I think I underestimated the PSU hate

[pittman71]

not from just Pitt fans but people in general lol. This plan to honor Paterno on the 17th has the rest of the country seeing red.

Maybe they need to rethink this lol, people are back talking about giving PSU the death penalty again

 

[mcm265]

As a PSU alum, I'm not overly thrilled with the idea on Sept 17 (I DO think there is a time/place to recognize Paterno's contributions to the school at some point). But the question I often ask is 'why are people outside of the PSU program so consumed by this?'

I am disgusted by the Joe-Bot crowd as much as you are - trust me. They have put all PSU alums in a very difficult position. How can we balance currently supporting our alma mater while not attaching ourselves to that pathetic, lunatic fringe ('Sandusky might not be guilty', etc)?

I think honoring Paterno's first game as coach is harmless. I think it's a bit tone-deaf - but it's not malicious. And if the PSU folks want to do that, without infringing on another program, why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? The past cannot be washed clean - and that should apply to both the good and bad. I know that no one will forget the bad. But are we then supposed to turn around and forget the good? I dunno, its a weird situation now. Which sucks...

 

[9nationalchampionships]

Every opponent is going to let the cult have it this season. If they would just accept that their administration screwed up, including the grand wizzard, people would accept them. They bring this on themselves IMO

 

[pittman71]

As a PSU alum, I'm not overly thrilled with the idea on Sept 17 (I DO think there is a time/place to recognize Paterno's contributions to the school at some point). But the question I often ask is 'why are people outside of the PSU program so consumed by this?'

I am disgusted by the Joe-Bot crowd as much as you are - trust me. They have put all PSU alums in a very difficult position. How can we balance currently supporting our alma mater while not attaching ourselves to that pathetic, lunatic fringe ('Sandusky might not be guilty', etc)?

I think honoring Paterno's first game as coach is harmless. I think it's a bit tone-deaf - but it's not malicious. And if the PSU folks want to do that, without infringing on another program, why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? The past cannot be washed clean - and that should apply to both the good and bad. I know that no one will forget the bad. But are we then supposed to turn around and forget the good? I dunno, its a weird situation now. Which sucks...

first off I have basically ignored the issues regarding Paterno/Joe-Bot crowd so I would fall into the category of "non-PSU'ers". I just follow Pitt and my main focus on this game on Saturday was strictly football related. But like the Wall Street Journal and Huffington Post articles posted on this board have shown, people across this country really despise the PSU fanbase for their support of someone who MOST BELIEVE covered up crimes of child abuse for over 30 years, at least.

As far as the good vs bad it doesn't get much worse than covering up child sexual abuse, only thing worse is being the one committing the abuse. So yes I would say, publicly anyway, FORGET the good and move on from this. This celebration on the 17th was stupid and will just bring the hatred/wrath of the country back down on PSU like it was 5 years ago.

 

[ncyajleel]

It's the whole arrogant "We Are" pride in the face of a terrible scandal that involved children. If any of them would show some humility and remorse, people wouldn't hate them so much. They make themselves out to be the victim in this when it was that "We Are" pride that enabled this all to happen.

 

[BigNittanyLion]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

 

[pittiswhereiamfrom2]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

You were mostly glad that it didn't disrupt 30 years of enjoying your fake "success with honor" football program.

 

[Swervin27]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

Well you guys do sort of ask for it with your constant denial. Here is some advice, take the Andy Pettite strategy of quickly admitting your mistake, apologize and it's forgotten.. You deny, lie, deny, lie, well this is what you get.. At least follow what psu students are trying to do and separate psu from paterno and the past skeletons, they want a new psu.. You guys follow these kids, you'll be better off..

 

[pittman71]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

You have read the articles from the Wall Street Journal and Huffington Post, right? This is why I say I underestimated the hate for PSU, this is way beyond just Pitt fans it is the entire country. I just came from a message board on another site, not specific to either Pitt or Penn State but just a sports message board, and THEY were trashing PSU and their fans. That is what prompted me to make this thread, the source of the hatred is this celebration of Paterno next week.

Look you can still enjoy the game next week, none of the kids or coaches on the field had anything to do with this scandal and shouldn't have to suffer because of it. These people who support Paterno should, imo, do it privately and not publicly, and let the issue die.

 

[mcm265]

first off I have basically ignored the issues regarding Paterno/Joe-Bot crowd so I would fall into the category of "non-PSU'ers". I just follow Pitt and my main focus on this game on Saturday was strictly football related. But like the Wall Street Journal and Huffington Post articles posted on this board have shown, people across this country really despise the PSU fanbase for their support of someone who MOST BELIEVE covered up crimes of child abuse for over 30 years, at least.

As far as the good vs bad it doesn't get much worse than covering up child sexual abuse, only thing worse is being the one committing the abuse. So yes I would say, publicly anyway, FORGET the good and move on from this. This celebration on the 17th was stupid and will just bring the hatred/wrath of the country back down on PSU like it was 5 years ago.

you bring up a good point. This puts that spotlight back on the university and its people. The issue is just getting recycled and recycled over and over. The story just never ends. Its awful for everyone associated with the school. And I blame the FEW IDIOTS who are hell bent on restoring perceptions. Nobody is changing their opinions on the matter at this point. It's exhausting and now I can't stand my own fans (the crazy crowd) in addition to our opponents. In my experience this is the case for about 90% of PSU alums under the age of 40....

 

[Swervin27]

you bring up a good point. This puts that spotlight back on the university and its people. The issue is just getting recycled and recycled over and over. The story just never ends. Its awful for everyone associated with the school. And I blame the FEW IDIOTS who are hell bent on restoring perceptions. Nobody is changing their opinions on the matter at this point. It's exhausting and now I can't stand my own fans (the crazy crowd) in addition to our opponents. In my experience this is the case for about 90% of PSU alums under the age of 40....

You need to do what the germans did and just wait it out.. eventually that generation will die off..

Not similar, but we have an older generation that still thinks it's 1978 here and that Pitt is a "blue Blood" program and anything less than 10 wins is unacceptable.. Kind of weird since it's been, well about 3+ decades since we've realistically been there. It's kind of like someone in their mid 30s still hanging out at college bars and thinking they can pull 19 year old wool out of the place when in reality, it hasn't happened since they were themselves 19..

 

[anon_vmuicqnzlyp3u]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

Well then tell your JoeBots to stop the "We are crap" "Success with Honor crap" the "Grand Experiment" and it might go away. Admit Joe knew, covered it up in the name of football and move on and people might start to accept your kind again.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

I just throw my arms up in resignation of the BWI Board.

When Pitt fans (as well as fans from other schools) go to the BWI Board to just discuss football topics (no Joe Pa stuff) in a non attacking manner they find themselves "BANNED" for rules violation.

What kind of Board is that.

That is why you guys are in a "Bubble Board" that restricts open and free discussion.

Why is that.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[MIPittfan]

The lunatic fringe at psu, be it a majority or a very vocal minority, will not let the issue pass. As long as they keep bringing it up, so to will the people who feel this is a great injustice to the victims.

 

[pittiswhereiamfrom2]

You need to do what the germans did and just wait it out.. eventually that generation will die off..

Not similar, but we have an older generation that still thinks it's 1978 here and that Pitt is a "blue Blood" program and anything less than 10 wins is unacceptable.. Kind of weird since it's been, well about 3+ decades since we've realistically been there. It's kind of like someone in their mid 30s still hanging out at college bars and thinking they can pull 19 year old wool out of the place when in reality, it hasn't happened since they were themselves 19..

Not only not similar but not even relevant. In fact, no reason to try to identify with this person as this person is quite literally ignorant.

 

[ncyajleel]

Are you truly this stupid? Is that possible. You are the inbred ass jacks that won't let it go. Who are the dumbasses that are celebrating a football coach's 50th anniversary of his first game? Do you know what a hypocrite is? Look in the mirror!
Of course YOU want to talk football, apparently your life is so pathetic that is all you have and how you identify yourself!

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

 

[BigNittanyLion]

Are you truly this stupid? Is that possible. You are the inbred ass jacks that won't let it go. Who are the dumbasses that are celebrating a football coach's 50th anniversary of his first game? Do you know what a hypocrite is? Look in the mirror!
Of course YOU want to talk football, apparently your life is so pathetic that is all you have and how you identify yourself!

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

 

[Swervin27]

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

 

[President Stache]

Well... reading BWI, which I never do... they have plenty of hate for us too.

Not sure what the reason is

 

[UPitt '89]

Well... reading BWI, which I never do... they have plenty of hate for us too.

Not sure what the reason is

I made a thread about this.

The reason they hate us so much is because Pitt fans... more than any other fanbase... keep holding a mirror up for them to look in. We won't let them "get past it".

And they hate us for it.

 

[pittzap]

Are you truly this stupid? Is that possible. You are the inbred ass jacks that won't let it go. Who are the dumbasses that are celebrating a football coach's 50th anniversary of his first game? Do you know what a hypocrite is? Look in the mirror!
Of course YOU want to talk football, apparently your life is so pathetic that is all you have and how you identify yourself!

Right, from the beginning, many of the Joebots wanted this to pass and to get things back to normal.....with the football program, not with the kids who were effected by this. Joe has been made the victim from the start. He wasn't, yet Nutjob PSU fans will not move on until everyone thinks Joe didn't di anything wrong. Every time someone defends him it pours more salt in the wound. People have no patience for crimes on kids, but thathas become secondary in all of this.

Big Nittany wants to throw up his hands, but he is representative of a group of people looking to move on from child rape simply to clear a dead coach's name. When people won't believe them, or when the rest of the world thinks they are a cult, they feel like they are being put out by all of this.

As has been mentioned, admit guilt, admit awful things happened, admit your coach and administration knew, show some freaking remorse, and then maybe other people will move on. The more certain Penn State people open their mouth, the worse it gets for them, as more and more things are uncovered.

 

[QuitCallingMeWanny]

Seriously BigNittanyLion is a parody account....I'm convinced of this

 

[UPitt '89]

Seriously BigNittanyLion is a parody account....I'm convinced of this

Except his words are exactly the same as hundreds of posters on BWI and other PSU sites.

If he's a parody of them, he's damn convincing. Because he uses their EXACT SAME words and arguments.

 

[NTOP]

I just throw my arms up in resignation. Since Pitt is the closest school to Penn State, we knew this would be something that will be brought up instead of football. But really I thought most people are past all of this stuff. I guess I am wrong. It is sad, it is ruining what I was hoping for, a nice football afternoon. I guess I am tired having our football games being sullied by this constant and repetitive rehashing of past events.

You're paying for your willful disregard for children. You are sick.

 

[Panther Parrothead]

As a PSU alum, I'm not overly thrilled with the idea on Sept 17 (I DO think there is a time/place to recognize Paterno's contributions to the school at some point). But the question I often ask is 'why are people outside of the PSU program so consumed by this?'

I am disgusted by the Joe-Bot crowd as much as you are - trust me. They have put all PSU alums in a very difficult position. How can we balance currently supporting our alma mater while not attaching ourselves to that pathetic, lunatic fringe ('Sandusky might not be guilty', etc)?

I think honoring Paterno's first game as coach is harmless. I think it's a bit tone-deaf - but it's not malicious. And if the PSU folks want to do that, without infringing on another program, why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? The past cannot be washed clean - and that should apply to both the good and bad. I know that no one will forget the bad. But are we then supposed to turn around and forget the good? I dunno, its a weird situation now. Which sucks...

It's a matter of timing. It's too soon. There are still too many wounds that haven't healed for a lot of people.

The fact that so many people are being critical should be sending a message to your administration. But unfortunately, your administration remains blind to what everyone else can see.

 

[MIPittfan]

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

perhaps the victims should should attend and attest as to how they feel about the great enabler

 

[Jpripper88]

As a PSU alum, I'm not overly thrilled with the idea on Sept 17 (I DO think there is a time/place to recognize Paterno's contributions to the school at some point). But the question I often ask is 'why are people outside of the PSU program so consumed by this?'

I am disgusted by the Joe-Bot crowd as much as you are - trust me. They have put all PSU alums in a very difficult position. How can we balance currently supporting our alma mater while not attaching ourselves to that pathetic, lunatic fringe ('Sandusky might not be guilty', etc)?

I think honoring Paterno's first game as coach is harmless. I think it's a bit tone-deaf - but it's not malicious. And if the PSU folks want to do that, without infringing on another program, why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? The past cannot be washed clean - and that should apply to both the good and bad. I know that no one will forget the bad. But are we then supposed to turn around and forget the good? I dunno, its a weird situation now. Which sucks...

Ummm...Joe Paterno is treated as a deity, despite the fact he (at best) ignored a pedophile for 40+ years and continued to give him access all over PSU. At worst he actively covered up the rapes/rapist because he feared it wouldn't ruin a completely fabricated and contrived legacy and still continued to give that man access to his program, campus, and games.

Joe Paterno was a despicable human being. Despicable.

 

[Jpripper88]

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

He stood for placing football and himself ahead of innocent and broken children being raped by his buddy. That is what Joe Paterno stood for. That is the person you idolize.

 

[pittzap]

It's a matter of timing. It's too soon. There are still too many wounds that haven't healed for a lot of people.

The fact that so many people are being critical should be sending a message to your administration. But unfortunately, your administration remains blind to what everyone else can see.

Exactly! The whole world isn't wrong. The Joebots are.

 

[mcm265]

Ummm...Joe Paterno is treated as a deity, despite the fact he (at best) ignored a pedophile for 40+ years and continued to give him access all over PSU. At worst he actively covered up the rapes/rapist because he feared it wouldn't ruin a completely fabricated and contrived legacy and still continued to give that man access to his program, campus, and games.

Joe Paterno was a despicable human being. Despicable.

Joe Paterno is dead. Your not changing your opinion on him. I'm not changing mine. And the Joe-Bots aren't changing theirs. So what is the debate? This is what I don't understand. What do the non-PSU folks want to get out of these types of discussions? If they are waiting for PSU supporters to say all PSU is scum and Joe Paterno is the devil, that's never going to happen. "But JoePa is an enabler" is the response I would expect to this question. That's why PSU folks like myself get frustrated. I'm not going to detest my love for the university and it's history. I don't have another alma mater.

 

[ViciousHitter]

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

Well, he didn't build it.

 

[Jpripper88]

Joe Paterno is dead. Your not changing your opinion on him. I'm not changing mine. And the Joe-Bots aren't changing theirs. So what is the debate? This is what I don't understand. What do the non-PSU folks want to get out of these types of discussions? If they are waiting for PSU supporters to say all PSU is scum and Joe Paterno is the devil, that's never going to happen. "But JoePa is an enabler" is the response I would expect to this question. That's why PSU folks like myself get frustrated. I'm not going to detest my love for the university and it's history. I don't have another alma mater.

But everyone else sees his legacy as BS and that he was (at best) non-acting for 40+ years while Sandusky raped innocent children. So, any act to honor him is seen as disgusting and completely tone deaf by the rest of the world. So what is your debate? Everyone thinks PSU is trash for doing something like this. His entire legacy is tied to his longevity and total control of a program, which he built on a false premise of a "Grand Experiment" and "Success With Honor" so it is a complete sham and the Sandusky thing let people see it was even worse than everyone in the B1G and close proximity to PSU knew all along. No one else is debating. Everyone else agrees honoring Paterno makes PSU look like a joke and a cult, who hasn't learned a damn thing. PSU fans can't figure out why they would think that.

Love your alma mater. Appreciate the school. Understand EVERYTHING that happened to build your football program was a complete farce, even more tragic and contrived than ever imagined when we all found out about Sandusky and, most importantly, the fact PSU, and specifically Paterno, covered it up for years, so it wouldn't hurt the program or PSU. That is the truth. Nothing Joe Paterno did should ever be honored. Ever.

 

[CrazyPaco]

But everyone else sees his legacy as BS and that he was (at best) non-acting for 40+ years while Sandusky raped innocent children. So, any act to honor him is seen as disgusting and completely tone deaf by the rest of the world. So what is your debate? Everyone thinks PSU is trash for doing something like this. His entire legacy is tied to his longevity and total control of a program, which he built on a false premise of a "Grand Experiment" and "Success With Honor" so it is a complete sham and the Sandusky thing let people see it was even worse than everyone in the B1G and close proximity to PSU knew all along. No one else is debating. Everyone else agrees honoring Paterno makes PSU look like a joke and a cult, who hasn't learned a damn thing. PSU fans can't figure out why they would think that.

Love you alma mater. Appreciate the school. Understand EVERYTHING that happened to build your football program was a complete farce, even more tragic and contrived than ever imagined when we all found out about Sandusky and, most importantly, the fact PSU, and specifically Paterno, covered it up for years, so it wouldn't hurt the program or PSU. That is the truth. Nothing Joe Paterno did should ever be honored. Ever.

And it insults victims of rape and abuse anywhere, and reinforces the concept to the victims that it is futile to seek justice or confront attackers that are in any place of power or importance or adulation, and that change from a permissive culture that exists at a place like Penn State is unobtainable. It is completely abhorrent.

 

[PITTLAW]

I have a great life thank you very much. We are celebrating Joe at the stadium he built in front of the fans that adore him. If people don't like him or what he stood for, they don't have to attend.

Be sure, "we" will not be attending. However, should those of you that adore him wish to carry on a celebration publicly in remembering or honoring anything to do with his coaching career--public discussion and comment will follow. Perhaps you should follow your own advice and ignore the comments and discussion that ensue? Personally, I find it quite odd to celebrate a dead football coach, but if there is nothing better to celebrate up there--I guess you go with it. I guess we can expect future celebrations for other "milestones" in his career? Either way, if Joe's adoring fans are so tone deaf as to not understand or perceive the issue raised by such a celebration--why not be tone deaf to the comments and criticism that follows. Presume it would also be easy for you folks that read to ignore the Wall Street Journal, Panther Lair and other public forums where the comments are written? Hail to Pitt!

 

[Panther Parrothead]

But everyone else sees his legacy as BS and that he was (at best) non-acting for 40+ years while Sandusky raped innocent children. So, any act to honor him is seen as disgusting and completely tone deaf by the rest of the world. So what is your debate? Everyone thinks PSU is trash for doing something like this. His entire legacy is tied to his longevity and total control of a program, which he built on a false premise of a "Grand Experiment" and "Success With Honor" so it is a complete sham and the Sandusky thing let people see it was even worse than everyone in the B1G and close proximity to PSU knew all along. No one else is debating. Everyone else agrees honoring Paterno makes PSU look like a joke and a cult, who hasn't learned a damn thing. PSU fans can't figure out why they would think that.

Love you alma mater. Appreciate the school. Understand EVERYTHING that happened to build your football program was a complete farce, even more tragic and contrived than ever imagined when we all found out about Sandusky and, most importantly, the fact PSU, and specifically Paterno, covered it up for years, so it wouldn't hurt the program or PSU. That is the truth. Nothing Joe Paterno did should ever be honored. Ever.

This is what the Nit faithful don't seem to understand. By honoring Paterno, the university has taken an official position in the matter. And in essence, they're honoring a guy who was unceremoniously fired because of the various things that happened.

It's crazy and nonsensical. And it's a stupid position to take, as they're knowingly putting themselves in the crosshairs of a most controversial topic. As a tax payer who indirectly supports this school, I don't like the position that they've taken at all.

 

[DT_PITT]

It's the whole arrogant "We Are" pride in the face of a terrible scandal that involved children. If any of them would show some humility and remorse, people wouldn't hate them so much. They make themselves out to be the victim in this when it was that "We Are" pride that enabled this all to happen.

This is EXACTLY it.

 

[mcm265]

What happens when the victims of Jerry Sandusky meet the kids who were part of/benefitted from Thon? Both can be linked to the football program. My point is, there's lots of gray areas. People point to PSU and say either 'Black or White'. You can easily make a case that Joe Paterno is the devil. You can also easily make the case that he was a saint. It probably falls somewhere in the middle. Make no mistake - I'm not saying this board is wrong. I'm just not willing to say your right. Both extremes of the argument give me heartburn at times... This is an endless discussion. I'm going to bail out for now. Good luck on Saturday. I hope you guys stay at least 1 point behind us all the way through. I'll be at my sister-in-laws wedding in Wexford, missing the whole thing. son of a.....!

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

you bring up a good point. This puts that spotlight back on the university and its people. The issue is just getting recycled and recycled over and over. The story just never ends. Its awful for everyone associated with the school. And I blame the FEW IDIOTS who are hell bent on restoring perceptions. Nobody is changing their opinions on the matter at this point. It's exhausting and now I can't stand my own fans (the crazy crowd) in addition to our opponents. In my experience this is the case for about 90% of PSU alums under the age of 40....

But the problem is that it's not just a few idiots. Based on your alumni elections for the board, the constant petitions signed by hundreds of former players, the Paterno merchandise for sale in every campus shop and other incidences, it's clear that it is a large and significant portion of the Penn State alumni and fan bases. Even if what PSU is doing is harmless, it just encourages the cultists and pushes them further and further. It doesn't appease them. It just makes them move onto the next item on their agenda: restore the statue, publicly apologize to the family, rename the stadium after him, purge the BoT and fire the President. By now, the PSU leadership should understand that there is absolutely no middle ground that they can meet these people on in order to move on. I seriously have to wonder at what point do kids, particularly out-of-state kids, start crossing PSU off a list of potential schools.

 

[Joe Pa Thetic]

why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? ..

Decent, moral human beings are nauseated at the school formally honoring someone who, at the absolute very best, did nothing to stop the abuse of children. When honoring someone who stood by and did nothing while children were being abused suddenly becomes acceptable to society as a whole, that will be a sad day for humanity.

 

[Saboteur]

As a PSU alum, I'm not overly thrilled with the idea on Sept 17 (I DO think there is a time/place to recognize Paterno's contributions to the school at some point). But the question I often ask is 'why are people outside of the PSU program so consumed by this?'

I am disgusted by the Joe-Bot crowd as much as you are - trust me. They have put all PSU alums in a very difficult position. How can we balance currently supporting our alma mater while not attaching ourselves to that pathetic, lunatic fringe ('Sandusky might not be guilty', etc)?

I think honoring Paterno's first game as coach is harmless. I think it's a bit tone-deaf - but it's not malicious. And if the PSU folks want to do that, without infringing on another program, why do non-PSU'ers feel the need to be heard in the matter? The past cannot be washed clean - and that should apply to both the good and bad. I know that no one will forget the bad. But are we then supposed to turn around and forget the good? I dunno, its a weird situation now. Which sucks...

From my perspective, it is the years of claiming "Success with Honor" when the opposite was the unknown reality.