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Jeff Capel is not the answer

Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself
I’m sorry you expressed yourself also.
 
These things take time. Our instant gratification society doesn’t allow that to happen. I want Pitt to be good again as bad, or worse, than anyone but if Pitt is going to be a turnstile of coaches, they won’t ever be good again. JC is going to get 5 years minimum to get this thing fixed. Like a lot of people have said, a basketball program can be turned around much quicker than football but we simply aren’t there yet. He needs to get better players and do a better job of having those players ready to play every night so games like SFU, Wake, ND, and NC State don’t happen. Hell, losing to ND isn’t even a black eye unless you play the way they did. I als
 
Jeff Capel is a good fit for Pitt. ACC coach who will get some good recruits to Oakland. You won’t get high 4 or 5 stars but you’ll get good recruits. He’s not Huggs, Lon Kruger, Mark Few, Chris Beard or Jay Wright once he’s on the court (ie. Good x and o coach).

He’s more like K, Cal or Roy Williams...coaches who are incredible recruiters, leaders of young men, etc. but not necessarily known as best x and o guys. Often, you’ll see assistants drawing up plays in a K or Cal huddle. Of course, he’s not to that level but I think he’s capable to bring good seasons to Pitt. Charismatic guy who should be able to recruit fairly well (ie. His strength).

I understand it doesn’t take long to turn over roster but you’ve got to give a coach at least 4-5 years in hoops (and 6-7 in football). I could be wrong but I believe he erroneously reached for highly rated recruits and was rebuked by most/all. He will learn what he can bring to Oakland, adjust and recruit fairly well. You’re asking for trouble if you remove coaches every couple seasons and word will get out in the coaching community.
 
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coaches who are incredible recruiters, leaders of young men, etc. but not necessarily known as best x and o guys.

The problem is ( outside of those who favor his politics and rhetoric) there is little evidence to suggest that he is leading young men with any extraordinary charisma, or is an "incredible" recruiter.
In fact evidence as to the former is leaning the other way.
 
The problem is ( outside of those who favor his politics and rhetoric) there is little evidence to suggest that he is leading young men with any extraordinary charisma, or is an "incredible" recruiter.
In fact evidence as to the former is leaning the other way.
As I stated, he’s not to those levels yet but has certainly reached “good recruiter” level. This is based off of his VCU, OU, and Duke experiences.

My guess (and it’s just that) is that he is a “net negative” Xs and Os coach, but there are tons of those littered in college hoops.
 
Based on our 3 highest rated recruits (Jeffress, Hugley and McGowens) being a non factor or not on the team anymore, our 5-8 ACC record or the plethora of 2021 recruits in the fold? I’ll hang up and listen.

So generalizations like “he has his eyes on players” :rolleyes: and “transfers and JC guys” don’t mean anything for 2021?

I would imagine landing Efton Reid would change things immediately. I don’t follow recruiting that closely but from what I gather he’s a pretty big mystery.
 
Not sure the disdain for Jeffress. Kid reclassified and most of his peers are still playing in HS gyms. How many of them do you think can contribute at a P6 school right now. Remember there was no off season conditioning programs or individual practices during summer. Not to mention the Covid breaks which eliminated even more practices. Kid is going to be real, real good. Maybe even better than that. I hope he does it at Pitt.
 
Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself
I think the problem is, since you say capel isn't the answer, you don't know the question.
 
Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself
Here’s guessing this guy also belongs to a “ Firec Mike Tomlin” page. Hmmmmm
 
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What legit transfer is going to come to a program who’s missed the NCAAs five consecutive seasons?

The JuCo ranks blow anymore overall. Kids with grade issues go to prep schools these days instead of heading to junior college, or so I‘read. There is a better chance I’ll see Reid here in Austin, Texas, playing for the local GLeague team or as a visitor than we will him in a Pitt uniform.
 
Based on our 3 highest rated recruits (Jeffress, Hugley and McGowens) being a non factor or not on the team anymore, our 5-8 ACC record or the plethora of 2021 recruits in the fold? I’ll hang up and listen.
Whichita State re did their whole team with transfers this season and lost its coach. No one knows what this or any team will look like next year with possible free transfers and seniors who have been given an extra year. They are also free to transfer regardless of the rule being passed as grad transfers.
 
Based on our 3 highest rated recruits (Jeffress, Hugley and McGowens) being a non factor or not on the team anymore, our 5-8 ACC record or the plethora of 2021 recruits in the fold? I’ll hang up and listen.
So JC is the only head coach in the history of college bb to have a highly rated recruit ( for Pitt ) not to live up to expectations in Trey . Since Trey is still the same old Trey in Nebraska I guess that’s still JC fault ?

JC is also probably the only HC to ever have a player doing something incredibly stupid off the court .

JC also must be a horrible HC since he hasn’t turned a true HS senior into an instant contributor in the ACC . If I remember correctly did anyone truly believe that Jeffress would come in and be a solid contributor this season !

It is a little troubling that JC hasn’t found his niche yet in what type of players he can successfully recruit and sign . I’m sure if he signed a player ranked similar to Justin C in the early signing period pundits like yourself would’ve been all over him for signing a kid ranked well over 200 in the early signing period .
 
If not him then who? The only other coach that was interested was Hurley and it's a given that he was just using us as leverage to squeeze every penny out of UConn. Then add in how many coaching jobs will be open this year because some people should have been dumped last year but weren't because of Covid. So far we have an opening 90 miles east of here and a conference opponent with an opening. Add in Wichita who were paying Marshall $3.5 million a year. Will Pitt offer be competitive because there will be competition for the hot young mid major coaches and top assistants.
 
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This is based off of his VCU, OU, and Duke experiences.

Basing ones ability to recruit while coaching for a legend at a Blue Blood is foolish, at Oklahoma it seems there were violations during his time, before he was fired, so the legitimate talented recruiter argument is reduced to VCU, but is still probably a positive.

I get what you are saying though, Capel's ceiling is a poor man's K, Cal. Roy , and in time if he can get a good x and o's guy he will be fine?
 
Jeff Capel is a good fit for Pitt. ACC coach who will get some good recruits to Oakland. You won’t get high 4 or 5 stars but you’ll get good recruits. He’s not Huggs, Lon Kruger, Mark Few, Chris Beard or Jay Wright once he’s on the court (ie. Good x and o coach).

He’s more like K, Cal or Roy Williams...coaches who are incredible recruiters, leaders of young men, etc. but not necessarily known as best x and o guys. Often, you’ll see assistants drawing up plays in a K or Cal huddle. Of course, he’s not to that level but I think he’s capable to bring good seasons to Pitt. Charismatic guy who should be able to recruit fairly well (ie. His strength).

I understand it doesn’t take long to turn over roster but you’ve got to give a coach at least 4-5 years in hoops (and 6-7 in football). I could be wrong but I believe he erroneously reached for highly rated recruits and was rebuked by most/all. He will learn what he can bring to Oakland, adjust and recruit fairly well. You’re asking for trouble if you remove coaches every couple seasons and word will get out in the coaching community.
This is not meant to rag on you, or coach Capel, but your first paragraph states Capel is a good fit for Pitt, and then your description of him in the 2nd paragraph seems to instead be a better argument for him not being a good fit.
 
This is not meant to rag on you, or coach Capel, but your first paragraph states Capel is a good fit for Pitt, and then your description of him in the 2nd paragraph seems to instead be a better argument for him not being a good fit.
He definitely has shortcomings on the court. He’s a good (potentially, very good) recruiter. I think his recruiting trumps his shortcomings. That is summarizing my 2nd paragraph.

Almost every coach has flaws....whether X and Os, recruiting, player management, leadership ability, ability to motivate players, etc. There are a few who are great at it all (Few and Wright come to mind).
 
Basing ones ability to recruit while coaching for a legend at a Blue Blood is foolish, at Oklahoma it seems there were violations during his time, before he was fired, so the legitimate talented recruiter argument is reduced to VCU, but is still probably a positive.

I get what you are saying though, Capel's ceiling is a poor man's K, Cal. Roy , and in time if he can get a good x and o's guy he will be fine?
I’d take a poor mans Coach K , Cal or Roy in a heartbeat for my HC at Pitt .

Pitt got extremely lucky in hiring a little named coach from NAz and even luckier in hiring his assistant when he left by default and if JC doesn’t workout the only way Pitt will ever get a special coach is by pure luck . Pitt will never outbid any major program for a HC that’s in demand and no up and comer is going to risk his future by coming to a troubled ACC program .

Pitts best course of action is to stay the course and see if JC can find his way to recruit successfully here at Pitt .
 
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The problem is ( outside of those who favor his politics and rhetoric) there is little evidence to suggest that he is leading young men with any extraordinary charisma, or is an "incredible" recruiter.
In fact evidence as to the former is leaning the other way.
The only folks worried about his politics are those who aren’t comfortable with equality
 
Basing ones ability to recruit while coaching for a legend at a Blue Blood is foolish, at Oklahoma it seems there were violations during his time, before he was fired, so the legitimate talented recruiter argument is reduced to VCU, but is still probably a positive.

I get what you are saying though, Capel's ceiling is a poor man's K, Cal. Roy , and in time if he can get a good x and o's guy he will be fine?
Correct. I think he will recruit good players to Pitt (that HAS to be the desired expectation of Pitt fans when he was hired....it certainly couldn’t have been that he would be great at Xs and Os...these things are known in coaching circles). It sounds like he overreached to a degree in his first season or two. However, you’ve got to give him time to hone in on better recruits that are to level of Pitt (which can still be good players) and not Duke. That’s not realistic.
 
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Jeff has been a head coach for 12 years.

How long until he figures all these things out? 5 more years? 10 years?

Asking for a friend
Tell your friend I think coming in here he knew Duke level recruits were off the table , but what he’s finding out that so are the next level of recruits.

He got very lucky in how JC turned out , he was rated in the 240’s coming out of hs . Imagine how folks would respond to a class if he recruited four guys in a 200 to 240 range ! For Pitt to get over the hump in the ACC they need a couple more JC like surprises .
 
Tell your friend I think coming in here he knew Duke level recruits were off the table , but what he’s finding out that so are the next level of recruits.

He got very lucky in how JC turned out , he was rated in the 240’s coming out of hs . Imagine how folks would respond to a class if he recruited four guys in a 200 to 240 range ! For Pitt to get over the hump in the ACC they need a couple more JC like surprises .

Then why did he spend so much time going after Duke level recruits?
 
Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself

Great guy. Hope it works out for him here but its not looking like it will.....mostly because of his poor recruiting. He wasnt hired to outcoach his ACC counterparts. He was hired to recruit like juggernauts SHU, Prov, Creighton, Miami, LSU, Alabama, etc and win on talent.
 
Then why did he spend so much time going after Duke level recruits?
Therein lies the rub. I wish Jeff capel and staff were the answer. But there is no particular recruiting plan, no rhyme or reason to anything Pitt does... it seems. They pinned all their hopes on Reid? If he comes here I’ll streak through the quad naked. He’s not going to Pitt.

He was brought here to elevate Pitt’s recruiting. And 5th in the ACC (probably 11th sans Trey now), 11th in the ACC, 7th in the ACC and last in the ACC this year is not gonna do it.

And for the billionth time, everyone knows how young Jeffress is. Why are you guys convinced he’s gonna be a good player? He was the composite 125th player in the country and has looked completely out of place the entire year. He’s shown zero flashes of being a very good player. I’m not asking him to be a stud right now. Give us SOMETHING. We’re a 5-8 ACC team. It’s not like I’m asking him to contribute at FSU or UVA. He’s played AAU against older players his entire life.

And for the people defending Capel on Hugley. That’s fine, it’s not his fault he did what he did. But he had huge red flags coming out of Brush. Immaturity, anger issues that were constantly on display in AAU. When you make 3.5 million dollars, you are accountable for EVERYTHING in the program. He’s making way too much money to absolve blame of every failure because we won 0 conference games when HS seniors were trying to get handjobs in 8th grade gym
 
Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself

Absolutely not true. Every statistical element both offensively and defensively, this current team is better than the first two years. And also our rank among other teams in those categories has improved as well.

Defensively we have the best rebounding team of the last three years. That is DRBs only I am considering. We have more offensive rebounds too. We are taking more shots but are also making a higher percentage of them.

Free throws this is our worst shooting percentage year. We make about the same number of free throws as last year but are getting to the line more but not taking advantage.

We are allowing teams to take more shots than in any other year. They aren’t necessarily making a higher percentage of shots but more shots at same scoring rate results in higher opponent than scoring than in past years. Our PPG is higher too and that is why games are close but we still are losing.

So again, statistically this is the best team of Capel’s three years. It just is not translating into wins.
 
You make the same excuses over and over.. Same thing you did for Stallings..

Pathetic
First of all I’m not making excuses I’m just telling you the way I see it . Without a booster group facilitating the recruitment of program changing athletes ( in both Fb and bb ) it should be obvious to anyway who pays attention to Pitt athletics that they cannot compete with schools who WANT to win and will do whatever is necessary to do so .

I never thought KS was the answer , but I think the perception of both coaches ( KS and JC ) coming in is that it shouldn’t be that tough to recruit well at Pitt . After all it‘s an ACC school with nice faculties in a big city urban environment etc , but the realities seem to suggest otherwise ...don’t they . Say what you want about KS , but he recruited several No. 1 NBA draft picks to Vandy .

Not only have KS and JC had a difficult time recruiting to Pitt JDs last four ( I’m counting the Kithcart class too ) classes were well below average with only MYoung being a top 100 player .
 
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Absolutely not true. Every statistical element both offensively and defensively, this current team is better than the first two years. And also our rank among other teams in those categories has improved as well.

Defensively we have the best rebounding team of the last three years. That is DRBs only I am considering. We have more offensive rebounds too. We are taking more shots but are also making a higher percentage of them.

Free throws this is our worst shooting percentage year. We make about the same number of free throws as last year but are getting to the line more but not taking advantage.

We are allowing teams to take more shots than in any other year. They aren’t necessarily making a higher percentage of shots but more shots at same scoring rate results in higher opponent than scoring than in past years. Our PPG is higher too and that is why games are close but we still are losing.

So again, statistically this is the best team of Capel’s three years. It just is not translating into wins.
This is reasonable

we are better year to year
I’m concerned with the lack of in season progression
 
Therein lies the rub. I wish Jeff capel and staff were the answer. But there is no particular recruiting plan, no rhyme or reason to anything Pitt does... it seems. They pinned all their hopes on Reid? If he comes here I’ll streak through the quad naked. He’s not going to Pitt.

He was brought here to elevate Pitt’s recruiting. And 5th in the ACC (probably 11th sans Trey now), 11th in the ACC, 7th in the ACC and last in the ACC this year is not gonna do it.

And for the billionth time, everyone knows how young Jeffress is. Why are you guys convinced he’s gonna be a good player? He was the composite 125th player in the country and has looked completely out of place the entire year. He’s shown zero flashes of being a very good player. I’m not asking him to be a stud right now. Give us SOMETHING. We’re a 5-8 ACC team. It’s not like I’m asking him to contribute at FSU or UVA. He’s played AAU against older players his entire life.

And for the people defending Capel on Hugley. That’s fine, it’s not his fault he did what he did. But he had huge red flags coming out of Brush. Immaturity, anger issues that were constantly on display in AAU. When you make 3.5 million dollars, you are accountable for EVERYTHING in the program. He’s making way too much money to absolve blame of every failure because we won 0 conference games when HS seniors were trying to get handjobs in 8th grade gym

Yeah the recruiting plan is weird. Contrary to what @Fsgolfdr thinks. Capel went after a bunch of top 25-30 recruits off the bat. Then he seemed to transition to hyper focusing on one kid like Davis or Reid.
 
Not sure the disdain for Jeffress. Kid reclassified and most of his peers are still playing in HS gyms. How many of them do you think can contribute at a P6 school right now. Remember there was no off season conditioning programs or individual practices during summer. Not to mention the Covid breaks which eliminated even more practices. Kid is going to be real, real good. Maybe even better than that. I hope he does it at Pitt.
I’m not worried about Jeffress at all, I think he’ll be a really good player. With the extra year of eligibility you could get he’s essentially redshirting but substituting the missed off-season work with in-game experience.
 
The only folks worried about his politics are those who aren’t comfortable with equality

On the contrary, the entire nation particularly within Academia, but elsewhere, is quite concerned with the politics and rhetoric in matters of equality, BLM, etc. HCJC not only seems to check all the boxes, but also as a person of color, he has instant credibility by way of real life experience which can be viewed as an advantage when handling the delicate situations which occur in handling personnel found in any supervisory position. Is it no fair to say that those who share his vision are pulling for him with a bit more vigor had he not been a good representative of something they are passionate about?
 
Then why did he spend so much time going after Duke level recruits?
In my judgment that has been his biggest mistake , he needs to find Pitts niche which so far he hasn’t .

Let’s assume that Pitts level is really a .500 team in the ACC , you won’t be satisfied and you’d say in a few yrs Pitt needs a new HC this guy is never going to win here . Until the university decides it wants to win no coach is coming in here and turning either the bb or Fb programs into championship level programs.
 
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Yeah the recruiting plan is weird. Contrary to what @Fsgolfdr thinks. Capel went after a bunch of top 25-30 recruits off the bat. Then he seemed to transition to hyper focusing on one kid like Davis or Reid.
I‘ve never advocated going after elite recruits nor putting all your eggs in one basket . Pitt simply isn’t a destination for elite athletes at least not since the demise of the Golden Panthers .

I‘ve always endorsed finding undersized guys with excellent bb skills that the big boys ignore .
 
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In my judgment that has been his biggest mistake , he needs to find Pitts niche which so far he hasn’t .

Let’s assume that Pitts level is really a .500 team in the ACC , you won’t be satisfied and you’d say in a few yrs Pitt needs a new HC this guy is never going to win here . Until the university decides it wants to win no coach is coming in here and turning either the bb or Fb programs into championship level programs.

Capel can't really have a "niche." He's not a niche coach. He's more of a "roll the balls out" guy who wins on talent. But he's not bringing in talent. Its not asking much for a Pitt HC to recruit as sell as SHU, Creighton, and Miami so I agree with him going after Top 25-75 guys.
 
Yeah the recruiting plan is weird. Contrary to what @Fsgolfdr thinks. Capel went after a bunch of top 25-30 recruits off the bat. Then he seemed to transition to hyper focusing on one kid like Davis or Reid.


The names are just being tighter lipped and Im being tighter lipped.

Mady Traore is a guy Ive mentioned months ago on here. He's a 6'11 power forward with lottery pick potential. He's already cut his list to 8 with Pitt in it and is a 2022 kid. And Traore can 100% reclassify. He is originally from France.


Again, Pitt has a wider net cast than Efton Reid for players on the table for 2021. That does not mean we will get these players, but there are more options on the table than just Reid. Pitt has a chance with Traore.


The Filipowski brothers from NY can also reclassify from 2022 as a second example. There are others...
 
Since he's been here this team has looked EXACTLY the same each year... 0 progression in any phase of anything ...he's a great man I'm sure but he is not the guy. Im not even sure there is a guy to fix this program, absolutely irrelevant at this point and I am sad. Sorry I had to express myself
Where does he is a great man come from? Just curious.
 
Yeah I voted in the last poll in pgh sports now that he won’t turn it around. Would love to be wrong but nothing I have seen has shown me that we are on the right track.
 
Capel has recruited a good, competitive roster with growing depth. The team yesterday battled maybe the best team in the ACC all game without its 2nd best player. I’m not exactly someone who looks through rose colored glasses, but we need to keep perspective. I do agree that Capel and his staff have failed in recruiting a capable ACC-level starting big man, but the other 4 positions are in very good shape. Now, as for in-game coaching and preparation, I do think there are some shortcomings, but I am not casting any judgment until after 4 years.
 
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