs based on slogans on BWI can be talked out!
The real head scratcher for me, though, is how you just ignore TSM. IMHO, TSM is the key to the whole thing.
Well, it is time to understand that is not all of it by any means at all?
It is the beliefs and demand that Paterno did not doing anything wrong, did not make mistakes, in fact may have unintentionally ignored more than his family ever knew, and had some bad misjudgements as well, and he admitted it too.
It is time most of you to admit the same about him and quick calling everyone Nittany Liars or the Lair the Liar when lies are only at Penn State many websites?
Penn State Trustees too responsibility for Victim's in settlements, put in Reforms to correct the Football Program, and the NCAA reduced Sanctions and gave back Paterno Vacated Wins, and that Penn State Football Paterno Era is over and buried.
If you are still scratching your head it is because you have been ignoring the Victim's Voices from day one, and still believe in slogans proven false from yesterday, and blaming it all on Penn State Hate?
But that is you beliefs and your isolated bubble fans beliefs that you won't accept it was always a Total Penn State Scandal and Paterno was there too when it happen and it tarnish his Legacy and Statue?
Here's the bottom line. Without the nitters trying to spin their story.
As far back as the late 90's. Ex Penn st players made running jokes about Sandusky. This is fact. Yet, Joe Paterno never heard one thing about his nasty Defensive coordinator.........come on man!
On top of Penn st and Jopa allowing Sandusky free reign around the football program.
He was in booth with the media for crying out loud a couple months before he was arrested.
As far back as the late 90's. Ex Penn st players made running jokes about Sandusky. This is fact. Yet, Joe Paterno never heard one thing about his nasty Defensive coordinator.........come on man!
On top of Penn st and Jopa allowing Sandusky free reign around the football program.
He was in booth with the media for crying out loud a couple months before he was arrested.
Perhaps you should actually read my post where I explicitly said I hope all who were complicit with Sandusky's crimes are brought to justice.
Fair enough.
It also would have been nice if you would acknowledge that I didn't "diminish" ANYTHING as regards Penn State's role in this. Your post insinuating such was 100% dead wrong.
Perhaps I insinuated more than I should and you have been a breath of fresh air compared to the usual PSU posters who show up here. Peace.
Sorry for not getting back sooner. I'm not ignoring TSM at all. In fact, I agree 100% that it's the cornerstone of the entire cluster. Seems to me that someone involved with both TSM and PSU was in charge of protecting the very rich and powerful. Football program was an east get so they let the world feast on it.
I can't possibly allege that Joe knew that or was actively helping to cover anything up for TSM. I do believe he put football first and that his insatiable desire to win overwhelmed his judgment. That seems difficult to argue at this point.
These lunatics are really brainwashed. What a pathetic bunch of blind sheep!
https://bwi.forums.rivals.com/threads/interesting-quote-from-paterno-by-the-book.133313/
https://bwi.forums.rivals.com/threads/interesting-quote-from-paterno-by-the-book.133313/
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