OK, did anyone think Narduzzi was this good?

[anon_d97v9o3a8b6xr]

I agree with all of that. The defense is absolutely well coached and a huge improvement over last year. But let's also keep in mind the competition. It took VaTech over TWENTY minutes to pick up a first down last year against Pitt. The Hokies had less than 30 rushing yards for the game and they picked up a lot of their yardage in the 4th Qtr, when it looked like the game was wrapped up.

Not to minimize yesterday's performance, but was against a bad offense with a backup QB in horrible weather conditions. Because if you go back and watch closely, there were plenty of plays to be made for Tech yesterday. Their QB was just incapable of making them. He is a deer in headlights when it comes to pressure.

There were also a ton of penalties by their oline that should have made their stats even worse. Our defense did a very good job. Their offensive line did a great job holding all game and an offensive pass interference that would have eliminated another field goal. Don't forget VT with backup scored a boatload of points against Purdue. Their defense couldn't stop ECU.

 

[Jeffburgh]

Today and last week was clear and convincing evidence that coaching does matter greatly. This defense that looked like a sieve last year, with pretty much the same players is among the top defenses in the country... almost overnight.

This was fun to watch today. I mean, on offense literally all we have is Boyd and a bunch of very young running backs, but we are still winning games simply by crushing it on defense.

GREAT GAME... damn it feels good to be a Panther

I liked his hiring a LOT, and have said he might be this program's Neo ...

 

[vegasgreed]

Hamlin has to be higher on Pitt and Sanders head is turning!

They should bring Hudson along as well.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

TD_6082, post: 373598, member: 510"]I love what I've seen from Duzzi so far. But lets pump the brakes here. This was a 4 point win versus a team we beat just as convincingly last year. Really, going back to 2001, Pitt owns VaTach.
It is not the winning by 4 points over VT or losing by 3 points to Iowa, it is about seeing the Offense not quit in the last minute at Iowa and score as well as the Special Teams block a Kick and score.

Additionally, seeing the Defense take control of the win and game the last possession of VT. This has not been seen around Pitt a long time and seeing the with changes in the Players Attitudes on how they are responding together is another example.

Most important as far as I concern is seeing Pitt play better from YSU to Akron to Iowa to VT? One can see Players coming forward each game, coaches selecting and improving them, and just progress from game to game on all 3 Units. However, like coach Pat said, so much more to do and never be satisfied.

The offense minus Boyd is a little scary to think about going foward. We really need to pick up recruiting in a big way.
No question about it, losing Connor was a big loss too, but bringing in a New OC outweighs them all, as far I am concern on coming unknowns on the Offense.

Chaney decided to mess with an Offense that scored over 30 Points the last few games last year, so it is on him now, more than any one Player.

At the same time, by playing QB Peterman it is clear Pitt has another back Up even if he goes down or starts to falter? Same with Running Backs and O-Linemen they are playing more now and will get better. The 2 Pitt Tight Ends are now bigger weapons as well.

Pitt has had 2 coaches that cared only about the Offense, but now we have one that knows how to build Defenses and find Special Team Coaches.

This is big at Pitt just like WVU keeps looking for a better Defensive Coach or Penn State now needs better QB, OC, and OL Coaches!

 

[thebadby2]

I certainly thought going into the season he would be good enough to be 3-1 or even 4-0 right now with the team he inherited against the teams we've played. Iowa appears to be better than I thought they were though. I will say the defense appears to be ahead of where I thought they would be-i expected instant improvement but they have been better than just improved-they have looked far better than they ever did under Chryst. But I want to see how they do against a good offensive team. I don't think we've played one yet and yes, I'm counting Iowa.

I'm worried about the offense. Narduzzi is the head coach so he's responsible for that too. Let's see how it looks in decent weather/field conditions, but a lot of what I'm concerned about has little to do with those factors. So as much as I like Duzzi, I am staying cautiously optimistic week to week. Many of the same posters who are gushing from every orifice about the Dooz after his first 4 games gushed about Chryst at various times too. It's an 11 game season and better opponents are yet to come, so there's a lot to be determined yet. Virginia is atrocious and we have them at home, so I'd like to see us just put an all out ass whippimg on them. A close game would not be encouraging, a loss to this team would be a huge setback.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

"TD_6082, post: 375281, member: 510"]I agree with all of that. The defense is absolutely well coached and a huge improvement over last year. But let's also keep in mind the competition. It took VaTech over TWENTY minutes to pick up a first down last year against Pitt. The Hokies had less than 30 rushing yards for the game and they picked up a lot of their yardage in the 4th Qtr, when it looked like the game was wrapped up.
Compare the improvements from YSU in each game progressing every game and a NO Quit Attitude. Iowa made a great Kick but Pitt was in that game until the last 2 seconds?

Not to minimize yesterday's performance, but was against a bad offense with a backup QB in horrible weather conditions. Because if you go back and watch closely, there were plenty of plays to be made for Tech yesterday. Their QB was just incapable of making them. He is a deer in headlights when it comes to pressure.
Both Teams struggle on Offense but Pitt's Defense stood up in the end!

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

I love what I see so far on the field. I'd just like to see him recruit a lot better, then I'll really be excited about the future.

If you like it, some recruits will start seeing it too, especially if Penn State continues to sputter and WVU gets blown away at Away Games, and OSU, Michigan & MSU are loaded with Talent! So, Pitt will catch and turn some eyes.

But right now recruiting needs improvements and winning can do that kind of thing as seen as MSU is now recruiting in the Top 15 today!!!

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

No question about it, losing Connor was a big loss too, but bringing in a New OC outweighs them all, as far I am concern on coming unknowns on the Offense.
Chaney decided to mess with an Offense that scored over 30 Points the last few games last year, so it is on him now, more than any one Player.

That's the way I see it -- A Pitt defense that looked mediocre last year now appears head and shoulders better because of the defensive coaches (Narduzzi included).

The offense returned almost everybody from a unit that played well and scored plenty of points last year. Chaney has enough to work with (even without Conner) to get the offense scoring more than it currently is. If Pitt struggles to put up more points this season, it's on Chaney (and the rest of the offensive staff) more than the players.

Like the DC is doing, he needs to show he can get everyone on his side playing up to their potential and that the plays he calls always match up well with the personnel he puts on the field.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

thebadby2, post: 375368, member: 1492"]I certainly thought going into the season he would be good enough to be 3-1 or even 4-0 right now with the team he inherited against the teams we've played. Iowa appears to be better than I thought they were though. I will say the defense appears to be ahead of where I thought they would be-i expected instant improvement but they have been better than just improved-they have looked far better than they ever did under Chryst. But I want to see how they do against a good offensive team. I don't think we've played one yet and yes, I'm counting Iowa.
Fair enough and good comment, but the Jury was still out on Chryst if you recall??? Chris Peak mentioned it last year saying no one knows if this team will improve in 2015 and Chryst's Coaching Tenure was still undecided. Bringing in Narduzzi is also undecided at this time.

I'm worried about the offense. Narduzzi is the head coach so he's responsible for that too. Let's see how it looks in decent weather/field conditions, but a lot of what I'm concerned about has little to do with those factors. So as much as I like Duzzi, I am staying cautiously optimistic week to week. Many of the same posters who are gushing from every orifice about the Dooz after his first 4 games gushed about Chryst at various times too.
I hated him after YSU & Cincy then he showed he could improve and make a team and then he went Inconsistent very similar to Graham, Wannstedt and Harris that latter two at least winning 9 and 10 games after 6 years for Walt and 3 years for Dave of rebuilding. All 4 Coaches made Coaching Mistakes on learning to become Head College Football Coach at a Power Conference Program and took time to become established and all 4 Coaches lost 2 to 3 games each year that they could have been won and most seldom beat Top 25 Ranked Competition? Duzzi did the same mistakes that Chryst did against Iowa, but looked to learn from it, can he continue to improve is the question for the remainder of 2015?

It's an 11 game season and better opponents are yet to come, so there's a lot to be determined yet. Virginia is atrocious and we have them at home, so I'd like to see us just put an all out ass whippimg on them. A close game would not be encouraging, a loss to this team would be a huge setback.
UVA should be a win, but up to the Coaching Staff to out coach and create a Great Game Plan with execution against London that has had Top 25 Recruiting and some Top Ten 5 Stars ESPN Recruits that last year sacked our QB and stop Boyd! UVA has played far tougher competition than Pitt too in UCLA, Boise and ND! Losing this game would not portend better things to come. Winning by 10 or more will do that in my opinion. Win Or A Toss Up Win!

Georgia Tech-This is the Coaching Test as far as I am concern. Coach Pat & Staff have to show they can beat Georgia Tech's Johnson & Staff, something Chryst could not do! If Pitt wins UVA by 10 and beats GT, I expect more wins not less. The same goes if Coach Pat & Staff loses and how they lose? It can go the other way and Pitt struggles to win 6 games, especially if Chaney does not improve the Offense?Toss Up If Pitt Beats UVA By 10? If Not Loss!

Syracuse-Always a tougher win than expected and was the reason why Pitt got to a Bowl Game under Chryst. Coach Pat & Staff must win this game if they have beaten UVA and even loses to GT! Win!

UNC-Chryst lost to them on Special teams but Pitt players played them great except on Special Teams. They are for real this year in the ACC right before going on Probation. Only if Chaney has Pitt Offense humming by this game will Pitt win. It will be a big test for the defense just like UVA and GT! too! I still see a lost at this time. Toss Up If Pitt Is 5-2?

Notre Dame-is very good this year and owes payback to Pitt from last year. Pitt always plays them tough and then loses. I expect a loss but another great measurement test for the Staff???? Loss!

Duke-Chryst beat them with a collapsing Defense and tremendous Offense in 2013, but then lost with horrible Special Teams giving back great drives with Kickoff returns and poor Play calling making Blewit miss when running wide instead of running to the middle. Shows Chryst was still learning to become a Head Coach and still is but on Wisky Dime now? Coach Pat & Staff have their work cut out for them and Chaney better have the Pitt Offense ready by then, if not Coach Pat may have to replace him next year? Toss Up Right Now!

ULou-Coach Pat is going against Petrino that is having trouble right now, but should be much better by the time they play Pitt. If Pitt wins UVA, GT, Cuse and Duke, they should beat ULou, if not, Toss Up!

Miami-Golden may have this team in trouble or humming by the 12th game just like last year.....more trouble but Connor won it. Chryst blew the win in 2013 when he allow Canes Special Teams to score big early and Pitt never could catch up despite playing great later. Coach Pat has the same task by this 12th Game, Pitt could be 9 to 10 Wins if he continues to improve Defense and Special Teams and Chaney straighten out the offense???? But if they lose 4 or more, Pitt will struggle to win 6 games as well and especially this one, mostly due to Chaney not living up to his changes on Pitt Offense. Connor may be back by this time too is still an unknown and would cause some problems just getting back with a team used to playing without him????

UVA will tell Pitt Fans many things about where Coach Pat & staff are at this time. GT will confirm it! Cuse & ULou will make or break a Bowl Game. Duke like GT could be the Improved Measurement Win? UNC, ND, & Miami will prove Pitt is a Very Good Coach or Great Coach or needs much more Tutoring? Recruiting will show some things too!

Coach Pat Narduzzi Scale Of Pitt Coaches!
YSU-Coach Pat & Staff did not lose like Chryst's First Game!
AKRON-Coah Pat & Staff did what they were suppose to do unlike Chryst, Wannstedt and Harris that lost to MAC Teams?
IOWA-Wannstedt beat them Graham, Chryst & Narduzzzi lost?
VT-Coach Pat did what Harris & Chryst did!
4 Wins Same Old Pitt??????
5 Wins Needs More Learning Than Chryst & Walt????
6 Wins More Coach Learning??? (Chryst Clone But DC)
7 Wins Ditto Above??? (Wannstedt DC Potential)
8 Wins Hiccup Coaching?? (Harris & Wannstedt Era)
9 Wins Improved O-D-ST (Complete Good Coach)
10 Wins Very Good Coach!
11 Wins Great Coach!!
12 Wins Elite Coach!!!

 

[TD_6082]

What is an elite coach? Elite is a pretty strong term. IMO, There are only 3 coaches in the game that I would call elite.

 

[Tuck Shop Gal]

I'd love to see him recruit a big time quarterback. Our defense is lights out but unfortunately we have 2 quarterbacks who are just adequate. College football is all about the quarterback.

 

[DruidTM]

What is an elite coach? Elite is a pretty strong term. IMO, There are only 3 coaches in the game that I would call elite.

Just change the avatar to Cappaletti an No James Franklin is not elite.....

 

[TD_6082]

No. He isn't. Not close.

Elite would be Saban, Meyer, and Harbaugh. Stoops would be borderline.

 

[thebadby2]

No. He isn't. Not close.

Elite would be Saban, Meyer, and Harbaugh. Stoops would be borderline.

Dantonio, Briles, Patterson "not pleased". Stoops isn't ahead of any of them.

I agree with your three but you can't leave Dantonio off a list that has Harbaugh on it. He took a perennial mediocre program that was always second fiddle in its own state and turned it into a monster, without any top 15 recruiting classes. That;s why he's top 3 in salary in all of college football. There isn't anything Harbaugh has done at the college level that Dantonio hasn't done better.

Saban and Meyer are kind of in their own class. Harbaugh, Dantonio, Briles and Patterson are the next tier. Until they win multiple national championships, they aren't in the same rare air as the top 2. Stoops is top 20 but not top 10 IMO.

 

[Deer Head]

Today and last week was clear and convincing evidence that coaching does matter greatly. This defense that looked like a sieve last year, with pretty much the same players is among the top defenses in the country... almost overnight.

This was fTun to watch today. I mean, on offense literally all we have is Boyd and a bunch of very young running backs, but we are still winning games simply by crushing it on defense.

GREAT GAME... damn it feels good to be a Panther

Pitt/Narduzzi are following the correct processes to win consistently in football. This is going to be an enjoyable several years.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

What is an elite coach? Elite is a pretty strong term. IMO, There are only 3 coaches in the game that I would call elite.

WELL, NAME YOUR THREE?

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

That's the way I see it -- A Pitt defense that looked mediocre last year now appears head and shoulders better because of the defensive coaches (Narduzzi included). The offense returned almost everybody from a unit that played well and scored plenty of points last year. Chaney has enough to work with (even without Conner) to get the offense scoring more than it currently is. If Pitt struggles to put up more points this season, it's on Chaney (and the rest of the offensive staff) more than the players. Like the DC is doing, he needs to show he can get everyone on his side playing up to their potential and that the plays he calls always match up well with the personnel he puts on the field.

Agree and we shall see if Chaney can turn it around with Peterman & Voytik without Connor?

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

Just change the avatar to Cappaletti an No James Franklin is not elite.....

Chad was a Top Ten QB, and Chaney recruited Peterman when he was Top 10 QB!

Chryst Nephew was top 5 QB if not #1 but chose not to be coached by his Uncle?

However, they have one recruited from Cincy right now and you are correct go get a better one or a Top 5 QB, I agree!

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

No. He isn't. Not close. Elite would be Saban, Meyer, and Harbaugh. Stoops would be borderline.

I only chose Coaches with a number years of experience elsewhere in colleges and pros!

Just my opinion not gospel and goes in cycles but here is my partial lists and welcome others and comments too:

1. ELITE: 11-12-13-14-15 Game Winners!
1. Patterson TCU
1. Meyers OSU
1. Saban Bama
1. Miles LSU
1. Harbaugh MICHIGAN
1. Kelly NOTRE DAME
1. Fisher FSU
2. GREAT COACHES: 10-11 Game Winners
2. Snyder KSU
2. Stoops OU
2. Dantonio MSU
2. Briles Baylor
2. Petrino ULou
2. Beamer VT

Coach Pat Narduzzi Scale Of Pitt Coaches!
YSU-Coach Pat & Staff did not lose like Chryst's First Game!
AKRON-Coah Pat & Staff did what they were suppose to do unlike Chryst, Wannstedt and Harris that lost to MAC Teams?
IOWA-Wannstedt beat them Graham, Chryst & Narduzzzi lost?
VT-Coach Pat did what Harris & Chryst did!
4 Wins Same Old Pitt??????
5 Wins Needs More Learning Than Chryst & Walt????
6 Wins More Coach Learning??? (Chryst Clone But DC)
7 Wins Ditto Above??? (Wannstedt DC Potential)
8 Wins Hiccup Coaching?? (Harris & Wannstedt Era)
9 Wins Improved O-D-ST (Complete Good Coach)
10 Wins Very Good Coach!
11 Wins Great Coach!!
12 Wins Elite Coach!!!

 

[The Loaded Italian]

Pitt/Narduzzi are following the correct processes to win consistently in football. This is going to be an enjoyable several years.

I still think we will have some games where the agressive D turns out to give up big plays... but I would rather that and kick behind the rest of the game than play pansy football and give up your 300 points and 450 yards a game that we were happy to do last year.

 

[Pittx9]

I still think we will have some games where the agressive D turns out to give up big plays... but I would rather that and kick behind the rest of the game than play pansy football and give up your 300 points and 450 yards a game that we were happy to do last year.

Did you happen to see Matt House's FIU defense this past weekend? For anyone who thinks it was the players and not coaching, I really suggest you look at the stats. That guy has no business being a football coach. He is absolutely clueless.

 

[Pitt79]

Is Narduzzi really "This Good!" He hasn't beaten or even played anybody that great yet, and he hasn't evn had a full season. I'll say Narduzzi is "This Good!" when we win more than 7-8 games or play in a NYD bowl. I like what I see so far, but him being this great savior is not a done deal yet. I need to have the result in my pocket before I crown the guy a king.

 

[Pitt79]

Loaded Italian will now call me a Penn State fan for not being all "Sissy Fan Girl Positive"..... YAY, lol!

 

[The Loaded Italian]

no, I call you a penn state fan for all your other post. You and TD may be the same person, but certainly the same agenda.

But... to answer your comment... yeah, I think going from a passive defense that couldnt stop a little girl to be a dominent, top 5 defense in the country with hard hits, sacks, turnovers, and all in only 4 games... that is 'this good'. I was basically saying... "yeah, we all knew Narduzzi could coach defense for MSU, but did anyone actually think he would make our defense look this amazing so quickly with the seemingly barren talent that was left him from Chryst"

 

[TD_6082]

Go back to BWI Nitter fanboy.

Yes Italian, we both want to win. (assuming we aren't the same person... and we're not. just messing with ya)

 

[The Loaded Italian]

Well, we all want to win.

But some dont want to win at all cost... this isnt life or death, its football... it is a game. You should win with integrity. My best friend is a Dback and Marlin fan (yeah there are a few). He always said it just didnt feel right when they would buy a championship, and much rather pull for the team with the younger guys developing.

I feel the same about Pitt. If Calipari was our bball coach and buying wins with primadonnas that are here a year and out... is that better than having success stories like Wannamaker and Knight and many others? Depends who you are. I think Narduzzi will do the right things the right way, and we will be a successful team. I think if we get to 10 wins, I am thrilled beyond belief. Have our team back to the 9-10 win per year with an off year at 6-6? I would take that.

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

I only chose Coaches with a number years of experience elsewhere in colleges and pros!

Just my opinion not gospel and goes in cycles but here is my partial lists and welcome others and comments too:

1. ELITE: 11-12-13-14-15 Game Winners!
1. Patterson TCU
1. Meyers OSU
1. Saban Bama
1. Miles LSU
1. Harbaugh MICHIGAN
1. Kelly NOTRE DAME
1. Fisher FSU
2. GREAT COACHES: 10-11 Game Winners
2. Snyder KSU
2. Stoops OU
2. Dantonio MSU
2. Briles Baylor
2. Petrino ULou
2. Beamer VT

Coach Pat Narduzzi Scale Of Pitt Coaches!
YSU-Coach Pat & Staff did not lose like Chryst's First Game!
AKRON-Coah Pat & Staff did what they were suppose to do unlike Chryst, Wannstedt and Harris that lost to MAC Teams?
IOWA-Wannstedt beat them Graham, Chryst & Narduzzzi lost?
VT-Coach Pat did what Harris & Chryst did!
4 Wins Same Old Pitt??????
5 Wins Needs More Learning Than Chryst & Walt????
6 Wins More Coach Learning??? (Chryst Clone But DC)
7 Wins Ditto Above??? (Wannstedt DC Potential)
8 Wins Hiccup Coaching?? (Harris & Wannstedt Era)
9 Wins Improved O-D-ST (Complete Good Coach)
10 Wins Very Good Coach!
11 Wins Great Coach!!
12 Wins Elite Coach!!!

Captain... I hope you don't mind...

I borrowed your "Narduzzi Scale" of wins this season and inserted my own thoughts about what I believe each number likely means.

4 wins- Won't happen. Period. (They will beat Virginia or Syracuse or someone else)
5 wins- Shouldn't happen unless pretty much everything starts going wrong on offense and defense.
6 wins- Not likely as long as Ollison and Boyd stay healthy (knocking on wood right now)
7 wins- If offense continues to struggle to put up points all year, proving Chaney is not pulling his weight
8 wins- If Chaney's play calling gets a bit better and a few more things click with offensive players
9 wins - If Narduzzi gets more involved w/ offense and is able to point to ways plays /players can get better.
10 wins - Narduzzi gets very "hands on" w/ offense and is both able to work w/ Chaney to figure out ways to help offense be more effective, but he also helps offense playing with the same tenacity that the defense now has ... Plus the D continues to "bring it" all year.
11 wins- Narduzzi Gets near perfection orchestrated on both offense and defense... But lose in the ACC championship game or bowl game. No shame in that.
12 wins- Narduzzi orchestrates perfection and all his players just "refuse to lose" Pitt administration decides to erect a statue of PN - they're just not sure where to put it (temporarily outside of Heinz Field or on campus)!!!

13 wins - Plans to demolish Petersen Event center so they can build Narduzzi Stadium begin.

Anyway that's my two cents.

Let's Go Pitt!

 

[Teh Teh]

Narduzzi stadium

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

Is Narduzzi really "This Good!" He hasn't beaten or even played anybody that great yet, and he hasn't evn had a full season. I'll say Narduzzi is "This Good!" when we win more than 7-8 games or play in a NYD bowl. I like what I see so far, but him being this great savior is not a done deal yet. I need to have the result in my pocket before I crown the guy a king.

Agree and very fair statement. All I know is that the Pitt defense played better each week in each game, and that is measurement on All Coaching. If the Team is playing later in the year than earlier it is good sign coaching improves the Team?

I agree Coach Pat & Staff needs far more showing and the entire year to show true sustainable and stable change. Georgia Tech, UNC, Notre Dame, ULou, Miami and Duke will be good measurements against some very good to great coaches and that includes improving the Offense, Defense, and Special teams, having good Game Plans, making good Play Calls, and having the Players Execute and win Games they should win and upset the Teams that might have better Talent.

There are changes at Pitt way better than I saw under Chryst on Defense and Special Teams, but the Offense is not so great right now, the outlook although appears promising, we need to see and believe in it?

 

[Dr. von Yinzer]

Threads like this one are completely ridiculous. I have no idea what constitutes an elite coach coach versus a semi-elite coach versus a merely very good coach. I certainly don't have an itemized list on the matter.

For example, in the thread I have learned that Art Briles is an elite coach. Conversely, Bob Stoops, who coaches in the same conference as Briles and whose teams regularly finish ahead of Briles' teams, and who has won a national championship, well he "may be in the top 10-20."

Batshit.

 

[Dr. von Yinzer]

As for our new coach, I am cautiously optimistic by what I've seen so far but let's not get ahead of ourselves. Let's take the long view for once.

We are basically exactly where I thought we would likely be at this stage of the game.

We are probably a little further along on the defensive side of the ball than I had anticipated we would be at this stage of the game. Similarly, we have probably regressed a little bit on offense.

There are many reasons for those changes. Some of them are personnel related. Some of it is experience related. Some of it is scheme related. There is no one-size-fits-all answer here.

I will say that I knew coming into the season that we had a lot of young talent on both sides of the football. I also knew that the narrative that Pitt had no talent and of the roster was bereft of talent was complete nonsense and repeatedly said as much.

It is not remotely complicated. When you are forced to play with the youngest roster among all FBS schools, those young players are going to make mistakes and it will cost you football games.

However, the flipside to that is those young players grow under fire and oftentimes that pays off as they mature.

There is no question in my mind that the scheme is a better scheme than the one employed by the previous staff.

Similarly, there is no question in my mind that the players might be the same people, but they are far from the same players.

The sophomore version of Matt Galambos and the junior version of the same guy are two totally different players. The same goes with the freshman version of Avante Maddox and the version of him but has 12 games under his belt.

That is why my ideal for this program is to redshirt as many kids as possible and develop them. We will have made it as a program whenever we have legitimate, experienced, upper classmen depth.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

Threads like this one are completely ridiculous. I have no idea what constitutes an elite coach coach versus a semi-elite coach versus a merely very good coach. I certainly don't have an itemized list on the matter. For example, in the thread I have learned that Art Briles is an elite coach. Conversely, Bob Stoops, who coaches in the same conference as Briles and whose teams regularly finish ahead of Briles' teams, and who has won a national championship, well he "may be in the top 10-20."
Batshit.

First they are opinions not gospel and goes in cycles.

The way I see it, Elite Coaches are the ones that take 2 to 3 Star recruits and beat bigger more Resources College Football Programs that have many 4 to 5 Star Recruits and do it everywhere they go and win in most years. I see TCU's Patterson, Baylor's Briles, KSU Synder, MSU Dantonio, Wisky's Alvarez and some others in that category.

Then there are Elite Coaches at Elite Programs that have all the Money, Assistants, Fan Base, Boosters and Recruiting and win at those Programs in Bama's Saban, LSU's Miles, and FSU Fisher.

On OU's Stoops versus Baylor's Briles. OU is an Elite Program and few to none will coach there unless they win 10+ games and play for Conference and National Titles. Stoops has won the second most games since 1999 and won a NCS and lost 2 too. Stoops came to an Elite Program and won early but in my opinion has not sustain the Else Status and has gone 8-5 at lest time since 1999.

Art Briles took over a Perennial Bottom Feeder in Baylor with many 2 and 3 Star Recruits and far lower recruiting rankings why I dropped Stoops that has everything he needs to win at OU over Briles Baylor that has turned around Baylor into a top Ten Team. Now if it is disclosed that Briles is doing it by some cheating or under handed methods, that may change if the NCAA hits him with Sanctions?

What Briles has done at Baylor is remarkable while what Stoops has does at OU is expected and OU expectations have been let down a shade since 2008?

Additionally, Briles has beaten Stoops 3 of the last 4 years nad doing it to an Elite Program?

Stoops since 2009 has not had the OU Program as high as he once did from 1999 to 2008 when he was an Elite Coach at an Elite Program?If he did, Briles would not be beating him?

In addition, Boise, WVU, and Baylor have beaten Stoops by big scores as well in games in spite of Stoops having better Recruiting, Revenues, & Resources like a few Elite Programs.

Now if OU become a Top 10 Team and stays there even without going to NCS Playoffs perhaps Stoops is returning to form, but right now he is a Great Coach at an Elite Program, in my opinion!

Furthermore, one can follow these coaches and see some of them came to becoming Elite Coaches at lesser Programs when they started and just improved every year anywhere they go and then end up at and Elite Program, Such as Urban Meyers from Bowling Green to Utah to Florida, or Brian Kelly from Grand Valley State to Central Michigan to Cincy to Notre Dame?

This is why I follow Coaches and Programs over Statistics and Sports-lines. Great Coaches can win games they are expected to lose, but become Elite when they win games anywhere they go, and win or become a National Title Contender and not always on NCAA Probation.

Getting to the Top 10-15 is one achievement, but staying there or in the Top 25 every year is a very good, great and elite coach.

Do it over 10 years straight and one can actually build a Top 25 Program like Paterno built Penn State from 1967 to 1987, Beamer at VT with 10+ Wins of winning over 10 Years and now what Patterson is doing at TCU!

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Let's take the long view for once.

You realize these are Pitt fans you are conversing with, right?

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

"Dr. von Yinzer, post: 380429, member: 3314"]As for our new coach, I am cautiously optimistic by what I've seen so far but let's not get ahead of ourselves. Let's take the long view for once.
Agree, but we can measure even cautiously what we are seeing from games 1 to games 4? Again, good words like you say cautious optimism, but need to see more?

We are basically exactly where I thought we would likely be at this stage of the game. We are probably a little further along on the defensive side of the ball than I had anticipated we would be at this stage of the game. Similarly, we have probably regressed a little bit on offense.
No one disagrees there! But I do see an attitude change in players.

There are many reasons for those changes. Some of them are personnel related. Some of it is experience related. Some of it is scheme related. There is no one-size-fits-all answer here.
But change looks to be there? Whether it stays there and keeps growing is the question?

I will say that I knew coming into the season that we had a lot of young talent on both sides of the football.
Everyone knew Talent and Experience was on the Offense, but I disagree on Defense and Special Teams lacked coaching of any talent Pitt had last year! This has changed as one can see from games 1 to 4 and playing many Players!

I also knew that the narrative that Pitt had no talent and of the roster was bereft of talent was complete nonsense and repeatedly said as much.
Agreed! The Facts are Chryst left before we could see his Coaching & Staff for 5 years, and left 19-20? Talent is there but if coaches don't stay hard to measure!

It is not remotely complicated. When you are forced to play with the youngest roster among all FBS schools, those young players are going to make mistakes and it will cost you football games.
Exactly, and throw in New Coaches and New Systems every 1 to 3 years, and you get more instability, unknowns, and hard to measure any Team or Program?

However, the flipside to that is those young players grow under fire and oftentimes that pays off as they mature.
So far so good, but coaches have to find, teach, and learn what Players can do and those Players have to execute too! Especially the younger Players with less experience, size and speed against bigger teams and more Experienced Head Coaches & Stable Staffs? All Coaches have to learn from their mistakes too and when OC's Harris and Chryst took over both had to rebuild recruiting classes and find Assistants that helped them!

Wannstedt was an NFL Head coach and College DC but even he needed time to adjust to College Head Coaching?

Graham was a Head Coach in College but did not stay at Pitt long enough here for any evaluations, but has done well at ASU?

There is no question in my mind that the scheme is a better scheme than the one employed by the previous staff. Similarly, there is no question in my mind that the players might be the same people, but they are far from the same players. The sophomore version of Matt Galambos and the junior version of the same guy are two totally different players. The same goes with the freshman version of Avante Maddox and the version of him but has 12 games under his belt.
Excellent Post and evaluation!

That is why my ideal for this program is to redshirt as many kids as possible and develop them. We will have made it as a program whenever we have legitimate, experienced, upper classmen depth.
Grobe did this at Wake Forest and in 4 years did great, but later failed to maintain it. I am not sure, I am big believer like what Paterno did in 1967, if the Team is not winning with its more experience and older class men, then bench the ones not performing and play the younger one so they learn faster in games and not just practicing. Although at time, the NCAA did have rules that all Freshmen must not play in their first year.

So one never know and why it up to the Coaches to coach up their Players and that is on them on how they do it, but the results is why they get hired or are fired?

The UVA Game is the next test for these Coaches & Players, I am looking forward to it as well as the rest of the year?

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

You realize these are Pitt fans you are conversing with, right?

Yeah..... Wannstedt 2005-2010, Haywood 2 Weeks in 2010, Graham 2010-11, Chryst 2012-2014 and now Coach Pat 2014-????

Now that is a longer lists of coaches than any longer view?

 

[thebadby2]

Threads like this one are completely ridiculous. I have no idea what constitutes an elite coach coach versus a semi-elite coach versus a merely very good coach. I certainly don't have an itemized list on the matter.

For example, in the thread I have learned that Art Briles is an elite coach. Conversely, Bob Stoops, who coaches in the same conference as Briles and whose teams regularly finish ahead of Briles' teams, and who has won a national championship, well he "may be in the top 10-20."

Batshit.

I probably didn't give Stoops enough credit. but he has certainly seems to have been overtaken by Briles.

Anyway, Saban and Meyer are the only real "elite" college coaches IMO. There could be a lot of debate about who rebounds out the rest of the top 10.

 

[TD_6082]

Saban and Meyer no doubt. Just my opinion, but I would go ahead and put Harbaugh in the mix. I think any fanbase in college football would trade their Head Coach for one of those 3 guys and call it a big upgrade. I think Stoops would be just behind those three.

And among active coaches, I think Spurrier would have been considered and elite coach once upon a time.

 

[Teh Teh]

Threads like this one are completely ridiculous. I have no idea what constitutes an elite coach coach versus a semi-elite coach versus a merely very good coach. I certainly don't have an itemized list on the matter.

For example, in the thread I have learned that Art Briles is an elite coach. Conversely, Bob Stoops, who coaches in the same conference as Briles and whose teams regularly finish ahead of Briles' teams, and who has won a national championship, well he "may be in the top 10-20."

Batshit.

Well, that assessment is completely ridiculous. The post merely says did anyone actually think our defense would have such a turn-around like this so quickly. It certainly is a fair and accurate statement, 4 weeks or not. There is NO question the defense is far more aggressive and that aggressiveness is leading to more sacks, turnover, fewer points given up etc.

I think complaining about the offense is pretty ridiculous as there aren't many teams out there that can lose their best player and not miss a beat. And those that can are championship type teams. Weren't we 6-7 last year???
I mean, I understand the negativity, you're a pittsburgher, but geez this thread couldn't be more simple.

 

[TD_6082]

Teh Teh, VaTech lost their best offensive player. Defensive player too. Just saying.

 

[Pitt79]

Well, we all want to win.

But some dont want to win at all cost... this isnt life or death, its football... it is a game. You should win with integrity. My best friend is a Dback and Marlin fan (yeah there are a few). He always said it just didnt feel right when they would buy a championship, and much rather pull for the team with the younger guys developing.

I feel the same about Pitt. If Calipari was our bball coach and buying wins with primadonnas that are here a year and out... is that better than having success stories like Wannamaker and Knight and many others? Depends who you are. I think Narduzzi will do the right things the right way, and we will be a successful team. I think if we get to 10 wins, I am thrilled beyond belief. Have our team back to the 9-10 win per year with an off year at 6-6? I would take that.

I'd rather just WIN BIG, I'd take Calipari and his methods in a heart beat , and celebrate REALLY WINNING every year. Do I care if the Pirates would BUY a World Series championship? Hell no, I'd love it! If the Nutting pockets aren't deep enough, I'd root for someone richer with a giant ego to buy the team, the guy that would try to BUY a championship so he can stand there being presented the trophy! That's better than "developing young guys" and "coming close".