Only 22 of the Top 150 remain uncommitted

[Sean Miller Fan]

As I always say, it means everything to have a really good class signed in November. On the eve of signing day, Capel had a good start with Mintz but that's going to be his only Top 150 recruit for this class and the class overall will rank in the middle of the pack in the ACC and that's not good enough to propel us out of the basement. He desperately needed a good class this year to sell hope in what may well be the 2nd worst season in Pitt basketball history.

I know you guys hate Sean Miller but in this day and age of legalized cheating (booster payments disguised as NIL deals), a coach like Miller is what Pitt needs. A guy who can work the boosters for NIL deals for players. Capel isnt going to do that.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

First in for he’s focused on ‘23. Or guys who are going to reclass for ‘22.

Rinse. Repeat.

 

[pittchagg]

I don't think Mintz is going to be the only top-150 guy that we sign in November. I'm just not sure that Mintz won't be the only guy *in the top-150 when they sign*, versus guys who rise into the top-150 after signing day (similar to Femi rising into the top 150 after he signed in the spring).

 

[whirlybird optio]

As I always say, it means everything to have a really good class signed in November. On the eve of signing day, Capel had a good start with Mintz but that's going to be his only Top 150 recruit for this class and the class overall will rank in the middle of the pack in the ACC and that's not good enough to propel us out of the basement. He desperately needed a good class this year to sell hope in what may well be the 2nd worst season in Pitt basketball history.

I know you guys hate Sean Miller but in this day and age of legalized cheating (booster payments disguised as NIL deals), a coach like Miller is what Pitt needs. A guy who can work the boosters for NIL deals for players. Capel isnt going to do that.

The high school recruiting for Capel has been pretty good, despite the results so far. What has been shockingly bad IMO has been the transfers. I still can’t really believe that last year, with multiple scholarships available, and a million guys in the portal, we are landing role players from bad leagues? I just thought Capel could pull in a really good couple of stop-gap transfers every year (although Gueye looks pretty good).

Mintz and Buchanan (who probably ends up as a fringe 150 guy) is a good start to a 3-4 person class. The Hugley/Jeffress/Femi class is a very good class on paper. The first two classes were pretty good also. Hopefully Mintz is a star from. Day 1.

 

[Ski11585]

I'd argue Miller's lack of final fours is way more embarrassing than Dixon's given how much talent he accumulated at Arizona. And I don't think he'll be allowed to cheat at Pitt so his recruiting will be mediocre. And given he's a mediocre coach, it'll be... nothing for fans to get excited about.

I thought SMF knew basketball.

 

[JD1976]

I’d say for the most part the players that Capel has brought in have been quality (aside from Drumgoole), but there just haven’t been enough of them to build depth. And that’s really without exploring his role in the lack of chemistry and team culture that we have witnessed. He needs to really build some excitement in this class or the last of his supporters will be off the ship.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I'd argue Miller's lack of final fours is way more embarrassing than Dixon's given how much talent he accumulated at Arizona. And I don't think he'll be allowed to cheat at Pitt so his recruiting will be mediocre. And given he's a mediocre coach, it'll be... nothing for fans to get excited about.

I thought SMF knew basketball.

You don't have to cheat anymore. That's my point. They have legalized it. Get the kids paid as NIL deals. He would be good at that.

If you had 2 choices:

Sean Miller
Flavor of the month mid-major lottery ticket

You're really taking a mid-major coach, who typically have a very high failure rate?

 

[Vader_Storm]

I don't think Mintz is going to be the only top-150 guy that we sign in November. I'm just not sure that Mintz won't be the only guy *in the top-150 when they sign*, versus guys who rise into the top-150 after signing day (similar to Femi rising into the top 150 after he signed in the spring).

Like I said previously, Buchanan is a more consistent jumpshot away from making a significant move in the national rankings. He's a top 150 player right now.



From Jamie Shaw at Rivals.com on Buchanan

The 6-foot-7 wing/forward from Washington (D.C.) Woodrow Wilson High showed exactly why the likes of Pittsburgh and George Washington are prioritizing him. Buchanan had a featured matchup against 2023 Rivals150 No. 49 Dennis Parker Jr., in which Buchanan scored 22 points, going 2-for-3 from three, with eight rebounds and three steals. Look for Buchanan to be in the conversation for the Rivals150 in the next update.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Like I said previously, Buchanan is a more consistent jumpshot away from making a significant move in the national rankings. He's a top 150 player right now.



From Jamie Shaw at Rivals.com on Buchanan

The 6-foot-7 wing/forward from Washington (D.C.) Woodrow Wilson High showed exactly why the likes of Pittsburgh and George Washington are prioritizing him. Buchanan had a featured matchup against 2023 Rivals150 No. 49 Dennis Parker Jr., in which Buchanan scored 22 points, going 2-for-3 from three, with eight rebounds and three steals. Look for Buchanan to be in the conversation for the Rivals150 in the next update.

GW

Sounds like a lottery ticket. Might be good. Might be Drumgoole. Capel doesn't have many choices so obviously he should try to get him since nobody is left but we cant build a program on lottery tickets. Sounds like a kid who doesn't contribute much the first couple years unless you hit it big like with Champagnie. Capel can't afford to wait 3 years for major contributions. He needs to start recruiting like the legendary Nate Oats, who I said at the time we should have met whatever sky high salary he was demanding. Looks like I was right as he's basically become Calipari on the recruiting trail.

 

[Ski11585]

You don't have to cheat anymore. That's my point. They have legalized it. Get the kids paid as NIL deals. He would be good at that.

If you had 2 choices:

Sean Miller
Flavor of the month mid-major lottery ticket

You're really taking a mid-major coach, who typically have a very high failure rate?

1: People are still cheating. So you have cheating and NIL deals. And currently we've seen nothing for Pitt hoops in terms of NIL. So Miller will be facing an uphill battle here.

2: Yes. I'd rather roll the dice on a lottery ticket than someone with a track record of falling short with rosters filled with NBA players.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

1: People are still cheating. So you have cheating and NIL deals. And currently we've seen nothing for Pitt hoops in terms of NIL. So Miller will be facing an uphill battle here.

2: Yes. I'd rather roll the dice on a lottery ticket than someone with a track record of falling short with rosters filled with NBA players.

But you don't have to "cheat" now. The most important thing in the hiring of a new coach is to get someone with enough of a network or someone who can develop a network to get each Top 100ish recruit paid like 50K or so. Miller can do that. The HC of Mid-major U cannot.

 

[FrogmoreZeke]

But you don't have to "cheat" now. The most important thing in the hiring of a new coach is to get someone with enough of a network or someone who can develop a network to get each Top 100ish recruit paid like 50K or so. Miller can do that. The HC of Mid-major U cannot.

Haven't seen anything about Miller recently. Was he suspended by the NCAA or just fired by AZ? Seems to me he is more likely headed to the NBA. I heard an NBA exec about a year ago say that Miller was the most likely college coach to get an NBA HC job soon.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Haven't seen anything about Miller recently. Was he suspended by the NCAA or just fired by AZ? Seems to me he is more likely headed to the NBA. I heard an NBA exec about a year ago say that Miller was the most likely college coach to get an NBA HC job soon.

Just like Will Wade and Rick Pitino, there is no NCAA penalty coming for Miller. Another thing I was right about

 

[Ski11585]

But you don't have to "cheat" now. The most important thing in the hiring of a new coach is to get someone with enough of a network or someone who can develop a network to get each Top 100ish recruit paid like 50K or so. Miller can do that. The HC of Mid-major U cannot.

Miller can do that based on what actual evidence?

He’s an overrated coach and he won’t be able to recruit at Pitt. He would be a failure.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Miller can do that based on what actual evidence?

He’s an overrated coach and he won’t be able to recruit at Pitt. He would be a failure.

He can get guys paid legally now. These guys are going to go to whoever gets them more NIL money. He would be no worse than a mid-major lottery ticket. You guys make him out to be Capel or Stallings.

 

[FrogmoreZeke]

I'm not the biggest Miller fan but SMF is correct. NIL changes everything. It's no longer about who can coach up kids. It's all about who is going to position these guys to cash in, now legally. Saw an interview with Cal this morning in lead up to game w Duke and he said his whole focus has now shifted to providing his kids with financial literacy advice.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I'm not the biggest Miller fan but SMF is correct. NIL changes everything. It's no longer about who can coach up kids. It's all about who is going to position these guys to cash in, now legally. Saw an interview with Cal this morning in lead up to game w Duke and he said his whole focus has now shifted to providing his kids with financial literacy advice.

Exactly. The #1 thing to focus on in the next coaching search is what coach can get players paid. Miller has shown he can do that illegally and now its much easier since its legal. Its a no-brainer. He may not be the best coach and he may not get McD AA talent here but he'd live in the Top 50/100 similar to a Nate Oats, Will Wade, Buzz Williams, etc. But instead we'll hire whichever coach wins the CAA and hope for the best

 

[NCanton Panther]

The high school recruiting for Capel has been pretty good, despite the results so far. What has been shockingly bad IMO has been the transfers. I still can’t really believe that last year, with multiple scholarships available, and a million guys in the portal, we are landing role players from bad leagues? I just thought Capel could pull in a really good couple of stop-gap transfers every year (although Gueye looks pretty good).

Mintz and Buchanan (who probably ends up as a fringe 150 guy) is a good start to a 3-4 person class. The Hugley/Jeffress/Femi class is a very good class on paper. The first two classes were pretty good also. Hopefully Mintz is a star from. Day 1.

Can you put yourself in the shoes of a grad transfer with 1 year of eligibility remaining and tell me what would attract you to picking Pitt. Aside from a middle of the road guy from a smaller division school wanting an opportunity to play in a P5 conference. Higher quality small division players are going to have more options to pick from and are mostly going to go someplace with higher probability of wins, tournament participation, etc.

 

[FrogmoreZeke]

Exactly. The #1 thing to focus on in the next coaching search is what coach can get players paid. Miller has shown he can do that illegally and now its much easier since its legal. Its a no-brainer. He may not be the best coach and he may not get McD AA talent here but he'd live in the Top 50/100 similar to a Nate Oats, Will Wade, Buzz Williams, etc. But instead we'll hire whichever coach wins the CAA and hope for the best

I had been a season ticket holder and contributor for over 45 years until Barnes, "if you're not excited about this hire then your not in the right spot". At this point I don't care if they hire Satan. I just want to see The Pete rocking again and making the tourney before I die.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I had been a season ticket holder and contributor for over 45 years until Barnes, "if you're not excited about this hire then your not in the right spot". At this point I don't care if they hire Satan. I just want to see The Pete rocking again and making the tourney before I die.

Absolutely, I'd take Satan and a team full of devil worshippers if they can get back to the NCAAT. I fear we may be heading for a Rutgers-like 20/30 year absence. That's why the next hire has to be a slam dunk. You need a sure thing and have to overpay

 

[TheSpecialSauce]

Just Win Baby!!
When in Rome, Do as the Romans.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I just read an article on recruiting (football) in the athletic and writer (his opinion) said coaching in football (college) is 80% recruiting and 20% coaching and development. I disagree with that somewhat. I think it is more 67/33. You have to recruit. The guy brought up a great point of saying "Oregon has a great class, they are all 4 stars." Yes, a couple top 100, most in the top 250. The difference here, Alabama may recruit 20 4 stars in their class, but like 12-15 of them are top 100. That's a big difference amongst 4 stars.

In basketball, I do think coaching matters more. I think good coaching and development can mitigate recruiting, especially in the days of 1 and done, good coaching and development can be really successful. I would love to see those Pitt teams 2002-2011 in today's college BB. I think they would be uber successful. Recruiting is still important, but gone are the days when Carolina is rolling out a Sr Sam Perkins, a Sr Matt Doherty, a Jr Michael Jordan, and a 7'0 Soph named Brad Dougherty. Or the 85 Hoyas or Phi Slamma Jamma or the 92 Dookies with Laettner, Davis Seniors, Hurley a Jr and Hill a Soph. You just don't have this anymore.

So you can mitigate talent with coaching. Well...some programs can. Ahem.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

You can hate on Sean Miller, and I'm fine with that. But that ought to disqualify you from defending Jeff Capel at any point this season, because he is significantly worse.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

Oats was my guy but thought Capel was a credible get. I just still have no clue what the hell his plan is.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Just to recap, what this program really needs is a coach who couldn't win when he was running one of the dirtiest programs in America because now a lot of the dirty stuff he was doing can be done legally, so everyone can do it.

Someone with even an ounce of common sense might see how that doesn't make any sense, but not a certain someone.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Just to recap, what this program really needs is a coach who couldn't win when he was running one of the dirtiest programs in America because now a lot of the dirty stuff he was doing can be done legally, so everyone can do it.

Someone with even an ounce of common sense might see how that doesn't make any sense, but not a certain someone.

That could also apply to the guy on our payroll, post Blake Griffin.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

That could also apply to the guy on our payroll, post Blake Griffin.

So you want to replace Jeff Capel with someone who has a similar problem with his resume?

Once again, someone with even an ounce of common sense might be able to detect a problem there.

 

[snaphook297]

As I always say, it means everything to have a really good class signed in November. On the eve of signing day, Capel had a good start with Mintz but that's going to be his only Top 150 recruit for this class and the class overall will rank in the middle of the pack in the ACC and that's not good enough to propel us out of the basement. He desperately needed a good class this year to sell hope in what may well be the 2nd worst season in Pitt basketball history.

I know you guys hate Sean Miller but in this day and age of legalized cheating (booster payments disguised as NIL deals), a coach like Miller is what Pitt needs. A guy who can work the boosters for NIL deals for players. Capel isnt going to do Sean Miller belongs in jail

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

So you want to replace Jeff Capel with someone who has a similar problem with his resume?

Once again, someone with even an ounce of common sense might be able to detect a problem there.

No. I never once advocated for Pitt hiring Sean Miller. But do I think the guy we have is worse? Yes, probably.

And he may have never advanced very far in the tournament with Arizona, but I wouldn't say he didn't win there. He had four 30+ win seasons, made three Elite Eights, etc. I see people lauding Mike Tomlin for regular season success all the time.

Also, I think Arizona is different enough from Pitt for the comparison to not really be 100% relevant. Like I wouldn't expect Bronco Mendenhall to win big at Clemson. But he's done a pretty nice job for what Virginia is.

I say all of this as a person who isn't a Miller fan.

 

[FrogmoreZeke]

Just to recap, what this program really needs is a coach who couldn't win when he was running one of the dirtiest programs in America because now a lot of the dirty stuff he was doing can be done legally, so everyone can do it.

Someone with even an ounce of common sense might see how that doesn't make any sense, but not a certain someone.

Guess when you say "couldn't win", you mean a natty?! He won plenty. I have no delusions that any coach can win a Natty at Pitt in my life time. But if you don't think someone like S Miller can get Pitt back into the tourney then maybe you don't have an ounce of common sense.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I just read an article on recruiting (football) in the athletic and writer (his opinion) said coaching in football (college) is 80% recruiting and 20% coaching and development. I disagree with that somewhat. I think it is more 67/33. You have to recruit. The guy brought up a great point of saying "Oregon has a great class, they are all 4 stars." Yes, a couple top 100, most in the top 250. The difference here, Alabama may recruit 20 4 stars in their class, but like 12-15 of them are top 100. That's a big difference amongst 4 stars.

In basketball, I do think coaching matters more. I think good coaching and development can mitigate recruiting, especially in the days of 1 and done, good coaching and development can be really successful. I would love to see those Pitt teams 2002-2011 in today's college BB. I think they would be uber successful. Recruiting is still important, but gone are the days when Carolina is rolling out a Sr Sam Perkins, a Sr Matt Doherty, a Jr Michael Jordan, and a 7'0 Soph named Brad Dougherty. Or the 85 Hoyas or Phi Slamma Jamma or the 92 Dookies with Laettner, Davis Seniors, Hurley a Jr and Hill a Soph. You just don't have this anymore.

So you can mitigate talent with coaching. Well...some programs can. Ahem.

Football is 80% recruiting. That's correct. Basketball is less than that, maybe 65-70% recruiting because a HC can influence a game more in basketball.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Oats was my guy but thought Capel was a credible get. I just still have no clue what the hell his plan is.

I was the exact same. Said we should have given Oats a blank check but I liked the Capel hire. Funny thing is for probably 500K or 1 million more per year, we could have had Oats and would be in the Top 10 right now.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Guess when you say "couldn't win", you mean a natty?! He won plenty. I have no delusions that any coach can win a Natty at Pitt in my life time. But if you don't think someone like S Miller can get Pitt back into the tourney then maybe you don't have an ounce of common sense.

Correct. Miller was a failure at AZ because he didnt make a Final Four and got knocked out early of a few NCAATs. At Pitt, just like at Xavier, he's going to be in the NCAAT almost every year. Will he make a FF? No. Will he make a Sweet 16? Probably not. But he will get players and they will win games. Period.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Looking for positves, after getting down 14-2, Pitt was able to play even with this 8th (out of 10) place SoCon juggernaut. We looked like we can hang with some of the SoCon's worst teams

 

[Ski11585]

Correct. Miller was a failure at AZ because he didnt make a Final Four and got knocked out early of a few NCAATs. At Pitt, just like at Xavier, he's going to be in the NCAAT almost every year. Will he make a FF? No. Will he make a Sweet 16? Probably not. But he will get players and they will win games. Period.

So not good enough. If Dixon wasn’t good enough then neither is Miller.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

So not good enough. If Dixon wasn’t good enough then neither is Miller.

But you know who is? Whoever wins the CAA. Now that's a slam dunk hire there. You know those guys ALWAYS work out.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Guess when you say "couldn't win", you mean a natty?! He won plenty. I have no delusions that any coach can win a Natty at Pitt in my life time. But if you don't think someone like S Miller can get Pitt back into the tourney then maybe you don't have an ounce of common sense.

Well sure he won plenty. He was cheating at what was the best basketball program west of the Mississippi. A trained monkey could have won plenty at Arizona.

His problem is that his teams chronically underachieved. While he was cheating his ass off. If you think that NIL is essentially legalized cheating (and I'm not say that YOU necessarily think that) so that now everyone is going to be doing the kinds of things that Miller did at Arizona then the playing field becomes even more level. If someone can't win big when they have all the advantages then why on earth would anyone expect them to win big when they no longer have those advantages?

 

[FrogmoreZeke]

Well sure he won plenty. He was cheating at what was the best basketball program west of the Mississippi. A trained monkey could have won plenty at Arizona.

His problem is that his teams chronically underachieved. While he was cheating his ass off. If you think that NIL is essentially legalized cheating (and I'm not say that YOU necessarily think that) so that now everyone is going to be doing the kinds of things that Miller did at Arizona then the playing field becomes even more level. If someone can't win big when they have all the advantages then why on earth would anyone expect them to win big when they no longer have those advantages?

Again. You keep saying WIN BIG. I don't care about winning big. Just want to see the ncaa tourney 3 of every 4 years. That is where this program is now. Expectations have been lowered due to the last 8 years. But if you don't think Miller can at least bring this program back to getting into the NCAAs then we agree to disagree.

 

[Ski11585]

But you know who is? Whoever wins the CAA. Now that's a slam dunk hire there. You know those guys ALWAYS work out.

Maybe. Maybe not. I’d rather roll the dice than hire a proven underachiever.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Well sure he won plenty. He was cheating at what was the best basketball program west of the Mississippi. A trained monkey could have won plenty at Arizona.

His problem is that his teams chronically underachieved. While he was cheating his ass off. If you think that NIL is essentially legalized cheating (and I'm not say that YOU necessarily think that) so that now everyone is going to be doing the kinds of things that Miller did at Arizona then the playing field becomes even more level. If someone can't win big when they have all the advantages then why on earth would anyone expect them to win big when they no longer have those advantages?

Most good teams were cheating. Now most teams will "cheat" legally. If you can think of another coach who can get recruits 50K/year NIL deals, I'm all ears. Miller has the network to do it.